Markar_0v_Xaos Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Some people herehave assumed that there are even other hyes in one's area TO marry!! And this even refuses to acknowledge schisms of religion, politics, class and gender and plain old attraction ( ARA! a mouthful to type !) And also, to the purist types who believe that any and all " mixed Armenians" are no longer hye ( as if that individual EVER had any choice as to who their parentage was ) ??!! You have some VERY good points, however that I agree with in this context. HOWEVER_ assuming we accept your premise; What do you make of people from mixed background ..say somebody that's 1/2 or a quarter... who are fighting to keep their identity when they are not surrounded by a community? No Armenian language schools..no church...no AYF , ARF, AYCOA...no barbeques...no madags...np poetry...nothing for much of their life except for the superhuman ability to spot an Armenian name in a phone book or movie titles or school lists at lightning speed and the joy of watching their Armenian relatives succumb to assimilation year by year while at the same time being fed nationalistic ideas and being held to unattainable and gendered standards of behavior on account of "being Armenian"... and NO ONE to talk hayeren with even if their Armenian relatives finally agreed to teach them? Imagine being a 7 year old having to literally *beg* your relatives when you see them intermittently, or spend a year or so with them, to teach you Armenian so that you can communicate with your cousins and other family members? Imagine being refused to be taught by those Armenian relatives year after year the language/dialect? Imagine having to defend racist accusations and misunderstandings by your *own* non-armenian parent from a small age. To be a mini-educator and expert geographer to non-armenians- including your own relatives from such a young age. Imagine watching the pain of your Armenian parents and grandparents as they fight to assimilate. Imagine being told that out of all known family members, you are the only one of the grandchildren known of who knows the history, was around before total assimilation took place, and is the only one of them left who wants to learn, because the others are too poor, isolated and ignorant to know or want to learn? Imagine the pain of that child who becomes conscious of the implications of assimilation from a race subjected to genocide. Imagine the burden of that child who feels on one hand responsible to take advantage of waning prejudices and acceptance of ethnic pride to maintain identity against the genocide of assimilation on one hand, and not being accepted when intermittently around hye communities on the other? Some of the previous can be used to make arguements *against* intermarriage. But what to do with the children of these marriages who are conscious and decide that they *will not* be a party to the final stages, even if they remain marginalized by armenian communities? How can you then shoulder the burden entirely on these people when much of it is on account of factos beyond their choice like history, geography and class? And then consign them to oblivion when it comes to marriage issues? Isn't this a case of " blaming the victims"? Should they just give up, and say " you purist ethnonationalist types are right.. otar I am than" or should they fight for their place in the community? This includes the right to acceptance in marriage to a " full blood" armenian, which can only be made possible with further dialogues on the meaning of identity in a DEEP sense. Every conscious hye has to admit that it is *very* important as the last stages of genocide are going through (assimilation and denial). What do you ethnonationalist purists make of these mixed Armenians who try hard, with no language schools or little to no community around, who want to marry another Armenian? Do you think they should tell the " full blood" at a barahantes or party or whatever mode of singles meeting that " Well, I might LOOK a lil Hye and ACT a lil Hye an speak a lil Hayeren , but REALLY .. I'm an odar!" Doesn't this seem a wee bit , well.. weird? ( Damn, I feel like I'm talking reservation politics here with all this " full blood"/half-blood talk ;-) Why should the mixed-bloods throw in the towel and NOT fight ?? Why should the mixed ones who are trying to maintain thier identity against odds, and who ALSO grew up with the horror stories of the genocide , and the guilt of feeling complicit with jermag chert and the burden of assimilation... Why should they , if they are CONSCIOUS... essentially say " Well... the Turks won with my family. We are sufficiently ODAR-IFIED. We now surrender ;-) " Denial is one of the final states of genocide. And I , a mixed blood ARMENIAN .. REFUSE to be party to denial. I *do* wish to marry an Armenian man, mostly because of social programming and trust ( my emotional trust is mostly with Armenian men on account of my raising ). However, this assumes that I am *accepted* by in-laws and the like, and the community. And honey, one thing is right here in this forum where people have included money as a factor, not only do you have to be accepted, but you have to come from money and act like a material girl/dress like a material girl just to get these hye boys glances. And , to be " amergihye" in phrasing " Ara.. some of us are just BROKE and trying to get by, much less act the princess" . And some of us are simply politically and socially opposed to materialism and capitalism and how they play out in the politics of love. You should really think of the reality on the ground for many of us who do not want to surrender to the final stages of genocide. Not *ALL* of us have the luxury to travel to Armenian lands and communities, or plop down a good chunk of money for Armenian language software or books that actually WORK, or travel to armenian communities for overpriced barahantes ,,,and some of us like myself actually GO to the sparse Armenian church meetings ( even if we're very secular), weather the community gossip, donate money, educate other communities on Armenian issues, save money when we're broke and unemployed for ptitiful Armenian "language" books, read on events, and help where we can. TO be blunt, he77 NO I refuse to call myself en total an " odar" and prove the #$% murderers right. Even my not-so conscious mixed cousins refuse. And I refuse also on account of the fact that I *am* the last of my family who forms a line and was raised by a generation who spoke Armenian, had a community and knows the history. On the note of marriage, all I got to say is " vorteg e Monte Melkonian??????????