joseph parikian Posted November 15, 2003 Report Share Posted November 15, 2003 Sorrey Gamavor for changing the subject ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is from BBC London Bombs hit Istanbul synagogues The blast struck worshippers at prayer At least 20 people have been killed by explosions outside two synagogues in the Turkish city of Istanbul. Turkish officials said car bombs rocked Istanbul's largest synagogue, the Neve Shalom, and another synagogue nearby. A radical Turkish Islamist group, known as the Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front, said it was responsible, but the claim is being treated with scepticism. The Turkish Foreign Minister, Abdullah Gul, said he believed suicide bombers were behind the blasts. "It is clear that this is a terrorist event with international links," he said. Israel has denounced the blasts as "criminal terror attacks". 'Huge panic' The car bombs exploded outside the synagogues at about 1000 (0700 GMT) as worshippers were holding Sabbath morning prayers. TURKISH JEWISH COMMUNITY About 20,000 Jews, mainly in Istanbul Influx after expulsion from Spain in 1492 17 synagogues in Istanbul The facade of Neve Shalom collapsed and the second synagogue, the Beth Israel, about five kilometres (3 miles) away in Sisli district, was also severely damaged. "The blast went off in the middle of the prayer," Turkish Chief Rabbi Yitzhak Haleva said of the explosion at Neve Shalom. "All the windows were shattered and I suddenly found myself surrounded by thick smoke." Eyewitness Enver Eker, who was near Neve Shalom went the bomb went off, said: "There was huge panic, glass exploding and metal pieces all over the place. Istanbul health officials said 20 people had been killed and 257 people wounded. Television footage showed wounded people staggering in the street, some with bloodied or charred faces. The BBC's Steve Bryant in Istanbul says weeping people were searching for missing relatives, having found no news of them in hospitals across the city. He says many of the dead were passers-by or local shopkeepers. The powerful blasts turned cars into mangled wrecks and shattered windows across a wide area. "It was like a war zone," said eyewitness Sadettin Gul. Police and forensic teams are combing through the rubble at the centre of the blast for evidence about who carried out the attacks. Film from security cameras at Neve Shalom showed someone park a car and walk away before it blew up, police told the Turkish Anatolia news agency. The Neve Shalom synagogue, where most of the deaths reportedly occurred, was the scene of an earlier attack in 1986, when Palestinian gunmen killed 22 worshippers and wounded six others during a Sabbath service. It was also bombed by the Hezbollah militant group in 1992, but no-one was injured. Foreign forces? A caller claiming to be from a radical Turkish group, Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front - also known as IBDA/C - said it carried out the attack, Anatolia reported. The blast left a crater outside the Neve Shalom synagogue The caller was quoted as saying: "The reason [for the attacks] is to stop the oppression of the Muslims... Our acts will continue." The IBDA/C carried out a series of attacks around Istanbul in the 1990s, but has since been largely dismantled by Turkish security forces. Turkish officials are sceptical about the claim and are examining whether foreign groups were behind the attack. "An incident of such a scale might not be just the work of a domestic organisation," said Turkish Interior Minister Abdulkadir Aksu. Our correspondent says there had been no warning of any attacks against Jewish targets in the city. He says Istanbul has a small Jewish community that generally has very good relationships with other Turks. http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39573000/gif/_39573035_istanbul_city_map203.gifhttp://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39572000/jpg/_39572939_crater_ap203body.jpg http://www.vosgouny.com/NewsLeb.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted November 15, 2003 Report Share Posted November 15, 2003 Perhaps this synagogue sits on the same street of the mansion which was confiscated from my grandmother after the Turks killed my grandfather. Pera (now Beyoglu) was a posh suburb then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted November 15, 2003 Report Share Posted November 15, 2003 Bush has made a statement that "Moslem, Jewish and CHRISTIAN groups have flourished in Turkey for centuries." Since when is taken out into the desert to die FLOURISHING??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted November 16, 2003 Report Share Posted November 16, 2003 Now Bush talking about how Turkey has had to deal with terrorists, not mentioning that this is probably Al-Queda expanding into Turkey. Obstensibly tieing well-in-the-past Armenian terrorism with today's bombing in in Istambul. When did the ASALA ever strike a Jewish target? You guys voted for him and now look what he is doing.Are you going to vote for him again????????????????????????????????????????