What Happened In Khojaly?

[Accelerated]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khojaly_Massacre

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagorno-Karabakh_War

 

This is a great black blot on our otherwise heroic victory. If Armenians are/were responsible, something should be done to about it.

[MosJan]

if you search the forum you will find many topics on khojalu

 

most of the info you will find on the web by azeris is fabrications and staged photos of the khojalu

[Accelerated]

yea I had a look at a few topics. In my eyes our version of events: "Azeri soldiers shot their own civilians for later political exploitation" sounds like an unlikely scenario. In any case if this event is a fabrication we should be fighting it in Wiki, we need to find out what information the Human Rights Watch reports are based on. As far as I see, this is Azeris only really credible support.

[Aratta-Kingdom]

KHOJALU TRAGEDY OR MUTALIBOV'S LATE CONFESSION

 

 

February 26 marks the tenth anniversary of a tragedy that occurred in

Khojalu village in the Askeran region of Nagorno Karabagh. It doubtless

was a tragedy as it took the lives of 600 people. The 1992 February was

the highlight of the war in Karabagh, when Azeri armed units occupied

almost half of Karabagh's territory and its capital Stepanakert was

being bombarded day and night from nearby located Khojalu and Aghdam.

Karabagh was actually strangled.

 

 

Back in 1992 Heydar Aliyev, who was then chairman of Nakhichevan

parliament, blamed the Khojalu tragedy on the then president of

Azerbaijan Ayaz Mutalibov. Aliyev was quoted by Azeri news agency Bilik

 

 

Dunyasi as saying that "the bloodshed would be in our favor and we

must not interfere."

 

 

Regretfully the Khojalu tragedy has been exploited in Azerbaijan for

inner-political goals, when the tragedy of innocent people is being

exploited for the sake of political intrigues. Who killed the residents

of Khojalu?. Let us put aside all suppositions, let us apply to

chronicles. An Azeri cameramen Chingiz Mustafaev, who was shooting a

documentary in Aghdam and nearby territories, controlled then by

Azerbaijani People's Front, has questioned the official Azerbaijani

theory that it was committed by Armenians and began a journalistic

investigation. His first contribution to the Moscow-based D-Press news

agency about possible involvement of Azeri troops in it cost him

dearly. Shortly after it he was killed in Aghdam region under obscure

circumstances. Another evidence came from former chairman of Azeri

parliament Karayev who said that the tragedy was plotted and

implemented by a top Azeri official.

 

 

In a recent interview with the Moscow-based Nezavisimaya Gazeta

Azerbaijan's ex-president Ayaz Mutalibov insists that if the

People's Front had not hindered signing of an agreement that was to

place the Azeri army under the command of the CIS chief military

headquarters, the Khojalu tragedy would not have happened. The

interview was entitled "Late Confession." Mutalibov in other cases

insisted that Armenians provided Azeris with a humanitarian corridor to

leave Khojalu, but the armed forces of the People's Front fired at

innocent residents near the border of Aghdam. About 600 women, children

and old men fell victim to the slaughter, committed by the People's

Front of Azerbaijan. They also murdered brutally 34 Armenians in

Khojalu.

[Accelerated]

An Azeri cameramen Chingiz Mustafaev, who was shooting a

documentary in Aghdam and nearby territories, controlled then by

Azerbaijani People's Front, has questioned the official Azerbaijani

theory that it was committed by Armenians and began a journalistic

investigation. His first contribution to the Moscow-based D-Press news

agency about possible involvement of Azeri troops in it cost him

dearly.

 

I cant find this report. Was it a TV report, newspaper report? A google search of "D-Press Newsagency Moscow" only comes up with links that are related to Khojalu.

 

Another evidence came from former chairman of Azeri

parliament Karayev who said that the tragedy was plotted and

implemented by a top Azeri official.

 

Where did he say this? To whom?

 

Anyone have a link to the article quoting Mutalibov?

[Aratta-Kingdom]

This is what you need to read if you know russian. The link to the russian paper cannot be found online. You must get the hard copy from Nezavisimaya Gazeta.

 

По свидетельству азербайджанского журналиста М.Сафароглы: "Ходжалу занимал важное стратегическое положение. Потеря Ходжалу означала политическое фиаско для Муталибова ". (Газета "Независимая газета", февраль 1993г.).

 

Ходжалу наряду с Шуши и Агдамом являлся одним из главных опорных плацдармов, из которого в течениие трех зимних месяцев обстреливался Степанакерт - столица Нагорно - Карабахской Республики (НКР) - обстреливался беспрерывно и беспощадно, с использованием артиллерии, ракет и боевых реактивных установок.

 

Подавление огневых точек Ходжалу и разблокировка аэропорта были для жителей НКР единственным способом физического выживания населения, обреченного Азербайджаном на полное истребление. Каждодневные бомбежки Степанакерта со стороны Ходжалу, расположенного в непосредственной близости от него, уносили жизни сотен мирных жителей - детей, стариков и женщин. Военная операция вооруженных подразделений НКР по подавлению огневых точек Ходжалу не была неожиданностью для Азербайджана. О том, что силы самообороны НКР с целью подавления огневых точек и разблокирования аэропорта готовят наступление на Ходжалу, азербайджанская сторона впервые была уведомлена по телевидению почти за два месяца до штурма. Об этом писал в "Известиях" широко известный в Азербайджане правозащитник Ариф Юнусов. Не скрывали своей осведомленности и официальные лица Азербайджана, в том числе и президент республики Аяз Муталибов. Он подчеркивал, что "… нападение на Ходжалу не было внезапным ".(Журнал "Огонек" , N 14-15,1992) В результате этих предупреждений большая часть мирного населения Ходжалу перебралась в безопасное место.

 

Штурмующие подразделения НКР сделали все возможное, чтобы исключить гибель мирных жителей деревни. С этой целью ими был оставлен коридор для безопасного выхода мирного населения из зоны боевых действий. Азербайджанская сторона о наличии коридира, дающего возможность вывести жителей Ходжалу из-под обстрела, была своевременно осведомлена.

