MJ

Don't remember. It has been in High School that I have learned about Siranouish.

quote:Originally posted by Hakob: I didn't really answer the sex and rape part of this thread. As if you did now? Replacing one crap by another makes only two craps.

Vahan and Anshnork (what an ironic username) first of all, let me welcome you both to the forum. I have been following your dialog with an interest. In contrary of the private message that you have received, let me encourage you to keep an open mind and aggressive attitude in delivering your thoughts. In my view, nothing has poisoned neither in the distant nor in the near Armenian history the minds of younger and older men and women than the conventional Armenian Christian ideology (as opposed to the faith). I trace all the Armenian troubles throughout history to that source. As far as some of the substantial issues go, Vahan, I would like to disagree on a factual level with your statement regarding the proof in the realm of the modern physics that “no subatomic particles really exist.” I don’t think this is an accurate statement, scientifically speaking. Perhaps you meant something else, or I misunderstood you. I also would like to disagree with your statements that man learns about the world through experience only. First of all, I think the world consists of “things” and “thoughts.” The “things” and the “thoughts” are interconnected in some subtle way. It is trough that we first learn about the “things” through experience. But no experience can give a correct understanding of the “thing” unless the “thought” explains it. For example, we can experience the light through our sensors. However, we learn about the subtle properties of light through our mind only, which tries to explain the “thing” of light. Without the explanation the experience is worth not much – the experience would be too rudimentary. It is the “thought” that elevates our understanding of the “thing” to a new level, which allows us to materialize a new experience, which could’ve not been crafted without the “thought.” Sure, the thing exists irregardless of our experience, however only the “thought” allows us to have the experience.

Hamlet.

The question, I think, is not whether the exlosions have taken place or not. It is obvious that they have. The question is whther they are still going on are stopped as promised.

It’s called verbal diarrhea, Steve. And it is pity that it comes from such, otherwise, an intelligent person.

quote:Originally posted by THOTH: I for one think that we have been riding high due to reletively stable (not rising) energy prices and the influx of cheap goods from China (and to some extent the rest of Asia)... I would add the "e-commerce" bubble on the top of those points that you have made above. The current deterioration of the economy is partially attributable to its bursting.

From some friends.

While it is true that the Armenian government has to be blamed for the explosions, the speakers of the previous two articles are full of political crap, obviously. I am still waiting independent confirmation from Armenia whether the explosions still continue.

You don't need a lot of science in our days to provide fiber optics networks. This issue is in its industrial stage, now, and is way past the scientific stage. If I am not mistaken, ArmenTel is the primary stonewall on the way of plugging Armenia into the fiber optic network. Few years ago there were attempts to establish sports airplane assembly business in Armenia. As far as the aerospace science goes, I think that's not Armenia's scientific strength, and would require massive investments for long time so that to build that base(not clear who and why would do it) . I to believe that telecom and similar sciences can be elevated to higher levels in Armenia, assuming strategic program to do so. A lot of things can be done in Armenia. People just need optimism for the future, and be systematic. Yes, in the past, I have "sinned," by getting involved with few scientific disciplines. Have some idea about few things in the range from the relativity theory to portfolio management.

No, Steve. First of all, I don't believe that you, alone or with an army, could give a right reason. I am just saying that when we make strong statements the way you do (frequently), we should be prepared to provide adequate arguments, but not refer to some (unknown) newsgroups. Additionally, I may very well disagree what the newsgroups have to say. It is not the first time that I would associate with the Europeans or the Middle Easterners, and I think I know pretty well what they may say. However, as a rule, I they fail to say something fair or substantiated. As to the US being seen as pariah, it may be more indicative of those who have this opinion, rather than the US, while I am far from assuming that the US is an angle state. I just try to see basic common sense and fairness.

Steve, This is characteristic of what I have been puzzled about. For months you come up with unjustified declarations about America, and the very moment one requests that you bring some rational arguments, you refer one to some newsgroups. It is not a good way of conducting conversation/discussion. It reiterates only my previous point that your attitude towards America is not based on rationality. You don't need to spend a whole day on articulating your arguments. Just give three major arguments in bullet points, please.

Agree! But to develop the engineering sciences and technology on a proper level Armenia needs to maintain its traditions and culture in fundamental sciences, however, it has to put the fundamental sciences in service of the Applied Sciences. Btw, for this statement alone I would be crucified by the fundamental scientist of Armenia. One of the strengths of Armenian Applied Sciences has been the Laser Technology. Other ones have been the Applied Science of Cosmic Rays, Radioelectronics, etc - things that have to do with Applied Physics (thanks to Alikhanian brothers). Obviously Informatics has a solid base in Armenia, however it requires elevation to a higher level. There is a good base for boosting to a new level the biochemical science, but it would require investments and linkage with the corresponding industries. There is a strong tradition in crystallography, and there is also some industrial base. There are several other disciplines for which there is base in Armenia, or it may be found to create such base in a short while. But so that to achieve success in these areas, few things have to be done, and few things should not be done. Some of the things that should not be done is to waist the resources on building stupid monuments - churches, etc. More money has to spent on bringing younger people to America and European countries to receive university education. These were just few hectic thoughts.

