Armenian Genocide Bill 2007

[gamavor]

It is all very bad orchestrated play. I'm really disappointed. The Bush people in Turkey could have done better job. Ironically the once, waiving the red (turkish) flags on the streets of Turkey are the Turkish leftists complaining about Imperialist America. Boy, the Republican Party budget must have been in dire straits. To sink that low - to call the leftists for help?

 

Another funny thing is the reaction of the State Department. Every time there is an expected demonstration in front of any of the US embassies, the State Department issues warnings. No warning this time? Why? The life of American citizens in Turkey is not in danger?

 

 

[Arpa]

Who said Turkey is immune to foot and mouth disease?

Let the Turkey Shoot season open

=====

TURKEY TO SHOOT ITSELF IN THE FOOT

 

Today's Zaman, Turkey

Oct 15 2007

 

The Turkish decision to give the green light to a cross-border

operation as well as possible retaliation to an Armenian genocide

resolution adopted last week by the US House Committee on Foreign

Relations will in the long term affect Turkey's political and economic

reforms, isolating itself from the world, stated both Turkish and

Western analysts.

 

US Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs Dan Fried and

US Undersecretary of Defense for Policy Eric Edelman flew on Saturday

to Ankara from Moscow, where they had accompanied Rice.

 

The current image that Turkey has been portraying -- from the media

to the government and the military -- has been the one that does not

reflect the common sense that needs to prevail if Ankara does not

want to allow itself to be isolated from the world, said a Turkish

military analyst.

 

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoðan said last Friday that he is

prepared for a rupture in relations with the United States if his

government launches an incursion into northern Iraq in search of

outlawed Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK) terrorists.

 

"If such an option is chosen, whatever its price, it will be paid.

 

There could be pros and cons of such a decision, but what is important

is our country's interests," he said. Erdoðan is expected to seek

approval from Parliament most likely on Tuesday to launch attacks

against the PKK in Iraq.

 

Similarly, Turkey reacted both sharply and emotionally to the passage

of a resolution by the US House Committee on Foreign Relations on

Oct. 10 that labeled World War I events in Ottoman territory as "the

genocide of the Armenians." Nancy Pelosi, speaker of the US House of

Representatives, indicated last week that she plans to forward the

resolution to the House floor early in November.

 

A Turkish decision to step up the fight against the PKK including a

cross-border operation came a day before the US committee's adoption

of the resolution. The move came following the killing of 13 Turkish

soldiers in the Southeast near the Iraqi border. All the two incidents,

coming one after another, have added fuel to the already existing

Turkish frustration over the unresolved PKK terror as well as the

Armenian genocide allegations that have haunted Turkey for around

90 years.

 

'Shot in the foot'

 

Chief of General Staff Gen. Yaþar Buyukanýt told Milliyet daily

yesterday, in reference to the Armenian resolution, that the US has

shot itself in the foot.

 

"If the resolution is adopted by the US House of Representatives,

this will cause damage to Turkish-US military relations that cannot

be repaired," Buyukanýt warned in his statement published by Milliyet.

 

The adoption of the resolution and the possible Turkish operation

into northern Iraq came at a time when military-to-military ties

between the two NATO allies have seen considerable improvement since

the Turkish Parliament's rejection of a motion on March 1, 2003 to

allow the US military to use Turkish territory for its 2003 invasion

of Iraq. This has strained Turkish-US military ties.

 

Western military analysts agreed with Buyukanýt that adoption of the

resolution will cause irreparable damage to Turkish-US military ties.

 

But they also cautioned Ankara against the long-term negative effects

it can suffer as a result of possible severe retaliation such as

the cutting of US access to the Ýncirlik military base and staging

a cross-border operation that may result in things getting out of

control in the region.

 

"We are also afraid that Turkey may end up shooting itself in the

foot in the long term," said one Western military analyst.

 

In the meantime, remarks made by both Erdoðan and Buyukanýt over

the Armenian resolution have also attempted to deter the House of

Representatives from adopting the so called genocide resolution,

said a senior Turkish government official.

 

Long-term repercussions on Turkey

 

A Financial Times report last Friday that crude oil prices surged to

a fresh high of $84 a barrel on concerns that Turkey might soon launch

an invasion of northern Iraq in an attempt to hit PKK terrorists sends

a message that Turkey may start feeling the heat economically as well.

"Turkey will lose a lot of friends in Europe if oil prices continue

going up because of Ankara's latest policies," said another military

analyst.

Just as Turkey started doing well in both economic and democratic

reforms, the reforms have regressed with its policy of fueling already

existing nationalist sentiments in the country, said the same analyst.

 

Civilian, military competition

 

In both events -- the Turkish decision to give the green light to

a cross-border operation and the strong statements made by Turkish

decision makers over possible retaliatory measures against the US --

the competition between the Turkish Armed Forces-led bureaucracy and

the political power has emerged.

 

"This is a tragic situation for Turkey that we are witnessing a

competition between the military and the political leadership in

creating a war-like situation in the country," said a Western diplomat.

 

The Turkish government earlier resisted calls by the Turkish military

to send troops into northern Iraq to crack down on PKK terrorists,

stating that the PKK issue should first be resolved inside Turkey.

 

The deaths of 13 soldiers in one incident coupled with increased

PKK violence as well as the adoption of the genocide resolution

have played into the hands of the Turkish hard-liners, provoking

the political leadership to take a tougher stance on both events,

said a Western military analyst.

 

'The US can do without Turkey, but Turkey will lose a close friend'

 

Among possible Turkish measures against the adoption of the so-called

genocide resolution is the ending or limiting of US access to Ýncirlik

Airbase in southern Turkey, through which almost 60 percent of US

air cargo destined for Iraq passes. This will be a move complicating

US combat operations in Iraq. Such a move is expected to seriously

damage Turkish-US ties as well.

 

But many Western military analysts recalled that the US immediately

shifted its war preparation efforts to other parts of the region when

the Turkish Parliament rejected a motion allowing US troops to use

more Turkish territory for their invasion of Iraq in 2003.

 

Similarly, if Turkey introduces retaliatory measures such as ending

US access to Ýncirlik, the US will find another way, said a Western

diplomat, adding, however, that in the long term, it will be Turkey

that will suffer.

 

"Turkey will lose a close ally, i.e., the US. And the US public will

also question Turkish reliability in the relationship," stated the

same diplomat.

 

The US administration, which has fought against the adoption of

the Armenian resolution, has been urging Turkey not to punish the

administration and the US public.

 

US Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs Dan Fried and

US Undersecretary of Defense for Policy Eric Edelman both flew from

Moscow, where they had accompanied Rice, to Ankara last Saturday in

an unexpected visit. They relayed a message to Ankara: Washington

has done its best to stop the Armenian resolution, so do not punish it.

 

Senior US officials also urged that Ankara practice restraint and

not overreact to both events.

 

--Boundary_(ID_L0242uQviQpUd7V82EnrzA)--

 

 

[MosJan]

Bush Adamant In Opposing Armenian Genocide Resolution

 

AP, AFP

 

U.S. President George W. Bush has no plan to intervene with the top House of Representatives lawmaker to urge her not to bring to a vote a planned resolution to declare World-War I-era mass killings of Armenians a genocide, a spokesman said Monday.

 

The Bush administration has been lobbying intensely to persuade lawmakers to reject the resolution, which Bush believes would harm relations with Turkey. Turkey has said as much, promising that the document's passage by the full House would cause severe damage to relations.

 

"There should be no question of the president's views on this issue and the damage that this resolution could do to U.S. foreign policy interests," White House deputy press secretary Tony Fratto told reporters Monday aboard Air Force One.

 

Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who as the top Democrat in the House controls its agenda, has said she will schedule a vote soon on the resolution, which was approved last week by the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

 

Fratto said the White House does not want Pelosi to bring it to the floor; should it come to a vote, he said, "We will strongly encourage members not to support it."