 

Эльман Мамедов, мэр Ходжалу: - "Мы знали, что этот коридор предназначен для выхода мирного населения." (Русская мысль" 03,03,1992, цитируется из газеты "Бакинский рабочий")

 

По окончании операции в Ходжалу отряды спасательной службы "Арцах" обнаружили в деревне и ее окрестностях 11 трупов азербайджанцев. Это, естественно, без учета членов вооруженных банд формирований, находящихся в военной форме, которых тоже было немного. Небольшое количество погибших мирных жителей Ходжалу при значительной интенсивности боевых действий, предпринятых для овладения населенным пунктом, свидетельствовало о предпринятых армянской стороной мерах по обеспечению возможно большей безопасности населения деревни. Однако при этом не приходится сомневаться, что количество погибших мирных жителей Ходжалу действительно было значительным.

 

Где же были убиты жители Ходжалу и сколько их погибло?

 

Место гибели сотен жителей деревни упорно замалчивается азербайджанской стороной. Истина заключается в том, что все они были хладнокровно убиты на расстоянии 11 км от Ходжалу, в двух-трех километрах от Агдама, бывшего в тот период региональной опорной базой азербайджанских вооруженных сил. Один этот факт способен прояснить многое в запутанной истории с массовым уничтожением ходжалинцев. Трудно представить, что армяне выпустили жителей Ходжалу из осажденной деревни только лишь затем, чтобы с риском для жизни убивать их на подступах к Агдаму, на территории, в то время контролируемой азербайджанцами.

 

А. Муталибов в интервью "Независимой газете" заявил,что "коридор, по которому люди могли бы уйти, армянами все-таки был оставлен. Зачем же им тогда стрелять?" ( "Независимая газета" 02.04.1992) Он связал этот преступный акт расстрела мирных жителей с попытками оппозиции устранить его от власти, возложив всю ответственность за происшедшее на него.

 

В своем интервью журналу "Новое время ". Муталибов подтвердил свое заявление девятилетней давности. "Было очевидно, что расстрел ходжалинцев был кем-то организован для смещения власти в Азербайджане" (Газета "Новое время" , 6 марта 2001г) .

 

Известны аналогичные высказывания и оценки ходжалинских событий, сделанные некоторыми другими высокопоставленными азербайджанскими чиновниками и журналистами.

 

Р. Гаджиев - член правления агдамского отделения НФА( Народный фронт Азербайджана ): - Мы могли бы помочь ходжалинцам, были и силы, и возможности. Но руководители республики хотели показать народу, что у них силы нет, и снова призвать на помощь армию СНГ, подавив с ее помощью и оппозицию". (Москва, "Известия", апрель, 1992)

 

Существует и несколько отличающийся от предыдущих высказываний вывод азербайджанского журналиста Арифа Юнусова: "Город и его жители были сознательно принесены в жертву политической цели: не допустить прихода к власти Народного фронта Азербайджана" (Газета "Зеркало", июль 1992г. .) И в этом случае виновниками трагедии называются сами азербайджанцы.

 

В то время как ходжалинские события - это результат предательства жителей Ходжалу их же высокопоставленными соотечественниками, азербайджанская пропаганда на весь мир раструбила о "зверствах армян", распространяя по телеканалам жуткие кадры - усеянное оскверненными трупами поле. Утверждалось, что Ходжалу - это "месть армян за Сумгаит ".

 

Тамерлан Караев, в свое время - председатель Верховного Совета Азербайджанской Республики, свидетельствует: "Трагедию осуществили власти Азербайджана ", конкретно - "кто-то из высоко сидящих". (Газета "Мухталифат"...28 апреля 1992г.).

 

Чешская журналистка Яна Мазалова, по недосмотру азербайджанцев оказавшаяся в обеих группах представителей прессы, посетивших место событий в первый день и через несколько дней, заметила существенную разницу в состоянии представленных трупов. Побывав на поле сразу после событий, Мазалова не видела на трупах каких-либо следов изуверства. А вот пару дней спустя журналистам были продемонстрированы уже "подготовленные" к съемкам обезображенные тела "оскверненных армянами трупов".

 

Кто убил мирных жителей Ходжалу, а затем осквернил их трупы, если трагедия произошла не в освобожденном армянами селе и не на протяжении маршрута гуманитарного коридора, а на подступах к городу Агдам - на территории, полностью контролируемой Народным фронтом Азербайджана ? Независимый азербайджанский тележурналист и оператор Чингиз Мустафаев (Фуат-оглы), проводивший съемки 28 февраля и 2 марта 1992 года, усомнился в официальной азербайджанской версии и начал свое расследование. Первое же сообщение журналиста в московское агенство "ДР-пресс" о возможной причастности азербайджанской стороны к преступлениям стоило Мустафаеву жизни: он был убит недалеко от Агдама, при до сих пор не выясненных обстоятельствах. Рассказывая о полете в Ходжалу, отметил, что заснять на пленку трупы в Ходжалу ему не удалось, потому что "убитых там вообще не было в помине …" Во время первого полета журналисты засняли на пленку лишь пару десятков трупов азербайджанских солдат, обнаруженных недалеко от села Нахичеваник. Однако большинство трупов находились у Агдама, где их и снимали на видеоленту 29 февраля, а во второй раз -2 марта. Именно эти кадры и были показаны в Баку на заседании Милли Меджлиса, а затем и по многим телеканалам мира, как доказательство массового убийства азербайджанского населения Ходжалу. Первый вылет вертолета с азербайджанскими журналистами на борту состоялся 29 февраля 1992 года. Любопытно отметить, что журналисты, информированные о массовом избиении азербайджанцев в Ходжалу, вначале полетели именно туда. Не найдя ничего, что подтверждало бы эту информацию, они свернули обратно.

