An Outrageous Denial Of Armenian Genocide

[artusian]

Happy new year to all members. I am going to share a very important news with the members here as well as I think that is very important to know.

 

This is troubling to read that Armenian genocide is denied by some people. It is very disturbing to read that it is denied by some high profile people like doctors! This cannot be accepted. I came across a site where a medical doctor named Ariel Barkan, denies it in a very harsh way. This was so disturbing that I chose to share this with members of this forum.

 

Read his message yourself:

 

(Armenian Tale of Turkish Genocide Simply Untrue

I am an Israeli Jew, originally from the former Soviet Union, and have no dog in the Turkish-Armenian fight.

 

Nevertheless, the history of Armenian-Turkish relations is a difficult and complex one, and Jonathan Tobin did it a disservice when he wrote to support the Armenian claim of genocide (A Matter of Opinion: "Choosing Allies Over Principles," April 26).

 

During World War I, the nationalist Armenian movement was egged on by Czarist Russia to revolt against the Turks. This was designed to protect the flank of the Russian Empire from an attack by Germany's ally Turkey.

 

The Armenians obliged and unleashed an unprecedented terrorist campaign against ethnic Turks that resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of civilians.

 

The Ottoman Turks ordered the Armenians ousted from the affected areas. In the process, many were killed by the Kurdish gangs, many died of infections and starvation -- although it should be stated that Turks were dying like flies as well, and from the same causes.

 

But there was no genocide, because of the lack of intent or organized action on the part of the Turkish government to exterminate Armenians as such. The "ethnic cleansing" was limited to Eastern Anatolia. No Armenian in Istanbul was expelled or harmed.

 

The Armenians want to preserve the status of victims, not unlike the Palestinians. For years, Armenian terrorists killed Turks all over Europe, sent letter bombs, and set explosives in Turkish cultural centers.

Ariel Barkan, M.D.

Ann Arbor, Mich. )

 

from this site

 

http://www.jewishexponent.com/article/13003/

 

After googling his name, I found that this man is a highly profiled doctor and this makes it even more disturbing:

 

http://www2.med.umich.edu/department...nal%20Medicine

 

How can an educated man deny the Armenian genocide? Read his message and you will find more about him. We need to find more people like this man who as highly-profiled people can do lot of damage to the Armenian cause. This is very outrageous. His speech on medical issue, obviously an educated man.

http://endocrinefellows.org/new_medi...deo_frame.html

 

Artusian

[Ashot]

(Armenian Tale of Turkish Genocide Simply Untrue

I am an Israeli Jew, originally from the former Soviet Union, and have no dog in the Turkish-Armenian fight.

 

Ariel Barkan, M.D.

 

I just wonder if barkan is an israeli jew last name... and also if he has no dog in it, why does he care? this could be either a Turk or Azeri... last name just surprises me, he calls himself israeli jew...

[Ashot]

I just wonder if barkan is an israeli jew last name... and also if he has no dog in it, why does he care? this could be either a Turk or Azeri... last name just surprises me, he calls himself israeli jew...

just confermed that the last name is israeli... no doubt on that!

[artusian]

just confermed that the last name is israeli... no doubt on that!

 

Ashot

 

He is an Israeli Jew as he says himself. His name is real so his medical information and job. The question is what this man is doing.

 

This is very dangerous that a man in that position spreads such hate. As a medical doctor/medic he should love people and respect them.

 

One wonder what he does to his Armenian patients. It is outrageous. He has a dog in the fight. The question is why and what?

 

Read his hateful message, this is unbearavle.

 

Artusian

[Arpa]

I have a very short message to this so called doctor quack.

 

GO SCRATCH!!

 

Who the hell invited him to meddle in furkish-Armenian affairs? How is this issue his business?

Do we meddle with their affairs with the Palestinians and the Germans? Maybe we should. He says the Armenians revolted against the Ottomans. The Armenians revolted? Against who? The French or the British? Armenians were demanding their rights and their own lands back. How is that a revolt?

