THOTH Posted February 15, 2004 Report Share Posted February 15, 2004 Actualy Sip its more abotu what isn't being said...anyway...the point of this post has i think been made...though I think it was somewhat overstated. Sure - B may have reflect somewhat Hitler's platform (don't know really) or some aspects of his personality...but clearly much (arguably the most improtant things for conisderation) has been left out....but the orignal point wasnot really that you were voting for Hitler - as this is an absurd claim regardless..but that one (most folks) tends to go for socialistic solutions and to be wary about more anarchistic or revolutioanry approaches...jst natural I guess as the latter seems more warm and snuggly etc - LOL...but as both are taken so far out of contecxt to be at all meaningful - well -I think the point has been made to the extent that it deserves and don't see the value in now claiming that folks who chose B chose Hitler. etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vava Posted February 15, 2004 Report Share Posted February 15, 2004 Hitler ran for the leadership upon the well-documented platform of the NSDAP party - the program is quoted below: Based on some of the points - particularly #4,8 & 25 - the description of 'B' as Hitler, although not untrue, is clearly lacking much precision; and this deliberately in order to incite votes for candidate B. I'm sure we could claim the same imprecision for 'A'. The program of the NSDAP The Party Program of the NSDAP was proclaimed on the 24 February 1920 by Adolf Hitler at the first large Party gathering in Munich and since that day has remained unaltered. Within the national socialist philosophy is summarized in 25 points: 1. We demand the unification of all Germans in the Greater Germany on the basis of the right of self-determination of peoples. 2. We demand equality of rights for the German people in respect to the other nations; abrogation of the peace treaties of Versailles and St. Germain. 3. We demand land and territory (colonies) for the sustenance of our people, and colonization for our surplus population. 4. Only a member of the race can be a citizen. A member of the race can only be one who is of German blood, without consideration of creed. Consequently no Jew can be a member of the race. 5. Whoever has no citizenship is to be able to live in Germany only as a guest, and must be under the authority of legislation for foreigners. 6. The right to determine matters concerning administration and law belongs only to the citizen. Therefore we demand that every public office, of any sort whatsoever, whether in the Reich, the county or municipality, be filled only by citizens. We combat the corrupting parliamentary economy, office-holding only according to party inclinations without consideration of character or abilities. 7. We demand that the state be charged first with providing the opportunity for a livelihood and way of life for the citizens. If it is impossible to sustain the total population of the State, then the members of foreign nations (non-citizens) are to be expelled from the Reich. 8. Any further immigration of non-citizens is to be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans, who have immigrated to Germany since the 2 August 1914, be forced immediately to leave the Reich. 9. All citizens must have equal rights and obligations. 10. The first obligation of every citizen must be to work both spiritually and physically. The activity of individuals is not to counteract the interests of the universality, but must have its result within the framework of the whole for the benefit of all Consequently we demand: 11. Abolition of unearned (work and labour) incomes. Breaking of rent-slavery. 12. In consideration of the monstrous sacrifice in property and blood that each war demands of the people personal enrichment through a war must be designated as a crime against the people. Therefore we demand the total confiscation of all war profits. 13. We demand the nationalization of all (previous) associated industries (trusts). 14. We demand a division of profits of all heavy industries. 15. We demand an expansion on a large scale of old age welfare. 16. We demand the creation of a healthy middle class and its conservation, immediate communalization of the great warehouses and their being leased at low cost to small firms, the utmost consideration of all small firms in contracts with the State, county or municipality. 17. We demand a land reform suitable to our needs, provision of a law for the free expropriation of land for the purposes of public utility, abolition of taxes on land and prevention of all speculation in land. 18. We demand struggle without consideration against those whose activity is injurious to the general interest. Common national criminals, usurers, Schieber and so forth are to be punished with death, without consideration of confession or race. 19. We demand substitution of a German common law in place of the Roman Law serving a materialistic world-order. 20. The state is to be responsible for a fundamental reconstruction of our whole national education program, to enable every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education and subsequently introduction into leading positions. The plans of instruction of all educational institutions are to conform with the experiences of practical life. The comprehension of the concept of the State must be striven for by the school [staatsbuergerkunde] as early as the beginning of understanding. We demand the education at the expense of the State of outstanding intellectually gifted children of poor parents without consideration of position or profession. 21. The State is to care for the elevating national health by protecting the mother and child, by outlawing child-labor, by the encouragement of physical fitness, by means of the legal establishment of a gymnastic and sport obligation, by the utmost support of all organizations concerned with the physical instruction of the young. 22. We demand abolition of the mercenary troops and formation of a national army. 23. We demand legal opposition to known lies and their promulgation through the press. In order to enable the provision of a German press, we demand, that: a. All writers and employees of the newspapers appearing in the German language be members of the race: b. Non-German newspapers be required to have the express permission of the State to be published. They may not be printed in the German language: c. Non-Germans are forbidden by law any financial interest in German publications, or any influence on them, and as punishment for violations the closing of such a publication as well as the immediate expulsion from the Reich of the non-German concerned. Publications which are counter to the general good are to be forbidden. We demand legal prosecution of artistic and literary forms which exert a destructive influence on our national life, and the closure of organizations opposing the above made demands. 