McCarthyiologist Posted June 27, 2003 Report Share Posted June 27, 2003 Oups, correction, after searching google, I did find a little about the Sun Theory, even if they just talk about the general language notion and not the rest... still interesting reading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCarthyiologist Posted June 27, 2003 Report Share Posted June 27, 2003 (edited) TURKS TEACH NEW THEORIES Source:The New York Times Date:Feb. 9, 1936 ISTANBUL Feb. 7-In the presence of Mustafa Kemal Ataturk and members of the Cabinet the new school of history, geography and literature recently was opened at Angora. Its immediate purpose is to make the capital the cultural center of the republic and, combined with the law school, it will be the nucleus of a complete university, sister of the one at Istanbul. The significance of the new foundation, however, is much wider and more ambitious, for its object is to expound new theories on Turkish history and language for which no less a person than Mr. Ataturk is responsible. The President of the Turkish Republic, besides being a statesman and soldier of remarkable abilities, has considerable knowledge about history and linguistic matters.(Pffff... wahaha...haha... hahahahaha ) As the result of many years of labor in these directions, he has propounded certain theories which will be taught in the new school at Angora. They are somewhat difficult to explain, but their broad outlines are as follows: Work done by various scientists during the last fifty years goes to show that the Turkish race has been grossly maligned by older historians biased by racial or religous prejudices. The Turks are far form being a predatory race of barbarians. The Turks reached, in remote ages, a high state of culture which, during migrations into China, India, Mesopotamia and Asia Minor, they spread among the less enlightened peoples. They should threfore really be considered the fathers of civilization and possessors of one of the greatest and most glorious histories in the world. As regards language, the new theory is called the "sun language." Starting with the conclusion reached by the French scientist Hilaire de Baranton in his book "L'Origine des Langues, des Religions et des Peuples," published in Paris three years ago, that all languages originated from hieroglyphs and cuneiforms used by Sumerians, the Turkish theory claims that the Sumerians, being Turks, originating in Central Asia, all languages also consequently originated there and first used by the Turks. the first language, in fact, came into being in this wise: Prehistoric man, i.e., Turks in the most primitive stage, was so struck by the effects of the sun on life that he made of it a deity whence sprang all good and evil. Thence came to him light, darkness, warmth and fire, with it were associated all ideas of time: height, distance, movement, size, &c., and give expression to his feelings the sun was thus the first hing to which a name was given. It was "ag" [pronounced agh], and from this syllable all words in use today are derived. This, briefly, is the theory about the "sun language," and with the new conception of Turkish history it will be taught in the new Angora school. Specialists will also teach Greek, Latin, Sanskrit, Sumerian, Hittite, Chinese, French, English, German, Russian and Hungarian. Edited June 27, 2003 by McCarthyiologist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCarthyiologist Posted June 27, 2003 Report Share Posted June 27, 2003 What is funny is that in one of the library I consult, there is a work in French called "Les langues du monde" a book writen in the 60-70 or something, a big book of 2-3 thousand pages. In Sumerian area, they claimed something like: "No present language could be associated with Sumerian, attemps were made to link Sumerian with Turkish, but untill now those attemps failed" When I have read that years back, I said to myself, Turkish ? I was ready to accept, but making researches after researches I came to indirect references to Ataturk Historical compagny and the said excurtions in South America and the Sun theory... when I have read that, I understood what were those "attemps" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikephoros_Phokas Posted June 28, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2003 I have been thinking hard about the so called Holocaust that is tarnishing the image of Germans. I say open up the archives! Until the relevant archives are opened with records from Vichy France, The Third Reich, Germany's allies such as Bulgaria and Romania no one can make a decision about the alleged Holocaust. The only way a decision can be made by an individual about this Holo-hoax before the opening up of proper archives is due to a deep seated anti-German racism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hytga Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 is this post for real? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 There is no doubt the German nation is glorious. I need only to mention two names to prove this: Einstein and Freud Has the Jewish nation ever produced such minds? The answer is clear. The answer is clear. Both Einstein and Freud were Jews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 The answer is clear. Both Einstein and Freud were Jews. Dan jan (dungeon?), you took the whole thing too literally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Dan jan (dungeon?), you took the whole thing too literally. Literally? what do you mean? .... I don't think there's any metaphorical meaning in that........... or are you just looking for an argument with me again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 One thing is for certain - I am not looking for an argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 One thing is for certain - I am not looking for an argument. Then explain your point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 WAKE UP, Dan. Read the whole thread and you will understand. It is a spoof about how the Israeli government and the major Jewish organizations handle the Armenian Genocide. The Turks consider famous Armenians as Turks, whitewashing thier Armenianess. I have EVEN heard them refer to Cher as Turkish. Ditto famous architect Balian, etc. etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 WAKE UP, Dan. Read the whole thread and you will understand. It is a spoof about how the Israeli government and the major Jewish organizations handle the Armenian Genocide. The Turks consider famous Armenians as Turks, whitewashing thier Armenianess. I have EVEN heard them refer to Cher as Turkish. Ditto famous architect Balian, etc. etc. Uhhh, no, America-Hye.. actually, it's the Germans who want to claim Einstein and Freud as one of their own... they're in the same position as Turks.. however, their last names show that clearly, they're not German, but are Jewish......... Just like our Armenian last names... How can Cher Sarkissian be believed to be Turkish?.... I'm not pro-Jewish or anti-German. In fact, I've talked against the Jewish government and policies on more than one occasion, which I'm sure many will remember (especially Domino, Sip, Accelerated)... But there are some things that we need to be objective about... Yeah, well, I've been called lotsa things, including a Nazi and an anti-Semite, but things like that don't interest me at all. They are just insignificant. Yes, there are Jews out there who deny the Armenian Genocide simply because they want to be the only "nation" that was massacred, but undeniably, there are many pro-Armenian Jews. Just as there are many good Germans and bad Germans, good Turks and bad Turks. There are Turks who have APOLOGIZED to Armenians for what their "government" did to our ancestors. It might not mean much to people, but I wouldn't cast all Turks into one box and say that they are all evil, just as I wouldn't cast all Jews into one box, or all Germans into one box... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 The Turks claim a lot of things, such as Urartu was a "Turkish" ancient kingdom. The spoof that you missed was that just as the German's claim famous Jews as their own, just as the Turks do with famous Armenians. They will kill the Armenians, yet elevate those Armenians in history whose accomplishments they can use to pat themseles on the back. My family member is CONSTANTLY touted as an example of the Turkish magnanamous (SP?) approach to Armenians, yet they say nothing of his progeny working as a hammal in France due to their vile minority policies or those of us who are non-descript members of American society. The progeny of the Ittihadists languishing in the mansions of the Bosphorus that rightfully belong to non-descript Americans of Armenain descent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 The Turks claim a lot of things, such as Urartu was a "Turkish" ancient kingdom. The spoof that you missed was that just as the German's claim famous Jews as their own, just as the Turks do with famous Armenians. They will kill the Armenians, yet elevate those Armenians in history whose accomplishments they can use to pat themseles on the back. My family member is CONSTANTLY touted as an example of the Turkish magnanamous (SP?) approach to Armenians, yet they say nothing of his progeny working as a hammal in France due to their vile minority policies or those of us who are non-descript members of American society. The progeny of the Ittihadists languishing in the mansions of the Bosphorus that rightfully belong to non-descript Americans of Armenain descent. Dan, don't even listen to the individual having writen this above comment. The only reason this thread has been started is because Nikephoros_Phokas has taken Turkish denialist stances and replaced them with German and Jews to make fun of the Turkish claims. Hagarag don't live in the same universe as ours, please excuse this dude for being insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 The spoof that you missed was that just as the German's claim famous Jews as their own, just as the Turks do with famous Armenians. You keep contradicting yourself. What IS your point? I don't get it. They will kill the Armenians, yet elevate those Armenians in history whose accomplishments they can use to pat themseles on the back. Germans have never denied that Einstein is a Jew.... I can't see what you're getting at.... The entire world knows that Einstein was a Jew... So are you equating the Germans to Turks or the Jews to Turks, or what? I don't get it... You say one thing, and then come back and say something else... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Hey Domino, I am ESSENTIALLY stating the same thing that you are. Just because you are incensed about my comments about Damadian in the other thread, please do not bring your feelings here to muddle this thread. As for insanity, that is your perception. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