 

Pelosi and other top U.S. Democrats Sunday brushed off Turkish fury and vowed to press ahead with a bill condemning the mass killing of Armenians decades ago as "genocide," to right past wrongs. Pelosi said possible reprisals affecting Turkey's cooperation with the US military were "hypothetical" and would not derail the resolution. Holding a vote on condemning the massacre, even many years after the fact, is "about who we are as a country," Pelosi told ABC television.

 

"Genocide still exists, and we saw it in Rwanda; we see it now in Darfur," she said on ABC television after the House foreign affairs committee last week branded the Ottoman Empire's World War I massacre of Armenians a genocide.

 

But the White House warned Sunday that the bill could bring "grave harm" to the already strained relations between Washington and Ankara. "We regret that the Speaker Pelosi is intent on bringing this resolution for a vote despite the strong concerns expressed by foreign policy and defense experts, including a bipartisan group of former secretaries of state, and our Turkish allies," Fratto said at Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas.

 

The bill is likely to come up in the full House in November. Although the resolution is only symbolic, Turkey recalled its ambassador to Washington last week and has called off visits to the United States by at least two of its officials.

 

The angry reaction has fueled fears within the US administration that it could lose access to a military base in NATO ally Turkey that provides a crucial staging ground for US supplies headed to Iraq and Afghanistan. Two top US officials, one each from the state and defense departments, are now in Turkey to try to cool the diplomatic row. "We are certainly working to try to minimize any concrete steps the government might take (such as) restricting the movement of our troops," US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said Saturday in Moscow.

 

Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates lobbied hard against the genocide resolution, and the administration says it will keep up its effort to forestall a vote in the full House of Representatives.

 

US-Turkish military ties "will never be the same again" if the House confirms the committee vote, Turkey's military chief General Yasar Buyukanit told the daily Milliyet on Sunday.

 

House Democratic leader Steny Hoyer said that he had repeatedly raised the Armenia killings with Turkish political and military leaders during his 26 years in Congress. "Never once in that quarter of a century has anybody on the Turkish government said this is the right time. In other words, there would never be a right time," he said on Fox News Sunday. "If we forget what has happened... then we are at risk of letting it happen again."

 

House Republican leader John Boehner said there was no doubt that the Armenian people's suffering in the dying days of the Ottoman Empire was "extreme." "But what happened 90 years ago ought to be a subject for historians to sort out, not politicians here in Washington," he said.

 

"And I think bringing this bill to the floor may be the most irresponsible thing I've seen this new Congress do this year," Boehner said, calling Turkey "a very important ally in our war against the terrorists."

 

Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell said there was "no question" that Armenians had been slaughtered en masse. "But I don't think the Congress passing this resolution is a good idea at any point. But particularly not a good idea when Turkey is cooperating with us in many ways, which ensures greater safety for our soldiers," he said.

 

Opponents of the measure fear Turkey may be a less cooperative partner in the war on terror and is more likely to plow ahead with a possible military incursion against Kurdish rebel bases across its border into Iraq, dismissing calls from both the European Union and the United States for dialogue. A government bill seeking the go-ahead to launch an incursion any time in the next year is expected to be submitted to parliament after a cabinet meeting in Ankara Monday.

 

http://www.armenialiberty.org/armeniarepor...E7C956DAADA.ASP

[MosJan]

Kurdish rebel - i say we start using a Kurdish freedom Fighter - instead of rebel and turkish terror instead of turkish military incursion

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

 

 

 

U.S. House resolution on Armenian genocide an "historical" mistake?

 

 

 

 

MOSCOW.

RIA Novosti

 

Maria Appakova

 

 

This week the Turkish parliament will have to decide whether or not its government should approve a cross-border military operation to chase separatist Kurdish rebels who operate from bases in northern Iraq. The Turkish parliament will most likely vote in favor of the operation. The decision will be made at a time when Turkey's relations with the United States are worsening. On October 10, the House Committee on Foreign Affairs passed a measure calling the massacre of Armenians in World War I by Ottoman Turks genocide by a 27-21 margin.

 

This measure will prevent Washington, at least in the short term, from stopping Ankara's attempt to unleash one more conflict in the Middle East.

 

Discussions of Turkey's military operation in Iraq and the vote in U.S. Congress on the Armenian genocide coincided in time, but it could just be a coincidence. The two issues have been on the respective agendas for a long time, and the decisions were long due.

 

Turkey's parliament is ready to act because the military arm of the Kurdistan Workers Party attacked the Turkish military again, killing 13.

 

The Justice and Development Party, which won the summer elections in Turkey, cannot disappoint its voters by leaving the matter unattended. This would play into the hands of its political rivals, primarily the military, who were against selecting the country's president from among members of the party.

 

The current Turkish leadership should avoid quarrelling with the military, especially because it intends to carry out political reforms in the country.

 

Likewise, the approval of the measure on Armenian genocide in the U.S was a political decision made before the upcoming elections. The Democrats, who initiated the measure, needed a bold political move, as well as the support of the numerous and influential Armenian diaspora.

 

Although it is true that Armenians were massacred in 1915, we must admit that current decisions on the genocide and infringements on the rights of nations were made exclusively for political reasons. The issues of human rights and freedom of religion have become win-win topics.

 

All countries are doing this, but Washington is the loudest advocate of political morals and human rights. Unfortunately, its actions do not always support its words, as exemplified by disputes over the Armenian genocide resolution.

 

President George W. Bush said several hours before the voting: "Its passage would do great harm to our relations with a key ally in NATO and in the global war on terror." He said that Turkey is a moderately Muslim country and a NATO member crucial for the transit of U.S. shipments to Iraq and Afghanistan.

 

Did he mean that his administration would not protest against such a resolution if it were passed about a non-moderate Islamic country that is not an ally-and especially not a strategic ally-of the United States?

 

Bush has said more than once that genocide is a subject for historians, not lawmakers. But what about Serbia, Iraq and Sudan, where the issue was-and still is, in the case of Sudan-not yet decided by historians?

 

His press service has expressed surprise that lawmakers concern themselves with history when there are so many current acute problems awaiting solution. This brings to mind what House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, the first woman to serve as Speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives, has said on the issue of Armenian genocide.

 

Pelosi told reporters at her weekly news conference that congressional resolutions on Armenian genocide have been put off, with various justifications, over the past 20 years.

 

There is never a good time to acknowledge that genocide has taken place, Pelosi added, whether in the distant past or the present.

 

Turkey is vital for U.S. strategic interests in the Middle East and the Black Sea region. Therefore it is believed that the House's resolution has harmed U.S. foreign policy interests.

 

The planned Turkish operation in Iraq is not the most harmful aspect of the situation, but rather Turkey's possible refusal to allow American military planes to fly in its air space and use the Turkish air force base. Overall, the honest decision made by the U.S. House may curtail bilateral military relations.

 

The United States and Turkey will not sever relations, of course, but the resolution may prevent Washington from convincing Turkey to abandon its plans of a cross-border military operation in Iraq.

 

Yet the resolution is not the only stumbling block in bilateral relations. Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has said that Ankara does not need anyone to tell it what to do in Iraq, because the United States did not ask anyone's advice when it deployed its troops there in 2003.

 

The Turkish government has asked parliament for a 12-month permit to launch a military operation in Iraq. This means that it can send its troops to Iraq any time within a year, or not at all, using the permit to put pressure on Washington, Baghdad and leaders of Iraqi Kurdistan.

 

Also, in late September Turkey and Iraq signed an agreement on cooperation in the war on terror and agreed to remove from its text the clause about the "right of hot pursuit." If Ankara wants to maintain good relations with Baghdad, it should give Iraq a chance to fulfill the agreement before taking such drastic decisions.

 

 

 

 

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

 

American Thinker

October 15, 2007

Armenian Genocide Resolution Moving Forward

Rick Moran

 

 

If you're like many of us, you probably have mixed feelings about the resolution passed the by the House Foreign Affairs Commitee denoting the systematic killing of 1.5 million Christians, most of them of Armenian descent, by Turkey in 1915 as genocide.

