ThornyRose Posted June 11, 2001 Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 I don't think that's what Steve had in mind...And what is this?"Benim siyasi ve ekonomik bir kaygım yok. Ben sadece Allah'ın kuluyum ve herşeyi kalpten, inanarak söylüyorum. Önce gerçekleri kabul etmemiz lazım. Çevremizdeki herşeyden bizler sorumluyuz. Soykırım diyoruz. Ondan da bizler sorumluyuz. Ve diyaloğa başlarsak eğer, gerçeklere o zaman ulaşabiliriz." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raja Posted June 11, 2001 Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 quote:Originally posted by Thorny Rose:I don't think that's what Steve had in mind...And what is this?"Benim siyasi ve ekonomik bir kaygım yok. Ben sadece Allah'ın kuluyum ve herşeyi kalpten, inanarak söylüyorum. Önce gerçekleri kabul etmemiz lazım. Çevremizdeki herşeyden bizler sorumluyuz. Soykırım diyoruz. Ondan da bizler sorumluyuz. Ve diyaloğa başlarsak eğer, gerçeklere o zaman ulaşabiliriz."Well,Steve was talking about the front page article on Friday's Sabah and that's the one.As for the text,I have no doubt those were said but knowing the journalistic approaches in Turkey I wonder how much was omitted in between for the text to appear as such. Please accept my congradulations on your efforts btw my paternal grandfather was from Kayseri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 11, 2001 Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 quote:Originally posted by raffi:Well,Steve was talking about the front page article on Friday's Sabah and that's the one.As for the text,I have no doubt those were said but knowing the journalistic approaches in Turkey I wonder how much was omitted in between for the text to appear as such.Yeah, I reckon such... quote: Please accept my congradulations on your efforts btw my paternal grandfather was from KayseriReally? That's cool. One of the Armenians I contacted at Agos told me he was originally from Kayseri. And thanks. Do you speak Turkish? Just how are you a Bolsahye? Born there yourself or you deem such from parents?[ June 10, 2001: Message edited by: Thorny Rose ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted June 11, 2001 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 quote:Originally posted by raffi:Here is the Sabah article http://garildi.sabah.com.tr/sayfa.cgi?w+30...08/t/index.htmlYes, that is the article I was refering to. The following day's newspaper has a small report on the actual event at the church - but i have yet to see any decent pictures of the service yet - from where were all the photographers from, i wonder? there were about 10 of them, by the look of all their gear.Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted June 11, 2001 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 quote:Originally posted by Mike77:You its so funny. Just as you think you have hope for a better tommorow you discover something. Yes maybe thorn rose went there. So what does that prove after all? What you discover is that even if that person took a chance they will end up in Turkish prison with the other 10000 plus political ones. Turkey is ruled and has been rulled by a facsist military dictatorship. So they let a few American Armenians in for tourism! Oh my GOD thank you Turkey for that! You did not murder us for a change. Should we bow down and kiss our master??I could care less if the Turks let us in for tourism etc. You know what? Turkey is like a Germany before the allies liberated her. Turkey is the unpunished NAZI. A NAZI allowed to live because of the corruption of the West. Do you think that by allowing a few tourists into your racist land, you will somehow makes things right? I am sorry I do not accept that! You must take responsibility for your actions and then determine if what you did was right. If the moderators here have a problem with that ban me now. As I grow sick and tired of people that make concessions to EVIL.I think it proves you are a coward, or lazy, or full of hot air, or probably all three. You are only interested in Turkey as something to hate - doing something constructive, like actually visiting the place, seems not to be on your agenda. Because of my interest in Turkey's Armenian past i have unwillingly seen the inside of a fair number of police stations and army bases - (something Armenians do not seem prepared to risk) - but that did not stop me travelling to Kayseri. Do something positive - then you will have the moral right to hold any views you want.Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellthecat Posted June 11, 2001 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 A little correctıon: In a bit of my second posting i wrote "Look at all the stuff produced during the Soviet period (...dare I use Saroyan as an example!)." I meant to write "Sarian" (as in Martiros Sarian). But nobody took up the dare anyway! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 11, 2001 Report Share Posted June 11, 2001 quote:Originally posted by bellthecat:I think it proves you are a coward, or lazy, or full of hot air, or probably all three. You are only interested in Turkey as something to hate - doing something constructive, like actually visiting the place, seems not to be on your agenda. Because of my interest in Turkey's Armenian past i have unwillingly seen the inside of a fair number of police stations and army bases - (something Armenians do not seem prepared to risk) - but that did not stop me travelling to Kayseri. Do something positive - then you will have the moral right to hold any views you want.SteveSteeeeeeeeeeve, you're greaaaaaaaaaaaaaat! Like here: http://armenians.com/cgi-bin/forum/ultimat...c&f=18&t=000003 )))))))))) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted June 12, 2001 Report Share Posted June 12, 2001 Steve - LOL - I have never had the pleasure of spending any time in a Turkish police station (I don't envy you on that one)...though I got stopped by police for speeding...and that was a funny episode. I vigourously (and succesfully) argued down the fine (from something around $200 [yea, lets rip off the rich American] to about $10 [nah, he is making this too much work...etc]...meanwhile my wife is repeating "midnight express" over and over agin and urging me to just pay...then several days later we spent a few anxious moments with our car surrounded by