phantom22 Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 Romina, you hit the nail on its head. I have been told by Armenians that because I am 1/8 Assori that I am not an Armenian. These guys are going apoplectic over the supposition that Vartan Mamikonian may have had 1/36 Chinese blood. You have labelled them as to what they are. What the hell is wrong with all of you? .... You guys are just talking out of your asses. And its embarrassing because we are all Armenian here, and we should be open to ask questions and not assume the most stupid sh*t that your little mind comes up with... My parents actually went to one of the East of Byzantium fundraisers and not once did the director Roger Kupelian (who I might add, he is a great patriot, were you guys in Karabagh during the conflict, or your parents? well he did and he made a really touching story call Dark Forrest in the Mountains) Anyway he never said anything about Armenians being from chinese decent..... So i don't think he would direct an epic film with the wrong information. Come on why the hell do you think a guy like that will waste his time giving mix messages to an non Armenian audience? Also what the hell is wrong with the Chinese anyway? why are we being so racist? Why some people are so touchy? are you that insecure about our own culture? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 the issue is not the 1/36 being chinese, the issue is calling the whole race of people that are ARMENIAN a descendants of chinese people... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johannes Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 (edited) These guys are going apoplectic over the supposition that Vartan Mamikonian may have had 1/36 Chinese blood. You told well, Phantom. As I remember, previously, you were sure and conclusive about the Chinese origin of Mamicon. And, as a result of your ''scientific" conclusions, You made our people, derived from many and different races, where the Armenian, somehow, was in margin. And, we saw, your eagerness, in your historical topic's contributions, showing us, that the Armenians, are as much mixed people, as are the imperial nations, which is wrong thinking, in my opinion. It is wrong, because, as we know, the Armenians never armenised peoples, in their lands, nor organized janissary armies, to be in need, other people's boys. Edited May 6, 2008 by Johannes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 OK! EVERYONE! STOP! TAKE A DEEP BREATH! Let's go back. This thread is being derailed worse than an Amtrack train with a broken axle, or a twisted out of shape railroad track. I may not have read this thread more carefully. Will someone please remind us where Roger K (I will not spell out his furkophone surname) has inferred that Vardan was Chinese, and how he is inserting it in the "script"? How about it Ashot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 Romina, you hit the nail on its head. I have been told by Armenians that because I am 1/8 Assori that I am not an Armenian. These guys are going apoplectic over the supposition that Vartan Mamikonian may have had 1/36 Chinese blood. You have labelled them as to what they are. phantom aka nostradamus, koja, and 1/8 asshole, we know you were there when the Christ was betrayed, we also know that Alexander the Great was your soldier, and Hitler was your uncle, but you got no prove that Vardan Makikonyan was Chinese. That's a fact you can deny it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 the issue is not the 1/36 being chinese, the issue is calling the whole race of people that are ARMENIAN a descendants of chinese people... no bro, Mamikonyans were Armenian and that creature called phantom plays with words. First he says Vardan is Chinese, then he says he's only 1/36 Chines-and you push him enough, he'll contine to play with words -but will never be able to back up his claim with facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zartonk Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 It isn't even about the movie. It wouldn't matter to me a single bit if they were Chinese. In fact, I wouldn't bother me if we are a Sino-Africans mix, as I don't believe in a such a concept as pure anything. Just make sure before labeling other people 'nationalist' and 'racist' that it isn't mere facts they are after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 I have a question for Ashot, what is your involvement with East of Byzantium, are you a director to? or what do you contribute to the project? Best Regards T Welcome to Hyeforum Tigranik. I know Ashot in person, and I can assure you he cares for the Armenians-and he has proven it with his work. Day after day, week after week, he spends sleepless night working on projects. I can assure you, if he was involved with East of Byzantum project, he would have done his best...! Romina, welcome to Hyeforum dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyethga Posted May 6, 2008 Report Share Posted May 6, 2008 OK! EVERYONE! STOP! TAKE A DEEP BREATH! Let's go back. This thread is being derailed worse than an Amtrack train with a broken