24. We demand freedom of religion for all religious denominations within the state so long as they do not endanger its existence or oppose the moral senses of the Germanic race. The Party as such advocates the standpoint of a positive Christianity without binding itself confessionally to any one denomination. It combats the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and around us, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our nation can only succeed from within on the framework: common utility precedes individual utility. 25. For the execution of all of this we demand the formation of a strong central power in the Reich. Unlimited authority of the central parliament over the whole Reich and its organizations in general. The forming of state and profession chambers for the execution of the laws made by the Reich within the various states of the confederation. The leaders of the Party promise, if necessary by sacrificing their own lives, to support by the execution of the points set forth above without consideration. Source: Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression Volume IV Office of the United States Chief Counsel for Prosecution of Axis Criminality Washington, DC : United States Government Printing Office, 1946 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted February 15, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2004 (edited) You keep reliving your Hitler fantasy but there is no mention of vegeterianism nor storm troopers in description B. B seems to be in favor of "promotion of whole-grain bread and soybeans" which by itself does not imply vegetarianism. As a matter of fact, candidate A may be a vegeterian just as much as candidate B might be. I think what you are proving with this experiment is how much people tend to read more into a description than what is actually being said. You can technically nitpick the specifics, but my example was purely theoretical between someone who is a statist, a socialistic candidate, much like our present candidates, and someone who is what the framers of the constitution were. How you vote determines who you think. Cheers. Edited February 15, 2004 by Anonymouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted February 15, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2004 Hitler ran for the leadership upon the well-documented platform of the NSDAP party - the program is quoted below: Based on some of the points - particularly #4,8 & 25 - the description of 'B' as Hitler, although not untrue, is clearly lacking much precision; and this deliberately in order to incite votes for candidate B. I'm sure we could claim the same imprecision for 'A'. Source: Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression Volume IV Office of the United States Chief Counsel for Prosecution of Axis Criminality Washington, DC : United States Government Printing Office, 1946 Precisely my point. Grazie, for posting that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THOTH Posted February 16, 2004 Report Share Posted February 16, 2004 (edited) Hitler ran for the leadership upon the well-documented platform of the NSDAP party - the program is quoted below: Based on some of the points - particularly #4,8 & 25 - the description of 'B' as Hitler, although not untrue, is clearly lacking much precision; and this deliberately in order to incite votes for candidate B. I'm sure we could claim the same imprecision for 'A'. Source: Nazi Conspiracy and Aggression Volume IV Office of the United States Chief Counsel for Prosecution of Axis Criminality Washington, DC : United States Government Printing Office, 1946 Actually 4, 8 & 25 seem to be fairly central points eh? And ones which Mouse was very clearly claiming were not part of the party platform (he stated that there were no concentrations camps or mention of war and such in the platform - well duh - but anti -Jew certaily was...changes things jjst a bit eh? So vava I think Mouse is thanking you because he is getting off on his bud Hitler (kill the Jews etc..oh I forgot - they are not really Jews...etc etc...)..not for furthering anythign he was trying to say in this thread... Edited February 16, 2004 by THOTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anonymouse Posted February 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2004 Actually 4, 8 & 25 seem to be fairly central points eh? And ones which Mouse was very clearly claiming were not part of the party platform (he stated that there were no concentrations camps or mention of war and such in the platform - well duh - but anti -Jew certaily was...changes things jjst a bit eh? So vava I think Mouse is thanking you because he is getting off on his bud Hitler (kill the Jews etc..oh I forgot - they are not really Jews...etc etc...)..not for furthering anythign he was trying to say in this thread... Can you wait while I get my blah blah blah blah translator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurgen Posted February 16, 2004 Report Share Posted February 16, 2004 And ones which Mouse was very clearly claiming were not part of the party platform (he stated that there were no concentrations camps or mention of war and such in the platform - well duh - but anti -Jew certaily was...changes things jjst a bit eh? And that's exactly what he meant. So did I, if you bothered to actually read my post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominO123 Posted February 16, 2004 Report Share Posted February 16, 2004 Gurgen, why don't you let big "guys" discuss what ever they want? Why do you need to constantly inject in conversations which obviously you have no clue about? You know, you don't have to answer to this question if you don't want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurgen Posted February 17, 2004 Report Share Posted February 17, 2004 I'm sorry mighty sage, I will not interfere anymore. I assumed there was something like freedom of speech. But I'll let the 'big guys' like yourself (not so big in spelling though) get on with it. And if you don't want me to answer questions don't ask them g00f. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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