khodja

TWILIGHT BARK, Ays esheen hede eencho ge khosis?

TWILIGHT BARK, Just follow MJ's post over the months and you will get a sense of his disposition. You all know that I am an angry man by now. With him you can see that he is total cynical. He has an extremely narrow-minded view of what an Armenain should be. Those who do not fit his image of an Armenian, he immediately dismisses. "Eencho ge harkes ays marteh?"

Hovsep, Your view of an Armenian is different than mine. You are so deep into the traditional way of thinking that you do not understand my viewpoint. I do not HATE Armenians. I respect progressive Armenians such as Anna Eshoo, Dick Harpootlian, Raffi Manoukian, Rachel Kaprielian, Cher, Charles Garry, etc. It is the Ottoman/Soviet/Arab rigidity that I HATE. Do you know anything of the diversity of Armenian thought through the centuries? Do you know that some of the most enlightening viewpoints in history were engendered in the Armenian community, only to be quelched by the traditionalists?

MJ, You have made a brilliant observation. But you have not gone far enough. These Turkish citizens of Armenian Apostolic (and have you forgotten Armenian Catholic Uniate and Evangelical) adherences are really not as pure as those from eastern origins. A lot of interspersal of other races and peoples, e.g. French and Mongol in Giligia, former Jews from Adiabene Kingdom and Urfa (Edessa)region (Christian Jews). Religion, not necessarily genes or approach, has forged identity in this diaspora.

MJ, You are again in true form. Kill the bastards? What the hell is wrong with you? Even in view of the latest debacle concerning the INS and Armenian nationals you adhere so tightly to your conservative ideology (this attested by you in a recent posting) and your adulation of George Bush. Yet you claim that I am less of an Armenian than you are?

Interesting, in view that is WELL DOCUMENTED that the the man who is held in the most high esteem by the Turkish nation today PRACTICED the dualist sexual identity that you have alluded to.

Semper Hye, I am as Armenian as you claim to be. Who are you to determine that I am not Armenian? 1/8 Assori does not amount to not being Armenian. I suspect that you added to this thread after it was dormant for months because Karekin II met with the Israeli Foreign Minstry undersecretary Peleg yesterday in his chambers in Etchmiadzin. You are very transparent.

He is still young. His time will come. The country needs time to acclimate to an American-born Armenian as President. Armenia needs time to de-Sovietize. Kocharyan understands the system, as corrupt and inefficient as it is.

Immediately after he head that the first plane had hit the tower in New York, the President's brother, Jeb Bush, exclaimed "Did the terrorists do it? Why didn't he think that it was a plane malfunction, unless he had previous knowledge?

One prominent "Christian" soldier once told me "It is not the reality that counts, but the perception." If someone who has been involved in homosexual relations well in the past is disease free and HIV negative, then it is imperative to make it appear that they have AIDS. Ralph Reed stated that by running stealth campaigns, the public would wake up after elections in "body bags." Does this guy sound like a follower of Jesus to you? Looks like Bush and Company put the Armenian lobby in "body bags" concerning the recent INS/Justice Dept. debacle.

Winston, Have you lived and worked with these folks, like I have? Do you know their inner thoughts like I do? They will do anything to make their prophesies come true. Do you really believe that the US FBI and CIA had no idea that 9/11 was about to take place. Are you that naive?

Jesus lived poor and washed the feet of others. Benny lives in an oceanfront castle in Dana Point and drives a multitude of luxury automobiles. The only reason that designated homosexuals and bisexuals were consumed in fire in 1995 was because Benny and his so-called Christian Republican friends secretly poisoned them. Not having any homosexual relations for 20-odd years did not matter, they would poison you anyway. BENNY IS A SNAKE-OIL SALESMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TB, Place any people in a new environment and they will conform somewhat to that environment. Armenians have done this quite well over the centuries. Many new Armenians have assimilated new cultures while holding on to the things that keep them Armenian. We have more of this due to the fact that the majority of Armenians are in a diaspora. The key word for us should be tolerance. One of my closest friends in my youth was Yegytotzi Hye. I was totally America-Hye. As for your comment that homosexuality or bisexuality has to do with genitals, that is not correct. It has to do with the mind. The genitals are just a machine which is controlled by the mind. Whatever causes these phonomenon emanates from the mind. Homosexuals exhibit an approach to the world which is different than that of heterosexuals. The bisexuals, who can are aware of both camps, understand this best. The celibates, who do not dissipate their energies become very aware that this whole phenomenon is based in the mind.

