Arad9 Posted September 20, 2003 Report Share Posted September 20, 2003 To assimilate or not to assimilate that is the question. Should Armenians in Diaspora assimilate to the country that they are living, if yes then to what degree? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamavor Posted September 20, 2003 Report Share Posted September 20, 2003 It is very individual issue. Everyone finds his own reasons. The short answer is no, the more complicated issue is why? Someone asked why there are Armenian Protestants? Why? Because they have their own reasons. Why I like Beatles, why I want to be Armenian, why you study, why you want to have sex? As far as genetics are concerned.... While I was in New York I've noticed that people are extremely interested to know your origins. It is kind of sport over there. People were asking me weather I'm Irish more than any other nationality. Two times they took me for German, although I don't think I look German. One time for Danish. Another time one of those tourist's guys stopped me on the street and started talking to me in Italian, and was shocked that I'm not Italian. The closest was an Indian guy, street vendor who was 100% sure that I'm Greek. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiner Posted September 21, 2003 Report Share Posted September 21, 2003 (edited) If you are talking on an individual basis, I think it's best for everyone to fully integrate in the society they are part of in terms of behavior, mentality, way of life etc. You can do this while still being familiar with your native culture in terms of history, language, foods, music, etc. On a mass basis it's uncontrollable. It's not something that can be decided by anyone. Sociological and many other factors control the rate and degree of assimilation. Edited September 21, 2003 by shiner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 15, 2003 Report Share Posted October 15, 2003 (edited) It is (in my oppinion) very wrong to assimlate within the country Armenians live due to the fact we are a dying people and we must keep our culture and values so we can pass them on to future Armenians. There is some assimlation we can not prevent, the easiest one is speaking the launguage of the country we are in more than Armenian. But it's a good idea to at least speak Armenian at home so we won't forget our language. But it is sad how Armenias are starting to lose their Christian morals and family values in other countries especially in North America. A lot of the education has to come from the parents to their children and its a constant struggle between the old world Armenians and their children born in the Diaspora. This is our true fight and we must stand up to protect our culture or else we will wash out our race and the Turks will sit back and laugh cause hey, they don't have to kill us anymore. We will kill ourselves. Edited October 15, 2003 by A_D_G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted October 15, 2003 Report Share Posted October 15, 2003 I finally got it. We must prevail so that Turks don't laugh at us. I finally got motivated for the continuing existence of the Armenian nation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 15, 2003 Report Share Posted October 15, 2003 (edited) Well let's put aside the Turks and everyone. It's not about anyone else. It's just Armenians having to protect their culture. Face it nobody else on this planet cares about us. We just have to protect ourselves. Edited October 15, 2003 by A_D_G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azat Posted October 15, 2003 Report Share Posted October 15, 2003 do we have a choice? okay maybe we do for 1 or 2 generation, but in the long run do we have a choice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Maybe not it really is a tough topic. It's a good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vava Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 If you are talking on an individual basis, I think it's best for everyone to fully integrate in the society they are part of in terms of behavior, mentality, way of life etc. You can do this while still being familiar with your native culture in terms of history, language, foods, music, etc. On a mass basis it's uncontrollable. It's not something that can be decided by anyone. Sociological and many other factors control the rate and degree of assimilation. Good post shiner , that's almost exactly how i feel... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 (edited) I disagree with shiner and vava. I mean why integrate fully into another society? Well Armenians are a dying race of people. It is ok for a chinese person or a mexican let's say to integrate into another society cause look at their populations! If they lose a few people it won't destroy the race. But Armenians are so few that if we lose our identy, we will only be known as an ancient civillization in about 100 years. And before I have lived in areas where there where no Armenians. It is controllable because it only made me stronger in my culture and way of life. It also helped that they hated Armenians, but that actually did better because instead of integrate to become like everyone else and fit in, I just became more involved in my Armenian culture and I'll die to protect that. Me and all the Armenians I am friends with. Edited October 16, 2003 by A_D_G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 I disagree with shiner and vava. I mean why integrate fully into another society? Well Armenians are a dying race of people. It is ok for a chinese person or a mexican let's say to integrate into another society cause look at their populations! If they lose a few people it won't destroy the race. But Armenians are so few that if we lose our identy, we will only be known as an ancient civillization in about 100 years. And before I have lived in areas where there where no Armenians. It is controllable because it only made me stronger in my culture and way of life. It also helped that they hated Armenians, but that actually did better