Zara Posted May 16, 2008 Report Share Posted May 16, 2008 It's funny how much people appreciate things when they're finally gone. Even if it's for a short time. I appreciate and miss a lot of things. I miss not caring or thinking before acting. Not worrying, Or judging. Being free of headaches. Painless. Stoical. Feeling________________________________________________________________ nothing. Just living. But why care so much now? Why think between the lines, Beyond what other people say? Why desire being wanted or needed? Why want to be successful or wealthy? Why desire to survive? What about your own flesh and blood? Why feel the need to have kids or take the responsibility to raise them? To keep them safe from harm And hope for them to be successful? Why? Why do people want these things and not others? What is it that drives people to want them? What's the point? Where will all of this end? Death? Something less significant? Or more? Are we a part of something much greater and older than we believe to be a part of? Do we have a purpose beyond what we can fathom? Are we being used? why do people have thoughts? A conscience? Why do we think? And use logic? Is there a reason? I'm pretty sure someone out there can ballpark what's driving me to think about all of this. There's only one thing running through my mind that seems to stand out to me: your own flesh and blood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 16, 2008 Report Share Posted May 16, 2008 Zar jan, inchies jghaynatsel??? Ova xatrit kpel??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harut Posted May 16, 2008 Report Share Posted May 16, 2008 everyone likes to boast about their accomplishments and creations... a human being is the most complex object that one can create (yet so effortless to do)... the only option for many and the last ditch effort for others... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 16, 2008 Report Share Posted May 16, 2008 (edited) Zar jan, inchies jghaynatsel??? Ova xatrit kpel??? Do I really sound angry? I'm just thinking about things and trying to be very neutral with my own feelings. Edited May 16, 2008 by Zara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 16, 2008 Report Share Posted May 16, 2008 everyone likes to boast about their accomplishments and creations... a human being is the most complex object that one can create (yet so effortless to do)... the only option for many and the last ditch effort for others... Ironic isn't it? But what I'm curious about is why. Why do we make them? What's the real reason for sex and reproduction? We obviously don't have to have offspring. No creature has to produce offspring. But most creatures do. Why? What drives most beings to reproduce? Even the ones that may or may not find a partner? There are more questions but that's a fundamental starting point for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anoushik Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Ironic isn't it? But what I'm curious about is why. Why do we make them? What's the real reason for sex and reproduction? We obviously don't have to have offspring. No creature has to produce offspring. But most creatures do. Why? What drives most beings to reproduce? Even the ones that may or may not find a partner? There are more questions but that's a fundamental starting point for me. It's the desire for hope for the future. Because we know that we are all mortal beings, yet it's easy to accept that fact when we know that we will continue to live in our offsprings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harut Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Ironic isn't it? But what I'm curious about is why. Why do we make them? What's the real reason for sex and reproduction? We obviously don't have to have offspring. No creature has to produce offspring. But most creatures do. Why? What drives most beings to reproduce? Even the ones that may or may not find a partner? There are more questions but that's a fundamental starting point for me. http://hyeforum.com/index.php?showtopic=10044 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hetanos Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 (edited) I think God or Whoever was very clever to combine pleasure with reproduction in human beings. On the other hand, Some people chose to have an offspring due to societal and cultural pressure. Some needed more children to work in family farm settings(true with agrarian societies). Some are insecure about themselves and would like to transfer their miseries to their children. Some deeply regretted to have children(in case of my Mom). I don't really know. I guess, in the past, people relied more on their children to take care of them when they age... No simple answer. In my case , I still weight. What happens if the child grows up and on his or her stupid teenage years despises everything about you? What then? 15 years of miseries? Midlife crisis, Russian rullet, hard drinking, death? Has to be buried by the person who despised you all these years?