 

Во время второго полета в район массового убийства людей, уже 2-го марта 1992 года, журналисты заметили, что положение тел на земле и степень повреждений и ранений, по сравнению с первым осмотром, разительным образом изменились. О том, что положение тел и поврежденность трупов не совпадали с первоначальным осмотром, Ч. Мустафаев (Фуат-оглы) проинформировал президента А. Муталибова, который к тому времени уже явно догадывался о причинах трагедии. Муталибов ответил поистине пророческими словами: "Чингиз, никому не говори ни слова о том, что приметил неладное. Иначе тебя убьют". Чингиз Мустафаев был убит на том же самом поле, где он снимал главный азербайджанский "аргумент".

 

Нынешний президент Азербайджана Гейдар Алиев лично признал, что в ходжалинских событиях "виновато и прежнее руководство Азербайджана". Еще в апреле 1992 г. он, по сообщению агенства "Билик-Дуньясы", высказал следующую мысль: "Кровопролитие пойдет нам на пользу. Нам не следует вмешиваться в ход событий". Кому именно "пошло на пользу кровопролитие"- ясно всем. "Мегаполис-экспресс" писал : "Нельзя не признать, что если НФА действительно ставил далеко идущие цели, то они достигнуты. Муталибов скомпрометирован и свергнут, мировое общественное мнение потрясено, азербайджанцы и братские им турки поверили в так называемый "геноцид азербайджанского народа в Ходжалу".( "Мегаполис-экспрессс", N17, 1992г.)

[Accelerated]

interesting.....obviously a large number of civilians was killed and the Azeris tried to use the event to paint the Armenian fighters in the worst light possible. I still find it hard to believe though, that they knowingly fired on their own civilians for political purposes. Too many people involved IMO....

[irlandahay]

interesting.....obviously a large number of civilians was killed and the Azeris tried to use the event to paint the Armenian fighters in the worst light possible. I still find it hard to believe though, that they knowingly fired on their own civilians for political purposes. Too many people involved IMO....

 

hmmmmmmm

 

well in fact the body count was somewhere in between 200 and 400

 

the azeris claim it to be 2000 and the so called azeri genocide.

now that it just propsttrous but...you cant blaim them for being stupid.

 

second. i also find it hard to believe that azeris shot anyone, but it was a litlle crazy, they gavce a corridor and those who were fleeing the city, the azeris couldnt accept defeat and considered those fleeing deserters and shot. amongst the civilians were azeri nation liberation front soldiers.

 

but that doesnt make armenians totally inncoent. we have to accept it, we have to be better then the turks, armenians have done wrong...

 

but the rage used to perpetrate such horrible actions was bottled up inside armenians since sumgait, baku, and many many more massacres by azeris to armenians...

 

it is a sad event in armenians history but we must live up to it

[MosJan]

search for mutalibovs statement on khojalu

 

"article written by the Azerbaijani press.

 

February 26 marks the tenth anniversary of a tragedy that occurred in Khojalu village in the Askeran region of Nagorno Karabagh. It doubtless was a tragedy as it took the lives of 600 people. The 1992 February was the highlight of the war in Karabagh, when Azeri armed units occupied almost half of Karabagh’s territory and its capital Stepanakert was being bombarded day and night from nearby located Khojalu and Aghdam. Karabagh was actually strangled.

 

Back in 1992 Heydar Aliyev, who was then chairman of Nakhichevan parliament, blamed the Khojalu tragedy on the then president of Azerbaijan Ayaz Mutalibov. Aliyev was quoted by Azeri news agency Bilik Dunyasi as saying that “the bloodshed would be in our favor and we must not interfere.”

 

Regretfully the Khojalu tragedy has been exploited in Azerbaijan for inner-political goals, when the tragedy of innocent people is being exploited for the sake of political intrigues. Who killed the residents of Khojalu?. Let us put aside all suppositions, let us apply to chronicles. An Azeri cameramen Chingiz Mustafaev, who was shooting a documentary in Aghdam and nearby territories, controlled then by Azerbaijani People’s Front, has questioned the official Azerbaijani theory that it was committed by Armenians and began a journalistic investigation. His first contribution to the Moscow-based D-Press news agency about possible involvement of Azeri troops in it cost him dearly. Shortly after it he was killed in Aghdam region under obscure circumstances. Another evidence came from former chairman of Azeri parliament Karayev who said that the tragedy was plotted and implemented by a top Azeri official.

 

In a recent interview with the Moscow-based Nezavisimaya Gazeta Azerbaijan’s ex-president Ayaz Mutalibov insists that if the People’s Front had not hindered signing of an agreement that was to place the Azeri army under the command of the CIS chief military headquarters, the Khojalu tragedy would not have happened.

 

The interview was entitled “Late Confession.” Mutalibov in other cases insisted that Armenians provided Azeris with a humanitarian corridor to leave Khojalu, but the armed forces of the People’s Front fired at innocent residents near the border of Aghdam. About 600 women, children and old men fell victim to the slaughter, committed by the People’s Front of Azerbaijan. They also murdered brutally 34 Armenians in Khojalu. © Copyright AZG

"

 

 

then remember azeri soldiers war using civilians as a human shilled

3 or 4 video documentaries do exists of the fights and haw azeris war killing of their own people + haw one of their generals or commander was disciplining / slapping their "fighters" who was retrieving back from khojalu or the front lines

 

and again - most of the images from Azeris side are staged

a topic in staging was just posted on this forum not to long ago - sorry don;t have the time to search and post the link. on the web you will find a video or the photo of 3 or 4 individuals one of them has a blue clothing on it - 1 day before pictures was taken by an international observer this individuals was dead an no mutilations on then - then the next day - the same people have totally different look the body's are mutilated

 

search the forum - this has been discussed many times

 

wan you visit what ustobe khojalu pay attention to houses and barns or any structure - your going to find obvious signs that azeris was bombarding the village heavily and even more then ARmenians -

the side of the structures that was facing the azeris side has severe damage on it - most of the structures that has collapsed artillery shells are by azeris bombardment

[Hellektor]

This is a great black blot on our otherwise heroic victory. If Armenians are/were responsible, something should be done to about it.