 

It is a classic case of Real Politik versus a moral imperative. Turkey is absolutely insistent that any such acknowledgement of genocide by the House will bring down swift retribution in the form of reduced military cooperation with the United States - something that could have very serious consequences for our efforts in Iraq.

 

On the other hand, history demands that we, as a civillized people, bear witness to the crime against humanity perpetrated by the Turks when, for a variety of reasons including economic and religious, they set about the task of starving, massacring, and driving from their homes millions of Armenians.

 

Does national security trump all other considerations in this case? Speaker Nancy Pelosi doesn't think so:

 

 

The speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives insisted Sunday that she would bring to the full chamber a resolution condemning the killings of Armenians nearly a century ago as genocide, even as a Turkish general warned that this could lastingly damage a military relationship crucial to American forces in Iraq.

 

A House committee Wednesday passed a nonbinding resolution declaring the killings, which began in 1915 in the waning days of the Ottoman Empire, to be genocide, and the speaker, Representative Nancy Pelosi, said Sunday that "I've said if it passed the committee that we would bring it to the floor."

 

But in Ankara, the Turkish military chief, General Yasar Buyukanit, said that if the full House passed the resolution, "our military relations with the United States can never be the same," Reuters reported. "The U.S. shot its own foot," he told the Milliyet newspaper.

 

Buyukanit's comment came two days after Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan cautioned that bilateral relations with the United States, a key partner in NATO, were endangered. To underscore the point, Turkey has recalled its ambassador from Washington for consultations.

The Turks have a wide range of options open to them as far as retaliation is concerned, from mild to catastrophic. One interesting note is that Turkey is one of America's biggest arms customers which includes spare parts. This opens the question of how much do the Turks wish to damage their own interests when punishing the US for the House vote.

 

Most experts agree that the Turks will almost certainly curtail or even cut off our ability to resupply our forces in Iraq through Turkey. This would be more than an inconvenience for our military who would then be forced to bring even more supplies overland through Kuwait - a long and dangerous journey that is already stretched to the limit as far as logistics is concerned.

 

Turkey has also been a steadfast ally in the War on Terror. Reduced cooperation in that theater would also hit hard our capability to fight al-Qaeda.

 

The Turks continue to deny their "relocation" of Armenians and other Christians during World War I was anything except an unforseeable tragedy. This flies in the face of mountains of evidence including the deliberate confiscation of Armenian property and the denial of food deliveries to the refugees which caused mass starvation. There are also numerous eye witness accounts of the massacre of more tens of thousands both by Turkish troops and the so-called "Special Organization" who were designated as "escorts" for the refugees after they had been forcibly kicked out of their homes.

 

The Armenians were rounded up and marched out into the desert where unspeakable atrocities were committed against them. Most simply died of thirst or starvation. Others were brutally murdered by roving gangs of criminals while members of the "Special Organization" stood by and watched, sometimes actively participating in the killings themselves.

 

Those who survived the trek across the desert were brought to detention camps. There were contemporary and historical reports that many of the women and children were burned to death at these camps with others being poisoned and even drowned.

 

The question of whether the death of 1.5 million Armenians was genocide or not shouldn't be the issue. It was. The question should be is the House vote really necessary in light of the consequences that will fall upon our military in Iraq?

 

Is there a right or wrong answer? We are at war and there is a compelling argument to be made that we don't have the "luxury" of taking such a moral stand. The countervailing argument, that the vote is long overdue as is recognition of the Turkish government's culpability in crimes against humanity also strikes a chord in our conscience.

 

A cynic might point out that getting Turkey riled at us enough to cut off access to our troops plays right into the hands of the anti-war crowd. But I have enough faith left in most politicians that they will vote based on the issues I outlined above rather than some end run around our war policy.

 

Whether a vote of conscience or convenience, there will be a vote. And how it turns out will say something important about this country.

 

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2007/1...solution_m.html

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

People Died And The Bush Administration Lied

 

 

 

October 15th, 2007

 

by The Stiletto

 

 

 

 

 

More than 60 years ago, Polish-Jewish scholar Ralph Lemkin coined the term "genocide" precisely to describe the scale and brutality of the systematic slaughter of 1.5 million Christian Armenians by the Ottoman Turks.

 

The assertions Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates made arguing against Congress passing HR 106/SR 106, which calls on our government to recognize the historical truth of the Armenian Genocide, are outright lies: That loss of access to Turkish land and air supply routes will imperil coalition forces in Iraq, and that that Turkey is an indispensable ally. Unfortunately, these lies were enough to sway one co-sponsor of the bill, Jane Harman (D-CA), to withdraw her support.

 

The truth: Turkey is irresolute as an Iraq War ally and irrelevant as a NATO ally.

 

If Turkey makes good on its threats to deny the U.S. access to Incirlik Air Base – through which 70 percent of military cargo sent to Iraq is flown – and closes the Turkish-Iraq border to trucks that deliver 30 percent of the fuel used by the U.S. military, there is a Plan B. "Turkey has been a tremendous hub for us, and if we didn't have it that would increase time lines and distances. But it would be a short-term impact," a senior military officer involved in logistical planning and operations tells The New York Times. Armored vehicles and other equipment flown to Iraq over Turkish airspace can also be rerouted, if necessary.

 

The day the Berlin Wall fell was the day Turkey ceased to matter as a NATO member. Here, highlights of a "Note to the Turkish government" Hugh Fitzgerald posted on Dhimmi Watch that are germane to the focus of this post:

 

The Cold War, or at least the First Cold War, is over. It is no longer 1950, or 1960. There is no longer a need for Turkey's help in confronting Russia, which, while it has reverted to unpleasantness and despotism, is not the menace it once was. And Turkey is not quite so important a place for listening-posts and other bases. …

 

Turkey has not fulfilled, as it seems to think, its duties to its American "ally." It did not permit the use of Incirlik airbase. Three rather than four divisions, therefore, had to take over Iraq. There was no invasion force from the north that might have made a difference in Anbar. …

 

Turkey is a member of NATO. The Turks apparently think they will remain in NATO no matter how outrageously they behave. But why should NATO continue to tolerate an Islamic country? What conceivable good can come of having privy to NATO circles a government like that now in power in Istanbul, given that the great threat to the other countries of NATO, and to the Western alliance, comes now from the forces of Jihad? …

 

It may be that Bush thinks that the large-scale murders of Christian Armenians by Muslim Turks began in 1915, when it began twenty years before, with no "wartime conditions" to blame

… [Emphasis, The Stiletto's.]

 

[T]he E.U. does not need Turkey, does not want Turkey. … NATO, and the Americans, do not need Turkey, a recalcitrant Turkey, a difficult Turkey, a Turkey that makes demands for the rewriting or the ignoring of history. … [T]he Turkish army will not be ordered to collaborate with Infidels against other Muslims - and it will not be, not by the current government - then what good is Turkey to NATO?

 

Fitzgerald's piece also details what a back-stabbing "friend" Turkey has been to the U.S. and punctures Turkey's denialist claims, parroted by our government – as well as by John Fund and Turkey's other shills at The Wall Street Journal.

 

Here's what's really going on: Turkey is using HR 106 as a pretext to carry out its long-planned excursion into Northern Iraq to kill as many Kurds as possible – along with any ambitions they might have of joining their brethren on the Turkish side of the border to form an independent country. The real prize is the potentially huge untapped oil reserves now under the control of the Kurdish Regional Government.

 

The "insult" of passing the Armenian Genocide Resolution gives Turkey the cover it needs to further it's geopolitical interests and to undermine the U.S. mission in Iraq once again – just as a "neutral" Turkey undermined the Allies in WWII by secretly supplying Hitler with chromite. (Another historical truth that Shimon Peres and Abe Foxman must deny along with the Armenian Genocide so that Israel can maintain its "friendship" with Turkey.)

