gdavidyan Posted August 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 I am going crazy to think that no one will allow her here with me, and I do not want to take the last resort of going to a different country with her, I will though if I have to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted August 16, 2007 Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 (edited) Lord Byron shagged his half-sister. I was attracted to a cousin a few years ago (a cousin I had not seen since I was 5 or so. I think I even wrote about it on this forum). Can't help you on the U.S. thing, but I wonder how you are going to keep this a secret from the rest of your family forever. Edited August 16, 2007 by nairi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 16, 2007 Report Share Posted August 16, 2007 I am going crazy to think that no one will allow her here with me, and I do not want to take the last resort of going to a different country with her, I will though if I have to. You should probably talk to an attorney who deals with immigration law and family law respectively. This is a legal matter. Forget the family, that is already phucked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 17, 2007 Nairi, so I guess you know how I'm feeling. I got over this, before I saw her for the first time last year, and I had this lust for her. I loved her, but I would tell myself no, you are not in love with your cousin, that is disgusting, don't think like that. But I missed her so much that I bought tickets to go see her "one more time before she gets married and things won't be the same anymore." That was my excuse, that we wouldn't all play and talk together like before, but really I fell in love with her and I just wanted to see her. And when I saw her again, I don't know how the conversation came up to it, but we some how sensed it in ourselves and we were in love. At that time I was scared and thinking, "Sako, es inch kaki mech es kez kcum" but now I'm going crazy for her and I love her, and I will always treat her like a queen. Anonymouse, you are right about the family and what I have to do. I made an appointment to see an immigration attorney next Friday. I'm not going to keep it a secret from my family forever, after I graduate and get a job out of the state, we will move together to that state which is when I will call tell my mother and her mother. However, I don't think I'm going to tell them how we did everything. Most Armenian guys in Armenia are very "khandot" (jealous) and very controlling of their wives. I don't want her marrying that type of guy, I know I will forever take good care of her and always try to keep a smile on her face, I love her and it doesn't matter to me anymore if she is my cousin. You guys might now think I'm a liberal nut or something, but I was one of the most right winged conservatives when it came social issues, marriage, love, etc. A year and a half ago if someone said something like this I would tell them to shut up and get over it, and it's sick and nasty, but now that I'm in this position I now understand. My eyes are in tears as I type this, and I should stop listening to Armenchik, he makes me cry more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 17, 2007 Report Share Posted August 17, 2007 (edited) Anonymouse, you are right about the family and what I have to do. I made an appointment to see an immigration attorney next Friday. I'm not going to keep it a secret from my family forever, after I graduate and get a job out of the state, we will move together to that state which is when I will call tell my mother and her mother. However, I don't think I'm going to tell them how we did everything. Most Armenian guys in Armenia are very "khandot" (jealous) and very controlling of their wives. I don't want her marrying that type of guy, I know I will forever take good care of her and always try to keep a smile on her face, I love her and it doesn't matter to me anymore if she is my cousin. You guys might now think I'm a liberal nut or something, but I was one of the most right winged conservatives when it came social issues, marriage, love, etc. A year and a half ago if someone said something like this I would tell them to shut up and get over it, and it's sick and nasty, but now that I'm in this position I now understand. My eyes are in tears as I type this, and I should stop listening to Armenchik, he makes me cry more. When you see an attorney, tell him all the facts and make sure to tell him what you worry as the possible legal implications. Most attorneys provide a free consultation. If he takes the job there might be a retainer fee. If not, they may work on a contingency basis. Know this, this might not be cheap, but if you really love your cousin, err, this girl, then you should be willing to go through with the costs. And by the way, don't be too "loving" trying to be the ideal romantic type like from the Arthurian romances. I understand you love the girl and all, but seriously dude. And what's this about being khandot is bad? Mi kich el petke khandot linel. Everything has its place. Sometimes you need to be rough and tough, sometimes you should be possessive and protective, and other times a "liberal nut". And seriously dude, you should get a grip. Be a man. Even if you love your cousin, stop sobbing and get a grip over yourself. And by the way, any sensible Armenian should stop listening to Armenchik, Armen Aloyan, Tatoul, and any of them useless pieces of Turko-Asiatic influenced mongrels. Maybe if you stop listening to Armenchik and trash that CD, God will grant you a good attorney who can save your love. But first you must save yourself from that crying. Be a little mannish. Me thinks that, even if it's your cousin, girls are girls and they love a man more than half-a-man. Cheers mate. Edited August 17, 2007 by Anonymouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2007 Anonymouse, thanks a lot for your help and support. You're right about those singers. And you're right about still being "mikich khandot" and there are times when you have to be posessive and protective, and I know when I will use those limits. I'm talking about the ones that don't allow them to go to their aunt's house, their uncle's house, their mom's house, etc. I don't like that. This is what I think I will do, I think I will break down decisions in the house half and half, but if it's a touchy decision or a big decision, I'll take her suggestion, but I'll make the final decision. For instance, if she wants to take the kids to dance lessons, a boy, I will say no, because boys and dance lessons in the U.S. is not a good idea. That's just an example. Anonymouse, thank you, you've been very supportive, please know that you will have contributed to my happiness in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harut Posted August 18, 2007 Report Share Posted August 18, 2007 this is a madness... i can't believe this... guess what i learned today... apperently, my first cousin's cousin (from the other parent's side) (whom she had not seen since baby years and whom has just returned from russia) is madly in love with her... and now she's absolutely fed up it (after months long explaining to him that "there is no way") and has let the entire family know about it (expect her father of course (we don't want any dead bodies around))... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 18, 2007 Harut, it is such a thing that is very hard. I did a lot of research about this, and really, there is almost no increase risk in birth defects and nowhere in the bible does it say you can not marry a cousin. Also did research on falling in love with relatives, lots of scientists were saying that it could be that relatives are naturally attracted to each other, and when separated at birth, when remeeting eachother they fall in love. Did you know that siblings separated for adoption from young ages go through counseling about not falling in love with their opposite sex sibling when remeeting them? Yeah man, I'm seriously in love with my cousin and I want her to be with me in the U.S., I do not see anything wrong with being in love with me, a male being in love with another female. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Posted August 18, 2007 Report Share Posted August 18, 2007 Harut, it is such a thing that is very hard. I did a lot of research about this, and really, there is almost no increase risk in birth defects and nowhere in the bible does it say you can not marry a cousin. Also did research on falling in love with relatives, lots of scientists were saying that it could be that relatives are naturally attracted to each other, and when separated at birth, when remeeting eachother they fall in love. Did you know that siblings separated for adoption from young ages go through counseling about not falling in love with their opposite sex sibling when remeeting them? Yeah man, I'm seriously in love with my cousin and I want her to be with me in the U.S., I do not see anything wrong with being in love with me, a male being in love with another female. de vartapet ari u mi gjvi!!! che che.......I'm officialy on vacation to Hawaii and my pure breed dog German shepherd is probbly geting screewd by her own brother at kannals where I bought her from Once in weeding there was this girl, at Armenian weeding, a persian! and she was having a blast singing with us and dancing, nice looking 40-ish women, someone asked me why she wouldent get married and start a family, she replied............I'M A DOOOOOOG, my father made me marry my first cousin when i was 15, she was in teers...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Takoush Posted August 19, 2007 Report Share Posted August 19, 2007 (edited) Actually I know this family who's parents were cousins. The third child turned out to be not so good but the first one was the best of the three kids. I don't think the Armenian Church even in the diaspora encourages or marries first cousins as you have been told above and as you know it already. I know that you are in love; but you are very young and in my opinion, you shouldn't marry at such a young and an immature age. Most guys in my opinion, is better when they marry at about the ages of 26 or 27. First, you have to be mature and know what you are getting into and be more established as a man before considering marriage. Marriage is not all fun (it is a great responsibility for yourself, for your wife and especially for your future children). Anyhow, nowadays young adults are marrying in their late twenties and well into their early thirties. They're getting full college education, getting a good job then considering marriage. That's the better way; believe me gdavidyan for your sake listen to reason. I have nothing to gain by giving you my logical consent; but you have everything to gain in your life by listening to reason as some already advised you above. Good luck!!! Edited August 19, 2007 by Anahid Takouhi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 Anahid, I appreciate you trying to help, but nothing and no one is going to change my mind or my feelings toward her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 (edited) Please everyone. Before we cast the proverbial “first stone”, let us consider who Adam married, but the product of his own “riib bone”. Who did Armen, from the village of Armenaavan marry , when the village of Armenouhi was ten days away? In the Armenian tradition, one cannot marry except one separated by seven, repeat SEVEN navels, եոթ պորտ apart. Note the number “seven” again. And tell us who Armenian boys and girls married before the invention of the superhighway that cut down a ten day travel to ten minutes. I may have said