Against whom?

How would this clown like it ifwe say that his people deserved it because they had become a pain in the neck of the Europeans? Shall we say that? Why? What business is ours to meddle in their relations with their opponents?

WHO THE HELL INVITED TO MEDDLE IN OUR BUSINESS?

WE DON’T HAVE TO BE NICE TO THEM.

He does not even deserve the dignity of a response. If we must then all we have to say is;

SHUT THE HELL UP!!!

ALL WE HAVE TO SAY IS TO GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR FACE!!!

Those who claim that we have something common with them don’t know the real story.**

I have heard this out of the mouth of eyewitnesses, that in Marash the local hryas would lead the murderous mobs saying - “Armenians live in this and that building”

Above we just saw and read about the hospitality of the Syrians of Aleppo. I hate to think what would have happened if his ilk had control of Aleppo.

** Read all the stories of spitting at the Armenian Cross that has come from their so called "promised land".

[artusian]

Arpa,

 

Well said. The problem if ignoring man is that he is in a powerful position, he is a medical doctor. Let put it this way, if he was nobody, we could ignored him, but he can influence people, and that is very dangerous. Second he signs that outrageous post by his real name and his MD title!!! That is evident that he feels secure and power. Such a thing he says is discrimination, racism and defaming. We need to make an officila complaint . Contactring him does not make sense, if someone posts such a contempting message, he has a racist. Help to inform as many Armenians as possible. Help to spread the word on different forums. Someone need to stop his racism. Imagine if someone writes some thing about his people in the America he will be punished

 

Contacting him does not make sense, but complaining yes, first many need informed about this statement

 

artusian

 

[Arpa]

Arpa,

Well said. The problem if ignoring man is that he is in a powerful position, he is a medical doctor.

artusian

Why are these hryas meddling in our affairs? When did we meddle in their affairs?

Who the hell invited him to be arbiter and judge in Armeno-furkish affairs?

Is he the reincarnation of Moshe/Yehovah that we Armenians still swear by, and ever since they entered our national affairs in 301 AD we have not had a day of peace and tranquility??

He is a medical doctor my vorik.

So was Dr. Mengele a medical physician, so is Dr. Jack Kevorkian.

How does him being a "medical doctor" make him different from a clown?

As a medical doctor he should specialize in cutting his male children's reproductive organs, and, in the process cut his own, lest we do it.

Tell him again. TO GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR VORIKS!!!

I don't want to subscribe to the site, but those who are can relate this my message to him.

"Dear Dr. Mengele, or whatever the F* your name is. Who invited you to comment on turko-Armenian relations?

YOU are welcome to comment about the subject as many times WE comment about the "holocaust-schmolocaust".

Now, GET THE f OFF OUR TUCHUS AND CONCENTRATE ON CUTTING THE PREPUCE OF YOUR ILK.

Are you the alter-ego of Abe Focksman who contends to be judge and jury about Armenian affairs?

Why don't you get the fox out of here?

Is that Abe Fucsman still the director of ADL?

Edited January 3, 2008 by Arpa

[artusian]

He is medical doctor my vorik.

So was Dr. Mengele a medical physician, so is Dr. Jack Kevorkian.

How does him being a "medical doctor" make him different from a clown?

As a medical doctor he should specialize in cutting his male children's reproductive organs, and, in the process cut his own, lest we do it.

Tell him again. TO GET THE HELL OUT OF OUR VORIKS!!!

 

Arpa

You are absolutely correct. I dont know him. We need to stop him and his danegrous thoughts.

That is why I post his crazy and hate post here. Such a hate post by him is really crazy

 

Artusian

[Ashot]

Arpa

You are absolutely correct. I dont know him. We need to stop him and his danegrous thoughts.