 

Conservatives who argue that the Armenian Genocide happened, but it's "inconvenient" to say so right now, should know better than anyone that doing the right thing is never "convenient." It's convenient to steal a car, not to save up money to buy one; to rape a woman a man is sexually attracted to, not to woo and marry her; and to abort a baby, not to feed, clothe and raise him. But in each of these cases – as with passing the Armenian Genocide Resolution - the convenient thing is not the right thing.

 

On "Fox News Sunday," Steny Hoyer (D-MD) told Brit Hume that he supported the U.S. government's official recognition of the Armenian Genocide for 25 years – and that there never seemed to be "a right time" as far as the Turks were concerned:

 

Hume:

… Just on the strength of the committee action, the Turks recalled their ambassador, which is a — you know, it's more than a mild form of protest about this. If it's that sensitive at this moment, why do it now?

 

Hoyer:

OK, Brit. That's a good question. I've been in the Congress 26 years. I've been for this resolution for 25 years. I've talked to the Turkish ambassadors, Turkish government, Turkish parliamentarians, over a quarter of a century. Never once in that quarter of a century has anybody in the Turkish government said to me, "OK, this is the right time." In other words, there would be no right time. …

 

Hume:

I mean, do you think it's an urgent issue, something that happened between Turks and Armenians in World War I?

 

Hoyer:

Brit, do I think it's an urgent issue? I think the issue of genocide is a very urgent and present issue. It's happening in Darfur now. It happened in Bosnia not too long ago. And the world sat by and watched. Yes, I think it's an urgent issue.

 

Hume:

Well, but nobody's arguing that it wasn't a mass killing or even a massacre.

 

Hoyer:

No, it was a genocide. And I understand some people are arguing that well, let historians look at it. Historians have looked at it. Nobel writers have looked at it. And there is a conclusion that, in fact, this was a conscious effort to eliminate a race of people.

 

Hume:

… [D]o you think it's worth making this expression of this at this time, all these years later, at the expense of souring relations with a country who has helped us, is vital in the Mideast and in Iraq in particular?

 

Hoyer:

Well, I think Turkey's help to us is vital. More vital is the United States' help to Turkey, Brit.

Over the last half a century, the relationship between the United States and Turkey has far more advantage to Turkey than it has the United States.

Are we both advantageous to one another? We are. [Emphasis, The Stiletto's.]

 

It's an added irony that some of the very same conservatives who decry the harassment of Christians in this country by the ACLU, the killings of Christians in Muslim countries and in communist China and the twin threats of Sharia-creep and Islamofascism are siding with Turkey against Armenians, who were victims of the first Muslim jihad against Christians in modern times.

 

As with the furor over the Danish cartoons and the flying Imams, Turkey's hysterical reaction to a historical fact is yet another case of manufactured Muslim outrage.

 

 

Unlike some Christians who advocate worshipping Allah, HR 106/SR gives Christians a way to express

our outrage over the centureis of dhimmitude that continue to this day in Turkey and throughout the

Middle East; to express our outrage over the Ottoman Turks not only annihilating the Armenians but

replicating their murderous MO to drive out and slaughter Christians in the Assyrian and Greek

communities; and to express our ourtrage that the price two-timing Turkey is extracting for its toxic

friendship is that Americans dirty our hands with the blood of Christian martyrs, instead of cleansing

our sould by belatedly joining the 22 other civlized nations worldwide that have acknowledged the

Armenian Genocide.

Edited October 16, 2007 by Aratta-Kingdom

[Aratta-Kingdom]

AZG

 

 

 

TIME TO RECOGNIZE THE ARMENIAN GENOCIDE

 

The Armenian ambassador to Britain on why he believes, nearly a century on, Turkey should admit to a genocide

 

Throughout the twentieth century to the present day there has not been any substantiated doubt about the character of the mass deportations, expropriation, abduction, torture, starvation and killings of millions of Armenians throughout Ottoman Turkey that started on a large scale in 1915 and carried onto 1923.

 

Centrally planned by the government of the day and meticulously executed by the huge machine of the state bureaucracy, army, police, hired gangs and - specially released for that purpose - criminals from prisons, the campaign had one clear aim expressly stated by the government in secret directives: to rid Anatolia of its indigenous Armenian population and settle the so – called ‘Armenian question’ for good.

 

An entire nation and its Christian culture were eliminated to secure a homogenous Turkish state on territories where Armenians had lived for many centuries.

 

Terms such as "genocide" or "ethnic cleansing" were not in circulation then, so Winston Churchill later referred to the 1915 massacre of 1.5 million Armenians as an "administrative holocaust".

 

The Turkish authorities made no secret of the aim once it was achieved and other governments and nations have known the truth since. One of the early accounts of Armenian Genocide was published in 1916 in Britain.

 

The British Government at the time commissioned James Bryce and Arnold Toynbee to compile evidence on the events in Armenia. The subsequent report was printed in the British Parliamentary Blue Book series "The Treatment of Armenians in the Ottoman Empire, 1915-1916". The report leaves no doubt about what was taking place.

 

In 1915, thirty-three years before UN Genocide Convention was adopted, the Armenian Genocide was condemned by the international community as a crime against humanity. It is well acknowledged that Polish jurist Raphael Lemkin, when he coined the term genocide in 1944, cited the Turkish extermination of the Armenians and the Nazi extermination of the Jews as defining examples of what he meant by genocide.

 

Amidst huge international pressure, the Turkish Government succeeding the Young Turks had not only to recognize the scale and vehemence of the atrocities but also to try the perpetrators in military tribunals and sentence the leaders to death.

 

However, the sentences were not carried out and with the passage of time moods changed not only in Turkey but also in some countries, such as the UK, where Turkey is nowadays seen as a key alley. Still, even in countries that have not yet for some reason recognized the Genocide scholars have no doubts about the character of the events: they point out that there is no scholarly issue, only one of political expediency.

 

Armenians throughout the world insist that there be an international recognition and condemnation of what is often called the first genocide of the twentieth century. We are past the stage of scholarly discussion since a very few challenge the fact. To dispel any doubt, 126 leading scholars of the Holocaust placed a statement in the New York Times in June 2000 declaring the "incontestable fact of the Armenian Genocide" and urging western democracies to acknowledge it.

 

In 2005 the International Association of Genocide Scholars addressed an open letter to Turkey’s Prime Minister R. Erdogan calling upon him to recognize the truth. The evidence is so overwhelming that the only question remaining is how to help the two nations close that shameful page of the history, reconcile and move forward.

 

However, despite the affirmation of the Armenian Genocide by the overwhelming majority of historians, academic institutions on Holocaust and Genocide Studies, increasingly more parliaments and governments around the world, and by more and more Turkish scholars and intellectuals, the Turkish government still actively denies the fact. So long as they do that, Armenians have no choice but to struggle for wider international recognition.

 

This is however not an end in itself. It is important that Turkey recognizes the Genocide, apologizes and condemns it. When the Germans have apologized for the sufferings they had caused to the Jews, the British for slavery, the Americans for their treatment of native Americans etc, Turkey’s continuing denial, moreover, increasing efforts and resources spent on the denial are alarming signs, aggravated by their insistence not to establish diplomatic relations with neighboring Armenia and by maintaining a blockade on all ground communication. Armenia does not even set the recognition of the Genocide as a prerequisite for normalizing relations and calls for establishing diplomatic relations and opening of the border without any preconditions.

 

As the killing this January of Hrant Dink, the Turkish-Armenian editor of the Agos bilingual periodical demonstrates, international community cannot stand aside and watch. Hrant was persecuted under the infamous 301 article for "insulting Turkish identity" and the hysteria around someone daring to speak the truth created the fertile soil for the hatred that killed him. His case was shamefully still open even after his assassination and in a demonstration of absolute absence of morality, Turkish courts yesterday sentenced Hrant’s son, as well as another of Agos’s current staff to a year of imprisonment under the same accusations, for simply daring to re-print Hrant’s words.