this before. In the Beդwin Arab vernacular "bint 'ammi" , leterally "my fraternal borthers' daughter" is a euphemism for "my wife". In which ulture, not only it is a privilege to marry one's own cousin(e), but a duty. And, now please tell us how many handicapped offspring THEY have produced. Do you think all our ancestors were as privileged as Zangi Zrangi, owning horses and esheks to go over ten villages, travel 40 days to bring a bride? Once again, let us review thiose mythical figures of "SEVEN" and "FORTY/ՔԱՐՍՈՒՆ" Սարերի հովին մեռնեմ, հովին մեռնեմ, ԵՕԹ տարի է չեմ տեսել, Տէսնողի ջուխթ աչին մեռնեմ... In the old Kilikian tradition when one was engaged to marry and the neighbors asked who the bride/groom was, the answer would be "Chcgitem qouirk, Otar /gharib e". Meaning- The bride/ groom was neither Marashtsi, Aintaptsi, Zeituntsi or Hajintsi..... And now! After Marashtsis married fellow Marashtsi, Zeituntsis married married fellow Zeituntsis, Mshetsis narried fellow Mshetsis.... we open thos dusty old mythical biblical canon/schmanons??? Yeah! Yeah! Marrying or not one's cousin is based on an even scietific basis as that STUPID BOOK Edited August 20, 2007 by Arpa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted August 20, 2007 Report Share Posted August 20, 2007 I knew we were inbred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Arpa, thank you very much for your help, I found this on another forum, and if I was to listen to Anahid these words would be out of my mouth. "My cousin and I are together. We have a great relationship. We have a mixed bag in terms of family that accepts us and those that don't. It's not always easy to stand by this choice that I've made. Some family and friends have left us, have horrible disgusting things to say, but you know some ask questions and have seen the fact that us being together isn't a big deal. Some have actually been better friends and better family and we love them even more because they have stood by us loyally. Quite frankly, the ones that don't have been pretty well ignored in terms of my daily life. My life is my man and my kids, and the people that truly love us and want to understand. I have fears, I have concerns but they don't add up to matching the amount of love and faith I have in us. So here is the point.... I notice on here so many people saying they are scared about their family or scared of coming out of the closet, so to speak, and also under the stress of those that don't approve of them. Here is an example.... When I first talked to people about the fact that I was planning on getting together with my cousin there was a general attitude in some that they had to correct my thinking. I'm not a little teenager who is in love and out of love every week, I'm not inexperienced in life, I know what love is, I know when it's real...I know what I had with this man was the most incredible thing that I would ever touch in my life. Some said that I was crazy and that I was wrong, that I shouldn't get together with him. I thought to myself about their words and realized....at the end of the day they are going to go back to their loving relationships, their life, their house, their car, their family, their vacations and their daily routine, they are going to live their life in their way. If I listened to them...where would I be? Would I be happy while trying to take care of my kids, when I was in my car, my house, my vacations? No, I would be dreadfully miserable. My life would be a living lie that would never be anything other then desperately empty. Would they really care that I wasn't happy, would they even have a clue how deeply I'd be effected by following their advice? No, they would likely just smile and say "Oh isn't it so wonderful that we talked some sense into her and she didn't make that horrible mistake!!!" while they sit on their back porch with a glass of wine...while I'd have been at home crying and suffering. Would those people be in my home to hold me at night, to be close to me when I needed a friend, to celebrate the small daily things in life that happen, to help raise my children? No, cause they weren't doing that now. Jimi Hendrix had this quote that basically says When it comes time to die, I'm the one that is doing the dying, so I'm going to live my life my way. It just can't be said better then that. I hope all of you that are letting others rule your life seriously consider and see the truth in what I have said and find your courage." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Yes, you are right, I shouldn't have said it was my cousin right off the back. I will consult a lawyer, because this seems like a hard topic. Someone said it is fraud, I don't see anything fraudulent, I am not lying in any papers. Sip, thank you, we talked about that, and if our analysis say that we have a high chance of having an abnormal child, we will adopt a child from Armenia. It's perfectly "legal" in the U.S. But the Armenian church won't marry you unless there are at least 7 generations of separation between the couple (e.g. great-great-great-great-great grandparents are in common) -- this of course you can get-by by lying/not mentioning which I at least know one couple that has. But this isn't recommended as the children will either be very good looking, or very not-so good looking... (there's a reason the church has this ancient rule...) Anyways... Move on. You'll "fall in love" again. And it will be as easy as how you "fell in love" this time around (if it only took a first glance at her...). Finally, keep in mind that birds of a feather flock together; so it's likely she's got some girlfriends that match her profile Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Nairi, so I guess you know how I'm feeling. I got over this, before I saw her for the first time last year, and I had this lust for her. I loved her, but