Arpa

Sireli Mos, never mind that furko-Persian jan, jin, jon ending. How did I make this post? Even though I am not quite satisfied in its final version. You underestimate and despise my intelligence, specially when I speak against dolma -basturma and other non-Armenian furkish culture. Yes I am an old fart, yet again I have been with the internet for over 20 years, way before some of our correspondents were even born. Ask yourself and see what Ani said and almost swore about her failure to post in Armenian. Ask yourself and see why our best posters in Armenian, the likes of Nane, Ani, Johannes, to not forget SAS, have not written anything since we went to this new garbage format.

In the Armenian culture the ODZ/Snake has been a symbol of snakiness, sneakiness, smseghumq. I wish I could find that reference to snakes creeping in the Ruins of the City of Ani while owls fly overhead. Both, above and below are Omens of Bad News. See Russel's -Zoroastrianism in Armenia- pg. 459 about snakes and scorpions. http://www.naturephoto-cz.com/photos/sevcik/indian-cobra--naja-naja-2.jpg http://www.naturephoto-cz.com/photos/sevcik/indian-cobra--naja-naja-2.jpg http://www.med-practic.com/arm/824/381/article.more.html

ԵՐԿՆԵԼ ԵՐԿՈՒՆՔ One becoming two as in Childbirth and the Pain of Childbirth. From the Armenian word Yerkou/two. Let us get to the bottom of this linguistic Fiasco. ---- Note. If I cannot make this appear in Armenian I will swear to not post anything in Armenia anymore, with that nonsense of HTML Garo-bage. I will just post in that furken dolma/basturma furkish.. ----- See #s 3 and 6 here; http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=13100 Classical- Grabar; Երկնէր երկին, երկնէր երկիր, Երկնէր և ծովն ծիրանի. Երկն ի ծովուն ունէր և զկարմրիկն եղեգնիկ. Ընդ եղեգան փող ծուխ ելանէր, Ընդ եղեգան փող բոց ելանէր, Եւ ի բոցոյն վազէր խարտեաշ պատանեկիկ. Նա հուր հեր ունէր, Բոց ունէր մօրուս, Եւ աչքունքն էին արեգակունք: Eatern Armenian Երկնում էր երկինքը, երկնում էր երկիրը, Երկնում էր և ծիրանի ծովը. Երկունքն էր բռնել ծովում նաև կարմիր եղեգնիկին. Եղեգան փողից ծուխ էր ելնում, Եղեգան փողից բոց էր ելնում, Եվ բոցից դուրս էր վազում մի խարտյաշ պատանեկիկ. Նա հուր մազեր ուներ, Ուներ բոցեղեն մորուք, Եվ աչքերն էին արեգակներ: Tolegian. Conceptual, not at all literal ; The sky is turbulent, turbulent the earth Turbulent the purple*** sea And turbulent also the red reed in the sea. Smoke curled out of the ree, Flame leaped out from the reed, And out of the reed a fair child came forth. His hair glowed, His beard flamed, And his eyes were very suns. ***To once to repeat. When some translate Tsirani as purple**** is simply because where as in Armenian it is the color of royalty and in Europe the royal colors are/were purple. We need professional dictionarians, not amateurs who copy from one dictionary/mictionary to another. Bedrosian. In another thread I said that his interpretaion of -trvail- French travail=labor as in Labor of Love, pain of childbirth. The heavens and the earth travailed, There travailed also the purple sea, The travail held The red reed (4) (stalk) in the sea. Through the hollow of the reed (stalk) a smoke rose, Through the hollow of the reed (stalk) a flame rose And out of the flame ran forth a youth. He had hair of fire, He had a beard of flame, And his eyes were suns. Ghapantsian; Here and below he interprets the words as the Pain of Childbirth, ծննդաբերութեան ցաւ a pain, labor of love? He goes further to invoke the -Pain of Creation- as in literary creation-. Further he refers to the use of the word in re of the death, virtual/extermination and the painful Rebirth of the Armenian Nation, as some interpret the word mainly to mean PAIN. Yerknel http://nayiri.com/imagedDictionaryBrowser.jsp?dictionaryId=6&pageNumber=620 Yerkounq http://nayiri.com/imagedDictionaryBrowser.jsp?dictionaryId=6&pageNumber=621 **** Purple?. Look here #7 http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=20790&st=0 And here; http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=12093&hl=purple&st=20

