so_mest_13 Posted November 2, 2003 Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 Okay, first of all that article on Frederick Earl Fisk...I know his son, and instead gettin pissed about what the news feeds us, you should remember how much they exagerate, cuz my friend told me what happened..and it wasn't ANYWHERE close to the drug-debt thing, so ya before you say it burns you up, think about the people you're hurting by saying that. Krysta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angel4hope Posted November 2, 2003 Report Share Posted November 2, 2003 i think that the death penalty is a crucial way of punishment- although im not too much of a religious erson- i think that its wrong to take someones life- it just seems immoral-no matter the crime-because if the persone is being given the death penalty for murder or manslaughter-anything involving death/harm of another human being- what kind of example are we setting by givig them the death penalty-yeah i know "eye for an eye,and tooth for a tooth" as some pple say- but its totally hypocritical- because you-or the person carrying out the act of death penalty- is trying to make a certain point by saying that-the criminal is wrong for killing/harming another person-or whatevere the case- and yet again you are doing them same thing to the criminal by proceeding with the death penalty- therefore saying that murder---etc is wrong but going off and killing the criminal--in other words doing onto another what you were trying to point out was wrong in a sense- like trying to teach a 5 year old that hitting their little sibling is wrong and violence is bad by punishing the 5yr old by spanking/hitting him/her- !! i hope what im trying to say is clear...!! <_< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirumemKez20 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 I'm just going to say what I feel is right. I do agree with the death penalty, I think it's wrong for a criminal to kill someone, and I don't think it's right that they take some innocent persons life away, so yes they should deserve what they do...please guys dont be mad at me if you disagree thank you very much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 (edited) I feel us Humans by nature are violent since the beginning of time.. Revenge by death is always a temptation (and quick fix for our anger).. But I feel logically, letting the person rot in jail for the rest of his life is the best way.. Let him live many many many years with what he has done. Killing him will only help put him out of his misery. Only time I believe in killing someone is to protect your family. Edited December 3, 2003 by Armo77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Let him live many many many years with what he has done. Killing him will only help put him out of his misery. If what we are just a memory bank (Sasun,Domino excluding “God” part) then the horrible act one commits soften and become blurry over the years hence the intended punishment becomes pointless if the criminal would not even remember the act. He could theoretically read Plato rest of his existence in jail without remorse or guilt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 then the horrible act one commits soften and become blurry over the years hence the intended punishment becomes pointless if the criminal would not even remember the act. He would if he is in jail the rest of his life caged up like an animal and never sees the light of day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 I do respect your view though Armat... One thing I love about us Armenians compaired to other people is that we are level headed and not many of us are Flaming liberals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 He would if he is in jail the rest of his life caged up like an animal and never sees the light of day. Actually it is not that bad as you describe. They have a library, excise room, which is often outside, and they get a decent meal and even a free health care, which many of us cannot even afford. I am neither for nor against on this issue however my thinking here is that most criminals hardy remorse or repent their acts and are short on memory. The intended punishment becomes a lifestyle… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anileve Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Completely against! We didn’t create life, we have no right to take it away, besides people feel like they have an authority to enforce their judgment upon others, I say its heresy. Whether we pay to keep those people alive or not, we have no say in how our taxes are distributed. Besides if you think about it, there are always flaws in the system and mistakes in the justice system are bound to happen. How many people have been convicted falsely and then released after serving a 10 year sentence, with the words “Oops sorry we made a mistake”? Who is to say that it won’t happen with death penalty. I oppose any sort of extreme measures. By the way now the poll is no longer even, the percentage of “against” is higher. There! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Armat, I'm surprised that as an artist interested with fundamental questions you are not against death penality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Completely against! We didn’t create life, we have no right to take it away, besides people feel like they have an authority to enforce their judgment upon others, I say its heresy. People who are against death penalty are mostly idealistic. What if a particular person raped your ten-year-old daughter then cut her to pieces and ate her slowly over a period of time. Would you or could you see this monster enjoying his exercises in jail while reading comic books?I know you can’t answer this nor you will understand the victim’s perspective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasun Posted December 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 I know you can’t answer this nor you will understand the victim’s perspective Armat jan, I understand that the victim will feel like that. But is justice about the victims perspective or the society's perspective? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anileve Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Armat jan, it’s hard to position myself in the cruel situation you described above. We are overcome by anger and hatred, but that fades and we are left with our sorrows. Humans have this incredible ability to be resilient, so everything is pretty much temporary. After taking your revenge on someone who demonically murdered your loved one, what will you have? Who are you doing it for? Isn’t it for a selfish reason of self satisfaction? Will the person you avenged death for return to the living? Do 2 wrongs make a right? I am a strong believer that each one writes their own destiny, signs their own will and eventually gets what they deserve. I much rather know that they will have to live with what they’ve done. Death is often achieved through suicide which many resort to, since they can’t handle the harshness of living. Why do you think so many end their lives this way, is it easy to live? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 (edited) People who are against death penalty are mostly idealistic. What if a particular person raped your ten-year-old daughter then cut her to pieces and ate her slowly over a period of time. Would you or could you see this monster enjoying his exercises in jail while reading comic books?I know you can’t answer this nor you will understand the victim’s perspectiveThis monster is a monster, not part of what we could consider humanity. Like a lion that could eat a human being. What we must do is to isolate them from the rest of society. Lions are a danger if they are released in a city, does that justify to kill lions? No! They must live with their kinds and not live with humans, the same goes with the monster you refer to. I know, those people in prisons have an easy life, this is a problem with the system. Oh and, the victims perspective is biased BTW Edited December 3, 2003 by Fadix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 lol some people here would not even cut down a tree I see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 I know you can’t answer this nor you will understand the victim’s perspectiveArmat jan, I understand that the victim will feel like that. But is justice about the victims perspective or the society's perspective? Good question. Victims do influence the Society at large that is just human nature and the media does a good job of exploiting horrific crimes and you know the rest.You opened a can of worms Sasun. How do you explain our take on AG.We are second ,third, fourth generation away from those horrific crimes and how you explain our lust for revenge for the Turks… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armat Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Domino I understand you and others for objecting death penalty on moral grounds but shouldn’t the crime fit the punishment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Domino I understand you and others for objecting death penalty on moral grounds but shouldn’t the crime fit the punishment? This is because you consider those "monsters" as humans, see them like animals such as lions, and I am sure your vision will change. For me being part of humanity does not mean being a homo-sapiens, it goes beyond that. Those persons that do such acts(the one you discribed) are not persons, and must be left to live with their kinds, the same way that we isolate dangerous animals from civilisation and not kill them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasun Posted December 3, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Good question. Victims do influence the Society at large that is just human nature and the media does a good job of exploiting horrific crimes and you know the rest.You opened a can of worms Sasun. How do you explain our take on AG.We are second ,third, fourth generation away from those horrific crimes and how you explain our lust for revenge for the Turks… There are those who want revenge, and those who want justice (including myself). Those who want revenge do so mostly because they are disappointed because there has not been justice so far. Otherwise at this point revenge seekers would be very-very few. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sev-mard Posted December 3, 2003 Report Share Posted December 3, 2003 Why do you think so many end their lives this way, is it easy to live? Many times I think not. Most ppl would go on 'living' this life because it's what we have that is certain to us. Others choose suicide, because like you said, living isn't always an easy thing to do... sorry mi kitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 4, 2003 Report Share Posted December 4, 2003 Completely against! We didn’t create life, we have no right to take it away, besides people feel like they have an authority to enforce their judgment upon others, I say its heresy. Whether we pay to keep those people alive or not, we have no say in how our taxes are distributed. Besides if you think about it, there are always flaws in the system and mistakes in the justice system are bound to happen. How many people have been convicted falsely and then released after serving a 10 year sentence, with the words “Oops sorry we made a mistake”? Who is to say that it won’t happen with death penalty. I oppose any sort of extreme measures. By the way now the poll is no longer even, the percentage of “against” is higher. There! What pushiment would you recommend for somone who raped and killed a young woman? Just Curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anileve Posted December 4, 2003 Report Share Posted December 4, 2003 Most ppl would go on 'living' this life because it's what we have that is certain to us. sorry mi kitch Sev mard jan, beautifully put. Also I think that suicide is romanticized by the youth (not that I am excluded from that age group ). I remember thinking that Kurt Cobain was so brave to take his life. Later on you realize that life is romantic on it’s own, an if you consider it an adventure of always anticipating of what will happen next it becomes much more exciting to live. Well now we are even, I am also . It’s aaight, I’ve seen worse things happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sev-mard Posted December 4, 2003 Report Share Posted December 4, 2003 I remember thinking that Kurt Cobain was so brave to take his life. Really?! How so? I remembering being young and thinking Japanese samurai were hard core for taking their own lives, but that had all types of things wrapped up in it. Cobain to me I didn't understand how he'd rob his fans of himself. I know he had issues but he was leading a movement. I was reading his handwritten diaries in a bookstore the other day, deep stuff. Vay menk aveli enk! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sev-mard Posted December 4, 2003 Report Share Posted December 4, 2003 What pushiment would you recommend for somone who raped and killed a young woman? Just Curious. Probably rape and murder~ I'm not against the dealth penatly per se. I know many ppl are innocent or don't deserve and as a black man I know I could get picked by a cop any day of the week and get locked up. But for those criminals who are brazen enough to disregard life and liberty of others, most with no remorse, I can't say I don't agree with them being put down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armo77 Posted December 4, 2003 Report Share Posted December 4, 2003 Probably rape and murder~ I'm not against the dealth penatly per se. I know many ppl are innocent or don't deserve and as a black man I know I could get picked by a cop any day of the week and get locked up. But for those criminals who are brazen enough to disregard life and liberty of others, most with no remorse, I can't say I don't agree with them being put down. bro, me and my Black friends discuss this all the time.. But I must admit that even I myself have been a victim of excessive police force in the past.. Some cops just have a complex and want to flex their muscles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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