That is why I post his crazy and hate post here. Such a hate post by him is really crazy

 

Artusian

Art jan, don't worry bro I have more medical doctor's on my side, probbly 30 of them that have nation wide importance, among them are germans, chineese, and other races, blacks too... don't worry too much, an M.D. like that has no business in politics and his voice can never gt accross because he is too small for being a politican, and there is a very good response under his comment from an american from phili, I give props to the man, he put the bastard doctor in it;s place far better than some armenians would!!!

I suggest not taking this all the way to the buttom of your heart, he is nothing for the media, there are far more important people and places where we need to watch out!!!

[Nikephoros_Phokas]

It is a waste of time to bother with people like him. The real issue is this:

 

The Turkish state is having positions on history and it imposing them on the Turkish populace and historians. It also imposes them abroad successfully in chairs of Ottoman and Turkish history. Someone needs to take Ottoman history Chairs at Universities in the USA for example away from the Turkish state. Some rich Armenian American, Greek American or organizations needs to get more people descended from Ottoman Christians who know modern Turkish and Ottoman Turkish into the field as Professors to challenge the Turkish hegemony.

[Arpa]

Art jan, don't worry bro I have more medical doctor's on my side, probbly 30 of them that have nation wide importance, among them are

===

a very good response under his comment from an american from phili, I give props to the man, he put the bastard doctor in it;s place far better than some armenians would!!!

===

please do tell us what that "Amrican from phili" said.

I don't want to open the site.

Let me rEpeat my message.

Those who want to respond to him have only one option; TELL THAT F HRYA TO GET OFF OF OUR CASE. It is none of his business just as his case is none of OUR business.

Speaking of which that hypocrite, aka Tom Lantos has decided to not search further election due to health matters (esopghageal cancer). Taros@ to Elie Weisel the weasel and other weasel and fox hypocrites of his kind.

Why am I not afraid tp air such stuff?

This is America, not TelAviv.

Edited January 3, 2008 by Arpa

[DominO123]

It is a waste of time to bother with people like him. The real issue is this:

 

The Turkish state is having positions on history and it imposing them on the Turkish populace and historians. It also imposes them abroad successfully in chairs of Ottoman and Turkish history. Someone needs to take Ottoman history Chairs at Universities in the USA for example away from the Turkish state. Some rich Armenian American, Greek American or organizations needs to get more people descended from Ottoman Christians who know modern Turkish and Ottoman Turkish into the field as Professors to challenge the Turkish hegemony.

 

He is a reputable researcher, he made a huge mistake and probably if we push this to expose him, he'll appologize.

[Ashot]

please do tell us what that "Amrican from phili" said.

I don't want to open the site.

Let me rEpeat my message.

Those who want to respond to him have only one option; TELL THAT F HRYA TO GET OFF OF OUR CASE. It is none of his business just as his case is none of OUR business.

Speaking of which that hypocrite, aka Tom Lantos has decided to not search further election due to health matters (esopghageal cancer). Taros@ to Elie Weisel the weasel and other weasel and fox hypocrites of his kind.

Why am I not afraid tp air such stuff?

This is America, not TelAviv.

 

Arpa jan here is his response!

 

What If It Had Been Jews Instead of Armenians?

Jonathan Tobin asks: "Would it be worth it to damage an alliance with Turkey just to make a point about the truth of Armenian suffering? That might make us feel righteous, but if it leads to more deaths in the future, would it be right?" (A Matter of Opinion: "Choosing Allies Over Principles," April 26).

 

If we were to substitute Jews for Armenians, would it change the feelings behind the statement?

Sue Blum

Philadelphia

 

Here you go, it's a good response by my opinion

[gamavor]

Actually, my take on such sophisticated people like this Jew doctor is simple. There WAS NEVER EVER JEWEISH HOLOHOAX! NEVER! IT IS ALL JEWISH PROPAGANDA TO JUSTIFY THEIR OCCUPITION OF ARAB LANDS.

The Jews betrayed the third Reich and made alliance with their ideological brothers in Russia – the Bolsheviks. Naturally, they were relocated from the war zone in order to prevent their collaboration with the Red Army.