Dear MAN, thank you for the excellent post. Please pardon me for deviating from the spirit of the subject, but certain things must be said, specially for the benfit of those who may not be fluent enough in one or both langauges. ======= As good as Bedrosian is, and his invaluable contribution, at times he is need of corrections. Btw. Bedrosian is partially responsible for the nonsense that the Mamikoneans are of Chinese origin. They are from the Land of Jenats (search the forum and see), In the Yerevan vernacular the letter J is pronounced like CH , like when we say janj they say chanch, therefore Jenats is pronounced as Chenats . HUH! It must be a typo? AHA!! It is meant Chinats?** In fact, when one reads Bedrosian further we see that he corrects that jenats/chinats confusion As ro Zatik, once again , it is a total fiasco.To me it seems like he does not the Armenian language well rnough, he just copies and pastes what others whose knowledge of the language is questionable have said. We will see when we get to Vahakn. ------- About Zatik See #40 here where I redirected us . http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=15722&st=20#entry281001 To this; See # 31 here; http://hyeforum.com/...opic=1635&st=20 See where he translates -yerkner- to -travail. The latter is a French word to mean work/labor. Yerkner/yerkounq means one being two (yerkou)*** as in parturition/birth. Yes, his translation of travail is literal from the English -labor- (of birth). For a better translation, (mine), Birth of Vahakn , see #3 here http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=13100#entry280410 ---- ** Who said that to know a Second language well one must know the First one perfectly .***(* *** His translation. ****That is the problem with the likes of Diana Der Ohanessian; http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=18633&hl=poetry

At last someone else speak about the true meaning of Yeghern. See how many times he uses words like yeghern=vojir=crime=murder and yeghernagordz=criminal=murderer. Despite all the attempts, not only by them but also many of us to trivialize the impact to mean -calamity/disaster- YEGHERN is, as Agatha Crtistie would say MURDER MOST FOUL.. About time we learn our own language rather than mehmet p**** teaching us. 　 - Armenian Weekly - http://www.armenianweekly.com

　 　 \ YERJANIK yev BARGAVAJ AMANOR** HAPPY and PROSPEROUS NEW YEAR In the Middle East , on Dec. 31 and Jan.1 we celebrated Kaghand . It was the time to decorate the Tree and have Kaghand Papa visit and distribute the goodies, not on Christmas on Jan. 6, 13 or 19. Those dates were reserved for Christian rites at church. We called Santa Claus Kaghand Papa, not Dzmer Papik- Grandpa /Father Winter. Those of us who attended western oriented schools, we did celebrate Christmas eve on Dec, 24 when all the Christmas concerts and Pageantry were held. At times we would also go to the neighborhood magnificent Catholic cathedral for midnight mass and hear their wonderful choir sing in Latin. . http://www.sacred-destinations.com/syria/images/aleppo-maronite-cathedral-c-syrialooks-350h.jpg http://www.sacred-destinations.com/syria/images/aleppo-maronite-cathedral-c-syrialooks-350h.jpg http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/3465752.jpg To repeat, Christmas eve and Christmas day were solemn religious occasions, and all the merriment was done on the New Year's eve. We did not call Santa Claus Dzmer papik, Grandpa Winter, we called him Kaghand Papa, neither did we call the Tree the neutral atheistic Tonatsar, we called it Kghandi Tsar or Tsnoundi Tsar.. Tonatsar? In the Armenian Ton means feast/festival. Which Ton are we talking about? Nvasard/Nowrouz, Vardanants, Bargindan, Vardavar or even the feast of Independence? Please abide with me. Or is it that TON , the most disturbing of all when some, even today call April 24 Nahatakats Ton/Feast/Festival of the Martyrs? of 1915? Once again to Santa Claus St. Nicholas. Now we learn that his mother was Armenian which by association makes him Armenian.*** At the time I did not comment to this tragicomedy-as Yervant says -What if it is true? http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=47674#entry300497 If that is the case, then why we call Santa Claus with many names, the most ridiculous being Dzmer Papik/Papa Winter? Why don’t we call him Sourb Nikoghayos/St. Nikolaos? **I will join the crowd and write Armenian? with Latin characters, rather than subject myself to that sadomasochistic new and improved ? format. *** Tis the season to be jolly.**** Fa la la la.. Or is it Tis the season to be silly? Tis the season for more new and improved fables. Yes, yes we already know that Stalin’s father was Armenian as well. What in the world was an Armenian doing in Antalya and Izmir ? When were those places ever Armenian lands? When did, in the 3d c, 280 AD Armenians live there? Don’t ask Mr. Izmir-li-oghlu-ian. ****