(: Btw. Some people just love to have children:) Edited May 17, 2008 by hetanos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ani Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Ironic isn't it? But what I'm curious about is why. Why do we make them? What's the real reason for sex and reproduction? We obviously don't have to have offspring. No creature has to produce offspring. But most creatures do. Why? What drives most beings to reproduce? Even the ones that may or may not find a partner? There are more questions but that's a fundamental starting point for me. I will not try to answer the philosophical “why” part of the question…Because that question can be answered numerous times and still remain unanswered… The answer to the question “why do we reproduce or what drives or motivates us to have children?” is different for each of us, depending on our views, intersts, etc…Research shows that most women feel “whole” after becoming a mother, it has to do with rising estrogen levels, which effects emotional and physical state of a woman…Hetanos mentioned number of reasons , another reason I see some women have children for very often is to tie their husbands (or partners)…This never works and makes the existence miserable for everyone…Having children myself I , personally, think that one has to be in a very stable emotional (and physical) state, and simply be ready for the huge responsibility … I remember that I always wanted to have children, I really did, …when someone asked me “why” I did not have an answer…I thought to myself, what was the reason I wanted to have children when I was young, maybe it simply was my reflex and desire to become a mother… Sex is a physical need…Humans have primary and secondary needs, some researchers say that sex is a primary need next to food and water (of course for some people its primary and for some its not a need at all ), and reproduction is a consequence of the sexual act… Animals reproduce as they eat, sleep, run, defend themselves, etc…Its simply a reflex…For humans also It was simply a reflex, mixed with pleasure caused by chemicals in brain, for ages… until we started to “think”… I always thought that people who do not want to have children are selfish… selfish sounds rude… I mean a person who values his/her comfort, career that took them years to accomplish , organized lifestyle with steady hours for lunch, rest, dinner, sleep and realizes that children are gonna destroy all that…(which is btw true )…Today I think they are just practical people who know what they need and when… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azat Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Ani jan I am one of those people who does not want a child and any person who knows me would tell you that I am no where close to being selfish. I LOVE kids. they are great and have 9 little cousins who i think are awesome and would give up everything for them but at the same time i dont think i will ever be able to raise a child thus i dont want that responsibility. as for sex... reproduction is only small part of sex. there are many many other reasons including the highest form or expression of love for your mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MosJan Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 joghovurd es inch gortsy eq ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ani Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Ani jan I am one of those people who does not want a child and any person who knows me would tell you that I am no where close to being selfish. I LOVE kids. they are great and have 9 little cousins who i think are awesome and would give up everything for them but at the same time i dont think i will ever be able to raise a child thus i dont want that responsibility. as for sex... reproduction is only small part of sex. there are many many other reasons including the highest form or expression of love for your mate Azat Jan, that’s why I said that I used to think that way…it was way back when I saw the world in pink from my immature point of view …today I actually understand and respect them (and you know I respect you a lot) because as I said above raising a child is a very difficult and never ending process…Harut said in one of the posts above, that human kind is the most complex creature but effortless to make…I have to disagree, because effortless might be just getting sand and stone for the building, but to built, to organize, to furnish, etc. takes enormous effort…and chances of success are low… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ani Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 joghovurd es inch gortsy eq ?? eh...Movses Jan...Kyanqic xorata kenenq... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MosJan Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 ok Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Em Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Why do people in Somalia, Angola or Niger have children? What kind of a deranged person would bring life into this world under such horrible conditions? What "hope for the future" do they see? I think the ultimate act of selfishness is having the third, fourth, ninth child after witnessing the deaths of the preceding ones. How can one be so cruel to such a helpless being? I know some people would like to kill me for what I am about to say, but I honestly feel that children who are brought forth to live in poor villages without clean water, daily bread and some sense of security and safety in their environment are better off not living at all. If I was a young woman who could not escape such a situation; if I was forced to live in these conditions myself, I would opt to become sterile. Why subject a helpless soul to such misery and hardship? Knowing full well.. and willingly ? NO WAY! I don't know what the solution is or what repercussions will come with stopping them from becoming pregnant, yet I DON'T care. I wish they are prohibited from procreating until they can create tolerable conditions for the living children. I wish that the children of the world are not exposed to unending periods of hunger, of unspeakable violence, of molestation or rape. By the way, I completely agree that while creating a child may be the easiest thing to do (for some)- sustaining, nourishing, supporting and enabling that person through LIFE is the hardest endeavor any person