Germany And The Secret Genocide

[DominO123]

BOSTON FILM FESTIVAL

By Janice Page, Globe Correspondent | September 16, 2004

 

Boston Globe, MA

Sept 16 2004

 

[parts omitted]

 

'Germany and the Secret Genocide' One and a half million citizens of

the Ottoman Empire were exterminated between 1915 and 1923 during

the Armenian Genocide, and it's the position of this J. Michael

Hogopian-directed documentary that Germany bears substantial

responsibility -- if not for the Turkish government-ordered killings,

then at least for their coverup. Hogopian's collection of evidence

seems well-researched and historically important. Unfortunately,

it's more academic case-building than anything else.

 

 

------------

 

Anyone had the chance to see it?

[gurgen]

If they're going to release it on DVD be sure to let me know.

[Bakersfieldian]

Rediculous!

 

If you can't get your true enemy, go after the one the rest of the world blames for damn near everything.

 

Maybe he's trying to make some jewish friends.

 

Hagopian should be ashamed.

[DominO123]

Rediculous!

 

If you can't get your true enemy, go after the one the rest of the world blames for damn near everything.

 

Maybe he's trying to make some jewish friends.

 

Hagopian should be ashamed.

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German implication is well documented.

[ED]

Rediculous!

 

If you can't get your true enemy, go after the one the rest of the world blames for damn near everything.

 

Maybe he's trying to make some jewish friends.

 

Hagopian should be ashamed.

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I hope you will be able you answer your own remark by reading this, its important to realize Germany at the time did not commit the Genocide but wildly contributed in that aspect, this is just Dadrians work there are countless documents which spread unmistakable and cooperative alliance both Germany and Turkey at the time, to think being so close ally of Turkey Germany had no hand in it?

 

Now that’s ridicules, I see nothing wrong in the documentary and should be explored to the core if there is anything else up to this day haven’t been brought up to prove Germany's role, has nothing to do with jews whats so ever

 

http://www.h-net.msu.edu/reviews/showrev.c...=27841868967506

Edited September 21, 2004 by Edward

[skhara]

Why do you want to explore German contribution, but not the Jewish one?

 

Just asking....

[DominO123]

Why do you want to explore German contribution, but not the Jewish one? 

 

Just asking....

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Good question, and the answer is obvious.

 

There was a German Empire that was Ottoman ally... German support was an Empire support to an Empire... there was no Jewish Empire.

 

Germans provided arms, immunition, material, logistic supports, there Eastern division was considerable and Germany as an Empire greatly facilitated the genocide.

 

Germany COULD HAVE stopped the genocide, they havn't tried.

 

On the other hand one find Jewish involvement when trying to find the ethnicity of members of the Ittihadist... but ethnicity in this cases is irrelevent. The crime was commited, and a "modern" Turkish republic has arisen from it, not an Israel.

[Nakharar]

If I am not mistaken only one member of the Ittihadists was Jewish. The Finance minister (what else would you expect ) was Jewish. Why are we so desperate to find a Jewish connection? To satisfy our primitive anti-semitic urges?

[Nakharar]

I don't know what Dadrian's motivation is but his work is meticulous and reminds me of a prosecutor trying to construct a case. His articles in other journals are a testimonial to this. I've read his book German Responsibility in the Armenian Genocide: A Review of the Historical Evidence of German Complicity and I have to say that his writing is quite dense and assertive.

[DominO123]

There was a little more Jews than one, but this has nothing to do with Jewishness, but rather education, Jews like Armenians were getting more educated than the general Muslim population, and many Jews were converting to have Muslim advantages... on top of the system it was obvious that you would find Jews, and more so, when Jews like Armenians are generally a lot attracted by politic.

 

About Dadrian I agree, a moron "scholar" already criticised his work and claimed he did not bring much evidences etc... when someone says something like that about Dadrian, he in the same time reject all the works writen about the Shoah... there hardly is any searcher that document as much as Dadrian... did you see all the references and footnotes he uses? Hardly one will even find something similar in this domain or any other domain.

[lulo]

If this website is not known yet, then check it:

 

http://www.armenocide.de/armenocide/armgen...En?OpenFrameset

 

Wolfgang & Sigrid Gust (Ed.)