That SOB and his ilk need a radical anatomical excision. Paradise? My ise!!

　Thank you Ashot for your prompt response. Your mention of the cause of death of grandfather Ashot being from the so called Siberian Plague piqued my interest. I found out that most references point to an epidemic of Anthrax. A disease primarily of bovine/porcine**/cattle origin, while others advance its origin to rodents. Who is correct? Pasteur or Yersin? ** See the mention of them tending to herds of pigs. Ashot please tell us more about your grandfather. We understand that he was a painter. Have you seen any of his art? See below. http://en.for-ua.com/news/2012/05/04/154821.html === http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plague_(disease) 　 　

Who said that that silly jingo Jingle Bells is a Christmas carol? Where do you see words like Christ, Christmas or Jesus? We need real American Christian culture not silly vulgar songs. Look again and see in Yerevan they think Rap and bottom girating Michael Jackson are American culture. ====

　 HETQ has picked up that video of the debate. Dear Armenak, don’t expect much debate, like what I said above, so far as expected, there is no readers’ participation as the common citizen there, just as everywhere else lacks the knowledge and the sophistication about the subject. Among many; http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=18194&st=40 We will notice in the video many references beside the personal, to the socio-political aspect of the debate, i.e US v THEM just as we have on many occasions. Not to forget that some argue the technical difficulties, like the lack of qualified teachers. To repeat what I have said before- That the children were confused then as they will today, it is not the childrens’ confusion but the confusion of the teachers whose first language may have/is other than Armenian. I was surprised to see some people that we know of, the likes of Paruyr Hayrikian and Levon Chukazian (My refurkified spelling) speaking in favor. We here have often discussed this dilemma and debacle under many topics like Eastern - Western Armenian and more. As if we being so small with less than 3 million of us speaking Armenian we can afford and divide the Nation to East, West, North and South. What will we talk about when the Armenian Language becomes remanded to the dustbin of history and is listed among the Dead Languages? Not to worry. We can always speak pig latin, i.e Russky, Arabic, French, Apanish, English and, and …. furkish just like they do in Yerevan Armenian where speak is 30% Russian, 20% furkish,, 20 % Persian with about 30% Mesropian. Please note the main debate about our linguistic Roots and see what I have said before. http://hetq.am/eng/news/21949/a-return-to-roots-film-promotes-benefits-of-unified-armenian-orthography.html And the Armenian; http://hetq.am/arm/news/21949/a-return-to-roots-film-promotes-benefits-of-unified-armenian-orthography.html 　 　

Is this a joke? REPUBLIC ? of KUWAIT? What does Republic mean? Who is the publicly elected President of Kuwait?

Yes, yes, regardless, we know that in Armenian -am- means year as in Am-a-nor/New Year.

Amyan? What the h*** kind of Armenian family name is that? Aside from the fact that -'am- means hobar in Arabic, I hate to tell you what that taboo word -am- means in that other cursed language. Where is our Armenian Pride? Why don't we have family names like Hobarian?