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted November 16, 2003 Report Share Posted November 16, 2003 Well, Amerikanski Hye, with the bizarre way an obliterated group claimed responsibility for the attack, with the claim to be promptly dismissed and Al Qaeda being brought into the equation, it smells Bushski to me - you should be thankful to him for carrying on the work of ASALA by brandishing terror at prime Armenocide deniers. Vote for him next time, will ya? Phooey, the idiosyncracies you tickle out of me. Flee, clown! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted November 16, 2003 Report Share Posted November 16, 2003 In Boston Globe today at this story it was the usual serenade about the Jews living there in centuries in harmony with the Muslims. How could have this happened? bla bla.No mentioned about the special taxes on Jews, discrimination etc. In short all is love between Turks and Jews furthermore with this attack expect intense “closeness” of these two people especially along the editorial pages of US newspapers.No real analyses why the bombings or anything even remotely objective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted November 17, 2003 Report Share Posted November 17, 2003 Someone who owns the paper has a pecuniary interest in Turkey. It is called brain-washing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted November 17, 2003 Report Share Posted November 17, 2003 Barf, barfPuke, pukeYech, yechVomit, vomit! Has any one kept track of how many times this story has been broadcast? Every minute on the minute? How many times would the networks epu;d have broadcast it if it were a Buddhist temple in Laos? The hilarious part is that every newscaster has to make sure that er know they were "Jewish synagogues". Duuuuh!! Do they mean the "synagogues" were not Armenian or Irish?Reminds me of the time when a colleague asked me what my religion was and upon learning that I was of Christian heritage she said: "Yeah, I know you are Christian but are you Cathloic or Jewish?Wowwww!!! and Duuuuh!!! Yech, yech, puke, puke!! For those who have been out on Mars; There were two explosions at Jewish synagogues in Istanbul. And in case you need more information the synagogues were Jewish. Did you hear that? Two Jewish synagogues wer bombed in Istanbul, Turkey and they were Jewish synagogues.Huh? What did you say? I didn't hear you! Were the bombed synagogues Jewish? Oh,! Thank Jewhovah, I thought they were Armenian or Anglican synagogues!!If it takes this kind of news to highlight the Judeo-Turkish Romance then.....I'm glad the news is not about Armenians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted November 17, 2003 Report Share Posted November 17, 2003 Arpa - regardless - this is a terible thing and you as an Armenian should have sympthy for all victims of racially motivated hate crimes. I feel very very sorry for all those affected and feel only anger at those who would carry out such a cowardly (and utterly meaningless) attack... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted November 17, 2003 Report Share Posted November 17, 2003 (edited) Arpa - regardless - this is a terible thing and you as an Armenian should have sympthy for all victims of racially motivated hate crimes. I feel very very sorry for all those affected and feel only anger at those who would carry out such a cowardly (and utterly meaningless) attack...Thoth why automatically assume it was a hate crime? Why not a politically calculated, timely executed crime which is directly perhaps related to Turkish possible troops deployment in Iraq and furthermore is it not what state of Israel does to Palestinian population racially motivated?Don’t get me wrong I absolutely condemn killing any innocent people regardless of race but I think you read perhaps too much US media. Edited November 17, 2003 by Armat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp...07&floc=NW_5-L2 AlQaeda, my foot! The boogey man done it again. Or, maybe Santa Claus. Sooner ot later the truth will surface. The Turks are experts in creating boogey mans. Oddly enough Armenians are not yet implicated. This seems to be the beginning of a long overdue CIVIL WAR in Istanbul-land. The fake "secularism" is about to to unmasked and the true nature of the Turk exposed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 Here is another look. Latest; http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp...07&floc=NW_5-L2 Has anyone else noticed that at many TV reports Istanbul is described as the Capital city? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 Arpa - regardless - this is a terible thing and you as an Armenian should have sympthy for all victims of racially motivated hate crimes. I feel very very sorry for all those affected and feel only anger at those who would carry out such a cowardly (and utterly meaningless) attack... The point Arpa is making is that it is being turned into a piece of Jewish / Zionist propaganda by the use of phrases like "Jewish synagogues". No doubt the news reports of the explosions were sandwiched between appropriate (for Jews and neo-conservatives) other news reports. It probably went something like this. Start with a report of your brave American "heroes" in action in Iraq, then comes the report on Istanbul events in order to suggest to the viewer that this sort of thing is why America invaded Iraq, then move to a report on Palestine with all the usual Israeli bias, suggesting to the viewer that all palestinians are terrorists like those who planted the bombs in Istanbul. But, Thoth you know all about such wag the dog media manipulation of facts. It's your job, isn't it? But you and America's halcyon fool-some-of-the-people-all-of-the-time days are coming to an end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasun Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 One thing you can't blame the authors of bombings is not knowing the very best time to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted November 20, 2003 Report Share Posted November 20, 2003 AlQaeda, my foot! That's exactlly what I think... all this al-quaeda stuff, I am not buying... how could that claim be made just soon after the Synagog explosion ? How could they say this before an investigation ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewish Friend Posted November 21, 2003 Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 The point Arpa is making is that it is being turned into a piece of Jewish / Zionist propaganda by the use of phrases like "Jewish synagogues". No doubt the news reports of the explosions were sandwiched between appropriate (for Jews and neo-conservatives) other news reports. It probably went something like this. Start with a report of your brave American "heroes" in action in Iraq, then comes the report on Istanbul events in order to suggest to the viewer that this sort of thing is why America invaded Iraq, then move to a report on Palestine with all the usual Israeli bias, suggesting to the viewer that all palestinians are terrorists like those who planted the bombs in Istanbul. But, Thoth you know all about such wag the dog media manipulation of facts. It's your job, isn't it? But you and America's halcyon fool-some-of-the-people-all-of-the-time days are coming to an end. Jews like me cringe at the term Jewish/Synagogue. It is racist towards me. How you see it as A Zionist-Jewish thing is beyond me. Only YOU know your motives for saying it. Most Jews in America are flagrant liberals and the opposite of neocons. You paint with a braod brush..a sign of predjudice. Not that I care..I have good dialogue with mainstream Armos here..you are an abberation{You call names ..I call names} JF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph parikian Posted November 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 Duo shocked but not overawed Analysis by Paul Reynolds BBC News Online world affairs correspondent The timing of the Istanbul bombs could not have been more telling. They came at the height of US President George W Bush's state visit. He and Prime Minister Tony Blair were about to give a joint press conference in the very seat of the UK Government. London was already in a state of tension. Protesters were gathering, evidence of the divisive nature of their policies. There was a mismatch between the pomp of the visit and the passion it had aroused. Suddenly, the ground seemed to rumble under their feet. For two men who have said they will make the world safe from terrorism, here was a reminder that the reach of al-Qaeda and its allies is still long. They were clearly shocked but both resolutely declared that they would not be put in awe of such attacks. Churchillian response Instead, there was Churchillian talk, especially from Mr Blair. This was no surprise. It has for long been clear that Mr Bush has not dragged Mr Blair along with him. Tony Blair has been more than a willing partner. One recalls, and the former US Secretary of State Madeleine Albright's memoirs have recently confirmed, that Tony Blair wanted to send ground troops into Kosovo in 1999. Bill Clinton did not. Two quotations from him after the Istanbul attacks sum up his reaction: "Once again, we must affirm that in the face of this terrorism there must be no holding back, no compromise, no hesitation in confronting this menace, in attacking it wherever and whenever we can and in defeating it utterly." "Our response is not to flinch or give way or concede one inch. We stand absolutely firm until this job is done." Mr Bush is more used to such attacks. He experienced 9/11. Britain in front line But now the British prime minister was confronted with the reality that Britain, too, is in the