Turkish soldiers with machine guns pointed at us menecingly and some fat officer barking threatening gobblygook at me in Turkish...I managed to convince him that we were harmless Americans (mostly by saying "American" over and over again and pointing at myself and my wife and indicating that I didn't understand a word he was saying). He/they seemed to have a very favorable impression of Americans once they understood and didn't seem to mind at all that we had just trespassed across their base. (Though they did not treat me to Raki as most Turks seemed to want to do [and I would never complain or refuse such if offered of course]). Perhaps the fact that he didn't speak any English....In any event, I shouldn't neglect to mention that we had just driven through a loose moving formation of tanks and other military vehicals obviously conducting some sort of exercise...I was without a clue as to what was going on and how we got there (I stick by my story!)...but it was all quite exiting nevertheless. BTW - being a non-Armenian I gather (and perhaps not even anything close) - how is it that you aquirred such an interest (specifically) in the Armenian issues in Turkey - etc? I applaud such and of course would never wish to discourage you - just curious thats all.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raja Posted June 12, 2001 Report Share Posted June 12, 2001 quote:Originally posted by Thorny Rose:Really? That's cool. One of the Armenians I contacted at Agos told me he was originally from Kayseri. And thanks. Do you speak Turkish? Just how are you a Bolsahye? Born there yourself or you deem such from parents?[ June 10, 2001: Message edited by: Thorny Rose ]LOL.I spent 35 years of my 37 year long life in Turkey.Close to 2 years ago(to be exact 2 days after the earthquake)I came here.So it would be a fair assumption to say that I speak Turkish. I didn't come here with full free will,but for financial reasons.I'm still hoping that someday I will return although it might be quite a hard decision.Turkey is the place I was born,raised and lived;thus there would be no other place that I would consider as "home" My family comes from 4 different parts in Turkey.Kayseri,Yozgat(Bogazliyan),Ordu and Bilecik.So my roots lie in a widespread area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 12, 2001 Report Share Posted June 12, 2001 quote:Originally posted by raffi:LOL.I spent 35 years of my 37 year long life in Turkey.Close to 2 years ago(to be exact 2 days after the earthquake)I came here.So it would be a fair assumption to say that I speak Turkish. I didn't come here with full free will,but for financial reasons.I'm still hoping that someday I will return although it might be quite a hard decision.Turkey is the place I was born,raised and lived;thus there would be no other place that I would consider as "home" My family comes from 4 different parts in Turkey.Kayseri,Yozgat(Bogazliyan),Ordu and Bilecik.So my roots lie in a widespread area. Nice. You know, there are certain things some (but only some) Diasporan Armenians say about Armenians who consider Turkey their home - they are traitors, how can they live and like living among Turks, blah blah blah. I can guess what you are going to say, but I would like to hear from you, as well. LOL... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 12, 2001 Report Share Posted June 12, 2001 Wait a minute... Police stations???You will have to tell me some time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raja Posted June 13, 2001 Report Share Posted June 13, 2001 quote:Originally posted by Thorny Rose:Nice. You know, there are certain things some (but only some) Diasporan Armenians say about Armenians who consider Turkey their home - they are traitors, how can they live and like living among Turks, blah blah blah. I can guess what you are going to say, but I would like to hear from you, as well. LOL...Like any other subject this one also has its fanatics.Not yet have I encountered such animosity and I believe such people belong to a minority group.However,they exist,and the fact remains that it is impossible to reason with them.Dealing with them would bring about two alternatives.You either will ignore or start up heated exchanges since a normal discussion is not possible. I would prefer the prior but not refrain from the latter either.A more moderate approach would be to claim that I have been assimilated.I wouldn't try to refute that since I believe that to be true and moreover I see nothing wrong with that.It's only natural.In contributing to who I am right now my Turkish identity has been equally effective as my Armenian identity, if not more. Under the thread Turkish Friend I had made a couple posts regarding that topic and you can find some parallels in them with this subject.Long story short,I am quite happy for who I am regardless of what people may say or think.(Be careful to keep on holding the microphone,in case you hand it over you might not recieve it back.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 13, 2001 Report Share Posted June 13, 2001 quote:Originally posted by raffi:Like any other subject this one also has its fanatics.Not yet have I encountered such animosity and I believe such people belong to a minority group.Exactly, and you certainly do not find them here, by the looks of it. These people have the courage to talk this way only on the internet.Yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThornyRose Posted June 13, 2001 Report Share Posted June 13, 2001 By the way, I scanned my photos but haven't had time to format them. I will hopefully do that today. I have an appointment at the dentist's in a short while, otherwise they would have been ready in less than an hour or so...Additionally, I was seen by relatives who had been driving from Kayseri back home here in Ankara. They had happened to stop at the same place for a break as my bus. LOL! They thought it was me - they did recognize me - but then said to themselves, "It can't be... What the heck is she doing here?" LOL!I didn't see them. I was too sleepy. I boarded the bus at 4 PM and slept two hours straight until 6 PM when the bus stopped suddenly, for a break. I was that tired and sleepy. "Sleep pouring out of my eyes..." LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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