axle, or a twisted out of shape railroad track. I may not have read this thread more carefully. Will someone please remind us where Roger K (I will not spell out his furkophone surname) has inferred that Vardan was Chinese, and how he is inserting it in the "script"? How about it Ashot? If you watch the trailer, at the very end you see the statue of a clearly Chinese-looking statue collapsing, apparently this signifying that the alleged descendants of Mamikonian were fleeing their lands and taking up residence in Persia or Armenia. I'm quite certain that this is the crappy plot that is going to be inserted into the movie. Alot of other people are pissed because they think this is simply a film that is going to generate anti-Iranian hatred like 300 (which is, in any case, total BS). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 I have never stated that Vartan Mamikonian was Chinese, as I know that one of his newly arrived ancestors had married the daughter of the Armenian Archbishop. That was a few generations before Vartan. I will try to find Vartan's genealogical chart on the Internet and post it in this thread. no bro, Mamikonyans were Armenian and that creature called phantom plays with words. First he says Vardan is Chinese, then he says he's only 1/36 Chines-and you push him enough, he'll contine to play with words -but will never be able to back up his claim with facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 Yes, Armenians never Armenized people. Yet when a nation is a tolerant one assimilation naturally occurs. The Poles never Polishized the Armenians in Lvov, yet a majority of the the Armenians living there assimilated and lost their Armenian identity. You told well, Phantom. As I remember, previously, you were sure and conclusive about the Chinese origin of Mamicon. And, as a result of your ''scientific" conclusions, You made our people, derived from many and different races, where the Armenian, somehow, was in margin. And, we saw, your eagerness, in your historical topic's contributions, showing us, that the Armenians, are as much mixed people, as are the imperial nations, which is wrong thinking, in my opinion. It is wrong, because, as we know, the Armenians never armenised peoples, in their lands, nor organized janissary armies, to be in need, other people's boys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 7, 2008 Report Share Posted May 7, 2008 I have never stated that Vartan Mamikonian was Chinese, as I know that one of his newly arrived ancestors had married the daughter of the Armenian Archbishop. That was a few generations before Vartan. I will try to find Vartan's genealogical chart on the Internet and post it in this thread. lol now that I have asked about Vardan's grandfather, you speak of a daughter marrying an Archbishiop. that's a progress 1. DON'T CHANGE THE SUBJECT 2. STOP PLAYING WITH WORDS I WANT YOU TO QUOTE THE SOURCE WHERE YOU GOT THAT INFORMATION FROM!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigranik Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Hey guys I was doing some research on you tube and this clip just came out, it looks great! and on their newsletter they inform that a new group of clips and previews are coming out soon, also I don't see anything Chinese on Vartan, he actually looks pretty Armenian to me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 http://fabpedigree.com/s018/f085038.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 ARMENIA - Mamikonid Princes ARTAVAZD I, Prince of the Mamikonids in 314 VACHE I VACHE I, Prince of the Mamikonids, d ca 339 ARTAVAZD II ARTAVAZD II, Prince of the Mamikonids (ca 339-50) VARDAN I, Prince of the Mamikonids (ca 350-65) SANDUKHT, m St. NERSES I, Katholicos of Armenia (see under Armenia, Hereditary Bishops, for descendants) ARTASHIN MANUEL I MANUEL I, Prince of the Mamikonids (374/8-386) and Regent of Armenia (378-86) Hmayak, d 386 Vardandukht, m Arsaces III, King of Armenia (379-84) & of Western Armenia (384-90) ARTASHIR (ARTAVAZD III) ARTASHIR, Prince of the Mamikonids (386-7) HAMASASP I HAMAZASP I, Prince of the Mamikonids (387-432), m SAHAKANOYSH, the Gregorid heiress, dau of St. ISAAC (see under Armenia, Hereditary Bishops, for ancestors) HAMAZASPIAN St. Vardan II, Prince of the Mamikonids (432-51 when killed at Battle of Avarayr) St. Susan, d 474, m Vasgen I, Vitaxa of Gogarene Vardanoysh, m Arshavir II, Prince of Kamsarakan Magnus I, Prince of the Mamikonids (451-71) St. Hmaycak, d 451, m Dzoyk, dau of Vram Artsruni Vahan I “the Great”, Prince of the Mamikonids (471-505), Viceroy of Armenia (485-505) HAMAZASPIAN MAMIKONIAN, also killed at Battle of Avarayr 451 HMAYCEK HMAYCEK MAMIKONIAN, Mamikonid Prince in Armenia, a Persian vassal MUSHEL Gregory, alive 555 MUSHEL MAMIKONIAN, Mamikonid Prince, alive in 555, a Roman vassal DAVID DAVID MAMIKONIAN, Mamikonid Prince, alive ca 600, a Persian vassal HAMAZASP II Gregory, Prince of Armenia (662-84/5), m Helen, dau of Varaz Grigor I, Prince of Gardman HAMAZASP II MAMIKONIAN, Prince of the Mamikonids (ca 638-61), heir of the Gregorid domain, Governor (Ostikan) of Armenia (655-8) under