 

The Armenian Genocide during the First World War

Documents from German State Archives

Edition I

 

Revised and Extended Edition of the Collection of Diplomatic Documents published by Johannes Lepsius in 1919 under the Title: "Germany and Armenia"

[skhara]

There was a little more Jews than one, but this has nothing to do with Jewishness, but rather education, Jews like Armenians were getting more educated than the general Muslim population

 

Yeah, except Armenians kept to their Christian values, and didn't take the reigns of a generally savage Muslim population and use them to destroy the people who were their main economic competition. After all, the bible says "love thy neighbor", while the Talmud says the goyim are nothing but animals.

 

Those Jews didn't exactly convert. They had their own Donme doctrine.

 

If I am not mistaken only one member of the Ittihadists was Jewish. The Finance minister (what else would you expect ) was Jewish. Why are we so desperate to find a Jewish connection? To satisfy our primitive anti-semitic urges?

 

Nobody is desperate to find a Jewish connection. Read up on the Young Turks, it will hit you right in the face. The first time I ever even heard that Ataturk came from the Donme, I read an article that had nothing to with the genocide. It was an article printed in a Jewish newspaper in New York.

 

 

Here is a question one Armenian is asking and sugesting an answer....

 

These references to the relationship between the Donmè, the Masons, and the Young Turks has not been prompted by anti-Semitism or Masonophobia. Rather, we are attempting to shed some light on what to us seems like a puzzling paradox in this revolutionary movement, which is: Why it is that this non-Turkish leadership struggled so hard under the banner of justice for the Turkish people? Also, why is it that others, having nothing to do with Sunnite Islam [the form of Islam practiced in Turkey] struggled equally hard under the banner of justice for Islam? The only answer to this paradox demands that we consider that there may have been another reason  behind their fervid struggle, and that this unstated cause is what bound these "ideologues" together.

 

Source

 

Nakharar, Domino, please read the whole article and carefully consider the information this man is presenting.

 

Also, Germany could not have stopped the Genocide. They could have dropped their support for Turks true, but they could not have stopped anything. Only the Young Turk government could have stopped it. What about France and England? Why didn't they stop the Turks from invading Eastern Armenia?

[THOTH]

If I am not mistaken only one member of the Ittihadists was Jewish. The Finance minister (what else would you expect ) was Jewish. Why are we so desperate to find a Jewish connection? To satisfy our primitive anti-semitic urges?

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...I think your onto something here Nakharar...

 

..don't these Armenians understand that this is the same sort of distortion, half truth and racism that has been used against us...

[DominO123]

Yeah, except Armenians kept to their Christian values, and didn't take the reigns of a generally savage Muslim population and use them to destroy the people who were their main economic competition.  After all, the bible says "love thy neighbor", while the Talmud says the goyim are nothing but animals.

 

Those Jews didn't exactly convert.  They had their own Donme doctrine.

Nobody is desperate to find a Jewish connection.  Read up on the Young Turks, it will hit you right in the face.  The first time I ever even heard that Ataturk came from the Donme, I read an article that had nothing to with the genocide.  It was an article printed in a Jewish newspaper in New York.

Here is a question one Armenian is asking and sugesting an answer....

Source

 

Nakharar, Domino, please read the whole article and carefully consider the information this man is presenting.

 

Also, Germany could not have stopped the Genocide.  They could have dropped their support for Turks true, but they could not have stopped anything.  Only the Young Turk government could have stopped it.  What about France and England?  Why didn't they stop the Turks from invading Eastern Armenia?

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skhara, I've read anything you can show me about the Young-Turks and much more.

 

But again, reread what I've wrote. It doesn't change anything, since the crime was commited to build a homogenous Turkish nation, not Jewish.

[Nakharar]

I don't think anything is going to hit me right in the face. You don't have to mention these to me as I am familiar with all of them. It's much better if you take that article with a pinch of salt. Afterall the Greeks are hardly the best friends of the Turks and Jews, so its objectivity will be dubious.

 

I for one would be very happy if we had such devoted "Jews" who would serve their masters so faithfully and dutifully that they even would go so far as to discard their idenity for them.

 

They must be every nation's ideal of a perfect minority. Unbelievably loyal and subservient and eager to - forget assimilation- dissipate.

[skhara]

Afterall the Greeks are hardly the best friends of the Turks and Jews, so its objectivity will be dubious.

 

This is from a greek source, the author of the article is Armenian. His name is on the bottom. Neither are Turks and Jews our friends, the sooner you guys realise this the better. The Greeks are our friends. Best friends.l

 

I for one would be very happy if we had such devoted "Jews" who would serve their masters so faithfully and dutifully that they even would go so far as to discard their idenity for them.

