Preservation of Armenian identity

[gevo27]

umm how large was Armenia during and after the genecide?? i thaught it was pretty much the same size, i nland area .. even after the genecide.. and most of it was singlhandedly given to the turks by stalin.. so.. whats the point of not arguing that stalin gave most of our land away??

[gurgen]

Indeed, why do you imply that because we are in such a bad position we are not 'smart'?

 

Look at other nations, you don't have to be smart to be succesfull. We have very unfortunately been screwed over by our neighbours and in combination with some faults of our own we are now in such a position. These fault however are not the main and only reason for this.

[Boghos]

Hello Pirate,

 

I feel that you have a certain difficulty in comprehending simple texts. But given the fact that you seem to be a good boy, in spite of calling other people´s opinion garbage and making a number of ridiculous assumptions and deriving even more ridiculous conclusions from them, I will bother to answer you again.

 

I write once again mostly for two reasons: I have met many people like you and I used to be what one could consider a hard core nationalist.

 

I start by saying that there is a very different view from those that struggle to be Armenian and those that are Armenian. I am not much older than you, 10 years or so, but it has been enough time to allow for a good understanding of my ethnic identity. You see, one cannot be Armenian by force. As much as I believe that inevitably most of the diaspora will blend into their respective host countries, and that is supported by the most overwhelming historical evidence one can dream of and pure and simple common sense, I also believe that I am an Armenian and will inevitably be so until the end of my days. Something that I am not proud or ashamed of, but something that I feel very comfortable about and that I like. Just to give you a simple example: In the past I have cold called many Armenians in different parts of the world and the great majority has led to very pleasant moments, I could tell you many stories of this nature and others of great moments I experienced in what is defined an Armenian environment. Have no fear though, I no longer cold call Armenians anywhere in the world as I have passed the age where that would be deemed somewhat acceptable but I still try to discover the footprints that our people have left in many different places. I have been to most of the "obvious"communities, the only exception being the Little Armenian one in LA. So I am for example interested in the history of old Armenian communities that have disappeared or almost disappeared such as those that thrived in the British Empire in Asia and also the little known Armenian community of China.

 

When I say that one can live a happy existence accepting the absolutely inescapable reality that the diaspora will disappear, I mean a happy existence as an Armenian. That much I hoped was obvious.

 

So before you go around in your still adolescent ways accusing people of being fools and the like think twice or maybe even three times before you do that. Hopefully age and experience will help ypu understand what ethinicity and being Armenian is all about, for your own sake and not to save the Armenian diaspora from extinction, because that is as certain as my belief that Armenians will continue to exist for as long as there are human beings in this planet and that our Armenia will see much better days in the future.

Edited April 1, 2004 by Boghos

[Armat]

umm how large was Armenia during and after the genecide?? i thaught it was pretty much the same size, i nland area .. even after the genecide.. and most of it was singlhandedly given to the turks by stalin.. so.. whats the point of not arguing that stalin gave most of our land away??

Gevo j, It was Lenin who made a secret agreement with Ataturk to attack Armenia and recieved arms and green light not Stalin.Stalin came to power 1924 if my memory serves me right.

I am not even sure if Stalin had anything to do with Artsagk either.I keep reading this on Armenian web sites but found nothing to confirm it.

Edited April 1, 2004 by Armat

[axel]

Boghos, Anka,

I don't understand the purpose of your posts. It seems you want to take revenge of having lost your own faith by attempting to destroy the faith of others. This is somewhat reminiscent of the attitude of THOTH, the militant atheist.

I tell you, you are wasting your time.

[_Anka_]

umm how large was Armenia during and after the genecide?? i thaught it was pretty much the same size, i nland area .. even after the genecide.. and most of it was singlhandedly given to the turks by stalin.. so.. whats the point of not arguing that stalin gave most of our land away??

gevo, Stalin gave away Karabach, Naxichevan and Javax region in 1920's. I was refering to the british and Russian promises made to Dashnaks regarding western territories. Stalin has nothign to do with that.

