Accelerated

quote:Do we really equate power with truth? In most cases yes because it is the winners who write the history. quote:powerful Turks should always be considered in the right and the weak Armenians contribution to humanity should always be considred as worthless Turks may have the political clatter and millitary strength, but we have contributed to the world as much if not more than them, despite our inferior population quote:points being that in fact Aninet China, the Incas, the Sumarians etc did dominate their worlds to the extent that they were known Wrong, China for one refused to venture outside its political 'domain' to engage the rest of the world. They were always inward looking. While the Europeans 'expanded' their known world not through superior technology but through the prospect of glory and heavenly rewards (for spreading the Gospel). quote:But this doesn't mean that Christianity is true In my opinion there is a God, and since we are descndants of Christians we should seek to live our lives as Christians, even if we believe that the Bible has contradictions, it is the closest things we have to the original Gospel. quote:"Is religeon in general the true force behind our morals and ethics or can there be strong ethical and moral values even without this all important religeon"? For the tenth time religion IS the true force behind our CURRENT morals and ethincs.

Sip, I suggest you get some sleep, or am I that interesting

quote:Sorry if I seem to be dropping words in my sentences but I haven't slept in 36 hours ... Yes, I see its 4am there. . What are you doing up so late? quote:In a trully civilized society, I say you wrong. No need for religeon. Rational thought and reason is enough force.I say rational thought and reason are both relative and evolving. The 'standard' of our rational thought and reason however was DICTATED by Christianity and has been changing since. Now this part is hard to put into words, but I hope you understand what I mean. People on average have become more informed on the world around them, but it hasnt made us 'smarter' on deliberating on moral and ethical issues, hence we must look to religion to lead the way in such decisions.

quote:What happened to Egypt? Yes, Egypt was relativelly advanced (for its age), but they also had an influential religion quote:What about the Inkas in South America? As did the Incas. Seaphan I am arguing for religions in general as a moral force. I was simply using Europe and Christianity as an example. Needless to say, neither Egypt, nor the Incas or the Chinese were able to dominate the world like Christian Europe quote:Are you telling me there were no morlas and ethics before God and Jesus showed up with the Bible about 2000 years ago?No, of course not. What I am saying is that our current morals and ethics are derived from Christianity (which to a limited extent has its roots in Judaism). quote:How many witches did they burn? I am not saying the Catholic Church is infalable. But you should look in your own backyard (America) when you want to see immoral things done. The so called pinacle of civilisation is nothing more than a tyrannical regime bent on World domination (and its willing to sacrifice YOU, American citizens to achieve its ends eg. Pearl Harbour, Spanish War, Sept 11). quote:How many scientists did they destroy ... those who dared to say the Earth was round ... those who dared to say we revolved around the Sun? Those who dared to say evolution can and does happen?Trust me, not as many as the American media would make you think quote:The "church" may have helped science a lot but I am SURE it did more BAD than GOODWell you are simply wrong. It didnt help science advance in certain areas, but it was instrumental in its survival for 1000 years! [ July 22, 2002, 03:49 AM: Message edited by: Accelerated ]

quote:Would we be in a complete state of disarray and kill and rape each other every day? Probably not.It was largelly thanks to the Church that the scientific works of the Ancient Greeks and Romans, and the very basic forms of education survived through the Dark and Middle Ages (approx. 500-1500AD). Also, many of the first 'thinkers' of the renaissance were religious monks (eg. Mendel). If it wasnt for the Church we would be many hundred years behind. quote:Ethics and morals do not have their roots in religeon.I think you are very WRONG in this statement. Ethics and morals have evolved, but their roots lie in Christianity (in the Western World anyway) quote: No, we don't steal and we don't kill each other because doing so, would completely undermine 'civil' and 'social' existence in an advanced race such as us humans.As recent as 1000 years ago there was little in the way of social and civil order in Europe, yet the ethics and morals of today are very similar to those times if not more 'looser'. quote:We had 'civilized' societies way before christianity Ancient Rome and Greece only have a facade of 'civilisation', deep down they were nothing more than large tribes (or city-states) bound by prospects of common material advancement. History glorifies them for the sake of European prestige. quote:and we will have them long after it's disappearance as well We have allready begun the slide into the Abyss...

Hate is a strong word. I dislike them (Azeris/Turks) as a group, but they are human too, despite their savage ancestry .

Thanks for the info guys, certainly puts things into perspective. quote:as opposed to logical and ethical reasons of why one should live that way.Where do you think we got these ethical and 'logical' reasons? Thats correct, Christianity. Remeber that everything is relative when it comes to these reasons, had it not been for religion our society would be very different. quote:implies that it's individual members are capable of rational thought and clear thinking. Again, 'rational' is relative. 100 years ago it was rational to kill in revenge, now there is a justice system... quote:A trully enlightened person does not need spirituality to feel good about life and have a purpose. Enlightened of what? Of how the world 'functions'? I may not be a professor or a genius, but I am largelly aware of the history and current state of this world and the way it operates (from biology to the stock market) and I still have little doubt that there is a God. He may not be in the form as described in the Koran or the Bible, but not far and certainly far superior to our meagre existance. For one, how do you think the world and the universe came into existence? The Big Bang I believe is a load of rubbish... Another point I wanted to make was, just because events can be scientifically explained does not mean that they are not the 'work of God'. eg. During artificial insemination the sperm is inserted into the egg, then a jolt of energy is passed through the egg to start the process. Where do you think this jolt of energy comes from in a womens overial tube (I think thats what its called the tube that links an overy to the uterus)? [ July 21, 2002, 10:14 PM: Message edited by: Accelerated ]

quote:i'm just giving an advice that came to my mind after reading your post and remembering that you love to drink.Harut, I am sorry but I fail to see the link between enjoying a drink every so often and having to put up with idiotic drivers. quote:I ride Suzuki sportmotorcycle as a passion and I face death on daily bases. Rubo, I am sure you've heard this opinion a million times before, but I also think a motorcycle is a deathtrap!