 

 

What is killing 100+ or so worthless "Azeri" nomads in the warzone to all they did to us since they set hoof in the region? Why don't you even speak of the unpunished acts of genocide in Sumgait, Baku, Gandzat, Shamkhor, Shushi, Maragha, Shahoomian, Getashen, etc. in the period of 1988-1992 before they unleashed an all-out war on us, all in response to peaceful and civilized demonstrations? But the thing is it was not the Armenians who did it, it was the Turks and they admit it.

 

About 100 or so "Azeris" were killed by National Front of Azerbaijani thugs to topple Mutalibov. Then, about 35 innocent Armenian prisoners of war were buthchered and added to the pile of "Azeri" garbage to fake a "genocide".

 

Then they found out that the Armenians would be recognized, therefore, the genocidal savages did what they're best at: corpse porn. They carved the bodies and the changes were noticed by people who had seen the bodies earlier.

 

Armenians didn't have access to where the killings took place then, and the "Azeris" were informed of the attack on Khojaly from where they were bombing the Armenians.

 

Below I paste the article I have already posted many a time in different forums, where many "Azeri" sources confirm it was the "Azeris" who did it.

 

Facts come from this page.

 

 

The Greatest

Intergalactic

Tragedy in the

History of the

Universe

the

Khojaly Incident

 

All independent sources including "Azeri" reporters, survivors, even their president Mutalibov, have confirmed this.

 

"According to M. Safaroghli, an Azerbaijani journalist, "Khojalu was located in an important strategic position. Losing control over Khojalu would mean a political fiasco for Moutalibov".

 

The population of NKR which was in the danger of the total physical extinction by Azerbaijan could survive only by neutralizing the weapon emplacements of Khojalu and de-blocking the airport. Hundreds of peaceful people were killed in Stepanakert as the result of the daily bombing from the adjacent Khojalu.

 

The military operation of the armed forced of NKR on the neutralization of the weapon emplacements of Khojalu was not a surprise for Azerbaijan. For the first time the Azeri side was notified about the forthcoming attack by TV nearly two months prior to the operation.

 

Arif Yunusov, a well-known champion of human rights in Azerbiajan wrote about that in "Izvestia". The officials in Baku did not try to hide their awareness, including Ayaz Moutalibov, the president of Azerbaijan. He emphasized that "… the offense on Khojalu was not a surprise".("Ogoniok" Magazine, N 14-15, 1992)

 

As the result of these warnings the majority of the peaceful people of Khojalu moved to safe zones.

The detachments of NKR did everything possible in order to exclude the death of the peaceful population of the settlement and left a corridor for the safe evacuation of the peaceful population from the zone of military actions. The Azeri side was timely informed about the opened corridor which allowed to evacuate the people of Khojalu.

 

Elman Mamedov, the mayor of Khojalu: "We knew that the corridor was left for the exit of the peaceful people" ("Russkaya Misl" 03.03.1992, citation from "Bakinskie Rabochiy" newspaper).

 

The Azeri side is categorically silent about the place of the death of hundreds of residents of the village. The truth is that all of them were coolly assassinated at the distance of 11 km from Khojalu, about 2-3 km far from Aghdam which at that time used to be the regional military base of the Azeri armed forces.

This mere fact is enough for casting light on the intricate story about the massive extinction of the residents of Khojalu. It is hard to understand why should the Armenians let the population of Khojalu flee from the besieged village in order to kill them on the approaches of Aghdam putting their lives at risk (at that time Aghdam was under the control of the Azeris).

 

In his interview to "Nezavisimaya Gazeta" Moutalibov stated that "however, the Armenians had left a corridor for the escape of the people. Why a fire should have opened then? (cf.: "Nezavisimaya Gazeta", April 2, 1992)

 

He linked the fact of the criminal fusillade of the peaceful people with the attempts of the opposition to remove him from power, laying the responsibility for the tragedy entirely on him.

In his interview to "Novoye Vremia" ("New Time") Magazine Moutalibov confirmed his statement which was made nine days before: "It was evident that the some people had organized the shooting for shifting the power in Azerbaijan"

(cf.: "Novoye Vremia" , March 6, 2001) .

 

Similar statements and assessments of the Khojalu events were made by several other Azerbaijani top official and journalists.

 

R. Gajiyev, member of the Operating Committee of Aghdam Branch of NFA (National Front of Azerbaijan): We could have helped the people of Khojalu because we had the resources and means. However, the authorities of the republic wanted to demonstarte to the people of Azerbaijan that they are not able to do so and ask for the assistance of the CIS Army and with the help of the latter also neutralize the opposition"

(Moscow, "Izvestia", April, 1992).

 

The Azeri journalist Arif Yunosov's view is slightly different from the statements given above. According to Yunusov, "The town itself and its population are willingfully sacrificed for the political purposes, i.e., prevent the National Front of Azerbaijan from coming to power"

(cf.: "Zerkalo" ("Mirror") Newspaper, July, 1992.)

 

Again, it follows that the Azeris themselves are the perpetrators of the tragedy.

 

The Khojalu events are the result of the treachery of the high-level Azeri authorities towards the people of Khojalu whereas the Azeri propaganda blew up the story about the "brutalities of the Armenians", and the dreadful pictures of the site covered with defiled bodies were demonstrated by TV. It was propagated that Khojalu was the retaliation of the Armenians for Sumgayit.

 

Tamerlan Karayev, the former Chairman of the Supreme Council of Azerbaijan testifies: "The tragedy was perpetrated by the Azeri authorities", in particular, "some of the top officials" (cf.: "Moukhtalifat" Newspaper, April 28, 1992).