[_Anka_]

Boghos, Anka,

I don't understand the purpose of your posts. It seems you want to take revenge of having lost your own faith by attempting to destroy the faith of others. This is somewhat reminiscent of the attitude of THOTH, the militant atheist.

I tell you, you are wasting your time.

Loosing my faith? So now we're worshiping Armenism?

[_Anka_]

Boghos, Anka,

I don't understand the purpose of your posts. It seems you want to take revenge of having lost your own faith by attempting to destroy the faith of others. This is somewhat reminiscent of the attitude of THOTH, the militant atheist.

I tell you, you are wasting your time.

I don't care about destroying others beliefs. You haven't really read my posts have you? I don't care about what people want to believe in. I know that i can't change one's opinion because no one can change mine. I was just expressing my own opinion about this topic not more. But it seems like we got some nationalistic chavunists in here who think that they're the right one's and that everyone should follow they're footsteps. Being proud of being an Armenian is not a faith and has nothing to do with faith.

[Twilight Bark]

Having no disposable time these days, I feel guilty typing this hopefully short comment. And I confess that I did not read every comment in its entirety for lack of time. However, there seems to be a maddening tendency in this thread to talk past one another. And the amusing part is that almost every point of view expressed here is largely valid in its own context, often even implied by the writer. So I do not know what the excuse is for being so thick regarding one another's perspectives.

 

Boghos is right, in that without fresh additions a disapora that does not have the benefit of claimed religious profundity (read Jews) is bound to erode and eventually disappear given enough number of generations. The only way to avoid it would be to have such a high birth rate that compensates for the ones that willingly or unwittingly assimilated away. Boghos is not advocating an abandonment of Armenianness, but a simple acceptance of this cruel reality. I disagree with him, however, that we can or should be comfortable with that fact. I will always be melancholic about lost Armenian souls, and vansihed communities that once thrived with hope and determination. A part of me will always be profoundly sad about that.

 

Armenian Pirate is right, in that one need not take the forces of assimilation lying down. One should do what one can to maximize the number of Armenians left after each generation. Why? Well, that goes back to what Boghos said earlier; the idea that our survival should be centered around the country of Armenia. The more Armenians we have around by the time Armenia assumes its role as a magnet, as a powerhouse of human life and creativity, the better. Then they may start setting roots there with hope and happiness. I see my personal role as increasing the chances that at least some of my descendants will be Armenian enough to give that option a chance.

 

As for Anka, I think he is rather different from Boghos, and is inconsistent in his stance. He, like many other Armenians (of all kinds, from ultra-nationalists to anti-nationalists), doesn't quite understand what makes the Armenian identity and culture, for all its many warts, precious and special. If being Armenian is of no special significance to him, he should stop wasting his time on Armenian sites. Or rather, he should start wasting it equally and equitably among all the cultures that exist on our planet, if he thinks the same of all cultures. He can of course pick a more special culture more to his liking and join the millions of ex-Armenians who have voted with their feet for millenia. That would make me sad, but I can look at that reality and accept it since it is looking at me straight in the face.

 

As for the idea of "faith". Axel is quite justified in evoking it. It was Boghos who once talked of remaining Armenian as an act of faith. At least that is how I interpreted it at the time, and I regard it as a profound observation. It is indeed the faith in a better future, a better time when Armenia is a thriving, proud place, with a huge intellectual contribution to the world culture vastly disproportional to its size, a better time when Armenians and non-Armenians from all over the world make it a place of pilgrimage. A time when 1/64th Armenians would be digging out their Armenian ancestry and proudly proclaiming it as a sign of being blessed.

 

Alright, it wasn't short.

 

Best to all,

Twilight Bark

[Azat]

Dear Twilight Bark, how great to see you here. Please come back more often.

[Sip]

... As for Anka, I think he is rather different from Boghos, and is inconsistent in his stance.  He, like many other Armenians (of all kinds, from ultra-nationalists to anti-nationalists), doesn't quite understand what makes the Armenian identity and culture, for all its many warts, precious and special. ... Or rather, he should start wasting it equally and equitably among all the cultures that exist on our planet, if he thinks the same of all cultures.