 

I will not even comment on some minor technical issues – such as burning 2 million people through one single chimney. It is all BS….

 

 

The best proof that there was never a Jewish shoah is the attitude of the Jews and Israel. There is no way that people who suffered from such atrocities would hesitate to voice their support or concern for those that undergo through genocide. How come, people who have never in their history experienced such horrible things are supportive of the victims, but the so portrayed ARCH-VICTIMS (i.e. the Jews) are silent if not outright denialist.

 

[NoComment]

I don´t really think that it is a such god idea to take any consideration on what this so called "high profile" doctor have to say,

by the way this 2 links are not working

 

http://www2.med.umich.edu/department...nal%20Medicine

...

http://endocrinefellows.org/new_medi...deo_frame.html

 

Artusian

 

all the ones who were voting for the 106 resolution recognize the genocide, even those who vote against it,

now

if a so called doctor want to try to do some history by using the same arguments as the turks do, can he really be an intellectual representing the jewish community with the importance that Artusian try to advance,

I don´t think so

 

shall we do the same, trying to respond to this argument in order to give an importance to this so called doctor

 

the line between being furious against a group and hating it is very thin, be carefull

Edited January 3, 2008 by NoComment

[DominO123]

I don´t really think that it is a such god idea to take any consideration on what this so called "high profile" doctor have to say,

by the way this 2 links are not working

 

 

 

all the ones who were voting for the 106 resolution recognize the genocide, even those who vote against it,

now

if a so called doctor want to try to do some history by using the same arguments as the turks do, can he really be an intellectual representing the jewish community with the importance that Artusian try to advance,

I don´t think so

 

shall we do the same, trying to respond to this argument in order to give an importance to this so called doctor

 

the line between being furious against a group and hating it is very thin, be carefull

 

Lets not jump to guns, if this guy is really the researcher who already published in nature, then he can't do otherwise than apologizing, I don't think a reputable scholar who has nothing to do with history will accept having his credibility questioned for something outside his field.

 

[gamavor]

NoComment, in case you do not know the only obstacle worldwide for recognition of the Armenian genocide are the freaking Jews and I’m sick and tiered to listen here and there of some concerned Jew who would think otherwise. I am also sick and tired to listen to false excuses about why Israel and the Jews are not that much "supportive" of Armenian "claims" because of their good relations with the Turks. I understand their friendly relations are beyond the water issues in the Middle East. Simply, there is a blood bond, far more valuable than some superficial politics of the day.

 

 

Here, watch this! As they say a picture (or two) worth 10000000 words.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov5NRcTTyL4

[artusian]

Art jan, don't worry bro I have more medical doctor's on my side, probbly 30 of them that have nation wide importance, among them are germans, chineese, and other races, blacks too... don't worry too much, an M.D. like that has no business in politics and his voice can never gt accross because he is too small for being a politican, and there is a very good response under his comment from an american from phili, I give props to the man, he put the bastard doctor in it;s place far better than some armenians would!!!

I suggest not taking this all the way to the buttom of your heart, he is nothing for the media, there are far more important people and places where we need to watch out!!!

 

 

Ashot ,

 

Thanks for your reply. My only concern was that his hate message was too much to be ignore.

 

I am happy that you have your medic friends who will be informed.

 

Artusian

[artusian]

It is a waste of time to bother with people like him. The real issue is this:

 

The Turkish state is having positions on history and it imposing them on the Turkish populace and historians. It also imposes them abroad successfully in chairs of Ottoman and Turkish history. Someone needs to take Ottoman history Chairs at Universities in the USA for example away from the Turkish state. Some rich Armenian American, Greek American or organizations needs to get more people descended from Ottoman Christians who know modern Turkish and Ottoman Turkish into the field as Professors to challenge the Turkish hegemony.