front line. Our response is not to flinch or give way or concede one inch. We stand absolutely firm until this job is done Tony Blair The attacks on British targets promised months ago by Osama Bin Laden had taken place. There might be more. And they might come in Britain itself. So what is to be done about it? For a start, the US and UK have to put Iraq back together again. That was a major point made by both men at the press conference. How to do it was a major point, too, in their talks. "Our mission in Iraq is noble and it is necessary, and no act of thugs or killers will change our resolve or alter their fate. We will finish the job we have begun," said Mr Bush. "It should not lessen... our commitment to Iraq. On the contrary it shows how important it is to carry on until terrorism is defeated there as well," said Mr Blair. Our mission in Iraq is noble and it is necessary, and no act of thugs or killers will change our resolve or alter their fate George Bush The concept is that if Iraq can emerge from the current crisis with stability and a democratic government, it will remove one source of anti-Western hostility. But of course, there are other sources. That is why George Bush spoke so much in his speech in London on Wednesday about spreading "democracy" in what he has taken to calling the "Greater Middle East," which presumably means anywhere from Morocco to Yemen. In the short term, there will have to be tighter security at British diplomatic buildings just as there have been at American. Britain getting drawn in The fact that Scotland Yard has sent a team to Turkey shows how Britain is being drawn into examining the local conditions from which so many of these attacks spring. The FBI has been doing the same for years. A better understanding of how and why these attacks take place is needed. In Turkey, for example, the suicide bombers who attacked two synagogues on 15 November were cousins from the town of Bingol in the south east where Islamic fundamentalism is strong. One of them is said by Turkish reports to have been in Afghanistan and Iran some time ago. These links indicate how al-Qaeda seems to combine both local and international factors. Such links will have to be broken up but they are many. The rest of the agenda The Istanbul bombs completely overshadowed the rest of the Bush-Blair agenda. No decisions were made on two of Mr Blair's concerns - the British detainees at Guantanamo Bay and the US steel tariffs. On the first, talks are to continue over the two options - giving them military trials, to which Britain has objected, or sending them back to Britain. Probably no decision will be taken until the US Supreme Court looks at the issue over the next few months. Mr Bush did hint that British objections would be taken seriously. As for steel, the president simply promised a "timely decision". He is now considering a report from the US Government agency the International Trade Commission on how the tariffs have affected not just steel-making but steel-using industries. The tariffs are due to run until the end of March 2005. But having imposed them, it will be hard for Bush to lift them. Story from BBC NEWS:http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/uk/3223944.stm Published: 2003/11/20 17:19:14 GMT © BBC MMIII Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted November 21, 2003 Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 The point Arpa is making is that it is being turned into a piece of Jewish / Zionist propaganda by the use of phrases like "Jewish synagogues".I have no idea what "zionist" means. I don't ever remember using that word anywhere, not here, not anywhere else. Of course I know what it means, or rather what it is intended to mean.My point was partially understood. I have this habit of reading between the lines and picking up phrases in news broadcasts. The newscasters usually read what is written for them. My wondement was: Why did these editors and writers felt the need to repeat the phrase "Jewish Synagogue" at least 10 times during a 30 second report? Moreover; Why did they feel the neeed to use the qualifying word "Jewish" everytime they mentioned "synagogue". There may be one person in the world that may not know that a synagogue is a Jewish house of worship, just as a mosque is a Moslem one. When it comes to churches, it may be necessary to distinguish whether it is Cathlolic, Baptist, Armenian, or Anglican..... ad infinitum ad nauseam. I still don't know why it was necessary to use the phrase "Jewish Synagogue". Was it mean to distinguish it from an " Armenian Synagogue"?Duh,and double duh!Was there a message in it??What kind of idiots do they think we are??!