Very interesting that you should say that since I personally went through a similar self exercise because I realized I wanted to agree with anka but couldn't get myself to post it. So after all, there is something special in being Armenian but I still don't know what that is and thus, I've kept myself out of this discussion. Otherwise I simply cannot explain why on earth I am drawn to this forum so much

[Twilight Bark]

after all, there is something special in being Armenian but I still don't know what that is

If I may guide you in your search, I think it is about what Armenians don't do, rather than what they do.

[gevo27]

gevo, Stalin gave away Karabach, Naxichevan and Javax region in 1920's. I was refering to the british and Russian promises made to Dashnaks regarding western territories. Stalin has nothign to do with that.

Roger that.. but still it was armenias land.. thats my point ... lol.. and umm..

 

Armat.. sure stalin had something to do with it.. or i have been lied to and learned twisted history.. lol

[mx5]

As for Anka, I think he is rather different from Boghos, and is inconsistent in his stance. He, like many other Armenians (of all kinds, from ultra-nationalists to anti-nationalists), doesn't quite understand what makes the Armenian identity and culture, for all its many warts, precious and special.

you may understand your culture,but you need to have a FEELING for your identity,or one may end up like Boghos and Anka.

[Boghos]

Dear TB,

 

As usual your comments are straight to the point. My ideas come out much more clearly through your words. The only small divergence is when it comes to the old communities, I have, as mentioned before a special interest in those and they do arise a sort of melancholy in me.

 

Hope you are well and as Azat said come by more often.

Edited April 1, 2004 by Boghos

[_Anka_]

As for Anka, I think he is

How many guys named Anka have you met in your life?

[Twilight Bark]

How many guys named Anka have you met in your life?

Don't waste my time.

[Sasun]

TB, I think she is just saying that she is a woman not a guy

[Twilight Bark]

TB, I think she is just saying that she is a woman not a guy

I know that, and I don't care.

[_Anka_]

I'm not waisting your time. You're waisting your own time.. I didn't ask for a reply from you. You're the one who waisted your time by writing a paragraph about my earlier comments.

[Twilight Bark]

I'm not waisting your time. You're waisting your own time.. I didn't ask for a reply from you. You're the one who waisted your time by writing a paragraph about my earlier comments.

One more time. Don't waste my time. And my comments were not directed at you, any more than my comments on inanimate objects are directed at them. Now kindly get out of my face.

[gevo27]

we all need to just.. get along

 

lol....

 

Anka.. you crack me up

[Sip]

How many guys named Anka have you met in your life?

Here's one but I haven't met him.

[TheArmenianPirate]

Hello Pirate,

 

I feel that you have a certain difficulty in comprehending simple texts.

 

This is the second time you’ve blatantly attacked me personally with a condescending comment like this. If you have so much faith in your own ideas, you shouldn’t feel it necessary to attack me personally in your posts in order to push your ideas into the foreground of this discussion. You’re welcome to critique my ideas and try to disprove them with rationale, logic, and reason. But it seems the more I write, the less debating you do, and the more you have to resort to one line condescending opening sentences. If you think attacking me personally and trying to smear my character with your “implied stupidity” sentences will gain ground for your own notions, perhaps you’re not as mature as you claim to be. All I’ve heard from you thus far is the same irate declaration of inevitability and hopelessness. I’ve covered many different ideas in detail and you keep disguising your one dimensional notion of doom in different forms and tossing in blatant condescending comments. This will not win you any credibility with respect to this debate, so put the personal attack and condescending comments to rest.

 

 

 

 

 

But given the fact that you seem to be a good boy, in spite of calling other people´s opinion garbage and making a number of ridiculous assumptions and deriving even more ridiculous conclusions from them, I will bother to answer you again.

