annannimusss Posted May 31, 2007 Report Share Posted May 31, 2007 Sassun in an earlier post you said that the Armenians in 1915 resisted being Turkified, you forgot one thing that went along with that. They resisted becoming what you have sadly become, muslim. Our people or what used to be your people died because they kept there faith and did not want to become muslim. If you were alive in those days you would be considered a coward, a turncoat, a traitor. Sadly, this is the truth and I think that you need to go leave Lebanon and your family and go to Turkey and enjoy your time with your friends and your fellow Muslim people. I have zero problems with Arabs, they took our people in and let us live in there Country, but you becoming a muslim means that you have in fact sadly left your people and joined the enemy (Turks). It is sad I thought this day would never happen where an Armenian willingly became a muslim, not forced like the Hamshens, not forced like in the Genocide. I am thinking of becomong a Der Hayr one day, and when I hear things like this it breaks my heart to see you leave your religion and your people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmoPhil Posted May 31, 2007 Report Share Posted May 31, 2007 (edited) Sassun in an earlier post you said that the Armenians in 1915 resisted being Turkified, you forgot one thing that went along with that. They resisted becoming what you have sadly become, muslim. Our people or what used to be your people died because they kept there faith and did not want to become muslim. If you were alive in those days you would be considered a coward, a turncoat, a traitor. Sadly, this is the truth and I think that you need to go leave Lebanon and your family and go to Turkey and enjoy your time with your friends and your fellow Muslim people. I have zero problems with Arabs, they took our people in and let us live in there Country, but you becoming a muslim means that you have in fact sadly left your people and joined the enemy (Turks). It is sad I thought this day would never happen where an Armenian willingly became a muslim, not forced like the Hamshens, not forced like in the Genocide. I am thinking of becomong a Der Hayr one day, and when I hear things like this it breaks my heart to see you leave your religion and your people. Not only back then, but today also. I asked a question to all my family members, Hye Dajig gssvi? Their answers were with any doubt, no. They consider them a Tavajan. Like you clearly said Sako, we were killed for being Christian. I just hope no more Armenians convert to Islam because slowly, like I have mentioned it in my previous comments, our community will become Muslim. The Armenian Genocide victims would have been killed for no reason. I wonder Sassun, if you go to a Christian Armenian wedding, and the Der Hayr goes lets all do the prayer and start praying Hayr mer. Would you stand up and pray? Or stand up and pray your "Allahu Akbar" in your mind? Edited May 31, 2007 by ArmoPhil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmoPhil Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Long story short, it came from the discussion from whether or not Sassun would marry an Armenian woman. And if he did, whether he would treat her like a posession (i.e. how Islam treats women) or like a real person with feelings, desires, etc. That's where the sex talk came about as far as I remember. Also Arpa was suggesting sex as an alternative to this fixation on religion as a passtime. Well, my old buddy said once, Muslims use women to re product and somewhat become more populated than the Christians. And it seems to be working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anoushik Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Great post, but does that mean you just admitted you are not Armenian, since you yourself are not Christian? I'm a Christian. I believe in Christ's teachings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anoushik Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Anoushik is Atheist? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anoushik Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Just so you don't say I contradict myself that I'm an atheist and also a Christian: I don't believe in God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johannes Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 I don't believe in God. Աւետարանին մէջ գրուած է. «առանց տիրոջ հրամանին տերեւ մը շարժիր երկրի վրայ»: Ուրեմն՝ «պատերազմները, ոճիրները, անմեղ մարդկանց սպանդը տիրոջ հրամանա՞ւ է» մտածելով մեղադրած եմ Արարիչը, բայց ետքը եկած եմ այն եզրակացութեան, որ մեր կատարածը իրողութեան մէջ երկխօսութիւն մըն է, ոչ այդ տողի պատասխանտուն Աստուած է, ոչ ալ մեր եզրակացութեան պատասխանտուն: Կարծեք թէ շատ բան սպասած ենք եւ կը սպասենք Աստուծմէ: Սա փիլոնաւոր մարդկանց հոգեւոր մտաւոր աշխարհ հայեացքի դրսեւորումն է: Միթէ՞ երկինքի թռչունները կաշխատին, թէ Աստուած կը կերակրէ զանոնք»: Ես կը կարծեմ, որ պէտք եղածէն աւելի բեռ դրած ենք Արարիչի վրայ: Մեր խնդիրները, մենք պիտի լուծենք: Միայն փառք տանք Աստծուն, որ մեզ տուած է խնդիրներ լուծելու, մտածելու եւ գործելու կարողութիւն: Մարդ = Ազատ Կամք, Անմահ Հոգի եւ Դատող Միտք Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aSoldier Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Just so you don't say I contradict myself that I'm an atheist and also a Christian: I don't believe in God. You just did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Well, my old buddy said once, Muslims use women to re product and somewhat become more populated than the Christians. And it seems to be working. Excuse me ?? That's a myth... well let me ask you this, have you ever talked to a Muslim woman ???? i have not seen one Muslim woman who says that she is treated as a baby-producing machine. And actually higher fertility rates are related to poverty. Still, what is wrong with having lots of kids? Maybe except for the diaper changing part... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Not only back then, but today also. I asked a question to all my family members, Hye Dajig gssvi? Their answers were with any doubt, no. They consider them a Tavajan. Like you clearly said Sako, we were killed for being Christian. I just hope no more Armenians convert to Islam because slowly, like I have mentioned it in my previous comments, our community will become Muslim. The Armenian Genocide victims would have been killed for no reason. I wonder Sassun, if you go to a Christian Armenian wedding, and the Der Hayr goes lets all do the prayer and start praying Hayr mer. Would you stand up and pray? Or stand up and pray your "Allahu Akbar" in your mind? ArmoPhil Well for now I am pretty much not in the position to be invited to an Armenian wedding. However, if I am , I would of course stand up like the rest of them when asked to . And as for praying , Muslims do not pray 'standing up'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Sassun in an earlier post you said that the Armenians in 1915 resisted being Turkified, you forgot one thing that went along with that. They resisted becoming what you have sadly become, muslim. Our people or what used to be your people died because they kept there faith and did not want to become muslim. If you were alive in those days you would be considered a coward, a turncoat, a traitor. Sadly, this is the truth and I think that you need to go leave Lebanon and your family and go to Turkey and enjoy your time with your friends and your fellow Muslim people. I have zero problems with Arabs, they took our people in and let us live in there Country, but you becoming a muslim means that you have in fact sadly left your people and joined the enemy (Turks). It is sad I thought this day would never happen where an Armenian willingly became a muslim, not forced like the Hamshens, not forced like in the Genocide. I am thinking of becomong a Der Hayr one day, and when I hear things like this it breaks my heart to see you leave your religion and your people. Sarkis What you are saying is nothing new to me. I understand that it is difficult (and sounds impossible) to accept. Today, after Friday prayer, I stayed behind, in the Mosque, and prayed by myself, for some time. It was surreal, to be reading the Quran and at the same moment all those accusations of treason going through your mind (I had read your reply last night but decided not to respond). But let me tell you, that today, for the first time, I accepted that I will never be accepted, and will always be considered a traitor. Very well, if it will make you feel better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmoPhil Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Excuse me ?? That's a myth... well let me ask you this, have you ever talked to a Muslim woman ???? i have not seen one Muslim woman who says that she is treated as a baby-producing machine. And actually higher fertility rates are related to poverty. Still, what is wrong with having lots of kids? Maybe except for the diaper changing part... How can you love 4 women at the same time? It's psychologically impossible. You will have feelings for only 1 woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) How can you love 4 women at the same time? It's psychologically impossible. You will have feelings for only 1 woman. I do not know how, but if others can do it then that is their decision. Irents kidnalikn e... Not every Muslim takes 4 wives!!! The overwhelming majority do not.... Btw why do people talk about polygamy as if it only exists in Islam??? Edited June 1, 2007 by Sassun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) Excuse me ?? That's a myth... well let me ask you this, have you ever talked to a Muslim woman ???? i have not seen one Muslim woman who says that she is treated as a baby-producing machine. And actually higher fertility rates are related to poverty. Still, what is wrong with having lots of kids? Maybe except for the diaper changing part... Actually it's true, from Lebanon to Canada. It's not related to poverty. Muslim men marry multiple women, and they have plenty of kids. For example, Suleiman the Magnificent made hundreds of kids with his wives and harem women (who, by the way, were Christians). That's certainly not related to poverty. I think that this way, if some men take multiple women, some people are left single. Thus it permits the single men to go for other causes (terrorism) instead of founding a family. Edited June 1, 2007 by Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) Dave Wait, how do Muslim men take more than 1 wife in the west??!? I thought that was illegal??? In Lebanon and other Arab countries in the Middle East, as well as Iran , polygamy is not practiced as often