Nairi, Why would you even think that I was refering to you? you are one of the more open minds in this forum. It is some of the men HERE who are pig-headed, like the individual who has a problem with Armenians from Turkey demanding their rights or the individual who paints all Jews with one brush. No, my problem is with rhe perfectly- coiffed matrons who sit on the Board of Directors of the majority of our organizations.

TB, As usual you possess great insights. Yet if it were not for flame-throwers such as Baliozian and myself, the thoughs you so eloquently express would never come into the Armenian consciousness.

System of a Down and a long-scraggly haired German hippie are the Armenian heros of today, not the serpent-tongued Neiman-Marcus matrons throwing society balls.

It is all part of the "Holier than Thou" mentality of so many Armenians. Wearing their Christianity on their sleeves like a badge of honor. Treating Jews like crap back in the homeland. All of this has come back to haunt us. You would think that reform is begging. But the dans-kloochs who run things won't stoop down to accept System of a Down. The LA cops view Armenians as criminals, yet our community leaders claim that we are as pure as the driven snow. Yet we are social moralists, while so many young Armenian women are acting as prostitutes to fat old Turkish and Arab men from Istambul to Qatar.

MJ, I understand your reasoning as to why Armenians will become less tied to the community as they enter the corporate world. However, please explain from your viewpoint why so many prominent Armenians either barely acknowledge that they are Armenian or part Armenian, such as Cher or Agassi, or vehemently deny the truth such as Michael Arlen and Gregory Peck? I know of this phenomenon in my own family members, some of whom are only first generation in America. I am not aware of this denial among any other nationality. Even part Italians, Greeks, Jews, Hispanics whom I know proudly express their heritage.

It all comes down to two litle words "Amot e." Two little words that will lead to our extinction.

To make a fool of oneself anonymously is not my concern. To shock the Armenian community into what they are doing is my concern.

I will cease when someone in power starts listening. When the Armenia Church starts to minister to all of the families in pain, when not only the very prominent are listened to, when we gather all our people together as a team. Do I really care that you are annoyed? Do I think that you are listening to the basic premise of my arguments? Until that time I will drone on an on, just like Baliozian does with his arguments. You must say that I have gotten your attention, haven't I? Even if it is negative attention.

The Republicans turned everyone's attention to Clinton's sexual exploits in order to gain advantage to win the election in 2000. Millions of American tax dollars were spent to investigate Clinton's sexual exploits. No financial wrongdoing was ever found. Clinton conducted his job honorably. If you cheated on your wife would you admit it to the whole world? Whose business is it anyway but his wife's? Maybe the Democrats should appoint a Special Prosecutor to investigate the secret sexual exploits of the Republicans, many of whom have trysts with young women not their wives and some even with other men.

At the tender age of 30, I was in a relationship with a beautiful young lady who went on to become a DA and marry one of the most famous trial attorneys in America. Another woman in my work group developed a fatal attraction to me. She stalked me day and night, even renting an apartment a few doors down from my residence, to seek out why I was not interested in her offers of accompanying her to the ballgame with tickets she had bought. I was in a relationship with a woman that I loved. I was still searching my soul and experimenting. I was involved with a few passing same-sex liaisons about that time. When told her that I was involved with another woman in the office she went on a rampage. A young Hispanic guy in the office who already hated Deukmejian, all Armenians, and me (who had gained the respect of my supervisors), initiated a campaign of harassment when he found out from this woman that I had also tallied with men. This issue followed me for years. I was told by supervisors in diffrent jobs that despite my excellence in doing my job, no manager could ptomote me into a management job because of repercussions that would ensue from complaints against "my kind." You call it paranoia, I call it the REAL world.

Extensive counseling I have had. Meds only poison the temple within which God temporarily placed our souls. The mantle I have placed upon myself is "shock-jock." In real life I am quite shy. When you see your people collectively rushing like a bunch of lemmings toward national genocide, shock-jockism is the only way to get their attention.

You have crytallized the essence of our collective demise. What held us together through centuries in the homeland does not work in the present diaspora. The Jews successfully made the transition. We have not.