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted November 21, 2003 Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 Jews like me cringe at the term Jewish/Synagogue. It is racist towards me. How you see it as A Zionist-Jewish thing is beyond me. Only YOU know your motives for saying it. Most Jews in America are flagrant liberals and the opposite of neocons. You paint with a braod brush..a sign of predjudice. Not that I care..I have good dialogue with mainstream Armos here..you are an abberation{You call names ..I call names} JF JF - you know very well that Jews not like you will consider YOU to be the abberation. "Flagrant liberal Jews" like you have sat back for decades and allowed Zionist fanatics to rule the roost - so don't go crying foul now that most of the world is tarring Jews like you and Jews like them with the same brush. And you must also know very well that the majority of card-carrying neocons are Jewish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted November 21, 2003 Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 I still don't know why it was necessary to use the phrase "Jewish Synagogue". Was it mean to distinguish it from an " Armenian Synagogue"?Duh,and double duh!Was there a message in it?? I've just told you why, and what the message was! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewish Friend Posted November 21, 2003 Report Share Posted November 21, 2003 (edited) Jews like me cringe at the term Jewish/Synagogue. It is racist towards me. How you see it as A Zionist-Jewish thing is beyond me. Only YOU know your motives for saying it. Most Jews in America are flagrant liberals and the opposite of neocons. You paint with a braod brush..a sign of predjudice. Not that I care..I have good dialogue with mainstream Armos here..you are an abberation{You call names ..I call names} JFJF - you know very well that Jews not like you will consider YOU to be the abberation. "Flagrant liberal Jews" like you have sat back for decades and allowed Zionist fanatics to rule the roost - so don't go crying foul now that most of the world is tarring Jews like you and Jews like them with the same brush. And you must also know very well that the majority of card-carrying neocons are Jewish. I'm not liberal. If you read my posts you would know that by now. I am an army vet from over thirty years ago.. Draft dodger types like you are all the same. Great at slogans..poor in defending your country. Love it or Leave it! You hate me..well I hate you.. JF Edited November 21, 2003 by Jewish Friend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph parikian Posted November 22, 2003 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2003 Jewish Friend I dought that you Jews have friends . Look at your history in Palestine and Europe or any place where Jews live Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted November 22, 2003 Report Share Posted November 22, 2003 Hey Hovsep (Joseph), I have been following your back and forth with Jewish Friend. I will repeat my previous remarks. Why are you antagonizing this Jewish guy??????I am so happy about my former remarks to you that I will repeat them again. "The plane to Amman is waiting for you on the tarmac.When you get there send the beautiful Queen (nee Lisa Halaby) of your late king back to the US. She is one of us (Americans), you are not." Get LOST Parikian. Armenians like you we don't need in America. Go back where you came from. Our wave of Armenians produced Deukmejians, Michaelians, Petersons (Bedrosians). The only decent recent Armenians are the Barska-Hyes. I married a Beirutzi. I KNOW them well. And what about the Russa-Hyes? What have your type of Armenian produced other than the Armenian Mafia????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armen Posted November 22, 2003 Report Share Posted November 22, 2003 And what about the Russa-Hyes? What have your type of Armenian produced other than the Armenian Mafia????? I do not consider myself a Russa-Hye (I'm a citizen of ROA), but what you call Russa-Hyes produced Hovhannes, Aivazovski, Aram Khachaturian, Tigran Petrossian, 4 marshalls of Soviet Union and Viktor Hambardzoumian to name a few. And I can asure you the next Deukmejian is also going to be one of us. Just wait for some 20-30 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewish Friend Posted November 22, 2003 Report Share Posted November 22, 2003 Jewish Friend I dought that you Jews have friends . Look at your history in Palestine and Europe or any place where Jews live There you go again Name calling. My turn..you're a draft dodger. ..a coward..i can smell it!You're from Jordan? That explains it..after all..Jordan IS Palestine. Friends? your late King killed 30,000 Palestinians on Black September. I was living then{I liked him too but not that action..he was afraid of overthrow}. You were probably kicked out after peace with Israel as an agitator. you are second class here{My Country..U.S.A.}..I'm first class..get over it and keep cleaning my house....lowlife! As to my REAL Armenian friends.gnos't{I can say it but not spell it}. J Zionist F! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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