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*yan vs. *ian


ervaha

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I was wondering..

Here in USA there are Armenian last names that end with ian and yan.

What is a difference? How do we get our last names spelled differently and why?

It is pronounced the same, I think, yet my last name is Sarkisyan and there is a family in my building who's last name is spelled Sarkisian.

 

There are also names that end with yanc/ianc. Like Volodya Babayanc. Any information on that?

 

What do you think?

 

PS: Here is also something else I want to share. This article talks about the Armenian last names. I found it interesting.

Edited by ervaha
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Reluctantly, and as Harut points above, this subject has been discussed on many occasions.

A word about the quote above by Gary Lindt Sinanian. We have spoken about that too.

Gary is the director of ALMA (Armenian Library and Museum of America) in Watertown Mass. He is of German heritage married to an Armenian, and, with admiration and dedication to Armenian Culture has added/adopted his wives' surname of Sinanian. He speaks the Armenian language, he is more knowledgeable of our culture than many of us. Except. When he says that "uni" is of Persian origin, it seems that he may have his ABCs confused. "UNI" is of Urartuan origin, while "ani" is Persian/Arabic like in Tehr-ani, Sistani, Isfahan-i, Syrian-i.... etc, which in the Armenian language is better known as "TSI/from".

And, as to "UNTS/ANTS" ending, it is a PLURAL, like saying a person is from the family of the BAKUN-(TS)-NER, or Baban-ian-(ts)- ner.

Edited by Arpa
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I was wondering..

Here in USA there are Armenian last names that end with ian and yan.

What is a difference? How do we get our last names spelled differently and why?

It is pronounced the same, I think, yet my last name is Sarkisyan and there is a family in my building who's last name is spelled Sarkisian.

 

There are also names that end with yanc/ianc. Like Volodya Babayanc. Any information on that?

 

What do you think?

 

PS: Here is also something else I want to share. This article talks about the Armenian last names. I found it interesting.

 

In my case, it had to do with the spelling of local bureaucrat at passport station in Moscow. Hakobyan became Akopian. Russians don't have a letter H and they

spell ian instead of yan. Most Armenians who came from Russia have ian spelling and sometimes s at the end. Yerevan Armenians or from Armenia in general, on the other hand, have yan spelling.

 

 

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In my case, it had to do with the spelling of local bureaucrat at passport station in Moscow. Hakobyan became Akopian. Russians don't have a letter H and they

spell ian instead of yan. Most Armenians who came from Russia have ian spelling and sometimes s at the end. Yerevan Armenians or from Armenia in general, on the other hand, have yan spelling.

Why do they replace h with g? I've seen Ohanyan/Ohanesyan spelled Oganyan/Oganesyan (or Oganov/Oganesov).

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Why do they replace h with g? I've seen Ohanyan/Ohanesyan spelled Oganyan/Oganesyan (or Oganov/Oganesov).

Because of luck of letter H, Russians spell it with G or sometimes with X(KH). Highway-xighway, Hi-Xi, Hrach-Grach, Holland -Gollandia and so on.

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Why do they replace h with g? I've seen Ohanyan/Ohanesyan spelled Oganyan/Oganesyan (or Oganov/Oganesov).

 

Also, last names that end with ov, ev, in are Russian in nature. Russians don't change the ending of Armenian names, Armenians do...anything yan can become

ov...

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what if you have a middle name that ends in -ova ?

Like what? The middle name is a western phenomena. How many Armenians do you know that have middle name? Ova normally means ending of a female last name in Russian. Osipov-osipova, gavrilov-gavrilova, etc.

Edited by hetanos
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I think the faster a consesus is reach about this the better for us. It's a great way of staying together, at least on the surface, for Armenians. Have the exact same ending in the last name is quite rare for any nation. That would be our unique trademark. :)
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Also, last names that end with ov, ev, in are Russian in nature. Russians don't change the ending of Armenian names, Armenians do...anything yan can become

ov...

 

One little mistake. Lots of Armenians with their last name end with ov did take because they want it. I MIGHT be wrong, but weren't they forcing Armenians to change yan/ian to ov in Azerbaijan? At least, I know that all Armenians from Azerbaijan have it. It is impossible that they all changed to it with their own will.

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One little mistake. Lots of Armenians with their last name end with ov did take because they want it. I MIGHT be wrong, but weren't they forcing Armenians to change yan/ian to ov in Azerbaijan? At least, I know that all Armenians from Azerbaijan have it. It is impossible that they all changed to it with their own will.

 

 

Azeries and Georgians did force Armenians to change their names. Not all, but some did. On the other hand, Russia did not have a such policy for the most part. Armenians in Russia did it at the turn of century for various reasons, including social and economic status.

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  • 2 years later...

At the risk of being redundant, and opening old wounds let me revive a long lost topic. And in so doing maybe we can suck in some of the participant. You may hav noticzed that HyeForum is in a deep coma/մահաքուն. :o

Yes, there is no H in the Cyrillic , it is either dropped as in Akopian or it becomes G, as Hamlet becomes Gamlet and Harry /Harut becomes Garry as in Kasparov. There is/was a prominent Armenian professional in our community whose name is Agopovich (I am not sure if he is from Russia or Bulgaria, his Armenian clients called him Hagopovich or Hagopian.).

Just as in the Greek there is no H, it is often pronounced as KH. Greeks who also speak Arabic have many jokes about it, as when the Arabic word “hara”/ street turns to “khara” / human animal waste.

The proper transliteration of the traditional “ եան” ending would be “EAN”, but for whatever reason it has to become “IAN”. We have spoken about this, that “EAN” in the English would sound like “EEN” as in dean/mean etc..

As to “YAN”, it is once again an effect of Germano/Slavic where J is pronounced as Y. They write “karaJan” as in Herbert Von ** and pronounce it as “karaYan”, they write “Jugoslavia” and pronounce it as Yugoslavia. I have a German made map of the Near East-Naher Osten(Middle East), where Yerevan is labeled “Jerewan”. In Germanic J=Y and W=V. Is that why in the Russo-Slavo-Germano “IAN” becomes ”YAN/JAN”?

If we write “ParaJanov” will that be read as “ParaYanov” by russo-Slavo-Germano readers? How about Arno BabaJanian?

Remember a one time short lived FM of furkey Ali Babacan/BabaJan ? BabaYan?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_Babacan

 

** http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_von_Karajan

Note that in the above site his alleged heritage is listed as “aromanian” to mean “Armenian”.

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lol, so true :)

 

... except, my husband and I happen to have the same last name! (I was disappointed at first because I always looked forward to changing my last name to my future husband's like other women looked forward to their weddings). So, my last name has a different spelling than his and mine ends with "ian" and his ends with "yan". We always joke that we'll have to fight about how to spell our future children's last name but one day it will be a reality :o

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No need to fight over this! Just make it "yian". Problem solved. :D

Yervant, in fact you are right.

It is perhaps an unwriiten rule, that at least in the Western, it is usually "ian" except when between two vowels, where the I turns to Y, like in Papayan it becomes պապա Յան even if at times some may still insist to write it as "papa-Y-ian baba-Y-ian/բաբա-Յ-եան/ պապա-Յ-եան"

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