/" Now THAT's an Armenian man I would give my personal library for ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Vigil, define me race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loxxsqueen Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Vigil, you are not only ridiculous, the almost propaganda you spew is offensive and disgusting. YOu are self serving and self-righteous... If you do not understand the concept that the word 'race' is a man-made word and has absolutely no scientific backing... you are incredibly misguided and ignorant. Your near propoganda found here is not because you are so intelligent, it derives from you ignorance, lack of education, narrow-mindedness and self righteousness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 I think we have a schizo among ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Please edit your posts from personal insults, and try to use normal fonts <_< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loxxsqueen Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Vigil I am insulting you. You do a good job of that yourself. Can you hear yourself talk??? The ideologies that come from the distorted mind you have, of the world are absurd. To use words like 'mongrelesque' shows your ignorance... To call 'Americans' a race, shows you are not that you are not that learned and inteligent after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Mongrel wasn't used as an insult? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Sorry, Queen, didn't see your post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loxxsqueen Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Are you kidding Vigil. You have the nerve (you are on the hollier than thou horse by the way) to tell people how Armenian they are or not, you think you have the right to justify other peoples existence, including other Arme nians,and then YOU ASK THE QUESTION WHO HAVE I OFFENDED?? What a nerve .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vigil Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 (edited) Edited May 31, 2004 by Vigil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loxxsqueen Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 okay... okay Vigil, just calm down. I think there's more to life than the silly stuff you say.... Excuse me, I need y to enjoy the rest of my Sunday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 I know I am very badly placed to say this. But please guys don't get personal, and stop those insults. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 Mongrel an insult? ITS THE GOD DAM TRUTH. LAST TIME I CHECKED THE DEFINITION OF MONGREL IS "THE OFFSPRING OF PARENTS OF DIFFERENT BREEDS". Breed? Are you talking about dogs and cats or human beings? That is what you are doing like you have been doing for the whole thread, I have no idea why you've been let pass so long - you are reducing ethnicities into "breeds" of "lesser animals"... Are you an insolent (fill-in-the-blanks) or are you a king-size BS'er? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtraHye Posted May 23, 2004 Report Share Posted May 23, 2004 I'm sorry you guys, but this thread has gone way far. This thread is closed. Edit: The thread we be reopened once it gets cleaned up. So calm down, it's not the end of the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamMaster69 Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 to be honest with you I'll say that I woild want all armenians to marry an armenian,but at the same time it's not my responsibility to tell what others to do.I really want to have an armenian wife never know what can future brings,but that is my desire.I have never been in L.A. but I 've heard if i'll go I'll change my mind for having armenian wife,but I don't think so...."WE ARE FEW ,BUT THEY CALL AS ARMENIAN,....LET'S NOT MIX US WITH THEM.. style_images/master/snapback.png ha,ha ..... first, Armenian is NOT a race ... its a people. If you all intermarry, you will get funny kids and your people will be even more in danger. Trust me, look in your local villages where cousin has married cousin. Some of their kids can hardly see straight, are very strange looking and when they have a headache, its not the IQ that is pressuring. Its not an Armanian thing alone. It happens in lots of local towns/countries. Even in the USA. Look at the "Hill Billies" in the mountain area. So please, go travel and marry. Bring some fresh blood into the family and your family/people will prevail much, much longer than if you marry a local/cousin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kakachik77 Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 How is it the truth???? How many "Armenian" women have you met? Just because your ex wife was like that, doesn't mean all Armenian women are. Don't tell me your younger girlfriend isn't using you for your money. Pllllllllllease. style_images/master/snapback.png my 2 cents on this issue is that if you for some weird reason attract women who are into money and cars then perhaps it's because that's what you prefer to advertise about yourself...basically try learning about yourself first before putting the blame on the entire humanity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armjan Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 instead approaching from this perspective(marry armenian or not), think about it from this perspective, marry whoever that brings out the best in you, in your life's work, and how you treat each other. afterall, that's one of the most important ingriendents for marriage as far as i am concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armjan Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 my 2 cents on this issue is that if you for some weird reason attract women who are into money and cars then perhaps it's because that's what you prefer to advertise about yourself...basically try learning about yourself first before putting the blame on the entire humanity style_images/master/snapback.png I agree. I am not a girl, but from my experience with spending time with them,I don't think that girls are all about money. i know this is kind of obvious, but i think they just want to have fun. But i would say that the older they get, the more conservative they become as far as interests in guyz stable/financial assests. I mean as a guy, you definetely have your own life and if she fits in, then look into, she might be worth u'r time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lana Posted March 20, 2005 Report Share Posted March 20, 2005 what you guys think about "we armenians should marry an armenian"? I am not against marriages to other nationalities as far as it has something to do with LOVE. By the way there is a thread here about guys from US marrying girls from Armenia. Why is it closed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamavor Posted March 21, 2005 Report Share Posted March 21, 2005 Marring into your own culture has one big advantage. No matter where you live you will always feel at HOME! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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