 

Again, you open your argument up with another verbal assault on me, this is not the way to discuss an issue I’m afraid. Furthermore, you claim that my ideas about Armenians making an effort toward unity, staying together, preserving their lineage, their heritage, and culture are “ridiculous” and that my conclusion about these preservations being necessary for us on world stage in order for us have recognizable rights globally to be “even more ridiculous”. I can’t see how you can make those accusations except maybe for the sheer sake of arguing and being too prideful to admit that you’re wrong and that you feel bad about giving up your own efforts. What IS in fact “ridiculous” for a rational human being is your theory of “giving up” and “giving in” when there is absolutely no reason to. And make no mistake, your mentality is absolutely dangerous to our youth.

 

Let’s ASSUME for a moment that your notion of inevitable total assimilation of Diasporans, regardless of the effort to preserve ourselves, is true, which it is not, but lets just assume it is. Let’s also adapt your idea that while assimilation is inevitable, the 15-25 demographic will not witness it in their lifetime because perhaps total assimilation and Diasporan cultural death is 500 years away. How is it still rationale for any Hye to totally adapt a mentality of hopelessness, or any human being for that matter even if these notions are presumably true? The answer is that IT’S NOT rationale. And do not reply by saying “that is not what I meant, you just cannot understand my simple texts”, make no mistake, that is EXACTLY what the core of your idea is. You preach that in the face of assumed inevitability, I should as a Hye and as a Human Being, culturally live on my knees rather than continue to make a stand. Human beings in general have a tendency of being resilient in the face of even the most extreme hopelessness. Historically this has been proven with all the struggles that many “hopeless” individuals have overcome. So taking into the assumption that you are right in stating that our situation as Diasporans/Hyes is inevitable and unpreventable, it still should not be used as an excuse for me, you, or anyone else to just sit on the sidelines or follow the media’s flute playing piper into whatever nonsense theories of “we’re all one happy family” or “let’s globalize”. Yes we are in fact one human race, and no one culture is necessarily better or worse than mine, but that DOES NOT mean I have to mundanely and naively think that in order for me to be successful within the American system or any other system, I should completely buy into the ideas of dismantling my own efforts of preserving my heritage, blurring the lines of my lineage, turn my back on my heritage, etc.

 

I can make the “smart moves” that are necessary within any system while at the same time making simple decisions of maintaining my identity. Those decisions include the simple notion of investing my time in developing a relationship with a Hye woman versus an odar. They also include not subscribing to social stigmas that only hurt my relationship with my Hye peers or my Hye significant other. Or the simple effort of learning about my past, my people’s history, where my people presently are politically on the global stage, and how I can in fact aid them in any adversity they may be facing, or passing my cultural knowledge and value of that culture onto my children. Whether it’s through lobbying, educating myself in order to play a vital role, using my amassed financial strengths to personally oversee some positive changes via Kirk Kerkorian style, or the simple decision of dating a Hye instead of an odar, it is very easy and takes very little effort for me to perform day to day decisions of maintaining my lineage and heritage. Any yes, anyone that states otherwise in the face of all these facts, is in fact spewing out garbage and hiding that verbal garbage behind the protective wall of “that’s my OPINION”. All opinions, including yours’ in this case, are not infallible, if they were, then I could potentially say “in my opinion I can fly by flapping my arms really fast after jumping off a plane”, but we all know at best, I’ll end up as a smear of flesh on the ground, thus I was wrong, just like the way the ideas of “inevitable Diasporan death regardless of how much effort we as Hyes present", are wrong when all the factors are accounted for; one of those factors being individual effort contributions.

 

Lastly, I’m not here posting to be a “good boy” or a bad one. My ideas have nothing to do with my moral integrity, and you know nothing of my moral integrity to yet again attack me personally and imply that I lack any sort of morality.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I write once again mostly for two reasons: I have met many people like you and I used to be what one could consider a hard core nationalist.