as people think it is.... In Lebanon it is very very rare. By the way, way to go, you take the case of a Sultan , to draw conclusions that fertility rates are not related to poverty. Please look up some studies on the correlation between fertility rate and poverty and lack of family planning services. By the way in China , due to the 1 child policy , people engage in infanticide when they find out that they will have a female baby , and this has had severe implications on the male: female ratio. .. this has resulted in a lot of single men who cannot find women to marry... and a similar case in India , though for different reasons (mostly cultural ) people do not want female kids... yet I do not see how you conclude that when someone is single one engages in such activities as blowing himself up in a restaurant or whatever. Edited June 1, 2007 by Sassun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 By the way, way to go, you take the case of a Sultan , to draw conclusions that fertility rates are not related to poverty. It's a mere example. yet I do not see how you conclude that when someone is single one engages in such activities as blowing himself up in a restaurant or whatever. Do I need to remind you that Islamic mentality is different than those of China and India? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Hey, I'd love to see Sassun take multiple Armenian wives. Let's not forget with multiple Armenian wives, he will have to deal with multiple Armenian Zokanches as well. That will teach him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Hey, I'd love to see Sassun take multiple Armenian wives. Let's not forget with multiple Armenian wives, he will have to deal with multiple Armenian Zokanches as well. That will teach him No way !!!!!!!!!!! I'll stick to one, thank you very much. Besides the fact that polygamy is not my thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Do I need to remind you that Islamic mentality is different than those of China and India? What do you mean ? There are Muslims in China and India as well..................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmoPhil Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) Sassun, are you in a relationship with an Armenian? Edited June 1, 2007 by ArmoPhil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmoPhil Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Anyways, IMO, if you see Islam's history, it has been a violent one. I personally think no one was interested in Islam, that is why Muhammad started a conquest and converted many countries Islamic. But if you look at Christianity, it was done by a peaceful way. Hell it wasn't even Jesus' intent to create a new Religion. People loved him so much that they started praising him and eventually, it became a religion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) Sassun, are you in a relationship with an Armenian? No, i am not in a relationship with anyone. Btw , Christianity was not exactly and definitely not always spread 'peacefully'. Do you know that at some point , it was accepted that 'killing a Muslim is the duty of every Christian and the path to heaven' ??? (and actually people did it ) this was not even about forceful conversion , it was about pure intolerance and mass murder. So you are wrong in praising Christianity's history to the skies while at th same time attacking Islam for its violent history . By the way , have you heard of the Battle of Khaybar ? (Today there is a popular song in Lebanon and other Arab countries , Khaybar Khaybar ya yahood jaishu Muhammad sawfa ya'ud -- Khaybar Khaybar O Jews, the army of Mohammed will return ) . The Battle of Khaybar was started because the Jews in Khaybar plotted and rebelled against Mohammed 's army , when thy were not even touched before that... And actually, Prophet Muhammad also had "companions " (in Arabic Sahabah) and they had voluntarily (and not forcefully!!!) adhered to his teachings...... Edited June 1, 2007 by Sassun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annannimusss Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Sassun, you still have not explained how you feel about turning on 1.5 million Martyrs who died for there and my faith, died to stay Armenian, died for you and me to be alive today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sassun Posted June 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Sassun, you still have not explained how you feel about turning on 1.5 million Martyrs who died for there and my faith, died to stay Armenian, died for you and me to be alive today. Will it change a thing, if I answer ? No, it won't. Therefore I do not see what is the point. Or wait, I will answer. I feel like a traitor. Happy now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 (edited) Do you know that at some point , it was accepted that 'killing a Muslim is the duty of every Christian and the path to heaven' ??? (and actually people did it ) this was not even about forceful conversion , it was about pure intolerance and mass murder. This isn't a rule of Chirstianity because it isn't written anywhere in the Bible. It is not Jesus' fault if some Christian leaders distorted the message of Christianity. Edited June 1, 2007 by Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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