Thanks. I don't have news from Armenia, yet.

Steve, When it comes to America and Bush, I don't feel that your arguments are based on sound judgments, but rather on emotions. And I haven't gotten to the bottom of your emotions, yet, i.e. what’s driving you in these matters. So that to make this discussion substantive, let's develop it this way. You advance your concrete allegation, trying to cut down the mere declarations to minimum (better eliminate) and I will try to articulate the reasons behind my position based on your allegations.

Aharon, Thank you for the info. From what I understand, there is no evidence of formal appeal to the Kremlin. Additionally, formally speaking (not that it would’ve mattered), at the time both Armenia and Georgia were independent of the Kremlin (until 1930). They were just satellite states. Therefore, formally speaking, if any claims, Armenia should’ve directed them to Georgia, directly. However, of coarse the dilemma has existed since 1918. The issue is what has been considered to be the remedy. I am not here to argue that the Socio-Economic conditions of Javakhk have been and remain really bad. It has been recognized even by the Georgian government. But if they are bad, and there are no policies of massive investments, sure people will start to leave the region in search for jobs and better life. I don’t think that the Georgian government needed to do something about it. Now, whether the region was underinvested deliberately so that to drive Armenian out, I don’t know. And it would be a very hard threshold to meet to prove such allegation. There may be multiple reasons for historically not injecting massive investments into that region. One reason being, for example, the economic non-feasibility. However, I am still not sure that Javakhk has been Georgia’s most underdeveloped region. It is worth also noticing that if any negative attitudes towards Armenians in Georgia, they have come to surface only after 50s, i.e. after the death of Stalin. In the Stalin era, the investments into particular regions of USSR have been made on a very centralized basis.

Dear Karine, Just some quick replies: Why have US troops been stationed in Countries of say, the persian Golf? Becuase they want to protect the people who live there? America is not world’s police, or at least it shouldn’t be. The US troops are in the Golf to protect the US investments. I think it is a legitimate cause, as long as the investments are made on the basis of mutual consent. Additionally, none of the countries of the Persian Golf were the US troops are present have complained so far about their presence, and in fact, they are strongly for a continuing US presence on their soil. The same concerns Asian countries. What happened in Vietnam? Why did they destroy Vietnam? What buissness did they have there? What buissneess do they have anywhere? In Afhganistan? Putting the talibans in power. Many Americans feel strongly against the US involvement in Vietnam. But the fairness requires to admit that US didn’t get involved in Vietnam (as well as in Afghanistan) on a unilateral basis. It got involved to balance/prevent the expansionism of the USSR. In some ways, if they had not resisted the USSR worldwide, we would’ve lived under communism, now. They can easily bomb Irak. Why, because they want to protect Israel. From who? Saddam Hussein?! As Thoth has already said, the bombing of Iraq had not much to do with Israel. Additionally, it was not the US bombing Iraq, but NATO almost all Arab countries. Sure, the US was the strongest executer of the will of NATO and the Arab nations. WHat would the moral diffrents been with Irak bombing Israel and US bombing Irak?? Israel has not threatened Iraq, the Iraqi property, civilians, investments, and has not questioned Iraq’s right to exist. Obviously, Israel is not interested in a hostile environment. It is more that interested in peace in the region, but such peace that guarantees its security. Israel has not been the aggressor against Iraq, or the Arab world. US destroyed nuclear stations in Irak, few years ago. Because they believed it was a threat to Israel. I don’t think this information is correct. I think NATO has bombed some research facilities. I think for the sake of the truth and common sense, we should leave Israel out of this. But its OK for israel to have nuclear weapons? Not to mention US. Perhaps it is not OK that Israel has nuclear weapons, as much is it is not OK that India, Pakistan, North Korea do have them. The world superpowers are trying to reduce , and if possible eliminate the nuclear weaponry. Nuclear weapons are not toys. Sure, one wouldn’t like to see them in the hands of dictators who have used chemical weapons against the civilians of their own nations (Saddam against the Kurds). It's well known, America is a country with power, who likes to remain in power, not only in their country. Sure. Last time it didn’t have power, the tiny Japan slaughtered Americans in Pearl Harbor. Who doesn’t want to be powerful, or who would do hara-kiri to reduce its existing power? Why? Any evidence that America is striving for power in Australia, for example? The people in Irak is also people. The sanctions agais Irak by the US is an obvious crime against humanity. I am not sure if they are crime against humanity, but I find the sanctions of this scale to be wrong, and many Americans, including those in at power think the same way. But as a matter of “realpolitics” it is always easier to introduce sanctions/forces than to lift them up (to remove them). Let’s see what happens when the current administration get’s its hands around it. BTW, the current State Secretary of the US, as the Joint Chief of Staff, has been vociferously opposed to use force against Iraq during the Golf War. Isk Euvropan ira yughov tapakvi Amen! To summarize, Karine, I think there are a lot of things that the US has done, and perhaps still does which were/are wrong. However, given its might and power, in the big picture of things, in the broader historic context, the US is the world's guarantor of democracy, Human Rights, peace and security on the earth. Sure, with such power comes also some arrogance. But it is not as bad as it could've been, and so far, it has not produce such negative results as one might’ve expected from such power.