 

 

You have a very good point, but what if he connected to thos people? It could well be

[artusian]

Actually, my take on such sophisticated people like this Jew doctor is simple. There WAS NEVER EVER JEWEISH HOLOHOAX! NEVER! IT IS ALL JEWISH PROPAGANDA TO JUSTIFY THEIR OCCUPITION OF ARAB LANDS.

The Jews betrayed the third Reich and made alliance with their ideological brothers in Russia – the Bolsheviks. Naturally, they were relocated from the war zone in order to prevent their collaboration with the Red Army.

 

I will not even comment on some minor technical issues – such as burning 2 million people through one single chimney. It is all BS….

 

 

The best proof that there was never a Jewish shoah is the attitude of the Jews and Israel. There is no way that people who suffered from such atrocities would hesitate to voice their support or concern for those that undergo through genocide. How come, people who have never in their history experienced such horrible things are supportive of the victims, but the so portrayed ARCH-VICTIMS (i.e. the Jews) are silent if not outright denialist.

 

 

The problem is if you say you have problems. Sure both happened, but one can not say only they suffer, Armenians suffered even more. You have a very good point here. My statement was not to refer to his background but only to point the problem of his individual opionion

[artusian]

I don´t really think that it is a such god idea to take any consideration on what this so called "high profile" doctor have to say,

by the way this 2 links are not working

 

 

 

all the ones who were voting for the 106 resolution recognize the genocide, even those who vote against it,

now

if a so called doctor want to try to do some history by using the same arguments as the turks do, can he really be an intellectual representing the jewish community with the importance that Artusian try to advance,

I don´t think so

 

shall we do the same, trying to respond to this argument in order to give an importance to this so called doctor

 

the line between being furious against a group and hating it is very thin, be carefull

 

 

That was not my purpose. I only want to point out the bad behaviour of this individual, that is nothing with his religion and background. This can not be tolearted

[artusian]

The link about him:

 

http://www2.med.umich.edu/departments/endo...rnal%20Medicine

 

http://www.appointmentnet.com/view_doctor/...rkan/index.html

 

http://www.med.umich.edu/intmed/annualrepo...honorarysoc.htm

[gamavor]

My statement was not to refer to his background but only to point the problem of his individual opionion

 

The two are connected. If a given person regardless of his background makes ignorant remark about a historic event/crime/tragedy, etc.. you can pass this as ignorance and say, oh well....it doesn't matter. In the case of Jewish negations, there is something more than that. It is their fake superiority and hatred to anything that is not Jewish that governs such mental and psychopath attitude, which I find quite dangerous for the normal human beings.

[AVO]

Jewish person denied the genocide, whats so surprising here? Remember that their leading NGO's do the same. One of them actually called to Turkey and apologized that he was forced to recognize it. It hurts them when someone takes that uniqueness(holocaust) away from them. And no not all of them are this way, but a lot of them just don't care about Armenians. Giving this guy a fraction of importance will only undermine our cause. A lot of people in the world know about Armenian Genocide in part thanks to Turkeys billion dollar campaign to deny it.

[Nikephoros_Phokas]

"Zhou Enlai for his part had no doubt. He called on us to take the lead in organizing an anti-Soviet coalition. It should stretch from Japan through China, Pakistan, Iran and Turkey to Western Europe. The concept was correct but it could not be implemented through exhortation alone. Nixon and I agreed on the importance of Turkey, Pakistan and Iran -- but the next five years would reveal how little domestic support there was in America for viewing key allies in terms of world balance of power."

 

Kissinger, Henry. Henry Kissinger: Years of Upheaval. (Little, Brown and Company; Boston; 1981) p. 55.

 

Above gives an example of why the USA does not recognize the Armenian genocide and it has nothing to do with a Jewish cabal conspiracy that is running the world. Secretaries of State, like Kissinger lament that the American population do not think in terms of heuristic calculus of geopolitics and "world balance of power".

 

He is sadly very wrong because they are many stupid/base Americans thinking "in terms of world balance of power".

Edited January 4, 2008 by Nikephoros_Phokas