I could not see beyond … Tonatsar, jan tonatsar Inch siroun es ou paytsar Shat lavn es, du lavn es…

Can someone please post the words and music of Tonatsar. I have never heard it or seen the words.

Yes I did watch the video until my stomach turned on me. I forgot to add that those Sharagans- Armenian Carols- , are virtually impossible to sing not only by children but also by adults. Have we composed any so called Armenian carols since Khorenatsi, that is beside Tonatsar? BTW. I have nothing against Home@tmen. In fact I admire them, I have for a long time.

Read the rest here by Eddie Arnavoudian; http://www.groong.or...c-20040714.html Is this the reason why Antonina is despised even today? See paragraph 2.where we see the public burning of the book- The Burning Orchards- and that his wife lives in abject poverty even now The article by Eddie was written in 2004.

Was your grandfather born in baku? I can't find anything about him. There is a Gevorg Sanamian in rge SAE, film producer and director who was baku born, just as Emile Sanamian, editor of the Armenian Reporter is also baku born.

Thank you Ashot for the above article, please tells us the source and the author thereof. Sounds like it was written by a clergy. Even though they mention the Scandinavian origin of the custom they fail to go deeper into its pagan past. No harm intended in knowing the origin of things. All this will not waver the Christians’ faith and customs. Many similar articles like the one below by cynics and agnostics. One readers commented somewhere as to why people attack Christian beliefs both from within and without, with no repercussions while eve a whisper against other faiths become cause for World War. Somehow titillating facts about Christmas and the Christmas Tree. Some known , others not. The fact that the DATE and customs of Christmas, (just as other Christian customs, Easter, Thanksgiving- harvest festival- etc.) are based on the Pagan customs of the Scandinavian culture of the Winter Solstice is no surprise. It is surprising that Americans, mostly the Puritans rejected the concept of Christmas, a pagan practice. To this day, clowns like the jehovans still consider Christmas a pagan rite and reject it. I have seen somewhere that the Scandinavians would celebrate the Winter Solstice by setting bonfires, burning Fir Trees to warm the weather and fend away the frost of winter. Which brings us to the custom of decorating the tree with candles electric lights to symbolize the fire. In our days, before electricity we would decorate with live candles , and we had specially made candle holders like this; Candle holders http://news-antique..../BAUMKERZEN.jpg http://news-antique.com/primages/1/BAUMKERZEN.jpg Of course, that practice was phased out as it caused fires, replaced by Chinese made electric lights, which however is still a source of hazard of fire. To not forget that we also decorated the tree with small cotton balls as a symbol of snow.. http://news.yahoo.co...-145921591.html

Good news. Does rhis mean that the island that had become a penninsula will be an island again?

On a clear night look at the moon and see the Planet Jupiter to its left that looks like a bright star. Some theorize that the Star of Bethlehem was such a phenomenon.

Thank you ashot. Do tell us why rhose singers, even though pretending ro sin in Armenian, make so much furk-asszerii klklots?

Thank you Ashot. My question, why here and in many other so called Armenian audios the songs, even though ith Armenian words are sung in furkish, Persian and Arabic klklots, just like that clown Onnik Dinkji-oghlu-an .

Thank you Ashot for even more sad stories. In my post above I meant ro ask you if you ever got to know your grandfather. You clarified it. What was your grandfather's sin for deserving that vacation(?) in Siberia.

A fascinating account. Thank you Ashot. :clap: Have you met Mrs.Mahari?** Even more fascinating is the fact that Ashot Sanamian is in fact your grandfather. Has he ever spoken about it? You should write about his memoirs. **See where she says that people will not address her so, but rather as Antonina Mikhaylnova. Xenophobia? Despise of the - ODAR-? Is that why we know next to nothing about AK’s Russia(?) wife Nina Makarova***, or even LTP’s wife Lucia, aside from the fact that their son David was given a hrya name and now lives in telaviv? ***Was she in fact of Armenian origin, daughter of Makar/Magar?