Gamavor, I had understood you correctly. However, I think there was no independent source to confirm whether more Albanian civilians were killed in the result of air-strikes (and it is known that it has happened) or as a result of Serbian operations. Additionally, it is known that Serbians have used the Albanian civilians on a capacity of human shields, populating some objects of military significance with Albanian civilians. Propaganda is one of the instruments of conducting war, and both sides, I think, have used it during the Kosovo crisis.

quote:Originally posted by gamavor: There were instances where Serbians very "cleverly" used civilians as a human shield - no doubt about that. I don't like it, I disapprove that . It is cowered. In other instances NATO pilots took a tractor for a tank and.. Boom 124 people died at once As to the propaganda. Yes, You are right. Both sides used propaganda and this is part of the "game.” The difference is that those who were sympathetic to the Serb, did not rush to help them, or if they do that was in very limited scope, while our retarded neighbors in the same time started shouting on the streets of Contstantinopole "Hold on Kosova, We are coming!” It is possible. But in one case it is a very costly technical error, in the other case - a criminal act. Additionally, we have no knowleddge of the numbers of civilians murdered by the Serbs in the questioned period. For the sake of the fairness we have to also admit that those who were sympathetic to the Serbs were in no position to help them. Besides, there are two levels of being sympathetic to Serbs. One is on the level of Serbia's territorial integrity, the other may be on the level of sympathizing Serbia's homophobic attitudes and actions.

Welcome, Vahan. I see you have opened a thread called Zen in the Theology forum. Why don't you educate us all...assuming that you don't charge for it...

Raffi knows Greek.

quote:Originally posted by Hmayk: Thanks MJ This is my work. Hmayk, Btw, I do think that there is something of a similar spirit and sounding by Dzerents or Bakunts, or someone else of that scale. It starts like: "Mtnets. Dzerunin ..." Are you aware of it? I have forgotten more than I remember.

Good to see you Raffi. Please tell us more about "Sourp Nigoghayios." But note that in the insciption on the stone above it is spelled as "Sourp Nigolai."

An Armenian Radio joke: Question to A.R.: Who is the most aggressive nation of the world - USSR or USA? Answer: Of coarse USA, since it meddles all the time in the internal affairs of USSR in all corners of the world.

Mayja, I had missed your replies inserted inside my previous text quoted in the previous email. Let me respond to them. Arabs want to have their own nuclear gun. Why america is against that? America has its nuclear gun, as we know... Yes, America has nuclear arms, and it has misused them once. Tell me, please, why do Arabs want to have nuclear arms? Isn’t the world trying to get rid of the nuclear arms altogether? There was no proves that bombing of American airplane in Scotland was made by the order of Khadafi.. The crime was made by independent Maltese terrorists, which have found asylum in Libya. That’s all. I don’t think so. It is established I think that the two terrorists were working with the secret service of Libya. I don’t know Algeria, but I know that in the past America has been involved in many questionable acts. There is a joke from the Armenian Radio in this regard, which I’ll convey a bit later. Unfortunately, I don’t know of the Algerian events you are referring to. I am not the all-knowing... But why then Osvald was sentenced ? He was unguilty, its real fact. By the way, MJ , have u seen JFK by O.Stone? It is time to appeal to th Jesus Christ. (It’s OK, I hope. ) When was Osvald sentenced? Wasn’t he shut on the spot? No, I have not seen the movie. Never take my facts from movies. I this question is unsolvable, is impossible to come back to the past and to stop Balfour, which was, by my opinion, the guiltiest person in this case.... Elaborate, please. U are laughing at me???Why are u so sarcastic??? i am sure that u dont care about this "accurate chronology of the events" Not at all. Not an element of sarcasm. I am totally serious. Why do you think I am not interested in the accurate chronology of the events? Obviously, I don’t mean the unimportant events from the point of view of the development of the logic of the conflict. Perhaps you could open a new thread under the Forum International, and try to facilitate such discussion there? But i view Israel as darling of the USA, anyway. So what? What’s wrong with it? Isn’t everybody somebody’s darling? [ July 14, 2001: Message edited by: MJ ]