Eire

You seem to enjoy contradicting yourself. My favorite statement is this: "And I'm not claiming other continents are morally superior." And quickly followed by "PS: Armenak, I consider you a better man because of your un-Europeanness, " You then proceeded to confirming my earlier suspicion that you didn't grasp the fundamental difference between Hrya money-loving values and classical Western values. Those same western values that gave us philosophy, magnificent architecture, empires like the Romans and British, exploration, the thirst for knowledge and to better ourselves both physically and mentally. No other people posses this fire inside them like we do. As I said, if you arnt happy living in peace (no tribe will come raiding your village in the dawn), prosperity (you dont have to walk 8 miles a day to get water) and comfort (you, at least, can feed yourself 3 times a day every day), then you are more then welcome to pack your things and move to the morally superior third world. *Side note: If my words may seem insulting to some, know that it is the last of my intentions, I am merely expressing my disbelief at good young men and women who are ashamed of the blood that flows in their veins. Regards Eire

I think you are confusing MTV multicultural values with true western values. If you are referring to true western values however, you are more then welcome to pack your things, wrap a turban around your head or a piece of cloth around your waist and move to the other morally "superior" continents. Eire

What an ignorant statement to make.

Typical Armenian behavior. Blame anyone and everyone that didnt come to help us. Understand that countries have interests, not friends. Have no illusions on that. ALL governments have failed us, ALL, including our own. It doesnt change our blood or who we are. I have a lot of respect for you Moses, and know that I mean no insult when I say this but; read up on the origins of our people. Read about our language, our customs and our blood and how close we are to the rest of our European brothers and sisters. True European nationalists know where their loyalties lie. Eire

Our conduct doesnt change our race nor our blood. Sure there is corruption, and all kinds of other soviet leftovers in our country, but that doesnt change who we are. I am European. I have Europe in my head, my heart, my blood and my bones. Armenians are an ancient European people and I am damned proud that our government officials are reasserting our brotherhood to our European kin. Im tired of being compared to middle easterners or damned turks. I am not some desert-dwelling Semite, and I am not some slant-eyed descendant of Mongols. I come from the race that brought us the worlds greatest empires, the worlds greatest thinkers, the worlds most beautiful architecture. Be proud of your European blood and heritage. Arouyn ou Badiv Eire

I'm looking for the Armenian equivalent of Aries/Mars Basically our god of war. (Dont say Vahagn, he is our equivalent of Hercules...) Thanks Eire

This thread shouldnt even exist. Besides half-baked theories on just about everyone having some Armenian blood (WHO CARES IF PRINCESS DIANA HAD SOME ARMENIAN BLOOD, GWEN STEFANIE?? WHO CARES?), the idea that we could accept any Armenian who converted to Islam as true Armenians is beyond me. To address Ata Convert's earlier point that Tigran The Great was not a Christian, The thing about Islam is that by accepting it, the convert adopts an Arabic (I.E. Middle Eastern)lifestyle. We are not a Middle Eastern people. Our culture is NOT Middle Eastern (some ignorant Armenians might disagree with me). I would accept a pagan Armenian over a muslim one any day. The simple fact is that paganism is of our own people. Our gods walked with us, they drank from our rivers and ate from our trees. Christianity is now an integral part of our culture, and I rather the loving Christian values over any other faith. This thread should be taken down. I dont care what some Turkified Armenian did. He converted? Good on him, but the blood we share is no longer valid. Might as well open a thread about Buddhist achievements or Australian Aborigines... it has as much to do with Armenians as Islam. Eire

"Most" white men? Doubtful. I find it really sad to see Armenians that still lean towards the left, especially communism... How many times are we going to have to be slapped in the face before we learn? Eire

I have a problem with good white men dying for a cause that isn't their own, but a war to fight communism is a noble enough endeavor. Seeing as how you enjoy collecting rubbish books, might I suggest "the Cat in the Hat" by Dr Seuss? I find his views on Viet Nam to be just as accurate as Howard's Cheers mate! Your friend Eire

All politicians are prostitutes, thats the point Im trying to get across. Also, "dropping bombs over the peaceful population of Hanoi"? Sounds like someone read "A People's History of America"... Eire

I understand and hope you see that my intention was never to attack you Mousegh Jan!

