Loreley Posted December 8, 2002 Report Share Posted December 8, 2002 PERSONAL BILL OF RIGHTS 1. I have the right to consider my own needs.2. I have the right to say no to anything when I feel I am not ready, it is unsafe, or if it violates my values.3. I have the right to be uniquely myself.4. I have the right to be treated with respect.5. I have the right to express my feelings, both positive and negative.6. I have the right to have my opinions and ideas given the same consideration and respect others have.7. I have the right to take risks, make mistakes, and learn and grow from life’s situation and challenges.8. I have the right to change my mind.9. I have the right to expect honesty from others.10. I have the right to feel scared and say “I’m afraid.”11. I have the right to ask for what I want.12. I have the right to say NO without feeling guilty.13. I have the right to follow my own standards and values.14. I have the right to be in a nonabusive environment.15. I have the right to pursue my goals and abilities.16. I have the right to put myself first sometimes.17. I have the right to make friends and be comfortable around people.18. I have the right to choose my own lifestyle.19. I have the right to take responsibility for my behavior.20. I have the right to be happy and have an egalitarian relationship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigrannesIII Posted December 9, 2002 Report Share Posted December 9, 2002 yes to everything but putting yourself first, your family always comes first, and #20 is wrong also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baboyan Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 go by what u wantto go by nobody can stop u Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 I agree with Tig on #16 with a slight modification: I think one's CHILDREN always come first. "Family" could mean a lot of things. But the fact that the word "sometimes" is in that statement, makes the statement itself ok in my opinion. I can't imagine any other way. About #19, it's not only your "right" but I would say it's your "duty". For #20, I had to look up egalitarian which sounds good as a "right". But right to be happy? I think you have a right to pursue being happy but I don't think happiness itself is something that can be granted as a right. You have to search for and find it yourself ... and some, never will [ December 13, 2002, 04:51 PM: Message edited by: Sip ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MosJan Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 knereq sakayn - egoisty t@pavorutyun e tornum dzer grats@ mane inch qez amen inch dhu - qez hamar - et lav chi gone mi shish xmichq dir seranin tnashen. ham datark dzerqov es yekel ham el menak qez es govum qo maisn mtatsum - isk menq - ??? Azat jan 2 shish Noyak@ statsy ir hashvin / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loreley Posted December 14, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 Tigrannes:hi. If you don't mind me asking, why is it #20 wrong? Doesn't an individual have the right to search for happinness and the right to be in a relationship that is Not gender role oriented and in which both individuals are treated equally? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loreley Posted December 14, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 MosJan: I think that having the right to be treated with respect, to refuse to something that you don't want, etc. is Not being selfish. I do believe that we should care and help others, starting with our families, friends, communities. However, in order to take care of others, first we need to take care of ourselves so we can be there for our loved ones too. None of the statements says that you have the right to hurt others to have your rights validated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loreley Posted December 14, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 Sip: I agree with you on #19. We must take responsability for your behavior. It is like that saying that no matter what has happened to us (bad things in childhood, adulthood, etc.) it does not justify our bad/wrong behavior and we are still responsible for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigrannesIII Posted December 14, 2002 Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Loreley:Tigrannes:hi. If you don't mind me asking, why is it #20 wrong? Doesn't an individual have the right to search for happinness and the right to be in a relationship that is Not gender role oriented and in which both individuals are treated equally?That's because equal means is, and the same things don't apply to man and woman, they both have different roles to fill. Why are you so against traditional roles? Traditionally you will be the center of your family, is there nothing more noble? The role of the traditional Armenian woman is the most respectable role in all the world. We'd all like to be happy, but sometimes we have put others happiness above our own. Personally, that makes me happier than pleasing myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph Posted December 14, 2002 Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 TigrannesIII , I could not say it beter you speak my language . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loreley Posted December 14, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 Tigrannes: One's place and role in the family/society should NOT be defined by ones' gender/sex. Throughout history, women's traditional role has been a subordinated and oppresive role. According to traditional gender roles, women are supposed to be housewifes, take care of the children, serve and obey their husbands. In the professional arena, women are supposed to be teachers, social workers, nurses (low paying jobs compared to the jobs that are mainly done by men). According to traditional roles, women are not supposed to have powerful position in government/law enforcement and for that reason, the system tends to let women down. You stated that, "The role of the traditional Armenian woman is the most respectable role in all the world." Let me ask you Why is that? Because as Armenian women, we are taught to be quiet, take a passive role in our homes. I don't think that makes feel respected. Why is that an Armenian women's role is more respectful that other women's role from other ethnic groups? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigrannesIII Posted December 14, 2002 Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 You're exactly right, that's the way it SHOULD be. Look at the quality of people in Armenia versus the quality of person you find in the Western World. Women have their role, men have their role, that's the way it's been and that's the way it should be. Who are we to question what we've been doing? It IS your job as an Armenian woman to raise the children, as naturally you are better at it. You think your husband could POSSIBLY be the same nurturer that you will be- if you don't believe in the Bible (and amot if you don't), then it's in your DNA to fill that role. If you don't like being in a role where your sons will more or less deify you and your husband will show you respect, well then, I guess there's just something wrong with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigrannesIII Posted December 14, 2002 Report Share Posted December 14, 2002 Loreley, for God's sake you're in Los Angeles. Look at how women treat themselves there. They more or less whore themselves out to get ahead in the world. Look at the clothes the American girls in LA wear! Do you really want to be put into a world where you won't be judged on your intellectual capabilities, but rather on how much skin you show? Or whether or not you sleep with your boss to get ahead? Trust me, you're much better off as a traditional Armenian mother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted December 15, 2002 Report Share Posted December 15, 2002 In both of your previous posts Tigrannes I contend that you have no idea of what you are talking about. For one thing have you ever been to either Armenia or LA even? How can you judge people that you don't even know anything about. Your gross generalizations are just that... [ December 14, 2002, 08:59 PM: Message edited by: THOTH ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loreley Posted December 15, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2002 We have the right to question anything in society. That has been the only way in which change has been brought to society. It is NOT my job to raise children if I don't want to. I want to get married and have children because that something that I would like to do in my life, but it is NOT my duty because I am woman. Raising children is both the mother and the father's responsibility. About what you said that there must be something wrong with me or shame on me if I am not religious (which I am, but if a person is not religious, no one has the right to judge him/her), I am not going to answer that because I know who I am and don't need to prove it no one. Please, be more respectful of women and you do not need to use degrading terms to express your perspective. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 21, 2002 Report Share Posted December 21, 2002 quote:Originally posted by TigrannesIII:The role of the traditional Armenian woman is the most respectable role in all the world.Saudi Arabia: Time is long overdue to address women's rights "Saudi woman is a first class citizen....has rights...duties ...and responsibility... when we talk about the comprehensive development which our country is experiencing in all aspects we can not ignore the role of Saudi woman ....and her participation in the responsibility of this development."Crown Prince 'Abdullah bin 'Abdul-'Aziz Al-Sa'ud of Saudi Arabia quoted by Al-jazeera newspaper on 6 December 1999. http://web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/Index/MDE230...IESSAUDI+ARABIA quote:Originally posted by Loreley:Tigrannes: One's place and role in the family/society should NOT be defined by ones' gender/sex. Throughout history, women's traditional role has been a subordinated and oppresive role. According to traditional gender roles, women are supposed to be housewifes, take care of the children, serve and obey their husbands. In the professional arena, women are supposed to be teachers, social workers, nurses (low paying jobs compared to the jobs that are mainly done by men). According to traditional roles, women are not supposed to have powerful position in government/law enforcement and for that reason, the system tends to let women down. You stated that, "The role of the traditional Armenian woman is the most respectable role in all the world." Let me ask you Why is that? Because as Armenian women, we are taught to be quiet, take a passive role in our homes. I don't think that makes feel respected. Why is that an Armenian women's role is more respectful that other women's role from other ethnic groups? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 21, 2002 Report Share Posted December 21, 2002 quote:Originally posted by TigrannesIII:Loreley, for God's sake you're in Los Angeles. Look at how women treat themselves there. They more or less whore themselves out to get ahead in the world. Look at the clothes the American girls in LA wear! Do you really want to be put into a world where you won't be judged on your intellectual capabilities, but rather on how much skin you show? Or whether or not you sleep with your boss to get ahead? Trust me, you're much better off as a traditional Armenian mother.In most of non-Western countries, there are other things that plague society. For example, to get ahead in one's profession, you have to pay a bribe.On a side note, I don't know what kind of a respectable entity one would be working in anyway for one to have to sleep with the boss for you to promote instead of earning it. You're working in the wrong place to start with! Get out of there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted December 21, 2002 Report Share Posted December 21, 2002 quote:Originally posted by Stormy: quote:Originally posted by TigrannesIII:[qb]Loreley, .... Do you really want to be put into a world where you won't be judged on your intellectual capabilities, but rather on how much skin you show? Or whether or not you sleep with your boss to get ahead? qb][ Stormy]: I don't know what kind of a respectable entity one would be working in anyway for one to have to sleep with the boss for you to promote instead of earning it. You're working in the wrong place to start with! Get out of there!In a number of respects I think that this assertion/contention is way "over blown" - etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.