Bible Study

[Nané]

Recently I decided to "re-read" the Bible (especially the Old Testament). I quoted re-read because I don't remember much of what I read years ago. I think I just read it for the sake of reading.

 

So here I am trying to read and UNDERSTAND the Bible I started reading the Armenian translation then switched to English ... then decided to read both simultaneously. Still, I found myself drifting away and not understanding what I was reading. Is it me? or is it the wording? I was about to give up on the whole idea, then I found this book while at Borders. It's called "Spirit Filled Life Bible For Students: Learning and Living God's Word by the Power of His Spirit." Hey I WAS a studen less than a year ago I must say, this book made things much more clear.

 

Now, I am still reading Genesis and I already have a dilemma Why did God favor (or respect) Abel but not Cain? The explanation that is given in this book is that "true worship to God involves coming to His presence through the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ, which Abel's offering of the firstborn of his flock represented. Cain came to God on the basis of his own work or self-effort, which the fruit of the ground represented." Then it continues "Abel's and Cain's offerings represent two different ways we can come to God, either through faith in what Jesus Christ has done for us (Abel's) or on the basis of our own good works (Cain's)." What? Is this not teaching us to be lazy? You can be a BUM all your life and not do any good for people and be respected by God? Isn't our God a little too forgiving? (At this point some of you may tell me "How dare you doubt God's will?" Well I dare because I want to understand. I don't want to be a blind believer.)

 

Comments are welcomed.

 

PS. How ironic I just read the posting by armeniangirl83, which I can't answer yet ...

[shiner]

Sulamita,

I don't know the exact answer to your question. I will try to ask one of the religion professors at my school just out of curiosity and see what the issue really is. Not that they know everything but they can probably give a better than average opinion.

 

One thing that I do know for sure however is that there is an endless debate whether the bible should be interpreted literally or figuratively. Lately more and more scholars are adopting the idea that the bible should not be taken literally. Adopting this view is not considered antireligious today, as it would have been 200 years ago.

 

Maybe this is a case in which there is a figurative implication. Maybe the implication is that a human does not have what it takes to find God solely on his own and he needs Jesus. In this view the importance of knowing Jesus is magnified. The importance of Jesus' work and teachings are magnified also, as well as the amount of dependancy humans have on Him.

 

I'm just saying maybe it's something like this. I don't know much about the Bible or religion in general, but just like you I'm in the process of learning. Good luck! As I said I'll try to talk to some other people about this.

[Nané]

BTac:

 

Thanks for the response. You presented an interesting point of view ...

[raffiaharonian]

The interpretation of the Bible is one of the most controversial issues which has and is creating walls of separations and contradictions among the Believers. However there are basic principle which cannot and should not be ‘played’ with. The Bible is not a cookbook , nor a know-how-to-do-things reference guide.

I believe it is the spiritual guidance of the Believer , who has entrusted his/her beliefs in God.

 

First of all let me point out that the Genesis was written prior to the Birth of our Lord Jesus Christ and is part of the Old Testament, thus the explanation laid down in this version of the Bible is rather unrealistic and based on wrong assumptions.

It is the Spirit of the offering to God under discussion and not the work/laziness of Abel and Cain.

Abel offered his first and ‘rich production yield’ to God , while Cain chose the less ‘quality level production yield’.

Thus Abel’s offering is from his heart while Cain’s offering comes from the feeling of ‘obligation’ and not devotion to God.

 

It is like the wedding gift. You either take a gift just for the sake of the gift or you buy something which you consider will be usefull and appreciated!

[shiner]

Raffi,

You are right. I can't believe how it didn't even occur to me that Genesis was written way before the time of Jesus, and how it is impossible for Cain or Abel to come to God through Jesus.

[Nané]

I am sure the authors of the book were aware of that But what they are doing is comparing Abel's sacrifice of his firstborn to God's (future) sacrifice of his only son.

[raffiaharonian]

Sulamita ,although I am not a priest nor a 'theologician' , I believe the issue is not the offering as an item, the issue is the desire of the offerer to please God.

 

Abel's offering came out of his desire to 'show' his love , while Cain's offering was a half-hearted 'must-do' action.

 

Maybe I am wrong , but I suppose the idea of love and devotion to God is the principle idea of this 'play' of the Bible.

[Nané]

Why is Cain's offering "less quality level production" ? He was a tiller of the ground. He could only offer "fruits of the ground" !!! Why is Abel's offering "rich production yield" ? Because it was the firstborn of his flock?