 

Yana Mazalova, a Czech journalist, who, because of the oversight of the Azeris, was included in both of the groups of journalists who visited the place of the events on the first day and several days later, noticed the stunning difference how the bodies looked at the first and second site visits. before and after between the previous and latest outer look of the bodies. When Mazalova visited the site immediately after the events she saw that the bodies did not bear any traces of brutality whereas a couple of days later the bodies "adulterated" by the Armenians and "ready" for the cameras were demonstrated to the journalists."

 

"Who killed the peaceful people of Khojalu and later defiled their bodies, if the tragedy took place not in the village liberated by the Armenians, and not along the direction of the humanitarian corridor, but on the close approaches of Aghdam town, a territory which was entirely under the control of the National Front of Azerbaijan?

 

Chingiz Moustafayev (Fuat-oghli), an independent Azeri TV journalist and cameraman who filmed the aftereffect on February 28 and March 2, 1992, doubted the official version of Azerbaijan and initiated his own investigation. His life was the price for his very first report to the Moscow News Agency "DR-Press" about the possible involvement of the Azeri side in the crime: he was killed not far from Aghdam, and the details of the murder still remain unrevealed.

Moustafayev reported about the flight to Khojalu. He noted that he could not film the dead bodies there, because "there was not a single killed person there …". In the course of the first flight the journalists shot only a couple of dozens of bodies of the Azeri soldiers which were found not far from the village of Nakhichevanik.

However, most of the bodies were near Aghdam where they were video-filmed on February 29 and later on March 2. These tapes were displayed at the session of Milli Medjlis and, later, numerous TV channels of the world as an evidence of the massive manslaughter of the Azeri population of Khojalu. The first flight of the helicopter with the Azeri journalists on board took place on February 29, 1992.

It is noteworthy that the journalists who were informed about the massive offense of the Azeris in Khojalu flew directly to the place of the events. However, they did not find any evidence of the happenings and flew back. During the second flight to the region of the massive slaughter, on March 2, 1992, the journalists noticed that the positions of the dead bodies lying on the ground and the level of the injuries and physical impairment was astonishingly different as compared to the first inspection.

Chingiz Moustafayev (Fuat-oghli) informed the Azeri president A. Moutalibov about the changed positions of the bodies and their physical impairment. Undoubtedly, by that time the Azeri president understood the reasons which caused the falsification of the tragedy. Moutalibov gave a really prophetic answer to the journalist, "Chingiz, don't tell anyone that you think something is wrong because they'll kill you". Chingiz Moutafayev was killed in the same field where he had shot the main Azeri "argument".

 

The president of Azerbaijan Heydar Aliyev personally admitted that the "former leadership of Azerbaijan was also at fault of the Khojalu events".

As early as in April of 1992 the following was articulated by him, "The bloodshed will do good to us. We shouldn't interfere in the course of events"

(cf.: Bilik-Duniasi News Agency).

 

It is out of question who gained from the "bloodshed". Megapolis-Express wrote: "It is impossible not to admit that if the National Front of Azerbaijan in fact had defined far-reaching goals, it succeeded in addressing them. Moutalibov is compromised and forced out of his post, the international community is in shock, the Azeris and their brotherly Turks believed in the so-called "genocide of the Azerbaijani people in Khojalu"

("Megapolis-Express", N17, 1992).

 

The Azeri mass media was silent in its comments on the Khojalu events about another tragic detail which was revealed later: 47 Armenians were held hostage in the "peaceful" Khojalu since February 26. After the liberation of Khojalu only 13 of these hostages were found in the settlement (including 6 women and 1 child), the remaining 34 were taken away by the Azeris in the unknown direction. All that is known about these hostages is that at the night of the operation they were driven away from the place of imprisonment, but not from the settlement. There is no information about their further status as hostages. It is obvious that the bodies of the Armenian hostages were tormented beyond the degree when they could be identified. This was done in order to create the illusion that the bodies of the victims "had been defiled" by the Armenians.

This is the reason why the bodies of the wretched victims were outraged to the extent that it was impossible to identify the victims.

As a matter of fact, around 700 inhabitants of Khojalu, including Turks - Meskhets who for whatever reasons failed to use the free corridor for retreat were passed to the Azerbaijani side without any conditions. After the thorough investigation the fact of the unconditional return of the residents of Khojalu to Azerbaijan was confirmed in the conclusion of the Human Rights Watch Center "Memorial" (Moscow), as well as in the documentary film of Svetlana Kulchitskaya, a journalist from St. Petersburg."

 

 

http://www.armeniangenocide.com/photos/data/500/medium/Destruction-jugha-azeri-beasts-det.jpg

 

Genocide in Broad Daylight

 

Nakhijevan, December 2005 not 1905 or 1915.

Destruction of the ancient Jugha cemetery by "Azeri" beasts

The murderer gets rid of the evidence of the existence of the victim.

Edited August 11, 2006 by MosJan

[Accelerated]

Well, if all these are true quotations, I think I am suitably convinced. We need to do something about the Wiki pages then, and it seems like they had Human Rights Watch convinced....

[Hellektor]

Well, if all these are true quotations, I think I am suitably convinced. We need to do something about the Wiki pages then, and it seems like they had Human Rights Watch convinced....

I apologize to anybody who might find my posts a bit extreme but this is who I am and how I think, so if this "freedom of speech" shit is true, I'm entitled to my opinion.

 

Let me tell you I categorically shit all over this Jewish organizations and concepts with jewmanitarian names: Jewman Rights This, Jewman Rights That, Junited fukking Nations, International Cryjew Group, Radio Jewish Liberty, Jewish Freedom House, Heritage Jewish Foundation, Jewropean Junion, Jewish fukking Democracy (I coined the word Hypocracy for it), Jewish colorful "revolutions", etc., etc.