I also think we should stay neutral in this conflict, we certainly have many more pressing issues and we dont need another.

I will repeat, the driver had NOT drunk anything, and I DONT drink and drive (I wish here I could say I have never driven drunk, but I did once this past New Years and I am not pround of what I did).

quote:ALCOHOL, cars, chicks, grave (in that order)Harut, no need to be like that because we share this world with idiots, some of whome just might happen to be our friends and relatives, and others just around the corner or coming in the opposite direction. What happened to me can happen to anyone, thats a fact of life. [ July 21, 2002, 12:06 AM: Message edited by: Accelerated ]

....I still have some of the scenes flashing through my head, like in a movie....

quote:Definitely go and have yourself checked out if you haven't already done so. The amboes checked me out at the scene and said I should be ok, and the pain has almost died down now. I did get scared for a second at the scene, when I could taste the blood in my breath (as I was exhaling), but thats bound to happen as my blood pressure probably went through the roof. quote:So I guess there were no airbags in the car?no,no its '93 model quote:To his defense, I don't think he meant alcohol followed by driving. He was merely ordering his preference.Correct, none of us had been drinking, but the driver had just lost a large sum at the pocker machines. LOL. I must admit it was an experience like no other, better than any scary funpark ride. ...though one not worth sitting through again.

We were in a Honda Civic fully packed with 5 people, I was in the front passenger seat. The idiot driver (only 2 months driving experience) was doing 80 in a 50 zone down a straight road. He decided to swerve into the opposite lane and back again. While swerving into the opposite lane he lost control when he tried to swerve back. Locked the brakes, missed telegraph pole by 20cm (my side), hit the kerb and flew for 1 metre finally crashing into a brick fence wall (like in the movies). The car was a ride off, but was insured 7 days before. Thank God everyone was ok, though I still have a nagging pain in my chest (where seatbelt held me) and a headspin. Everyone at the site (ambulance towtruckies) said that if we had hit the pole at least two people would have died, and everyone else with major head injuries at the least. Mind you I would have been dead for sure. Im going to Church tomorow to light a candle. Moral of the story: "Dont trust idiots with your life!" I hope this is a lesson to everyone else like it was to me....

quote:In a way its good. When you hate something that you perceive to be bad (philosophically speaking), you subconsciously try to do, like, behave in a opposite manner. So, however wrong our impression is about turks, in our minds we associate them with dirt (so, we need to be clean), old-fashion (so, we need to be modern and fashionable), stupid (so we need to be educated and smart), ugly (we need to be handsome, God willing), nasty (we need to be kindhearted), uncompromising (so, we need to be tolerant?!?) and so on and so on.... LOL.

Oh ok, thats clear now... I saw bits and pieces of that documentary (I think), but I cant remeber anything from it except a few images... Do you know what 'illigal' activities they were conducting?

I think you misunderstood me. My question was, if the sect was successful in commiting mass suicide, why was this particular member of the sect seeking revenge? I mean his fellow members got what they wanted.

If the incident was as intended by the sect, a mass suicide, why did the Oklahoma City bombing take place?

I really dont blame them for the lies. I mean you dont expect them to say "...we are a bunch of mongrels, a collection of ethnicities from the Balkans to the Mongolian Plain, and everything we have achieved has been largelly thanks to the peoples we have ruled in the course of our history.....and which we have later punished for further refusing to co-operate for our good....while suppressing their legitimate rights to self-determination...."

Did these 'illigal' things (which btw I am not aware of, I know little of the incident) justify the massacre of over 100 (?) people including women and children?

Why was the Davidian Sect so brutally suppressed?

I'm not really into old cars, and dont understand the obsession some harbor for them

quote:Somehow I am getting the feeling we're not talking about cars anymore?Cars and women go hand-in-hand, in the early years a good car is a sign of 'coolness', later a good car is a reflection of ones wealth. So we havnt completely gone off topic quote:when the gardner and his lawnmower from HELL show up Oh, I hate that too, just wanna grab the kitchen knife and launch myself at him... btw, that was the first time I had been to a strip joint, but I didnt see anything I hadnt seen before. [ July 18, 2002, 10:16 PM: Message edited by: Accelerated ]

Mos, I'll take the one in the top right hand corner. Its the morning after, and I must admit last night was pretty good, it was a classy joint forcing me to spend over US$50. Had a final private show (there were four of us, not including stripper) at the end of the night. My friends were having trouser eruptions, I had too many drinks beforehand and got BORED! after like 10 minutes (the show went for 20 mins). I wasnt even aroused, even though she was shown everything she had!LOL Don't worry I'm not a fag, its just by the time we entered that small room my mind had stopped functioning LOL:)

And back on the topic , does anyone follow the World Rally Championship or Formula 1 here?