America-Hye Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Hey Dan, What contradiction?? Nikphoros_Phokas spoof had to do with co-opting prominet minorities as one's own. There is no contradiction here. Yes, Phokas was equating German to Turks. How old are you Dan. Are you out of high school yet?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 I know what he was trying to do, I am simply saying that not all Germans are like Turks, and not all Turks are like German denialists... That was my point.... How old are you Dan. Are you out of high school yet?? lol... I'm in 3rd year of university, and for the record, yes, I got the satirical element in the post... I am SUPPOSED to get that stuff, I'm taking courses in Satire, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Wow, talk about a thread with umph. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsuvan Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 as a turk i thought a lot to write or not to write. probably you won' t believe me or trust me, but İ just wanted to say something. there are sad stories about those years. as an eye wittness, my grandma told what she remembered about those days. so i find armenian side of the story more realistic. i mean, if the truth will free us, than i can accept any name you want to give to things happened at that times. but some of the things written in this topic are lie or wrong. e.g. things written about sun theory or urartu kingdom. no one in turkey claims that urartu kingdom is a "turkish" ancient kingdom. and today "sun theory" is called b******t by all the turks. there are funnier things that probably you won' t even heard. but these are all funny ideological stories stayed in those years. probably all the nations on the world has those kind of bullshits. also i really laughed the thing written about cher. i' m sure that nobody in turkey really claimed something like this. if you need a real example about turks claims, then i can give you one. "sabiha gokcen" who known as first turkish female pilot, is an armanian orphan. may be there are two or more stories like this, but the other claims about turkish claims are generally wrong or not claimed for at least last 30 years. finally, i don' t like atatürk. he could be a good friend of faschist butcher franco. but İ have to accept that he did a good thing to found a laic republic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 Thanks for the input Marsuvan - please tell us more. And welcome to the forum. You will find that most Armenians are not haters...even if we be atheists... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 but some of the things written in this topic are lie or wrong. e.g. things written about sun theory or urartu kingdom. no one in turkey claims that urartu kingdom is a "turkish" ancient kingdom. and today "sun theory" is called b******t by all the turks. there are funnier things that probably you won' t even heard. but these are all funny ideological stories stayed in those years. probably all the nations on the world has those kind of bullshits. Well, try and read the introductory chapter to "Blue Guide - Turkey", and you will see presented as truth what you have rightly said is bullshit. The Blue Guide bullshit was written by a Turkish diplomat I think (if someone has a copy of the book to hand then maybe they can check this), so it is still official history as far as the Turkish state is concerned. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 finally, i don' t like atatürk. he could be a good friend of faschist butcher franco. but İ have to accept that he did a good thing to found a laic republic. And he had the good sense to die before dictators went out of fashion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakharar Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 I have been to Istanbul and Ankara for about two weeks this February. The only bolsohyes I know live here in Germany. Is the situation so desperate as they make it out to be. Have the Bolsohyes crossed the point of no return or regeneration? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 finally, i don' t like atatürk. he could be a good friend of faschist butcher franco. but İ have to accept that he did a good thing to found a laic republic. marsuvan, sorry for my skepticism, but I am smelling fakeness here. You are a Turk whom consider Ataturk a fascist and indirectly as a butcher, on the other hand, you find he did a good thing building a Laic republic. My skepticism lies on the fact that those Turks that consider him a butcher and a fascist are religious muslims that are against a laic republic, but you are for it. You could have been a well informed personne that is well read, and I could have understood that a Turk that is neither an Islamist, neither a nationalist... but here again your ignorance of some thngs such as the Urartu Kingdom being considerd as a Turkish Kingdom by some etc... sound weird... even more weird... "sabiha gokcen" being Armenian is a recent claims made and the way you say it is if it was something so natural and well known... There is other things in your post that sound weird as well. By any chance, are you Kurd? Don't take personal, but since there has been many impersonations in the past, I became a little skeptic when a Turk come here and tell that Ataturk is a fascist, and when that Turk is not a Muslim foundamentalist. If I offensed you in any ways, or if you really are a Turk. I appologise, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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