 

If Israel decides to annihilate a whole country no one can do shit but if these "Azeri" lies are magnified by these Jewish organizations while all the atrocities in "Azerbaijan" BEFORE the war are totally ignored, (I'm talking About Sumgait, Baku, Gandzak, Shamkhor, Shahoomian, Maragha, Nakhijevan, etc. savageries where half a million Armenians were thrown out of their homes through genocidal acts) while all the destruction of Armenian heritage in "Azeri" occupied Armenian land is completely overlooked by those Jewish organizations (vampires hate the sign of the cross anyway), while the aggressor "Azerbaijan" is not condemned for having started the war instead they demand land from Armenia, while the plight of the Armenian displaced is not even mentioned in the OSCjE paper, then why should we give a semi-flying duck for what the "Human" Rights Watch thinks? Shit all over it!

Edited August 20, 2006 by Hellektor

[vava]

Hellektor - Please edit your post for language and hateful content. Any and all forms of hate, including ant-semitism (or anti-jewism, or whatever you wish to call it) are not allowed on this board. Consult our Code of Conduct if you'd like clarification. Feel free to advocate your opinion about Human Rights Watch, or any other organization for that matter, after all it's your opinion. Please try and do so without resorting to crude language and/or hateful generalizations. In my opinion these kinds of rants do nothing but diservice to Armenians everywhere.

 

You may choose not to edit your post, that's fine, I'll just remove it. Consider this a friendly warning.

[nairi]

I think Hellektor has spent too much time in Iran. Someone should show him that sometimes the grass is greener on the other side.

[annannimusss]

Hellektor,that was a great post that you made.I agree that many of these Organizations ignore the Armenian people and the Armenian Nation.And not all forums I guess allow bad words,but I have to say that was a very eye openinig post.

[Hellektor]

Hellektor - Please edit your post for language and hateful content. Any and all forms of hate, including ant-semitism (or anti-jewism, or whatever you wish to call it) are not allowed on this board. Consult our Code of Conduct if you'd like clarification. Feel free to advocate your opinion about Human Rights Watch, or any other organization for that matter, after all it's your opinion. Please try and do so without resorting to crude language and/or hateful generalizations. In my opinion these kinds of rants do nothing but diservice to Armenians everywhere.

 

You may choose not to edit your post, that's fine, I'll just remove it. Consider this a friendly warning.

One problem I always have on hyeforum is that there's neither a "Delete" possibility nor an "Edit" button after you leave the page where you have just posted.

 

There's only an "Edit" possibility right after posting.

 

I am neither anti-"Semitic", whatever the hell that might be, nor anti-Jewish nor anti-anybody. The blatant double standards of these organizations is simply sickening. If you think my language is bad, you just edit the "fukking" out of the post. It's just a word for emphasis and the original meaning of it is lost.

 

If you try to read my post with a smile, you'll see it's far less "hateful" than it seems after a casual reading.

 

That all said I'll keep in mind your "friendly warning".

 

 

I think Hellektor has spent too much time in Iran. Someone should show him that sometimes the grass is greener on the other side.

The Iranians have no problems with Jews. You have spent too much time watching/reading CNN and other Zionist owned (is it OK to use the term Zionist instead of J vava?) media therefore you equate the regime with the Iranian people. Haven't you heard of Cyrus the Great and his freeing of the J people? He's even mentioned in their story book the Bible. They have lived peacefully for 2500 years in Iran. It's true that the current regime hasn't been too kind to them but it's the same for all Iranians.

 

Us Armenians on the other hand have received a lot of stabs in our back by the Zionists:

 

Just think of the J***** inventors of pan-Turkism: Arminius Vambery, Emmanuel Carasso, Leon Cahun, Lumley David, Primo Levi, Tekin Alp (Mois Cohen), Falik Bey Toledo, etc.

 

Just think of the revisionist garbage by Brenda Shaffer.

 

Just think of the lies by the so-called International Crisis Group.

 

Just think of the Shimon Peres (and Israeli) denial of the Armenian Genocide and his praising of the genocidal bandit Cacaturk.

 

Just think of the J***** lobby's sucking up to the Turks and their frantic "efforts" to abort the AG recognition by the US admin.

 

Just think of the OSCE crap...

 

What have Armenians done to these bunch to deserve this sonofabitchery?

 

Didn't 300,000 out of 600,000 Armenians, who fought a war that wasn't even theirs, die to flush Hitler down the drain and even reached Berlin? And the Armenian partisans? All of this hardly after a couple of decades after losing 70% of our genofund.

 

Has the Zionist Hollywood EVER mentioned this?

 

Why as soon as one says J, one is branded anti-"Semite"?

What if I say I don't believe in J***** mythology and the Noah cock and bull story? So what's a "Semite"?

 

Arabs, Assyrians, Akkadians, Arameans... are also "Semitic" by that definition. An Arab person who has lost their entire family in the Zionist bombardments might hate the guts of the J***, so does that make them anti-"Semite"?

 

What do you call ShameOn Peres? An anti-Japhetite or something? Why isn't there a term for those who constantly stab Armenians in the back?

 

Hellektor,that was a great post that you made.I agree that many of these Organizations ignore the Armenian people and the Armenian Nation.And not all forums I guess allow bad words,but I have to say that was a very eye openinig post.

Thanks for the compliment!

[LionHeart]

Accelerated, don't believe everything you read on Wikipedia. You will be surprised at the amount of trash posted there by Turko-Azeri propagandists. Me and a few other Armenians (who are members here, though I will protect their identity) are actually working there to clean up much of the mess (including the Khojalu page). Our ranks there are currently few, so we do need many many more interested, dedicated, and knowledgable Armenians joining Wikipedia. So, do not hesitate to do it. Make sure to thoroughlly study the 3-4 pages on Wiki policy--they will be extremely helpful in making your work effective.

 

I agree, the scenario of Azeris intentionally killing their own for political gain is unlikely. They are humans after all, and humans do not usually do that.