What if the roles were reversed? Would God respect Cain if he was the sheep keeper?

I am sorry but I don't see the logic behind your reasoning.

[armeniangirl83]

at this moment i'm on school and about 20 minutes i have an exam, but maybe i know the answer: God respect abel and not cain because he was jealous. I have read it. At the moment i don't have an bible so i can't say were it exactely is. when i don't forget it i shall say it.

[Paul bunyan]

you must remember that when the state church of England translated the Holy Bible into english certain commentairies were not put in the english priest's bible as certain information was deemed not desirable

for the peasants to know about.

such as the fact that the betrayer of

Christ, Judas, did not hang himself but was lynched and eviscerated by certain men in the Sanhedrin who were

afraid that he would reveal their major role in conspiracy to murder

Jesus. they would have been in much

powerful trouble. also God loved Abel

because Abel loved God. cain had no more love for God than taalat ***** did he was the physical and spiritual

son of the devil, who impregnated eve

the english authorities deemed these

facts not prudent for the public to

know thats why today hundreds of years of later all english language bibles

still haven't corrected this error.

[vahan]

Do you understand difference bewtween a concept and reality ???most think they do..

sinplest way is this..close your eyes imagine you rub your hands together..now open you eyes and rub your hands together.. 1st one is a concept nothing to do with the real ..second one is REALITY...al religions are conceptual in nature....you believe in this or in that, anything that makes you feel good ..warm whatever...you have fooled yourself!!!..how to get out of this mess??answer is twofold:

1-always distinguish concept from real.

2-understand that mind doesn't understand anything!!!but your whole understands..your mind in a non-understanding pheneomena..it is a communication device..

If I explain to you the taste of a fruit unknown to you,with every example in the world..you will think that you understand what it tastes like right ?? well wrong you will form a concept about (remember the word about) the taste..But if i place a piece of the fruit in your mouth you suddenly and truly understand what it tastes like !!!!

that's reality!!

when you go to sleep,does your body ask your mind ,how to the millions of biochemical reactions(of supreme complexity)?? take place ..??NO !

This is why,the mind,talks CRAP all the time,concepts.....wasted energy!!muslims,christians jews...bla bla bla ,we all dance inconceptual thinking,and we choose this or that aspect ,of this imaginary discussion,and we think we know.

We know NOTHING,reality,is far more complex than mind's understanding..the you can only understand by experiencing!!!

and that is budhist Zen approach.

love you all

[Paul bunyan]

Hohoho heeeeheeeeheee, you certainly,

are funny Vahan.

[raffiaharonian]

I am Armenian, no I am a Chinese, no I am American/indian /Pakistani etc. etc. etc.

 

I love my parents, my brothers, my cousin, my neighbour. I love my girlfriend, wife etc.etc. etc.

 

I feel good when I do good deeds/ bad deeds,

I feel good when I hear good news etc.etc. etc.

 

Do I need to touch anything of those? Does my brain cells need to function in such a way so as to conceive these IDEAS or FEELINGS?

Maybe there are some hormone secretions, some nerves functioning, but are we in control of those functions.

 

I love God, I love Jesus , I think about doing good to others. I feel something about all these.

 

Are everything crap, as our friend Vahan is putting it? Well, if yes, then maybe we are a big crap ourselves! or 'manure producing machines'.

 

I cannot concieve the adoption of an idea or a relegious belief, that has not come from the rejection of a former idea or belief , after having deeply studied it. It is not fair for the new one too.

 

Just because we don't like the 'picture' of the old nannies or the people who go to the 'traditional' churches, doesn't constitute a valid reason to reject the idea or the essence beyond the "Building and the theatre-like ritual", of the traditional relegions.

 

Suddenly the world is discovering Thibet, Zen, Hinduism, Confucious etc etc etc.

It's new , its good , it looks different, maybe its more "IN" to be that. After all look at Richard Geer, Brad, .........

 

Well then this is not belief , this is not relegion, it is a Fashion Show.

 

If Zen is filling your life with positive energy and feelings, then it is good, but how dare you insult the remaining of us , who stupid enough, have chosen to follow the traditional relegions.

 

You cannot be even a true Zen believer , because a rejection or insult of the different, cannot depict the inner spirit of any belief.

Ask your relegion's guide (priest) and come share it with us.

 

It is fun sharing your newly acquired ideas around a coffee table , with some uninterested bimbos, but when you are sharing them with us, please be dissent enough to support your views, with proper respect to the rest of us ( the stupid ones...).