 

Well at least you admit that at some point you in fact showed great effort for your personal identity, and I can certainly respect you for that Boghos, it’s a shame that for whatever reason, you’ve decided that it is somehow so very not changeable. And to be perfectly honest with you, I still think that deep inside somewhere you just cant completely adapt to your own idea of just “letting go” and truly believe that things are in fact inevitably hopeless for us Diasporans. Even though you perhaps would like nothing more than to be right on this issue and see me running with my tail between my legs, I still care about you as a Hye, and if possible would like to see you rekindle that part of you that you claim has been extinguished. That is the essence of the meaning of hope.

 

 

 

 

I start by saying that there is a very different view from those that struggle to be Armenian and those that are Armenian.

 

No there isn’t. I don’t struggle at all to be Armenian, I AM Armenian, that’s it. It’s very easy for me to be Hye, I’ve been doing it for many years, and will do it for many more years with ease. My father is Hye and my mother is Hye, thus I am also Hye. It seems to me that between the two of us, it is you in fact that struggles so much to be Armenian. Who knows, maybe being Hye and maintaining your identity is so difficult because you feel somehow enticed by odars in some way. And that’s okay, you have the right to be so, but for me it’s just not a problem. I have many odar friends as well as Hyes, my odar friends and Hye friends intermingle at times, but I really never feel any reason to not continue my efforts of holding onto my lineage and culture. Maybe you feel otherwise because you have convinced yourself that it is such a monumental task to simply be who you are and to retain the identity that you were born with simply because you currently live in a society that is not of your origin. I’ve never seen this as a problem for myself personally, and I fail to see how it can be so much of a difficulty for those that claim it to in fact be a huge task to perform.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am not much older than you, 10 years or so, but it has been enough time to allow for a good understanding of my ethnic identity. You see, one cannot be Armenian by force.

 

 

You’re right, I absolutely agree with you my friend. You just can’t force anyone into anything they do not want to willingly participate in. And that lack of will usually occurs, again, due to the fact that the simple CHOICES that allow a Hye to maintain their identity are blown way out of proportion and exaggerated by media/pop culture notions of “an ever changing world” or “blurring the lines will bring world peace”. The reality of the situation is that all the choices that are “so very difficult” for someone that claims to be “too deep” in American society to be able to actively show effort and care about their Hye identity are in actuality very easy. I think people that lack effort just use the false “too difficult” or “inevitable” factors as excuses for their lack of willingness to preserve Hye lineage, heritage, and culture because they don’t want to be seen as Hyes that sit on the sidelines while many others are actively involved and even more have bled in the past in much harsher conditions to keep us alive as a people. Again, I agree with you Boghos, you just can’t force others to “be Hye”, you can just try and inform them as much as possible about the options that they DO have and by doing so, hope that you will inspire them enough with the reality of their situation which may stir up the willingness to preserve their own Hye lineage/identity. What I do not like or agree with, is the way people that have opted for the option of “giving up” or “letting go” the way you have, present their chosen option as a “lack of any options/choice” or “inevitability”. Lack of options is simply NOT our case yet, we still have a long way to go, before we can conclusively say “we’re screwed indefinitely”. But JUST BECAUSE we do have a long way to go before the situation does in fact become “hopeless”, doesn’t mean we should forge full steam ahead into the abyss so prematurely when we clearly are not at a dead end yet. This is very important to remember folks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As much as I believe that inevitably most of the diaspora will blend into their respective host countries, and that is supported by the most overwhelming historical evidence

 

Where is this historical evidence you so adamantly make claims to every other post? We’ve had Diasporan communities for thousands of years and still do, yes it is true that some did not make it and blended. But I can conversely and rightfully state that many have also flourished and still flourish to this day and refer to it as “indisputable proof” the way you keep doing, but it’s not proof of anything definite or inevitable. If there are East Asian Diasporans that did not survive, there also are Ethiopian Armenian communities that in fact thrive to this day in Ethiopia, some of which are close friends of mine, in a country that is predominantly composed of black individuals. So, to make reference to just those communities that did not survive as “historic proof” is wrong and cannot be claimed as historic proof of any kind for the notion of inevitability. The only proof it can be claimed as is the notion that “SOME communities of Diasporans will perish IF the community’s Hye populace does not make a conscious effort for cultural, heritage, and lineage preservation”, since that is not what your notion specifically is, do not make claims of having historic proof when you don’t have anything relevant pertaining to the topic at hand.