I find it to be a low blow to take a strike at his captivity and torture just because his interests don't coincide with our own. Let him be ignorant, let him be an idiot, let him be a Turkish tool. You can't hate him for putting his countries interests ahead of our own, even though he's in the wrong. Granted, he's in the wrong, and probably knows it, but he is a politician after all. Behaving like this is shameful. Attacking people personally because they refuse to help us doesn't encourage help, it encourages bitterness and hate. Fighting for our cause doesn't include bullying those who don't Just my thoughts Eire

Great... so they are now using Armenians to help them get into Europe? Him being appointed was deliberate, and I'm sorry to say but he should immediately step down. No way in hell we are going to betray our European brothers and let the Turk loose in Europe. No way in hell... Eire

Actually, the only people willing to even address this issue are the European right-wing populist parties who are slowly gaining ground in almost every European country. Does this show a racist trend amongst native Europeans? Or does it just point to the fact that White Europeans are sick and tired of being force-fed this guilt-trip lie? I find it rather appalling to see Armenians supporting Muslims or even defending their actions at any time (see Lebanese elections and who provided Hezbollah with it's rare Christian votes). If one properly studies history, Islamic expansion just jumps out and can be easily recognized. A perfect example of this European guilt-trip, we can see in the above article that the Crusades were noted as an example of Christian agression towards Muslims, when in fact it all started with the Byzantine attempt to deliver the Christian populations of Armenia from the hands of the Seljuks, resulting in the pivotal battle of manazkert. Its time for white Europeans, Armenians included, to stop accepting this "religious freedom" and "cultural relativism" garbage as fact, and to remember that behind our men lie our women and children, the very future of our existence as a people, a language, a culture and a faith. They are all in danger. Eire *Note: European nationalists who have dared to respond to middle-eastern aggression are quickly branded as Racist bigots. See Cronulla Riots.

Well said Shiner It was Obamania all over the Armenian community. Like idiots we all cheered his name, wore his t-shirts and massively supported him. What does that say about us? It shows that we are easily swayed once you promise us something regarding the G-word. Seriously? Are we that naive or do we just enjoy getting screwed over so many times? Our community is dissolving and none of you can see that. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

Im not going to discuss this here because it is not the place but our youth is falling through the cracks and it hurts. we need to reawaken their pride Aroun ou Badiv Eire

Movses Jan It may seem wrong to you but you dont seem to understand. Again. www.thereligionofpeace.com I can show you some more if your still not satisfied. The point is these faiths are foreign to Armenia and so how can you pretend to care for your people if you help bring about their downfall? Persia was the nation that wrote the first declaration of human rights... and then Islam invaded. As for the Hamshens. Its a very touchy subject and my stance on them is still blurry. I mean, yeah their our genetic cousins but... their language is heavily mixed with turkish. Luckily most are christian, true, but alot of them are sunni muslim. They speak A mixture of turkish and Armenian and are muslim = Are they really Armenian? or should we all just start speaking turkish so as to accommodate them? I dunno, its a very touchy subject and I dont know enough about the Hamshens to make any real comment about them. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

When you see the things happen to the people Iv grown up with, all because they hang out with Arabs or Blacks. You should see the crime, the drugs. We cant let this happen to Armenia. Most have lost faith in their own people. All they care about is their money and their cars. Nothing else matters. We live forever through the things we accomplish. Let our people live forever. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

Movses Jan I am catholic... not a pagan haha. I said I would accept armenian pagans because it is a part of our heritage. As for muslims. I suggest you go on www.thereligionofpeace.com and see for yourself. Everywhere a muslim community settles, they are followed by heavy problems, simply because they do not integrate. Talk to me about Artsakh. Iv been to Stepanakert and Shushi. Remember who we were fighting with, true, but also remember who we were fighting against, and who came to their muslims "brothers" aide. These middle eastern ideas are foreign and they are not a part of who we are. If to you, wanting a multicultural experiment in armenia is your idea of a bright future then you are as short-sighted as your leftist counterparts. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