I would tell myself no, you are not in love with your cousin, that is disgusting, don't think like that. But I missed her so much that I bought tickets to go see her "one more time before she gets married and things won't be the same anymore." That was my excuse, that we wouldn't all play and talk together like before, but really I fell in love with her and I just wanted to see her. And when I saw her again, I don't know how the conversation came up to it, but we some how sensed it in ourselves and we were in love. At that time I was scared and thinking, "Sako, es inch kaki mech es kez kcum" but now I'm going crazy for her and I love her, and I will always treat her like a queen. Anonymouse, you are right about the family and what I have to do. I made an appointment to see an immigration attorney next Friday. I'm not going to keep it a secret from my family forever, after I graduate and get a job out of the state, we will move together to that state which is when I will call tell my mother and her mother. However, I don't think I'm going to tell them how we did everything. Most Armenian guys in Armenia are very "khandot" (jealous) and very controlling of their wives. I don't want her marrying that type of guy, I know I will forever take good care of her and always try to keep a smile on her face, I love her and it doesn't matter to me anymore if she is my cousin. You guys might now think I'm a liberal nut or something, but I was one of the most right winged conservatives when it came social issues, marriage, love, etc. A year and a half ago if someone said something like this I would tell them to shut up and get over it, and it's sick and nasty, but now that I'm in this position I now understand. My eyes are in tears as I type this, and I should stop listening to Armenchik, he makes me cry more. Word of advice from someone who is a few years older: don't get married until you already have a job or business and have steady income and you're enjoying what you're doing, and you have your own place and are covering your expenses. Only then think about bringing someone from abroad... And only then make any promises to anyone else. And by that time, you'll be more mature... Or else, you've just trapped yourself into a bad predicament; and not only you, but her, your family, and everyone who you've kept out of the loop in your decision-making. And they might not be around the next time you need help or advice; and trust me, you will need your family and friends again.. No man can do it alone... As you're weighing in your decision, remember, too, that you'll "fall in love" tens of times more, too... So is it worth severing ties with family and friends all for a girl, which is practically replaceable, but you don't realize it now? ...But then again you might not... Either way, I'd give it some time: at least 3-4 years, w/o making any promises. Graduate, start working, move out, etc. First things first. Edited August 21, 2007 by Shahan Araradian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Yea gdavidyan, listen to Shahan Araradian about not getting married before getting a job or business. But let me interpret whhere Shahan Araradian left off. By getting a job or business it means by you getting a job or a business. However, it does not mean working at a company or for someone else or just merely providing labor power. He means you must engage in subsistence farming or have your own little wooden shed where you make your clothes and build your chairs, tables and bed to sleep on, and have a well to fetch water and stuff, because otherwise you will be nothing more than an automaton mired in the fields of misanthropy providing nothing more than labor power for your greedy corporate puppet masters. And by the way, per Shahan Araradian, you should not come to the United States gdavidyan, as that is not what a Shahan Araradian would do, and nor should you. You will be a slave like Neo in The Matrix before Morpheus showed him how deep the rabit hole can go. So be wise my friend. I suggest you take your new cousin-wife and run away into the woods or a farm and start a nice "A Little House on the Prairie" lifestyle, per the recommendations of Shahan Araradian. Edited August 21, 2007 by Anonymouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Yea gdavidyan, listen to Shahan Araradian about not getting married before getting a job or business. But let me interpret what Shahan Araradian meant by you getting a job or a business. He doesn't mean working at a company or for someone else or just merely providing labor power. He means you must engage in subsistence farming because otherwise you will be nothing more than an automaton mired in the fields of misanthropy providing nothing more than labor power for your greedy corporate puppet masters. You will be a slave like Neo in The Matrix before Morpheus showed him how deep the rabit hole can go. So be wise my friend. I suggest you take your new cousin-wife and run away into the woods or a farm and start a nice "A Little House on the Prairie" lifestyle, per the recommendations of Shahan Araradian. I here Artsakh is providing free housing to anyone who moves and bears children. + some stipend per child Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 I here Artsakh is providing free housing to anyone who moves and bears children. + some stipend per child Are you planning to marry your cousin? I don't think so. Be quiet Shahan Araradian. This thread is only for serious people considering marrying their cousin. Those who are not concerned with the trivial pursuits of marriage but are much more concerned and consumed with the Satanic place that is United State of America have their own proper thread and forum called International Politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Are you planning to marry your cousin? I don't think so. Be quiet Shahan