 

 

 

 

one can dream of pure and simple common sense,

 

Again another personal attack, why not devote another line to the actual debate instead of the demeaning opener? Might be a better approach to think about.

 

 

I also believe that I am an Armenian and will inevitably be so until the end of my days. Something that I am not proud or ashamed of, but something that I feel very comfortable about and that I like.

 

Good, at least you’re comfortable with who you are, for a while I thought you were somehow uncomfortable with even the notion of being Hye. Not trying to be sarcastic here, just didn’t know for sure.

 

 

 

Just to give you a simple example: In the past I have cold called many Armenians in different parts of the world and the great majority has led to very pleasant moments, I could tell you many stories of this nature and others of great moments I experienced in what is defined an Armenian environment. Have no fear though, I no longer cold call Armenians anywhere in the world as I have passed the age where that would be deemed somewhat acceptable but I still try to discover the footprints that our people have left in many different places. I have been to most of the "obvious"communities, the only exception being the Little Armenian one in LA. So I am for example interested in the history of old Armenian communities that have disappeared or almost disappeared such as those that thrived in the British Empire in Asia and also the little known Armenian community of China.

 

Excellent, I commend your efforts, and the cold calls we’re probably VERY interesting indeed. Thankfully, thanks to the magic of the internet, we can at least still perform something analogous to cold calls through forums such as these!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When I say that one can live a happy existence accepting the absolutely inescapable reality that the diaspora will disappear, I mean a happy existence as an Armenian. That much I hoped was obvious.

 

Well, based on everything I’ve seen and experienced, including my own day to day efforts, I just don’t think Diasporan disappearance is as inescapable as you claim it to be, it’s not even close to being inevitable in any way, not yet at least. And for that simple fact that things are not in fact hopeless yet, I for one, will choose to realize the limitless power of my individual effort. One man/woman CAN make a difference, it’s just too bad many people have been led to believe that they cannot, as a means to subdue them and make them easier to control. The media and pop culture is SO potent in its manipulation, that the sheer manner in which people live in the United States is based on a “cookie cutter” type model. Youth in society is led to believe that in order to achieve a state of “happiness” they must adopt to this model created by media elitists which control pop culture in this country. The model goes through some changes every decade or so but the basic elements stay the same. Currently, it is “Be born, grow up in suburbia as a white person or the hood as a black person, go through teenage angst, date get to know the opposite sex, make a choice about college (choice A) or labor (choice after high school, if choice A is chosen then finish college then move onto labor then work until you can either afford to not work anymore (retire) or die, if choice B is chosen work until you can either retire or die yet again.” Even after death there exist models of how we should have prepared for that death! Prepare “the Will”, leave finances to family, pre-pay for your coffin, when dead, have lawyer carry out orders. Rinse repeat for next generation. This is the model media and pop culture has branded into the minds of our society and youth, this is what erases the beauty that is known as “cultural diversity and lineage” because it creates the illusion that there is little time to in fact maintain culture, heritage, and lineage. Many immigrants see this model as very “anti-life” or “anti-living”, because they’ve seen the other side of the coin by not being exposed to media and pop culture from birth by the elitists. But some fall prey to it and only after they are nearly dead and decrepit do they realize just how wrong they were in their choice of choosing pop culture over personal culture, when they could have done both.

 

Lastly, it doesn’t seem to me that you are as happy as you claim to be, because you’re obviously very confrontational about my ideas of not giving up, having hope, and showing effort toward Armenianism VS your own ideas of just accepting our supposed fate. I think you just do not want to step into your own idea of inevitable disappearance alone, so you come onto these forums and try to convince others of it as well so that they can take the plunge with you, and you make personal attacks on those that call you on your bluff. I on the other hand, have no reservation about performing my own ideas by myself, I’ve been doing it all my life. The only reason I’m here is to prevent the propagation of false ideas of inevitability when we, as a people, clearly have such a good chance before we can truly say “it’s over”.