Well said Gamavor. Altho I personally wouldnt favor a strictly capitalist system for Armenia, simply because it is too selfish in nature. In my head I would see a form of Nationalist capitalism, one that doesnt forget the people. Maybe Im just a dreamer eh? Aroun ou Badiv Eire

once again I will not detail my involvement with Armenia because it is frankly none of your business. I am not saying they are our children and we should tell them what to do and what not to do. Im not saying we should look down on them. Im sure that we agree on that. I am saying tho that we are gone, not by choice. And we still have the right to want a better future for the lands we left behind. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

I agree with you there. but what happens when that country becomes yours? I know many pure armenians who now call themselves syrians or lebanese. Il tell you a story yervant Jan, king of the Bearia My uncle is the son of a genocide survivor (my grandfather) and so is his wife. while my parents were away they took me to dinner with them The whole way they speak arabic to each other. They listen to arabic radio and my aunt knows all the words to every single song. We discuss college and what I plan to do later on and I tell them about my goal of doing a year or two in Armenia and then probably going into politics there. My aunt immediately starts blabbing on about how crazy we are, me and my brother for wanting such things. According to her "they (emphasis on the word THEY) are all lazy, corrupt and ignorant (bla bla bla)" What struck me is the word they. To her, these were foreigners, not her own blood, not her people. We went to supper at Ruby's. A lebanese restaurant owned by armenians. The restaurant plays armenian and arabic music on the radio. My uncle leans in to me and says in french "tu vois, toute la musique des arméniens est triste!" (meaning all armenian music is sad) He then goes on to making some weird whiny voice to imitate the singer. Again, note the "the Armenians" and not "we", making it seem like they are a separate people and not his own kin. The arabic music goes on, all I hear is a relieved gasp from my aunt "finally!" she says. I personally know many Armenians who are pure-blooded and refer to themselves as lebanese or Syrian. Id understand Canada or France or the States but Lebanon and Syria? Those countries didnt open their arms to us, they took the genocide survivors and turned them into slaves, making them clean their houses, dont pretend that those people are saints. Even at that, does it make sense to go for example and open a "bolsahye mioutioun" wherever you settle in the west? If youv left bolis, you are no longer bolsahye... Im saying we should put the emphasis on the HYE and not what comes before it. Its the number of the bus you should remember, not the bus stop. Everything else creates division. Aroun ou Badiv old friend Eire

Movses Jan What makes us Armenian is our blood. but being muslim or jewish, or any other faith (besides pagan) is a betrayal to your own people. Think about it. Our people were put to the sword because of our christian faith. While invaded by our Mohamedan tormentors, our christianity only doubled our efforts to remain distinct and alive. The church and clergy has kept our language and customs alive. Islam itself is a DEEPLY flawed religion and their distorted faith has already taken a massive toll on Christian Europe. Our western life style is in danger of disappearing and I will not discuss this here, but you may take a look for yourself if you want. There is plenty of available information on the Islamification of Europe, and about the incredibly high crime rates of the islamic community, their barracks-turned mosques, and the rape of non-veiled white women. Adopting Islam means adopting an oriental life-style (prayers in arabic as an example) while our traditions and culture are European. As for being Jewish. the mentality they have is that if you are a jew, your loyalties lie with Judea. I have seen this personally with my half-italian half jewish friends, half french half jewish, and even half Armenian half jewish. We are two ancient peoples who have our own causes to further and mixing both would not be a good idea. let us be true to our ancestors and not foreign ones. Aroun ou Badiv Eire

I have never lacked respect to any member on this forum, nor have I ever been banned before. Your comment to me clearly shows your own bias and that you are unable to stand up to your forum friends, who are actually behind the degeneration of this debate. Good day Aroun ou Badiv Eire

Thats a question I cannot answer unless faced with the situation. If you had read my post properly, you would have understood that Im not urging everyone to just pack up and leave. Im merely pointing out that our loyalties should not lie with the countries we now live in, but with the country we now left. I have seen fights between armenians just because some lipanahye made some comment about bolsahyes, and so on. I feel our association with these countries only further causes division amongst my people and that is something we can no longer afford. Aroun ou badiv Eire