The Situation In Lebanon

[ArmoPhil]

Do you really think the U.S. has enough troops to launch an attack on Iran, let alone control Iran, when it cannot even control Iraq?

 

The U.S. doesn't have infinite resources.

The US doesn't even have 15% of its troops in Iraq... They have somewhat 130 000 troops on 1,426,713. To note, the U.K will probably follow the Americans along with the Jews. But, declaring war against Iran is basically starting WW3. To note that Russia is a major enemy of Iran as well.

Edited June 9, 2007 by ArmoPhil

[Sassun]

Really? That's why Monte Melkonian was defending the Armenians in BourjHammoud from invading Muslims during the Civil war.. Right?

They were Christians not Muslims.

Edited June 9, 2007 by Sassun

[Shahan Araradian]

Why exactly did the Armenians perish when Turkey decided to clean up the non-muslims?

You are confusing Turkish nationalism with Islam. The Armenian genocide was fueled by Turkish NATIONALISM, not Islam. It's easy to mix the two, though, since it just happened to be that the Turks are Muslim and Armenians Christian.

 

Were we "Zionists" in 1915 too?

Morgethau could have done a lot more to protect the Armenians; being a Zionist, he DID indeed protect the Jews of the rest of the Ottoman Empire.

 

This is the most pathetic excuse I have ever heard and it's purely an excuse to further the call of Islam to anihilate anyone who disagrees with it. Armenians in Iran have been VERY lucky that the masses are still not hard core "Hezb Allah" and wouldn't stand for their government irradicating hordes of non-muslims. In Lebannon, the non-muslims have the tremendous advantage of having some decent numbers to survive.

If you knew any Lebanese Muslims personally, you would know that they are ordinary human beings. You have been brainwashed by the Zionist-controlled media in the U.S. (which -- don't take it personally -- you clearly get your world view from) into thinking that all Muslims are bad, that they are sub-human, are out to convert everyone into Islam. Nonsense.

 

But if Hizb Allah had it's way, the whole world would be converted or simply killed. Don't doubt that for a second.

You are making that up. The Hizballah has never made such a claim. They are an organization with socialist roots that provide social services as well as physical defense for their people. Their model of government is to be envied, and that is why the Zionists don't want them to prosper.

 

They are the Hezb of Allah ... they do NOT recognize anyone's right to believe otherwise.

I PERSONALLY have been invited to dine and spend time with a Hezbollah family in the Bekaa Valley. You would be pleasantly surprised as to the hospitality and the humanity of these people.

 

The only reason they have given up trying to enforce their Islamic agenda in Lebanon (politically) is because they know they do not have enough support in the population for their bullshit views.

If Lebanese Christians stopped leaving Lebanon, then there would still remain a balance in the Christian-Muslim population. It's not the Muslims' fault that their own population is growing faster -- more kids staying in Lebanon ... guess who ends up in the majority?

Edited June 9, 2007 by Shahan Araradian

[annannimusss]

Read the damn posts, I will be able to read in a few semesters when I start taking classes at State. Hmmm,some people have real selective reading habits here. Edited June 9, 2007 by SakoPasha

[annannimusss]

Sassun, only Christains attacked Armenians, how are you even trying to say crap like that? You as well as I know that is not the case, muslims did attack Armenians!

 

 

Who were the people shooting 60 milimeter hounds at Zahle's popululation?Muslims! And killed my dads Armenian friend. How about the car bomb that went off in front of my dads friends MEchanic shop and killed mostly Armenians. These were all acts done by muslims.

 

How about Armenians driving there cars to Beirut who got killed by muslims.Are you forgetting all this.

Edited June 9, 2007 by SakoPasha

[Sassun]

Sassun, only Christains attacked Armenians, how are you even trying to say crap like that? You as well as I know that is not the case, muslims did attack Armenians!

Who were the people shooting 60 milimeter hounds at Zahle's popululation?Muslims! And killed my dads Armenian friend. How about the car bomb that went off in front of my dads friends MEchanic shop and killed mostly Armenians. These were all acts done by muslims.

 

How about Armenians driving there cars to Beirut who got killed by muslims.Are you forgetting all this.

Zahle is not an Armenian-majority city. It is a Maronite-sh*tty city. The attack on Zahle was about the civil sh*tty war betw. right wing parties & left wing ones , and Armenians were not part of either !

 

And as for car bombs, allow me to remind you who was the expert in car bombs . No wait, you probably know his name. And no, he is not a Muslim. Not the last time I checked.

[annannimusss]

Actually the City is not Maronite majority. It is Catholic, like 50%, then Greek Orthodox, then Maronites. IT is the Capital of the Cathoilics in the Middle East in a sense.

[Sassun]

Actually the City is not Maronite majority. It is Catholic, like 50%, then Greek Orthodox, then Maronites. IT is the Capital of the Cathoilics in the Middle East in a sense.

You are wrong. Revise your facts. Thanks.