 

 

 

So before you go around in your still adolescent ways accusing people of being fools and the like think twice or maybe even three times before you do that.

 

More personal attacks, I never once said anyone is a fool, but I did state that some ideas are foolish, don’t put words into my mouth to drive forward your side of the debate. You don’t gain any relevant credibility when you do that during a discussion.

 

 

Hopefully age and experience will help ypu understand what ethinicity and being Armenian is all about, for your own sake and not to save the Armenian diaspora from extinction.

 

I know exactly what being Armenian is all about, I know enough at least to understand what it has taken to preserve it thus far and what it will take to continue to preserve it, and being socially apocalyptic like you is not what is needed. I also know that it in fact is not “inevitable” yet, it’s still far from it. Also, I don’t necessarily equate my age or anyone else’s with the amount of “wisdom” they may have. If you are in fact in your mid 30s and thus about a decade older than me, that fact alone, doesn’t necessarily make you any wiser than me or wiser than anyone else younger than you. I may/may not have had a much more experience filled life in my 25 years than you may have had in your mid 30s, and while that may make me perhaps more “worldly”, it still doesn’t make me any wiser or my ideas any more correct than yours and vice versa, so lets not open up this can of worms within a debate setting. Ideas/opinons are inherently right or wrong based on the reality, actuality, and facts of a given situation, NOT because of someone’s age or experience. This is absolute.

 

 

that is as certain as my belief that Armenians will continue to exist for as long as there are human beings in this planet and that our Armenia will see much better days in the future.

 

I certainly hope so my friend, I certainly hope so. But if you believe this, why have you spent the last 7 pages going back and forth with me? I thought it was inevitable that we will be gone? Or is it that you perhaps are just feeling guilty about the choice of having let yourself go effort-wise when before you were a big proponent of showing effort? Very possible that the latter suggestion is what you’re going through.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Boghos, Anka,

I don't understand the purpose of your posts. It seems you want to take revenge of having lost your own faith by attempting to destroy the faith of others.

 

That’s a good analogy, though I doubt it’s as vindictive as “revenge”, I feel it’s more of feeling a bit of guilt for having made the choice of not showing effort, thus wanting others to join in on that choice as a means of appeasing that guilt/fear .

 

 

 

Loosing my faith? So now we're worshiping Armenism?

 

I don’t think he meant it in the context of “worshipping” Anka. The word “faith” doesn’t necessarily make reference to faith in the context of religious worship. He probably meant having faith in the idea of Armenianism as a culture/lineage/heritage, etc. in a positive manner VS a negative one.

 

 

Here's one but I haven't met him.

 

You're a research god Seaphan!!!

 

 

 

 

I would like to say that while my ideas and philosophy clash with some of the folks posting, they certainly have earned my respect, Boghos certainly has earned it indefinitely. At the very least, he and others have decided to register AND post, which is admirable. However, the posters are limited to roughly about 20-25 of the same people, yet I see 1500+ registered users. This place should be bustling with activity, where is everyone? Where are the women’s responses on the topics of sexual repression and social stigmas that have been brought up, regardless of whether you agree/disagree with me or anyone else, at least post something ladies. I for one would love to get “the woman’s point of view” in an uncensored and raw manner. I would think it’s something that would be important to any woman. So let’s hear it ladies and gents, feedback is critical for opening up some lines of communication. If you’re still reluctant to post, then just send it via a personal message, I’ve received a few but would like to get more thoughts in. Goodnight to all of you.

 

-The Armenian Pirate

[Boghos]

Hello Pirate,

 

Armenians in Ethoipia, in any meaningful scale are a post Genocide phenomenon. The emperor at that time decided to give refuge to two hundred orphans if I recall it properly. After Haile Selassie was unseated by the Socialists Armenians started to leave the place and what you have left is a very small community, not exactly a thriving one. Same apllies to Sudan for example.

Edited April 4, 2004 by Boghos