 

What happened actually is quite simple. Only 10 Azeri civilians died in Khojalu. Armenians let the rest of the Azeris leave. Once they got to the border, they were shot down by Azeri soldiers, who took them for Armenians. It was not a massacre for political gain--it was a massacre of mistaken identity.

[Accelerated]

Thanks LionHeart, that certainly makes more sense. And I do appreciate the work you guys put in to promote the truth on Wiki.

[Hellektor]

I agree, the scenario of Azeris intentionally killing their own for political gain is unlikely. They are humans after all (Really? H.), and humans do not usually do that.

Mutalibov said it was People’s Front thugs who did it to topple him.

Then what do you say about killing Chingiz Mustafayev? When he found out it was the "Azeris" who did it and shit hit the fan, they killed him. So much for their humanity.

 

This is the problem with us Armenians. After all the pain they inflicted on us the last thousand years, some of us still attribute humanity to this species of vermin.

 

Watching this clip I honestly believe they are Human Culture-deficiency Viruses.

 

Reading this article I truly believe they are murderous, parasitical, human-shaped monsters.

 

They promote the savage beast (forgive me, poor beasts) Ramil Safarov to "Man of the Year", their students (for god's sake!) protest against the sentence...

 

Just look at the fuss about the burning of some dry grass due to hot whether... That Turk sucking Eurofaggot piece of shit René van der Linden dignifies the "Azeri" hoax with answers:

 

"Such cases caused by one of the parties to the conflict are very unpleasant," René van der Linden said.

 

He should have dismissed the claim as ridiculous. What has he said of the Nakhijevan destructions?

 

The level of hatred against Armenians in Azgarbageland is unimaginable. Considering the savageries of these bandits who have founded their fake state on Armenian territory, I am not willing to accept ideas such as "They are humans after all", or "we shall cede the liberated land" for a worthless piece of pissed-on peace paper, from any Armenians, as long as these savages throw hatecrap at us.

 

They are the most worthless garbage ever produced in the universe and they have to pack their folding and non-folding tents, get the hell out of my home and go to the hell they come from.

 

 

http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/photos/20051117.OBS7739.jpg

Turk Sucking Eurofag, René van der Linden

I wonder how his lips got so swollen...

[LionHeart]

Hellektor, when I say Azeris are human, I mean that they are guided by the same human instincts as everyone else. They hate us, and would do the most brutal acts against us. That's human. They do not hate their own, and they would not massacre their own. That too, is human.

 

Mutalibov said what he said because he was angry at his opposition, and decided to pain them as evil. Chingiz was killed because he uncovered that Azeris killed Azeris, not because he uncovered an conspiracy on the part of Azeris to kill Azeris.

 

The unfortunate result of Mutalibov's statement is that it gave Armenia false assurance--Armenians though "well if Mutalibov says it, we can quote him and have credibility." They didn't realize that Mutalibov's version makes no sense, and that prevented them from pursuing the more logical version--i.e. massacre by mistake (which is supported by evidence).

[LionHeart]

I was hoping Accelerated would ask me why I believe that Azeris killed their own by mistake. Since he accepted my version uncritically, I will need to do some explaining:)

 

There is one VERY important fact that is unknown by many about the Khojalu event, even though it's undisputed--the location of the massacre. The Kjojalu massacre didn't happen in Khojalu. It happened about 10 km away from the village, right next to the Azeri positions (a few hundred meters away). That's where the dead were found.

 

There is a second important fact, interestingly used by Azeris agianst us, but actually proving our innocence. Some of the bodies were shot blank point. And some were mutilated. And get this--they weren't mutilated when foreign journalists first visitted the area--they were mutilated by the time the journalists returned there a few days later.

 

Now, Azeris don't dispute any of this. What the Azeris say is this: Those evil Armenians let Azeris leave the town, and once they got to the border, Armenians killed them. Then, a few days later, Armenians came back to mutilate them.

 

The reason this is absurd, and the reason those two facts prove our innocence, is pure logic. The shootings lasted for 7-8 hours. There is no way on earth that Armenians would be able to massacre hundreds of Azeris, for hours, under the nose of well-armed Azeri troops, who were just meters away. At the very least, the Azeris would provide a cover fire (firing at Armenains), so the civilians could cross over to them. Armenians would be shot and killed--especially if they tried to shoot Azeri civilians point blank. And Azeris were pretty heavily armed--the nearby city of Ahgdam itself had huge arsenal of heavy weaponry and ammo.

 

There is also no way that Armenians could come back and spend hours mutilating the dead Azeris, again without being shot at by the Azeri troops.

 

And let's think about this--why would Armenians let Azeris leave Khojalu, have the walk for 10 km, and then kill them--in the most dangerous (for Armenians) position? When they could easily kill the Azeris right in Khojalu, during the fight, and easily explain it all as collateral damage? Doesn't make sense.

 

What clearly happened is that the Azeri troops didn't know that Khojalu residents were coming their way. They saw dark figures against the snow in the distance, panicked, assumed that Armenians were again attacking them, and kept firing at them. The Khojalu Azeris themselves assumed they were being fired at by Armenians. And how do we know that the Azeri soldiers didn't know that Khojalu residents were coming their way? Because (again this is another undisputed fact) they themselves instructed the refugees to go to the village Nakhichevanik, mistakenly thinking that the village was under Azeri control. The village was actually under Armenian control, and there was a brief skirmish between the armed residents of Khojalu and Armenians of Nakhichevanik, and here Armenians were defeated. What this means is that the Azeris somehow had false intelligence about the positions of Azeris and Armenians, which lead to the mistaken massacre.

 

By the way, there is a very good chance that the massacre was orchestrated by Turkey--with the purpose of removing pro-Russian Mutalibov. From Turkish newspapers, we konw that Turkey had something to do with Mutalibov's removal. Turkish agents could have easily manipulated the intelligence sources of Azeris, giving them false info.