[annannimusss]

The Limits of Lebanon's "Confessional" Model

Danny Dedeyan

 

17 December 2005

 

 

This holiday season, I am thankful for a political system that establishes, both explicitly and implicitly, the freedom of religion. As I observe the U.S. government debate how similar privileges can be guaranteed in Iraq, I am taken back to Lebanon, where I spent seven months of this past year studying the Armenian language and exploring Middle Eastern politics and culture. I first conceived of this trip after researching a framework for conflict transformation in Lebanon for a Masters program in International Affairs. I am of Armenian descent and Beirut is arguably the most dynamic cultural and political center for Diaspora Armenians. Consequently, I traveled to Lebanon to see for myself this mosaic of religious communities that was sewn together by force — but remains weak at the seams.

 

As I made my way to the Levant, I wondered how it could maintain a plethora of different factions that had fought each other so recently, and whose children now lived together. As I eventually observed, the "confessional system" that characterizes Lebanon's governing system is an unsatisfactory answer to these problems.

 

No sooner had I landed in the country than I began to enjoy the Levantine hospitality. I befriended individuals from all faiths. Locals who became instant friends took me to tour Beirut and its surrounding attractions. This is Jounieh," they would comment. "It's all Maronites here." Then in the surrounding hill-country…"Oh, Beittdine? That's Druze… Here we are in Zahle — Catholic .Similarly, I would peer from my hosts' balcony overlooking Beirut: "See?" They would explain, "To the South is the airport, that's mostly a Shiite neighborhood." Thus, in the midst of abundant goodwill, one quickly perceives Lebanon's pronounced geographical sectarianism.

 

http://216.109.125.130/search/cache?ei=UTF...=1&.intl=us

Edited June 9, 2007 by SakoPasha

[Sassun]

Zahle is not anywhere close to 50% Catholic , Sako. It is not a Catholic city. If it ever was majority Catholic, it would have been so in the 1800s. Today its Christian population is already down in favor of the Shiite population , and among the Christian population , the majority are Maronites. It is time to stop making these assumptions based on some 1932 census , which everyone seems to base their philosophy of the world on ! How about actually visiting Zahle ?

 

Btw , your article actually is meant to show the regional-sectarian stereotyping , and not the real demographics of these areas. If anything, a great many of South Beirut (Dahieh)'s registered voters (and many inhabitants) are Christian.

Edited June 9, 2007 by Sassun

[AK-47]

Really? That's why Monte Melkonian was defending the Armenians in BourjHammoud from invading Muslims during the Civil war.. Right?

The Phalangists were the first to put the Armenians in Bourj Hammoud in danger when they requested we join the civil war and we wisely stayed neutral, which they afterwards followed by shelling us. We played it right. I see and speak to ex-pat Maronite Lebanese Arabs everyday and they tell me about how they regret going into the civil war and they praise us Armenians for playing it smart by staying neutral.

 

Also, don't get so high about Monte's role in Lebanon. I've heard from Lebanese Armenians that at some point, he participated in the killing of fellow Armenians, notably Dashnaks.

Edited June 9, 2007 by AK-47

[AK-47]

The US doesn't even have 15% of its troops in Iraq... They have somewhat 130 000 troops on 1,426,713. To note, the U.K will probably follow the Americans along with the Jews. But, declaring war against Iran is basically starting WW3. To note that Russia is a major enemy of Iran as well.

 

It will still be stretching its army. You need at least 60% of American troops at home at all times to defend the homeland. And ressources does not only mean men but equipment, funding etc. The UK won't join USA in an Iran war, even Bush's ex-foreign policy lapdog Blair objected to an Iran war. And says who Russia is a major enemy of Iran...Russia is actually building Iran's reactors lol. And Russia is the only one who is showing some opposition to UN mumbo jumbo and "tolerance" to Iran's power plant program.

Edited June 9, 2007 by AK-47

[Sip]

The Hizballah has never made such a claim. They are an organization with socialist roots that provide social services as well as physical defense for their people. Their model of government is to be envied, and that is why the Zionists don't want them to prosper.

 

You have been completely brain washed by the anti-semitic media. You are making all that up.

[Sassun]

Also, don't get so high about Monte's role in Lebanon. I've heard from Lebanese Armenians that at some point, he participated in the killing of fellow Armenians, notably Dashnaks.

Ramgavars ? :rolleyes:

 

They have the wrong guy ... Monte Melkonian never did such a thing . He might have had disagreements (re: ASALA) but he never killed any Armenians . It's rumors or deliberate misrepresentation of the GREAT HERO MONTE MELKONIAN .

 

[Sassun]

You have been completely brain washed by the anti-semitic media. You are making all that up.

Really ?

 

http://www.jihadbinaa2006.org/

http://www.alshahid.org/

http://alemdad.net/

http://www.alrasoul.org/

[Sip]

How about Armenians driving there cars to Beirut who got killed by muslims.Are you forgetting all this.

 

According to Sassun, no muslim ever does anything wrong. Those who do all those bad things are not muslims in his eyes. It's kind of a very cute and yet pathetically naive way of looking at the world. Also in his eyes, the Hezb Allah is going to embrace all non muslims (e.g. Armenians) and live wonderfully ever after in Lebanon and other places, once Israel is demolished. There is so much absurdity spewing around in this thread that is almost funny.