can take on. It is a 24 hours a day job. No vacations or sick days. Even if you are physically resting, your mind is still on the job. Every day you succeed and fail simultaneously. Becoming a parent entails forgetting about your own life- your SELF- and living for the primary and sole purpose of caring for another. Many people are not willing or may not be capable to give up as much. Thank God they realize it early on and do not become parents. And for those who aren’t certain, I would absolutely suggest that they visit a household with a small child for an entire week and participate in caring for the child. I am sure that will be a very eye-opening experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 I will not try to answer the philosophical “why” part of the question…Because that question can be answered numerous times and still remain unanswered… The answer to the question “why do we reproduce or what drives or motivates us to have children?” is different for each of us, depending on our views, intersts, etc…Research shows that most women feel “whole” after becoming a mother, it has to do with rising estrogen levels, which effects emotional and physical state of a woman…Hetanos mentioned number of reasons , another reason I see some women have children for very often is to tie their husbands (or partners)…This never works and makes the existence miserable for everyone…Having children myself I , personally, think that one has to be in a very stable emotional (and physical) state, and simply be ready for the huge responsibility … I remember that I always wanted to have children, I really did, …when someone asked me “why” I did not have an answer…I thought to myself, what was the reason I wanted to have children when I was young, maybe it simply was my reflex and desire to become a mother… Sex is a physical need…Humans have primary and secondary needs, some researchers say that sex is a primary need next to food and water (of course for some people its primary and for some its not a need at all ), and reproduction is a consequence of the sexual act… Animals reproduce as they eat, sleep, run, defend themselves, etc…Its simply a reflex…For humans also It was simply a reflex, mixed with pleasure caused by chemicals in brain, for ages… until we started to “think”… I always thought that people who do not want to have children are selfish… selfish sounds rude… I mean a person who values his/her comfort, career that took them years to accomplish , organized lifestyle with steady hours for lunch, rest, dinner, sleep and realizes that children are gonna destroy all that…(which is btw true )…Today I think they are just practical people who know what they need and when… I'm thinking of the bigger picture. With all procreating beings. Trees, bugs, sea creatures, mammals, and so on. Why would some small male spiders have sex if they knew that the much larger females might eat them after they're "done"? It's a death sentence for them just for the females to have a few billion offspring that they won't even take care of afterwards. Why do male lions kill all of the offspring of a pride that they win from the older male(s)? The only lion cubs that are spared are the females that are very close to maturity. What kind of hope is that for the cubs? Or the pride? Or the species? Why do female green flies reproduce exact copies of themselves when they have no partner? Why do some animals commit acts of cannibalism against the young of their own "kind" or "species"? Why do animals that raise their young defend them with more fervor when they are older rather than younger? What is going on in the bigger picture and the broader scheme of things? Why do dogs, which are basically domesticated and reshaped wolves, go into "heat"? That makes sex almost like a "need" right? Why do female hyenas have fake p**es? To get rid of the "urge" with eachother? Why is sex a "need" or a "reflex"? So, in the bigger picture, what is sex and why do procreating beings do it and reproduce? To me sex seems like the precursor to reproduction rather than reproduction being a consequence of sex. That's how I'm viewing the whole concept right now. Of course the questions are answerable in different ways for individual people when they give "human based" answers on their own conditions and opinions but the process of reproducing is similar for many living beings. Sex isn't exclusively a human thing so why only think of it in terms of humans? The body obviously operates with a purpose in almost everything that it does. So what is the reason for all of this? I want to say some things about human sexual behavior too but I think it might be inappropriate to post in public. It'll definitely be objectionable and distasteful. I'm not really in the mood to offend people. I'm a little confused, I guess. I think I need to go for a walk or something and just think about it some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 (edited) Something else I want to add. Why do some female fish lay unfertilized eggs and males of the same species "spray" sperm? They actively seek the eggs and not the females. No humpin' and pumpin' involved. That's a really complicated "need" or "reflex" isn't it? Similar concept applies with many plants. Edited May 19, 2008 by Zara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LK82 Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Cool topic. As far as sex is concerned, I like to think that sex is an art and we the artists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Zar jan - there is a good reason why seahorses are one of the few animals in the animal kingdom that I HATE, literally!!! Have you ever seen how they reproduce? Female seahorses produce the eggs and they transfer the eggs into the male seahorses, the male seahorses give the actual birth... Now spraying is ok, as long as she delivers the beasts, but having the males give birth is sickening when you think about it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Not to forget - those species that spray the are safe - they stay away from aids and stuff!