the Arab Governor of Syria, m dau of THEODOR, Prince of Rushtuni Mushel III HRAHAT HRAHAT, a Mamikonid Prince under Arab suzerainty Gregory I, Prince of the Mamikonids (ca 748-50) DAVID DAVID, a Mamikonid Prince, d 744 SAMUEL SAMUEL, Prince of the Mamikonids, heir of the Gregorid domain, killed at Battle of Bagravandène 772 HMAYEAK DAU, a Mamikonid Princess, m SMBAT VI, Prince of the Bagratids (see under Armenia, Bagratid dynasty for descendants) HMAYEAK, Prince of the Mamikonids, m ANNA, dau of LEO V, Emperor of the East (813-20) KONSTANTINOS (see under Byzantium, Amorian dynasty, for descendants) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 (edited) chgitem khndam te lats linem es martu vra! Hagarak, why you are so desperately trying to glue your identity to others? Jews, Chinese, Mongol, turk, persian, arab, maybe jibudi also?? what else? I agree we have some of it it our blood but what does make one an Armenian? contents of the blood or the spirit in which one lives by? what is the point of this conversation, i just don't get it Edited May 8, 2008 by Edward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 What makes an Armenian is what I am. To have been raised in an odar world yet speak Armenian and be involved in Armenian Causes. To send money to Armenia even when you do not approve of the way ordinary Armenians there are being treated. To read, read, read about our history. To have married an Armenian as I did. You are what your culture is. I am not trying to glue my identity to others. I am seeking scholastic truth. chgitem khndam te lats linem es martu vra! Hagarak, why you are so desperately trying to glue your identity to others? Jews, Chinese, Mongol, turk, persian, arab, maybe jibudi also?? what else? I agree we have some of it it our blood but what does make one an Armenian? contents of the blood or the spirit in which one lives by? what is the point of this conversation, i just don't get it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantom22 Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 http://www.angelfire.com/ego/et_deo/mamikonids.wps.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 (edited) http://www.angelfire.com/ego/et_deo/mamikonids.wps.htm IDIOT! Is this the source you get your info from? Does it prove anything? Who put that crap in the internet? Edited May 8, 2008 by Aratta-Kingdom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ordaco Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 (edited) Hello everyone, I found this forum through a friend of mine, and I was really happy to find so much info, but the topic that really caught my eye, was the East of Byzantium project, and us much as the conversation has gone out of proportion, I found it healthy that we can converse with one another. What ever your believes are, I think Respect should be in top of the list, so I hope I don't get called an idiot or stupid just because my beliefs are different, I mean, since when Armenians judge their own brothers....? Anyhow I just saw the "Teaser" preview and I'm hungry! I want to see more I think we should try to continue to talk about the movie Best Regards Edited May 8, 2008 by Ordaco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aratta-Kingdom Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Welcome to HyeForum Ordaco. If you are Phantom using one of his many names-then you know what is expecting you. If not, i would say spend a time in the forum for some time, find out who is who here -and who does what before you give advice to anyone. cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ordaco Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 (edited) Dear Aratta, I'm not Phantom, just a fellow countrymen trying send a chill pill to everyone, I apologize if I sounded preachy, Just seems that you guys know more about the progress of this film that anyone else, actually I'm intrigue about Ashot's work on the movie, can you tell us more please, also, are you sure he want to reveal the presence of China in movie ? Thanks Guys ps: I'm here to stay my friends, so know me as one committed fellow to the Armenian cause Edited May 8, 2008 by Ordaco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Ordaco, welcome to the forum... Please do go back couple of pages and you will see the presence explain by Zartonk! Thank you for your interests, and hope you will fill much welcomed!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ordaco Posted May 8, 2008 Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 Dear Ashot, thanks for the reply, I actually read the past pages, and I could only see that you were involved making the script of the film, that's so cool, what other stuff have you done I will love to se them and support them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashot Posted May 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2008 ummmm... who said I have been working on the script... I said I will be helping out to get the people to do the script, only if we come to agreements... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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