 

 

[AK-47]

If Lebanese Christians stopped leaving Lebanon, then there would still remain a balance in the Christian-Muslim population. It's not the Muslims' fault that their own population is growing faster -- more kids staying in Lebanon ... guess who ends up in the majority?

Yeah true. I think the Christians refuse to hold censuses in Lebanon for obvious reasons. I think their numbers have dwindled down to 25% now. If there was a normal democratic system held in Lebanon, the Shi'as would hold double the number of seats of the Christians. Sad that they are all leaving.

[Sassun]

Yeah true. I think the Christians refuse to hold censuses in Lebanon for obvious reasons. I think their numbers have dwindled down to 25% now. If there was a normal democratic system held in Lebanon, the Shi'as would hold double the number of seats of the Christians. Sad that they are all leaving.

More like, 15% (max 20%) ...

 

From ministry sources .

[AK-47]

Ramgavars ? :rolleyes:

LOL nah, i don't know alot of Ramgavars. They were AYF members from Lebanon I spoke to online.

 

They have the wrong guy ... Monte Melkonian never did such a thing . He might have had disagreements (re: ASALA) but he never killed any Armenians . It's rumors or deliberate misrepresentation of the GREAT HERO MONTE MELKONIAN .

 

ASALA killed some Dashnaks in Lebanon, perhaps that is what they were talking about.

[Sassun]

LOL nah, i don't know alot of Ramgavars. They were AYF members from Lebanon I spoke to online.

ASALA killed some Dashnaks in Lebanon, perhaps that is what they were talking about.

If they are really AYF members then that is a pity indeed as they do not know the story . in short , the story is that there was a split in ASALA , and there was a shooting incident , following which some people circulated the rumor that it was people associated to Monte , and so in revenge , they killed 2 of Monte's friends who had nothing to do with the incident . that is the whole 'Monte connection' ....

[Sassun]

According to Sassun, no muslim ever does anything wrong. Those who do all those bad things are not muslims in his eyes. It's kind of a very cute and yet pathetically naive way of looking at the world. Also in his eyes, the Hezb Allah is going to embrace all non muslims (e.g. Armenians) and live wonderfully ever after in Lebanon and other places, once Israel is demolished. There is so much absurdity spewing around in this thread that is almost funny.

Why do you need to define Armenians in terms of religious belonging ? In Lebanon Armenians have shown , throughout the civil war , that they do not want to be part of this sectarian-religious identification / group identity mentality . We are Armenian first and foremost, no matter what our religion . The Christians tried to view us as "Christians " , but they failed to prioritize this identity over our Armenian identity (otherwise we would have been assimilated into the Arab Christian community ) . Clear indication of this is the fact that when ppl talk about Arab Christians they only say "Christians " , but when they talk about Armenian Christians , they say Armenians . There is a reason why Armenians are not just referred to as "Christians " , and this is not because Armenians are any less Lebanese or identify any less as Lebanese !! Pls revise your outlook because it is very myopic .

 

Hezb Allah probably has not even thought of what would happen if Israel is demolished . In fact if / when that happens , HezbAllah and the Shiites of Lebanon more generally , might find themselves pushed against a wall by the Sunni majority which might turn its attention to settling old scores...

[ArmoPhil]

Alright just because Monte killed 1 Dashnak Member we have to start blaming him for the deaths of Christian Armenians? Send me a reference if you can, I've been trying to find any sources that say Monte has killed a Dashnak Member. Not that I don't believe you, I just want to make sure.

 

For the Iran vs Jewistan + America subject,

 

I'm confident that the IDF would stand their ground against Iran. They have an overwhelming technical lead over Iran, and the almost unconditional support of the US. They'd do just fine.

[Sassun]

Alright just because Monte killed 1 Dashnak Member

He did not killl a Tashnag member !!!!!!!!

Or any Armenian !!!

 

Monte was a real TASHNAGTSAGAN , he was critical of the defeatist methods of the A.R. F and the faction of the ASALA that he split from !!

[Sip]

Hezb Allah probably has not even thought of what would happen if Israel is demolished . In fact if / when that happens , HezbAllah and the Shiites of Lebanon more generally , might find themselves pushed against a wall by the Sunni majority which might turn its attention to settling old scores...

 

The point was and still is, there will ALWAYS be scores to settle with Hezb Allah around. Israel now, Sunnies now and later, Christians, then the non religious, it will never end. THAT is the problem with Hezb Allah no matter how much you like them or how wonderful you think they are.

[Sassun]

The point was and still is, there will ALWAYS be scores to settle with Hezb Allah around. Israel now, Sunnies now and later, Christians, then the non religious, it will never end. THAT is the problem with Hezb Allah no matter how much you like them or how wonderful you think they are.

The problem is not with Hezb Allah , but with the Sunnis .

The Sunnis need to get some guts and brains and honor and stop blowing themselves up and fight like real men. Then we can see who will settle scores with whom.