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Should we make a topic out of this--err-- topic? Ash, aren't you glad you're not a seahorse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LK82 Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 A topic about a topic? As you wish, rest assured my two-cents will be thrown in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Still I Rise You may write me down in history With your bitter, twisted lies, You may trod me in the very dirt But still, like dust, I'll rise. Does my sassiness upset you? Why are you beset with gloom? 'Cause I walk like I've got oil wells Pumping in my living room. Just like moons and like suns, With the certainty of tides, Just like hopes springing high, Still I'll rise. Did you want to see me broken? Bowed head and lowered eyes? Shoulders falling down like teardrops. Weakened by my soulful cries. Does my haughtiness offend you? Don't you take it awful hard 'Cause I laugh like I've got gold mines Diggin' in my own back yard. You may shoot me with your words, You may cut me with your eyes, You may kill me with your hatefulness, But still, like air, I'll rise. Does my sexiness upset you? Does it come as a surprise That I dance like I've got diamonds At the meeting of my thighs? Out of the huts of history's shame I rise Up from a past that's rooted in pain I rise I'm a black ocean, leaping and wide, Welling and swelling I bear in the tide. Leaving behind nights of terror and fear I rise Into a daybreak that's wondrously clear I rise Bringing the gifts that my ancestors gave, I am the dream and the hope of the slave. I rise I rise I rise. --Maya Angelou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zara Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 (edited) Dulce et Decorum Est Bent double, like old beggars under sacks, Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge, Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs And towards our distant rest began to trudge. Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind; Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots Of disappointed shells that dropped behind. GAS! Gas! Quick, boys!-- An ecstasy of fumbling, Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time; But someone still was yelling out and stumbling And floundering like a man in fire or lime.-- Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light As under a green sea, I saw him drowning. In all my dreams, before my helpless sight, He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning. If in some smothering dreams you too could pace Behind the wagon that we flung him in, And watch the white eyes writhing in his face, His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin; If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs, Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,-- My friend, you would not tell with such high zest To children ardent for some desperate glory, The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est Pro patria mori. --Wilfred Owen NOTE: Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori means "it is sweet and right to die for your country". Dulce et decorum est means "it is sweet and right". We Wear the Mask We wear the mask that grins and lies, It hides our cheeks and shades our eyes,-- This debt we pay to human guile; With torn and bleeding hearts we smile, And mouth with myriad subtleties. Why should the world be overwise, In counting all our tears and sighs? Nay, let them only see us, while We wear the mask. We smile, but, O great Christ, our cries To thee from tortured souls arise. We sing, but oh the clay is vile Beneath our feet, and long the mile; But let the world dream otherwise, We wear the mask! --Paul Laurence Dunbar Edited May 20, 2008 by Zara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anoushik Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Why do people in Somalia, Angola or Niger have children? What kind of a deranged person would bring life into this world under such horrible conditions? What "hope for the future" do they see? I think the ultimate act of selfishness is having the third, fourth, ninth child after witnessing the deaths of the preceding ones. How can one be so cruel to such a helpless being? I know some people would like to kill me for what I am about to say, but I honestly feel that children who are brought forth to live in poor villages without clean water, daily bread and some sense of security and safety in their environment are better off not living at all. If I was a young woman who could not escape such a situation; if I was forced to live in these conditions myself, I would opt to become sterile. Why subject a helpless soul to such misery and hardship? Knowing full well.. and willingly ? NO WAY! Em jan, why do people in poverty stricken places have children? It might be cruel to say, but it's because they aren't as enlightened as you are to realize that they shouldn't have kids in those conditions. It's lack of education, lack of knowledge. That's why we have the civilized versus the uncivilized worlds. I wish that the children of the world are not exposed to unending periods of hunger, of unspeakable violence, of molestation or rape. And thus the reason why I don't believe in God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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