 

This is why the world should not yield to Turkish threats that are outright blackmailing. The resolutions in various legislatures across the world, and recently in the US House of Representative Foreign Relations Committee are not merely the result of Armenian Diaspora’s – which by the way, was created in the first place because of the genocide in Turkey - influence. It is because there are more people who believe in values and in putting the wrongs right.

 

A number of British MPs have tabled an EDM (Early Day Motion), to raise the awareness about the Armenian Genocide and calling on British Government to recognize it as such. Currently, around 170 MPs across the party lines have signed an EDM which reads "That this House believes that the killing of over a million Armenians in 1915 was an act of genocide; calls upon the UK Government to recognize it as such; and believes that it would be in Turkey's long-term interests to do the same."

 

Their number grows steadily. It is time the British Government followed many others and re-affirmed the UK’s place among the standard-bearers of democracy and human rights.

 

It is worth repeating that international recognition of the Genocide cannot do harm to Turkish-Armenian relations since they simply do not exist. It does not prevent a dialogue, on the contrary, creates the necessary conditions to start a frank one. By recognizing the historic truth and helping open the last closed border in Europe, the international community can facilitate long-lasting stability and prosperity in our region. And it is also probably time to show that the human race’s evolution into the 21st century is evolution of ideals, principles and a code of behavior that should take precedence over political expediency or sheer commercial interest.

 

Vahe Gabrielyan, Armenia’s Ambassador to the Court of St. James’s

 

 

 

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

Finally U.S. is telling the turks to behave themselves.

 

Katdzes te jisht e asvats, '...antarum aryudzin vorpes arqa bolorn en hargum baci mi tzzan janj vor gnum galis nstum e arqai vra...' . Jamanak ne vor tzzan turqer@ tarberen arqain q@&ic.

 

 

 

 

 

US appeals for Turkish restraint over Iraq raid

(AFP)

 

15 October 2007

 

 

 

 

ROGERS, Arkansas - The White House Monday urged Turkey to show “restraint” as Ankara moved closer to a possible incursion against Kurdish rebels sheltering in northern Iraq that could further complicate the Iraq war. “We all have an interest in a stable Iraq and a desire to see the PKK (the separatist Kurdistan Workers’ Party) brought to justice,” spokesman Gordon Johndroe said.

 

“But we urge the Turks to continue their discussions with us and the Iraqis, and to show restraint from any potentially destabilizing actions.”

 

It was Washington’s most explicit call for restraint since its ally Turkey began considering a quick military cross-border incursion into northern Iraq to crush PKK rebels using Iraq’s Kurdish region as a base of operations.

 

The call coincided with Ankara’s request to Parliament Monday for a one-year authorization for a military operation in northern Iraq, where an estimated 3,500 PKK rebels are based, as announced by Deputy Prime Minister Cemil Cicek.

 

The government will decide on the timing and scope of the operation and can use the authorization for numerous raids it hopes it will not have to resort to, Cicek said. Officials said lawmakers could vote the measure on Wednesday.

 

Under strong public pressure for the Iraq War, the White House is concerned a Turkish incursion might upset one of the few areas in Iraq enjoying relative stability and spread to nearby countries that also harbor Kurdish populations.

 

The possible impending conflict made energy markets jittery as New York crude oil prices rocketed to record highs Monday, closing at 86.13 dollars a barrel.

 

World oil prices were already hovering at record highs before concerns spiked about a potential conflict affecting Turkey’s border with Iraq. Many of Iraq’s largest oil fields are located in the north of the country.

 

London oil prices also surged amid the concerns, sending a key oil contract through the 82-dollar-a-barrel threshold for the first time.

 

Ankara’s saber rattling also comes at a time of tense US-Turkish relations over a pending vote in the House of Representatives for a resolution calling World War I mass killings of Armenians by Turkey’s Ottoman Empire a genocide.

 

Flatly refusing the term and strongly opposed to the US resolution, Turkey has threatened to withdraw its logistical support for the Iraq War if US lawmakers approve the measure.

 

Fearing the loss of Turkey’s Incirclik airbase, which provides a crucial staging ground for US supplies headed to Iraq and Afghanistan, the White House has urged House speaker Nancy Pelosi not to bring the resolution to a vote.

 

“This is an important time for US-Turkish relations, and we would strongly encourage the speaker not to bring this to a vote, and should it come to a vote, we will strongly encourage members not to support it,” spokesman Tony Fratto said Monday.

 

Pelosi on Sunday said she planned to put the bill before the full House of Representatives. The House foreign affairs committee last week passed the measure despite White House warnings, triggering Turkey’s angry response.

 

The resolution, which could be brought up for a vote next month, supports what Armenians for nearly a century have been clamoring for: acknowledgement that at least 1.5 million of their people were killed from 1915 to 1917 under what they describe as an campaign of deportation and murder by the Ottoman Empire.

 

Turkey bitterly disputes the number of dead — putting it at between 250,000 and 500,000 -- and the characterization of the killings as a genocide.

 

 

 

 

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

The Washington Times

 

Armenian crime amnesia?

Bruce Fein

October 16, 2007

 

Armenian crimes against humanity and war crimes against the Ottoman Turkish and Kurdish populations of eastern and southern Anatolia during World War I and its aftermath have been forgotten amidst congressional preoccupation with placating the vocal and richly financed Armenian lobby.

 

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.d.../110160004/1008

 

 

 

 

Does anyone know who this fein creature is?

 

 

 

 

[Anonymouse]

So what is the point of this bill? I keep asking, I keep getting some sort of answers, yet why do I find myself asking again? It seems like this bill is nothing more than a redundancy and a political move at best. Democrats who cannot directly cut off Bush's war in Iraq are sort of using this to indirectly cut off support (i.e., Turkey).

 

There's more.

[Aratta-Kingdom]

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/article/200.../110160008/1013

 

 

The Washington Times

 

Armenian debacle

By Tulin Daloglu

October 16, 2007

 

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi says she believes that "the biggest ethical challenge facing our country is the war in Iraq." Therefore, she must believe that passing a resolution declaring the mass killings of Armenians at the end of World War I a genocide will restore America's moral authority. Rep. Tom Lantos, California Democrat, chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, said, "I feel that I have a tremendous opportunity as a survivor of the Holocaust to bring a moral dimension to our foreign policy." The resolution passed last week by a 27"21 vote.

 

 

However, while Mr. Lantos speaks so forcefully about the resolution now, he has opposed similar measures in the past, arguing that what happened to Armenians is not technically a genocide. In fact, he argued this right up until Turkey refused to give the United States a northern front to invade Iraq in 2003. According to congressional sources, Mrs. Pelosi urged Mr. Lantos to support the resolution, or else risk his chairmanship. In addition, Mr. Lantos was seriously troubled when the Turkish government invited the newly elected Hamas leadership of the Palestinian Authority to Ankara, and by what appears to be Turkey's strengthening relationship with Iran.

 

 

A delegation of Turkish Parliament members visiting Washington was disappointed by the vote. "What bothered me was that those [u.S. representatives] who supported the Turkish side, 21 of them said loud and clear that the events of 1915 amounted to genocide," said Gunduz Aktan, a former ambassador and member of the Turkish Parliament from the Nationalist Movement Party (MHP). "Despite this, because of Turkey's strategic importance, because of the national interest of the U.S., they are voting no. This was unbearable." Turks share Mr. Aktan's opinion. But they should also know who lobbies on Turkey's behalf. Former House Minority leader Richard Gephardt, hired by the Justice and Development Party (AKP) government to lobby for Turkey, actively worked in support of such resolutions in the past. When a last-minute intervention by President Bill Clinton stopped a similar resolution before a vote in 2000, Mr. Gephardt wrote to the then-House Speaker Dennis Hastert, Illinois Republican, to tell him that he was "committed to obtaining official U.S. government recognition of the Armenian genocide."