 

Oh, and who scalped and mutilated the dead "Azeris?" The Azeri soldiers themselves, once they realized their mistake, and decided to scalp a few cadavers and put a few pullets at close range, to make it seem it was a brutal genocide by Armenians. And most likely the cadavers were not those of Azeris, but those of Armenians taken hostage by Khojalu Azeris themselves (those hostages are still unaccounted for).

 

By the way, those who read Russian, here is an excellent discussion of all this evidence I talked about, complete with sources: http://www.armenianway.com/aw/News/levon/Khojalu/index.html.

[Accelerated]

hehe, Lion I dont think I accepted your version of events as fact, but it does make more sense than either, Azeris massacring their own for political gain (official Armenian version of events) or Armenians providing a safety corridor for civilians only to murder them as they approach Azeri held positions (official Azeri version).

 

PS. thanks for the detailed post

Edited August 30, 2006 by Accelerated

[LionHeart]

You are welcome, Acc.

 

By the way, regarding the fact that Azeris are human (with all the associated vices), it's helpful to remember that Armenians are genetically close to Turks and Azeris. It's something that every Armenian should be profoundly proud of (once they realize what it actually means).

[Hellektor]

Hellektor, when I say Azeris are human, I mean that they are guided by the same human instincts as everyone else. They hate us, and would do the most brutal acts against us. That's human. They do not hate their own, and they would not massacre their own. That too, is human.

 

Mutalibov said what he said because he was angry at his opposition, and decided to pain them as evil. Chingiz was killed because he uncovered that Azeris killed Azeris, not because he uncovered an conspiracy on the part of Azeris to kill Azeris.

 

The unfortunate result of Mutalibov's statement is that it gave Armenia false assurance--Armenians though "well if Mutalibov says it, we can quote him and have credibility." They didn't realize that Mutalibov's version makes no sense, and that prevented them from pursuing the more logical version--i.e. massacre by mistake (which is supported by evidence).

Dear Lionheart,

 

I believe no one's getting what I'm trying to say here.

 

Search every Armenian forum and you'll find more threads about this tiny, insignificant, unimportant wartime incident, either started by the Turks or as in here by an Armenian, than the savageries and hellish ordeal of innocent Armenians going through a bloody house to house slaughter hundreds of kilometers away from Artsakh or Yerevan, BEFORE any war started, and ONLY in return for peaceful, civilized demonstrations, everywhere in Azgarbageland.

 

Those state organized genocidal barbarities are enough to indict Azgarbageland for crimes against humanity. The destruction of Jugha cemetery (and every standing Armenian monument all over "Azeri" occupied Armenian territories) AT THE TIME OF "negotiations" are enough reason to stop those "talks" and demand compensation. Look what Israel did supposedly for two soldiers (yes, I know we don't have the same power). The "Azeris" are much better than us in getting the attention of J**ish organizations, look how they have got every Eurofag to say something about those silly fires. Why would Armenians burn some dry weed? This gets more feedback than the Jugha destruction or Sumgait, Baku, Gandzak genocidal acts and who's responsible?

 

I'm trying to say, if more than 90% of our home is under Turkish occupation, it also has to do with ourselves. We don't care what they do to us and we bring up this silly incident everywhere and every time and I quote Accelerated:

 

"This is a great black blot on our otherwise heroic victory. If Armenians are/were responsible, something should be done to about it."

 

WHY? About 100 worthless, stinking, illiterate, useless, nomads were killed in the war-zone. SO - FUCKING - WHAT? Why do we care? What the hell is wrong with us? To hell with Khojalu and the stinking garbage disposed of.

 

The reason the "Azeris" emphasize this insignificant incident is they want to bring the Armenians down to their genocidal level because of the corpseporn. The point is who really performed it?

 

They killed about 34 innocent Armenian hostages and added them to the pile of "Azeri" garbage, desecrating their pure bodies. It's supposed that the idea of corpseporn dawned upon the savages from the fear of the Armenian martyrs being recognized.

 

Chingiz Mustafayev and the Czech reporter noticed the changed bodies and that's why they killed Mustafayev. Beyond any shadow of a doubt it was the "Azeris" who performed the corpseporn, because it was done in Aghdam which was still under "Azeri" occupation and wouldn't be liberated until a couple of years later.

 

If they are capable of so much atrocity then I refuse to credit them with humanity. The chimpanzees’ genetic make up is for 98.8% the same as that of human beings but does that mean they are human? I have always said I sincerely think that somewhere down the line in the course of human evolution, the Turks missed the train and didn’t develop all the attributes the modern human beings have acquired.

 

These are among others:

Remorse, guilt, shame, compassion, honesty, modesty, sincerity, truthfulness, objectivity, self-criticism, understanding and sympathy for the suffering of others, the ability to share others' pain, the ability to value achievements of civilization such as works of art, places of worship, manuscripts, cities, etc.…

 

I hope I clarified my point. Spend your energy condemning and exposing the fake state of "Azerbaijan" and not propagating for them. Capice?

[Hellektor]

You are welcome, Acc.

 

By the way, regarding the fact that Azeris are human (with all the associated vices), it's helpful to remember that Armenians are genetically close to Turks and Azeris. It's something that every Armenian should be profoundly proud of (once they realize what it actually means).

Again a mistake I come across everywhere...

 

Man! What has race to do with all this?

Turks came from Mongolia; they spread like cancer in Central Asia in the 6th century annihilating the indigenous peoples of the region, the Turanians of Iranian origin. Then they came upon us like the plague in the 11th century. They turkified, islamized, stole kids for janissary and raped the women in their filthy harems for a thousand years. They were always the minority therefore the Turks of today have lost their Mongoloid features and look like the locals wherever they set their hoofs.

 

Unfortunately they still have the same Mongol brain that has not evolved in the last 12000 years or so. It's what you feel you are and it has nothing to do with what you look like.