 

Are you kidding me? Faithful and Dutifu? Masters? Giving up their identity? I thought you said you were familiar with all of them?

 

They were the masters of a generally stupid muslim population! It's like they created their own country in their own image from the ruins of the Ottoman empire. Most importantly a nation with no Armenians. Did you guys know that Armenian peasants fed the whole empire? Did you know that there was 15 years of famine that followed as a result of destroying the food producers?

 

 

Also, on the German involvement, no one can deny that. I think Germany has the most documented evidence on the events in the Ottoman empire in 1915. They probably keep it hidden in a vault ready to use against the Turks when they need to.

 

On the Jewish componnent. I know that Jews were involved in the destruction of our people. I know that they did it for themselves. I will continue researching this connection and will post my findings for your considiration. Also, I am curious, what do your parents and grandparents think of the Jewish involvement?

[Nakharar]

Hmm, Greeks our best friends? That’s news to me. I don’t remember saying that Turks and Jews are our best friends. The truth is that Armenians have no friends at all.

 

I for one would be very happy if we had such devoted "Jews" who would serve their masters so faithfully and dutifully that they even would go so far as to discard their idenity for them.

 

Are you kidding me? Faithful and Dutifu? Masters? Giving up their identity? I thought you said you were familiar with all of them?

 

They were the masters of a generally stupid muslim population! It's like they created their own country in their own image from the ruins of the Ottoman empire. Most importantly a nation with no Armenians. Did you guys know that Armenian peasants fed the whole empire? Did you know that there was 15 years of famine that followed as a result of destroying the food producers?

 

You take things too literally. There is a word called sarcasm. Now, you know. You have to read paragraphs instead of word to word.

 

The Ottomans relegated all trade and commerce to the non-Muslim minorities, including Armenians. They considered these things unworthy for themselves. They were busy with the administrative and military affairs of the Empire. They did the occasional taxfarming. That Turks starved after the Armenians were liquidated must be new evidence. That is highly unlikely in a country that consisted and still consists of subsistence farmers.

 

Also, on the German involvement, no one can deny that. I think Germany has the most documented evidence on the events in the Ottoman empire in 1915. They probably keep it hidden in a vault ready to use against the Turks when they need to.

 

On the Jewish componnent. I know that Jews were involved in the destruction of our people. I know that they did it for themselves. I will continue researching this connection and will post my findings for your considiration. Also, I am curious, what do your parents and grandparents think of the Jewish involvement?

 

That Germans put a lid on their archives to hold up cards against the Turks is ridiculous beyond belief. What do they have to be embarrassed about? I guess the Holocaust isn’t embarrassing enough.

 

You are free to believe what you like. According to your logic anyone could be behind the Armenians’ deaths. God beware, even Armenians could have had a hand in the slaughter of their kin!?

Please don’t rehash the horsesmith/shoesmith/cobbler tales from Lebanon and/or Syria about the evil Jews with long fangs and tails. You are giving the Turks the greatest compliment they could ever get by absolving them from the Armenian Genocide.

[DominO123]

You are free to believe what you like. According to your logic anyone could be behind the Armenians’ deaths. God beware, even Armenians could have had a hand in the slaughter of their kin!?

Please don’t rehash the horsesmith/shoesmith/cobbler tales from Lebanon and/or Syria about the evil Jews with long fangs and tails. You are giving the Turks the greatest compliment they could ever get by absolving them from the Armenian Genocide.

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EXACTLY!!!

 

Beside that, the Germans have absolutly no reason to hide materials regarding the genocide to use it later, and it is already known and documented that the Germans handed most of the documents incriminating the Turks back to the Turks because of a contract that both empires have signed... as well as destroying many of the documents incriminating them in the participation of the genocide.

[skhara]

You are giving the Turks the greatest compliment they could ever get by absolving them from the Armenian Genocide.

 

I'm not absolving them of being savage cowards. Try telling a Turk that Daddy turk was a Jew and watch them throw a quite entertaining temper tantrem.

 

That Turks starved after the Armenians were liquidated must be new evidence. That is highly unlikely in a country that consisted and still consists of subsistence farmers.

 

I have read this some time back and will look into some more.

 

That Germans put a lid on their archives to hold up cards against the Turks is ridiculous beyond belief.

 

Ridiculous?! Why is it ridiculous? The Brits and US do the same with Turkey. When US wanted Turkish bases for the Iraq war and Turkey refused, Bush threatened them with genocide recognition. Of coarse the Zionists would never allow that.