 

 

Although Egemen Bagis, one of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan's chief foreign policy advisers, said that Turkey has done everything in its power to avert the resolution's passage, it also made many mistakes. Not only did the Turkish government hire Mr. Gephardt, but it also placed too much stock in the perception that Turkey's geographically strategic position would ensure such a measure's defeat.

 

 

Evidently, President Bush, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates did all they could to try to defeat the bill in committee. Now Turkey must face this failure — it lost the propaganda war on this issue long ago. In fact, not only did the Turkish government fail, but Turkish Americans who did not take this issue as seriously as the Armenian Americans failed as well.

 

 

Mrs. Pelosi may think that a House resolution will finally close the issue. But Turks are convinced that it will begin a new chapter and spur reparations claims. U.S. officials advise Turkey to deal with the issue as plain historical fact. That's easily said. But Turks wonder what the connection is — and why the United States has done nothing to prevent the Kurdish separatist PKK from gaining strength in northern Iraq and increasing its attacks on Turkey. They are convinced that America wants to enforce the Treaty of Sevres which would allow Kurds and Armenians to lay claim to Turkish land.

 

 

Many in the United States believe the Kurds have a legitimate right to their own state. Recently the Senate passed a resolution calling the partition of Iraq into three self-governing regions for Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds. Turks are worried that such a plan will lead some of its Kurdish citizens to seek independence as well. However, Sevres did not promise Kurds an independent state; it promised "the formation of an autonomous region which would have the right to elect for complete independence one year after the formation of the autonomous area."

 

 

David McDowell, in "A Modern History of the Kurds, " explains that "[t]he terms were flawed"by the failure to demarcate Kurdistan's boundary with Armenia. This was foreseeably bound to outrage either the Kurds or the Armenians, as President Wilson's pro-Armenian proposed boundary accompanying the treaty clearly showed." Wilson set the Armenian borders to include Kurdish areas of Turkey, but he was unable to finalize them.

 

 

Turks look at their history and wonder why the president refuses to act against a Kurdish terrorist organization attacking them from northern Iraq, and why a Democratic Congress is considering an act that happened nearly 100 years ago. Ultimately, what everyone needs to do is move on — but the war in Iraq and the possibility of its breakup seem to haunt the present.

 

 

[Aratta-Kingdom]

So what is the point of this bill? I keep asking, I keep getting some sort of answers, yet why do I find myself asking again? It seems like this bill is nothing more than a redundancy and a political move at best. Democrats who cannot directly cut off Bush's war in Iraq are sort of using this to indirectly cut off support (i.e., Turkey).

 

There's more.

 

Stop bashing your head against the wall. But since you have a habit of repeating yourself, then you should be getting the same answer you got before.

 

 

"QUOTE(Anonymouse @ Oct 12 2007, 05:47 PM) So what is the point of this genocide bill?

 

 

 

To piss off the turks and leave president a-bush without turkey on thanksgiving day. Isn't that enough?

 

 

 

All the jokes aside...

 

1. Genocide is a crime against mankind. A bill like this will force all the other bloody bastards to think twice before committing similar crimes.

 

2. A bill like this will make the filthy revisionists to think twise before insulting the memory of the genocide victims.

 

3. A bill like this will create legal grounds for the genocide survivors and their children to seek justice.

 

4. A bill like this will put an to cultural genocide.

 

5. A bill like this will force the turks to face the truth and be less aggressive with the armenians. "

[MosJan]

An angry Mutafyan will do all he can against Resolution No. 106

 

Patriarch of Armenians in Turkey, Mesrop Mutafyan, came out against the House committee’s Oct. 10 approval of Resolution No. 106. The spiritual leader said that the resolution’s passage was because of “the fact that this question is periodically brought up as a part of their inner politics.”

 

During a visit to one of the churches of Antalya, Mutafyan stated that he would do all he could to work against the resolution becoming law, “because this resolution doesn’t reflect the feelings of Armenians living in Turkey. We are all against the resolution. Armenians in Turkey are worried about the resolution, and what might happen if it becomes law,” he added.

 

Mutafyan also expressed disappointment that official Yerevan didn’t agree to Turkish prime minister Erdogan’s offer to let historians look into the Genocide issue. “It is a very worthy suggestion,” he said, as reported by Turkish media.

 

Source: Panorama.am

[MosJan]

Orhan Pamuk: “The saddest thing is that there is no free speech in Turkey”

 

In recent days, at the Harvard University bookstore, a meeting was organized with Nobel Prize winner, Turkish writer Orhan Pamuk, who is quite well known to the Armenian community. As relayed by a Panorama.am journalist in Boston, Pamuk noted the one-year anniversary of receiving the Nobel Prize by publishing another book, “Other Colors,” which is a collection of essays and stories. The book presentation took place in the hall of the Harvard church.

 

Pamuk, who read selections from the book, told the packed house how he decided on a name for the book. “It happened that chapters had names like ‘White Fortress’ and ‘My Name is Red,’ and journalists asked me ‘what other colors does the book have?’” So, I decided to name the book ‘Other Colors.’ This is more so my journal, a collection of my thoughts and reflections,” the writer said.

 

After the readings, a question and answer session took place. Not surprisingly, due to the recent passage of House Resolution No. 106 by the House committee on foreign relations, questions related to this issue. To the auditorium full of Turkish students and Boston Armenians, Pamuk said the following: “The French recognized the Genocide, and so should the Americans. But this isn’t the final solution. The bad thing is that there is no free speech in Turkey today. It is prohibited to talk about this in Turkey today; people are living in fear. The solution of this issue rests in the ability of people to freely discuss and look into the question.”

 

We remind that Pamuk, who lives in Europe, was one of the closest associates of Hrant Dink, and is known in Turkey for his support of Genocide recognition, as well as his outspokenness about Turkey’s position regarding the Kurds. Pamuk left Turkey earlier this year, out of fear for his life. This happened after his being accused of anti-Turkishness, even though he was later acquitted of the charges.

 

Source: Panorama.am

[MosJan]

The Washington Times

 

Armenian crime amnesia?

Bruce Fein

October 16, 2007

 

Armenian crimes against humanity and war crimes against the Ottoman Turkish and Kurdish populations of eastern and southern Anatolia during World War I and its aftermath have been forgotten amidst congressional preoccupation with placating the vocal and richly financed Armenian lobby.

 

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.d.../110160004/1008

 

 

 

 

Does anyone know who this fein creature is?

 

 

a subhuman of some sort

[Error 404]

The guy (Bruce Fein) is waste of time. Ahmenijad's type of moron. I would ignore him.

[MosJan]

RA MFA inquired Turkish Embassy in Georgia about detainment of Armenians in Istanbul

16.10.2007 14:29 GMT+04:00 Print version Send to mail In Russian In Armenian

 

/PanARMENIAN.Net/ The Armenian Foreign Ministry inquired the Turkish Embassy in Georgia about the detained Armenians in Turkey. No response have followed yet, RA MFA Acting Spokesman Tigran Balayan told a PanARMENIAN.Net reporter.

 

Meanwhile, as PanARMENIAN.Net came to know from a reliable source, all detained are kept in Istanbul.

 

According to Armenia’s representative in the BSEC, Karen Mirzoyan, informal sources confirm arrest of Armenian citizens. “They were detained for further deportation to Armenia because of violation of visa regime,” Mirzoyan said.

 

Earlier, Irish Times newspaper reported that some 100 Armenians – illegal migrants – were detained in Turkey and will be deported soon. “They exile is eyed as revenge for adoption of the Armenian Genocide resolution by the U.S. House Committee on Foreign Affairs,” the newspaper said.