Araradian. This thread is only for serious people considering marrying their cousin. Those who are not concerned with the trivial pursuits of marriage but are much more concerned and consumed with the Satanic place that is United State of America have their own proper thread and forum called International Politics. LOL. So have you made up your mind yet on whether you will marry your cousin Moog? Edited August 21, 2007 by Shahan Araradian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 LOL. So have you made up your mind yet on whether you will marry your cousin Moog? I'll be marrying a cousin. Just not sure whether it will be mine or yours. I'm kind of eyeballing your cousin. I will build her a fort with a nice garden that will have all sorts of fruits and vegetables so we can "live off the land" and not be slaves to the corporate power structure that Shahan Araradian so rails against. By the way, if I need advice on marrying your cousin, I will come and post in this thread, or alternatively I can make a new one if by then this one is buried to deep and is too old. My best men will be Shahan Araradian, Arpa Papa, Ara Baliozian and the Bridesmaid will be Nairi (if she decides to come since she doesn't like weddings, but I'll make a formal free dresscode.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) I'll be marrying a cousin. Just not sure whether it will be mine or yours. I'm kind of eyeballing your cousin. I will build her a fort with a nice garden that will have all sorts of fruits and vegetables so we can "live off the land" and not be slaves to the corporate power structure that Shahan Araradian so rails against. By the way, if I need advice on marrying your cousin, I will come and post in this thread, or alternatively I can make a new one if by then this one is buried to deep and is too old. My best men will be Shahan Araradian, Arpa Papa, Ara Baliozian and the Bridesmaid will be Nairi (if she decides to come since she doesn't like weddings, but I'll make a formal free dresscode.) Not a bad choice. I do have attractive cousins... Indeed, all of them. As a wedding gift, I will provide you with the first generation of universally intelligent robots to do your harvesting. All they can do now is pick fruit and tell the difference between an apple and an orange. More coming soon... Another 15 years, fixed-cost perpetual energy. Another 30 years will bring molecular manufacturing... FYI... The robot wars have begun... We'll have to protect the fort with a few. Armageddon is highly probable shortly thereafter though. (So make sure to have had a lot of good sex before then.) Edited August 21, 2007 by Shahan Araradian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Not a bad choice. I do have attractive cousins... Indeed, all of them. As a wedding gift, I will provide you with the first generation of universally intelligent robots to do your harvesting. All they can do now is pick fruit and tell the difference between an apple and an orange. More coming soon... Another 15 years, fixed-cost perpetual energy. Another 30 years will bring molecular manufacturing... FYI... The robot wars have begun... We'll have to protect the fort with a few. Armageddon is highly probable shortly thereafter though. (So make sure to have had a lot of good sex before then.) Stop with your trickery and deviations you usurper! Stop engaging in Araradianism and help the world with its fair share of incestual problems. How can you be so selfish? Maybe we can take this all the way to the Supreme Court. Alternatively, we can take it on Maury or Jerry or one of them. But I would reckon an Armenian on one of these shows might be over the top and I would actually fear for gdavidyan and the love of his life with some angry rabies crowds stinking of cigarettes and body odor looking and chasing for them in their salvaged mercedes'. Edited August 21, 2007 by Anonymouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shahan Araradian Posted August 21, 2007 Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Stop with your trickery and deviations you usurper! Stop engaging in Araradianism and help the world with its fair share of incestual problems. How can you be so selfish? Maybe we can take this all the way to the Supreme Court. Alternatively, we can take it on Maury or Jerry or one of them. But I would reckon an Armenian on one of these shows might be over the top and I would actually fear for gdavidyan and the love of his life with some angry rabies crowds stinking of cigarettes and body odor looking and chasing for them in their salvaged mercedes'. Moog, the masses will awaken soon and in the final epoch will be armed with universal artificial intelligence, free energy, and molecular manufacturing. All this talk of incest is non-sensical. What matters between now and the end of the final human epoch is maximization of sex (and the usurping of capitalist/bourgeois property by force). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdavidyan Posted August 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted August 21, 2007 Just for your information, I don't have that same loving caring family you may have that I can turn to for help. I receive no help from parents. And no, I do not live at home and I do not rely on my parents at all. I have all my expenses covered, my own place that I only live in, not that room mate bullshit, my car, my motorcycle, my school and all my expenses, and I have two jobs. I appreciate the advice people give me when they try to help, or when they tell me to rethink it, I rethinked it many times and I believe the right decision is the decision I am choosing to do. I don't care about what the church says, what the church does, and bible does not mention you may not marry a cousin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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