because instead of integrate to become like everyone else and fit in, I just became more involved in my Armenian culture and I'll die to protect that. Me and all the Armenians I am friends with. Dear ADGAs sober as this sounds like your kids born in US or in Diaspora (minor exceptions perhaps some Islamic coutries) in general are going to be called American Armenians, French Armenians etc. and their kids will be called simply Americans, French etc. I would not worry about the dying part. As long as we have our republic we will have Armenians who will carry on. It is up to individuals to preserve what they want. I personally can do so much but lets face it our kids home countries are not republic of Armenia.I also think you misunderstand integration part. By integration does not mean forgetting everything that is unique about you but being part of society in general. You really don’t have a choice here unless you join some sect and isolate yourself. Having said the above I commend your patriotism and general feeling of having pride of being an Armenian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vava Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 While it is noble and honourable to wish to preserve one's culture - I do not think that integrating to a new host culture/community means necessarily the abandonment of one's roots. I think it's possible to evolve and adapt while retaining important aspects of one's heritage. The two are not mutually exclusive. Furthermore, I think a consiencious resistance to adaptation of a new culture can cause many undesireable situations within the 'new' local community (racism, zenophobia, etc.) and can significantly impede the progress of the immigrating group. The ability to integrate/adapt to host societies has been a vital component of Armenian culture - we have been doing it for a long time now - and yet we have still 'preserved' to a certain extent, our heritage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vava Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Armat, you beat me to it - but I think our sentiments are pretty similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Vava we posted at the same... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Armat, you beat me to it - but I think our sentiments are pretty similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 For the sake of clarity, could someone define what Armenian Culture and Heritage mean? Could one give a dense half a page description? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 For the sake of clarity, could someone define what Armenian Culture and Heritage mean? Could one give a dense half a page description? Americans view their culture through history; Arts, Food, Language, TV, Sports and I see no reason not to apply the same criteria to Armenians unless you (anonymous you) think we are from Mars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Does this answer the question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Does this answer the question? MJ - noted (here & above...Turks laughing at us...what to do - what to do?...LOL...)...but my advice to you...take 2 Paklava, a shot of Raki, listen to some Gomidas, and check back in the morning...LOL...seriously though wasn't it a bit of a rhetorical question? (though perhaps the possible answers might prove interesting...particualrly if they are all different - LOL) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 I sense a danger zone here.Someone is going to blur out AG and the shit will hit the fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 I take it as lack of merit when speaking of Armenian Culture and Heritage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 (edited) Furthermore, I think a consiencious resistance to adaptation of a new culture can cause many undesireable situations within the 'new' local community (racism, zenophobia, etc.) and can significantly impede the progress of the immigrating group.So you'd rather lay down and assimilate for fear of "racism, zenophobia, etc?" I guess with that logic we should have assimilated to turks because they were killing us and being openly racist? Assimiliation is the first step to becoming an ancient culture. I have even been stabbed cause I was Armenian and I rather still have died for my race. Fear of racism? You haven't seen racism. Edited October 16, 2003 by A_D_G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 ADG, I can understand that you have an accumulated protest to express. Many members of this forum have turned it into a dumping destination for their frustration. So you can use that "privilege," too. But why to do it in such vulgar manner and based on superficial pseudo-categories? Also, why don’t you just work on yourself, get proper education, get a proper job, build a proper future for yourself, before you come forward to save the “race?” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boghos Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 (edited) Those that are assimilated or propose assimilation should be turned over to a special court, or just be shot. We cannot afford to lose people. A patriotic Armenian even after six generations, inter-marriages, loss of language and other elements of culture, no interest in the country proper, no knowledge of basic history is a real proposition. A lahmajun Armenian, you can always re-heat it, but it gets harder every time. Edited October 16, 2003 by Boghos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_D_G Posted October 16, 2003 Report Share Posted October 16, 2003 Also, why don’t you just work on yourself, get proper education, get a proper job, build a proper future for yourself, before you come forward to save the “race?” MJ why you assuming I don't have an education or a proper job? I have a university degree and have a job much higher than yours trust me. The fact that you even diss people here means you are uneducated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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