 

[Lev7]

So what is the point of this bill? I keep asking, I keep getting some sort of answers, yet why do I find myself asking again? It seems like this bill is nothing more than a redundancy and a political move at best. Democrats who cannot directly cut off Bush's war in Iraq are sort of using this to indirectly cut off support (i.e., Turkey).

 

There's more.

 

who cares? As long as it alligns with our interests, let them do it!

[Arpa]

REMEMBER! THE PRESENT STANDOFF WITH TURKEY, AND ITS THREATS TO INVADE IRAQI KURDISTAN HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WITH THE ARMENIAN SAGA, EXCEPT, MAYBE IN ITS DIVERSIONARY VALUE

 

Speaking of “shooting oneself in the foot”, this is not anything new for turkey , For all of these 100 years , turkey by denying and lobbying against it , they have the issue alive. If they only knew that every time they deny it they in fact are using the G word, that is until a few months ago they finally decided to not use the word with or without qualifications.

Their latest knee jerk reaction is in fact a publicity for the Armenian that a billion dollars could not buy. In the past one weak the story has been told more time than in the past 100 years. Every fom of media, written, spoken or picture all the way from Afghanistan to Zululand spoke about the issu e hundred times a day. Every one from Iceland to New Zealand heard the story. As one credit card ad says; “PRICELESS”!!!

Having exhausted all other lame excuses, the likes of “staunch NATO ally” etc. the latest lame excuse is “timing”. That it is a bad timing as the Iraq fiasco will be affected. Once again, at the risk of repeating myself let us consider that quote by Defense Scty Gates about “70% of our military supplies come from our bases in turkey”. and this was and is still being lipsynched by every one and their uncles,, be day politicians or news persons. To this day no one has yet asked to see the figures, to see if it is 69.9% or 70.9%. How was this calculated? On a turkish abacus? The Dow Jones average sometimes fluctuates up to 200 points a day yet that figure of 70 % has not moved up or down even by an iota. Do we need more proof that it is a mindlessly manufactured figure?

Bad timing?

This past Sunday the subject was discussed all day long starting with ABC This Week with George Stephanopoulos. First guest was Madam Speaker Pelosi. I will come back to her, She was followed y Sen. McConnell, a long time friend of the Armenians. He opened with affirming his long and cordial relation with the Armenians, that he has many Armenian friends, that he knows about the Genocide, that he knows it happened, that he has been to Armenia and the Genocide Museum in Yerevan…. But “this is abd time” when we need do much the alliance of turkey. Dumb! Lipsynching! Succumbing to blackmail!

Back to Ms. Pelosi, the lioness of Congress. When quizzed about timing she said to the effect of; ‘this is not the first time this issue has come up in the past several decades, first the timing was bad because of the Soviet Union, then it was because this or that conflict, it was Desert Storm, one desert conflict or other, and now… When is the right time if not now?’

When will the right time be indeed! When the US poses to attack Tehran and uses those bases in turkey again? Or when Israel in alliance with turkey is engaged in an all out war with their neighbors?

 

Another lame excuse, that it happened almost a hundred years ago during another defunct regime.

Huh! Excuse me! How many years ago was the Holocaust? Under what regime? How many years ago was the slavery of the African American? How many years ago was the genocide of the Native Americans, be they North Americans or South. Under what Regime? Was there a United States when the Anglo colonists massacred millions of Native Americans? Were there South America states when Columbus and the Spanish genocide millions of South American Natives?

How long ago were those and under what regime?

Is this wrong time to talk about them as well? Specially when we are trying to placate the Latin American states to counter such rogue states as Cuba and Venezuela?

 

One wonders what kind of test these so called media pundits take to qualify when that idiot Jack Cafferty refers with a smirk, to the “incident that happened NINETY YEARS AGO”.

Huh! How many years ago?

 

Speaking of “how long ago it was , and what it was”, here is an item that made every major news medium;

October 13, 2007 NYT

World Briefing | Europe

Vatican City: Knights Templar Secrets Revealed

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

The Vatican has published secret documents about the trial of the Knights Templar, including a parchment long ignored because of a vague catalog entry in 1628, showing that Pope Clement V initially absolved the medieval order of heresy. The 300-page volume recently came out in a limited edition — 799 copies, each priced at 5,900 euros, or $8,370 — said the publishing house Scrinium, which prints documents from the Vatican’s archives. The order of knights, which ultimately disappeared because of the heresy scandal, are also a central part of the best-seller “The Da Vinci Code.” The Vatican book reproduces the entire documentation of the papal hearings convened after King Philip IV of France arrested and tortured Templar leaders in 1307 on charges of heresy and immorality. The publishing house said the large-format book included reproductions of the “Parchment of Chinon,” a 1308 decision by Clement, above, to save the Templars and their order. But under pressure from Philip, he later reversed his decision and suppressed the order in 1312. Jacques de Molay, the last Grand Master of the Templars, was burned at the stake in 1314.

Edited October 16, 2007 by Arpa

[Harut]

The Washington Times

 

Armenian crime amnesia?

Bruce Fein

October 16, 2007

 

Armenian crimes against humanity and war crimes against the Ottoman Turkish and Kurdish populations of eastern and southern Anatolia during World War I and its aftermath have been forgotten amidst congressional preoccupation with placating the vocal and richly financed Armenian lobby.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.d.../110160004/1008

Does anyone know who this fein creature is?

 

it says at the end of the article on the 2nd page: "Bruce Fein is a resident scholar with the Turkish Coalition of America"

Edited October 16, 2007 by Harut

[DominO123]

The backstabber country, and the idiotic journalists.

 

Not one journalist has ever raised the issue of internal matters. If the congress want to give its opinion about a subject, she should have the right to do so. What the US has really done when the penal code 301 was introduced, not even a binding policy but part of the Turkish official penal code. The US has trully no balls, cowards. All the help it provides to Turkey, lets just remember the national geographic members arrested, Encarta members arrested, ... An ally, someone who has an ally like this does not need any enemy. Who is the bright journalist who will even raise this issue, rather than the yap, yap, yap bullcrap wearing Bush durty underwears?

 

Let those morons missing a couple of millions of neurons in their temporal lobe understand this. TURKEY IS TREATING ITS SO CALLED ALLY FOR A NON BINDING RESOLUTION, WITH ACTIONS WHICH COULD POTENTIONALLY CAUSE MEN LOSS. DEATHS, KILLED, ''CASUALTIES!!! WHO CALL SUCH BACKSTABBERS ALLIES? IF THE THE AMERICANS ARE SO THREATNED WITH SUCH A DECISION, THEN THEY SHOULD HAVE THE BALLS TO STOP CALLED SUCH AN ANTAGONIST COUNTRY THEIR ALLY.

 

This this clear for idiotic journalists who ignore totally of what they're talking about? Isen't a taking of position, for something which isen't even binding, protected by the UN universal declaration of human right? Under FREEDOM OF SPEECH!!! SOMETHING WHICH THE JOURNALISTS SHOULD BE THE FIRST TO UNDERSTAND!!!

 

WHERE WAS THE RESOLUTION WHEN TURKEY BLOCKED ACCESS REGARDLESS?????

 

ALLY??? HOW? UNDER WHICH DEFINITION SUCH A NATION IS AN ALLY?

 

''YOU DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO HOLD YOUR OPINION, IF YOU DO SO, I WILL TAKE THE MEASURES WHICH MAY COST DEATH IN YOUR SIDE'' IS THIS THE LANGUAGE OF A FRIEND AN AALLYY?????? NO ONE PRIOR THE VOTE, NEITHER ANY OF THOSE IGNORANT JOURNALISTS HAVE RAISED THIS IMPORTANT POINT.

 

Will France make such threats for a NON BINDING resolution regarding Algeria? Will the US make threats for a NON BINDING resolution by the Turkish parlement on the destruction of American aborginens?

 

LET ME TELL YOU, WHAT KIND OF WEAK COUNTRY DOES THIS, IT IS A COUNTRY WHO RESTRICT OTHERS TO HOLD OPINIONS, A COUNTRY ENEMY OF FREEDOM OF SPEECH. AGAIN??? WHO IS THE JOURNALIST WHO COVERED OR RAISED THOSE KEY ISSUES? BECAUSE THOSE ARE THE MAIN ISSUES HERE!!!

 

Will baby Turkey run the US congress by CONSTENTLY THREATNING AMERICANS OF REPERCUTIONS AGAINST THEIR MEN IN IRAK??? AND WHO IS THE AMERICAN PRESIDENT WHO WILL HAVE THE BALLS TO STEND UP??? AFTERALL, DO THEY NOT HAVE THE BALLS TO ATTACK AFKHANISTAN, DIDN'T THEY HAVE THE BALLS TO ATTACK IRAK TWO TIMES? WHAT ABOUT THE THREATS AGAINST IRAN?

 

WE AREN'T EVEN TALKING ABOUT ATTACKING, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT, AGAIN!!!!!! ABOUT A NON BINDING, NON BINDING RESOLUTION, WHEN THE OPINION IN THAT RESOLUTION IS ALLREADY SHARED EVEN BY THOSE WHO OPPOSE IT!!!

 

ALL THOSE IDIOTIC JOURNALISTS WHO HAVE NOT FOUND ANYTHING WRONG WITH THE FACT THAT THOSE OPPOSING THE RESOLUTION SAID THAT THEY AGREE WITH THE CONTENT, THOSEFOR MAKING IT CLEAR THAT THEY CAN NOT HOLD THEIR OPINION, NOO FKING FREEDOM OF SPEECH, BECAUSE A COUNTRY IS THREATNING THEM. IT ISEN'T ENOUGH THAT THEY THREATEN THEIR OWN CITIZENS TO HOLD THAT OPINION, THEY DO IT ALSO TO THOSE OUTSIDE WITH CHEAP AND WEAK RETALIATORY THREATS.

 

HOW MANY JOURNALISTS HAVE DIED TO DEFEND FREEDOM OF SPEECH, WHO MANY JOURNALISTS HAVE GIVEN THEIR LIVES BY NOT ANSWERING TO INTIMIDATIONS???

 

I PUKE ON THE COWARD JOURNALISTS, URINATE AND DEFACATE ON THEM, THOSE HAVE BEEN ALIENATED FROM THOSE JOURNALIST PRINCIPLES AND WHO ARE WEARING BUSH UNDERWEARS!!! INSULTERS OF THE PROFESSION, FAKE INFORMERS, IDIOTS AND MORONS!!!

 

I feel better now, my anger is out!

[Error 404]

Very well said Domino.

 

I will also add that Turkey always used to catch fish in dirty waters. Now it is a perfect time for them to realize their criminal plans. Armenian Genocide Resolution has nothing to do with Kurds and Iraq invasion.

[Error 404]

Tomorrow the turkey's parliament will give the "license to kill" to Erdogan. What's next?

 

My guess is turkey will not do anything until the Resolution 106 vote in the house then it will proceed accordingly. What is your guess?

[Aratta-Kingdom]

AZG

 

 

ANKARA DEMANDS WASHINGTON’S CONCRETE COOPERATION IN THE FIGHT AGAINST PKK IN EXCHANGE FOR THE ADOPTION OF THE RESOLUTION

 

 

 

The recall of Turkish Ambassador to USA is temporary

 

The adoption of the Resolution 106 by the US House of Representatives’ Foreign Affairs Committee has had a large-scaled resonance in international press.

 

The first-rate press services of the world discuss the issue from Turkey-USA relations aspect. They predict possible results of Turkish counteraction. They touched upon Ankara’s anger, underlining the failure of the Washington’s efforts into not putting the resolution on vote.

 

Ankara’s anger is expressed in Turkish responses to the adoption of the resolution, informed before by "Azg" daily.

 

After the announcements of the Foreign Ministry and the Government of Turkey, the Prime Minister Erdogan made an announcement on October 11. Comparing the present resolution with the previous ones, he mentioned, "In 2000, similar resolution was adopted with 38 votes pro and 12 contra, in 2005 - 40 pro and 7 contra, and on October 10, 2007 – 27 pro and 21 contra. It means that we have a positive change in this sphere. Nevertheless, the essence of the issue will not be restricted with the discussion of the issue; it will have results. The USA will do harm to the relations with its regional colleague, and Armenia will be deprived of the hopes for future. However, Diaspora will make use of it.

 

To the question if Turkey would close the Incirlik, Erdogan answered: "We’ll continue our struggle to make the House of Representatives not to put the Resolution on vote. We have opportunities of counteractions. It is soon to speak of them, until the final result becomes evident". Then he mentioned that the role of the USA is decisive in the world, Turkey is in military alliance with the USA, and consequently the adopted resolution of the Genocide will fundamentally differ from the resolutions of Argentina, Canada or France.

 

The same day, Peoples’ Democratic Party deputy and previous ambassador Shukru Elekdag also made similar announcement. He mentioned that the adoption of the resolution by the US would encourage other countries. "There are several countries that are waiting for the adoption of that resolution. In the case of the adoption, this process will have a serious development. At present, the number of the countries that have recognized the Genocide is 18. If the USA recognizes it, that index will increase to 36, 40."

 

The leader of the faction Egemen Bagis, a member of Justice and Development Party said, "The US authorities, The White House, the State Department and Pentagon haven’t yet lost their chance to keep the level of the relations with Turkey. The only remedy of yesterday’s mistake is concrete cooperation in the fight against the PKK." Answering Bred Sherman’s words that Ankara will be angry some more days and then will calm down, he said, "Though some people say that Ankara will forget all these in several days, anyhow, we will answer them. If the House of Representatives also adopt the resolution, then we’ll answer by all means."

 

The above-mentioned announcements of the PM Erdogan and the members of the Turkish delegation clear up that Ankara centralizes its efforts on opposing the discussion of the Resolution in the House of Representatives, and demands Washington’s concrete cooperation in the fight against PKK in exchange for the adoption of the resolution.

 

Meanwhile, the US President George Bush gives hope that the Resolution of the Armenian Genocide will not be put on the agenda of the House of Representatives. State Secretary Condoleezza Rice promises to make every effort in that direction, and Foreign Minister Robert Gates warns the Congress about the negative results after the adoption of the resolution. Ankara has recalled its Ambassador to USA Nabi Shansoy.

 

Nevertheless, the above-mentioned did not prevent the House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi from announcing about her readiness to put the resolution of the Armenian Genocide Recognition on vote until November 22.

 

Pelosi is a representative of Democratic Party; it means that she opposes the form of Republican governing. The same we can say about the member of the House of Representatives Sherman, who mentioned, "Ankara will be angry several more days and then will forget it."

 

"The horrible events of 1915, when 1, 5 mln innocent Armenians were killed or displaced, are realities. Every country, including USA, must become the master of the dark moments of its history and conciliate with them innocently", said the Assistant State Secretary Daniel Fried to the members of Turkish delegation who were in USA to lobby against the Armenian Genocide Resolution.

 

It’s beyond any doubt that Fried expresses the viewpoint of the State Department as an Assistant State Secretary.

 

Anyway, though Bush, Rice and Gates are making every effort to hamper the future process of the resolution, Washington’s inflexibility is evident in its demand on Turkey to conciliate with the dark moments of its history. Probably, Turkey understands that inflexibility, and that is why in exchange for the adoption of the resolution it demands active cooperation of Washington in the fight against PKK.

 

The logic of the Kurdish program carried out in Northern Iraq contradicts the Turkish logic of compensation. It means that the Resolution will be adopted also at the full chamber of the House of Representatives. Nancy Pelosi will probably contribute to it, as her initiative to open October 10 chamber of the Foreign Affairs Committee with the Lord’s Prayer by the Catholicos of All Armenians Garegin II was very symbolical.

 

By Hakob Chakrian, translated by L.H.