RAFFI the PROPHET

[Anaheet]

Harut dont think Im trying to make Armenians look like the wholy christian nation of God...I hate christianity, and all other Semite religions. If it were up to me I would erase christianity from the history of the Armenians and replace it with Kragapasht.

What's Kragapasht? Why is it superior?

[Anaheet]

No, instead you'd rather have it up to the Jew to control your destiny. Of coarse, it's the blind idiocy of the Armenian's to do so...

Um, hello, Jews (most of them) are not Christian...Christianity may have originally been derived from Judaism but it has diverged from it (or one might say Judaism has diverged from it- they share a common root).

 

Besides that, what's wrong with having a Jewish-derived religion? You got something against Jewish people? They are nice folks- also much persecuted, also with a Diaspora.

[THOTH]

Besides that, what's wrong with having a Jewish-derived religion? You got something against Jewish people? They are nice folks- also much persecuted, also with a Diaspora.

Again - I like the sense you make...many (but not all here of course) take a widely divergent view from what you have just stated...shame...I think there is a difference between a people (and from judging people) then from judging how certain representatives of (a) people think/act...etc...just as I know and like many Turks and have a fondness for Turkish people (as essentially being very much like us) - while at the same time I abhor the Turkish Governemnt and certain aspects of Turkish society (and perhaps the aspect of the culture that breeds chavanism and such...yeah speaking of - many Armenains are like the Turks in that too....)

[koko]

Um, hello, Jews (most of them) are not Christian...Christianity may have originally been derived from Judaism but it has diverged from it (or one might say Judaism has diverged from it- they share a common root).

 

Besides that, what's wrong with having a Jewish-derived religion? You got something against Jewish people? They are nice folks- also much persecuted, also with a Diaspora.

 

Did anyone say a jew cant be nice?

 

And besides judaism is a religion, they can be turkish sweidish or even american or french.

 

and TashnagZinvor, if youre armenian youd know that judaism and armenians are not the same, they do not have the Same religion.

 

 

Again - I like the sense you make...many (but not all here of course) take a widely divergent view from what you have just stated...shame...I think there is a difference between a people (and from judging people) then from judging how certain representatives of (a) people think/act...etc...just as I know and like many Turks and have a fondness for Turkish people (as essentially being very much like us) - while at the same time I abhor the Turkish Governemnt and certain aspects of Turkish society (and perhaps the aspect of the culture that breeds chavanism and such...yeah speaking of - many Armenains are like the Turks in that too..

 

 

Remember our homeland used to be eastern turkey so it isnt a surprise that we share a lot of cultural aspects together. turks azgme goyotion choni, if youre armenian you should understand that.

[THOTH]

Remember our homeland used to be eastern turkey so it isnt a surprise that we share a lot of cultural aspects together. turks azgme goyotion choni, if youre armenian you should understand that.

of course and exactly...

[hytga]

just wanted to make a few coments about kurds and armenains. if you read raffi (a writer from late 1800's) i think you'd find a better understanding of how things worked than the modern infented crap.

And this goes especially to Munzur. you make it look like armenians were kurdish subjects and kurds were having their revenge by taking on other kurd's "slaves". perhaps there was 1 set of such tribes, but to say that the widespread harrasments that armenians constantly faced from armed kurdish bands were all the resultant works of 2 kurdish "clans" waring together is absurd.

Edited May 29, 2004 by hytga

[koko]

Dont be surprised a turk is always a turk and a kurd always a kurd,

 

Bajts yerpek yerpek nrank chen karoghana djndjel hyebatmotionne.

History cannot be changed, you get that into your thick heads.

 

Armenians were deported from their original homeland,

call it kurdistan, turkey...

why please armenians share some of your land with you there are plenty of different caucasian tribes, why so cheap, armenia/armenians?everyone is entitled to their "own homeland!!

[Arpa]

Kurds and Armenians may have a lot in common. They could be clones of one another, except for one distinction, Republic of Armenia is a sovereign state, a member of the world community while Kurdistan is still an amorphous collection of lands with no meaning.... yet!.

Kurds and Armenians have more in common than any two other people in that they have been both manipulated and used as tools by superpowers throughout their existence, at the present history is repeating again, Armenians are being used by the superpowers, true, but look at the Kurds. At least the Armenians may have a MORE defined identity, but look at the Kurds.

 

The Kurds can fend for themselves, they can benefit from the present geopolitics or not, but what have We learned, what are WE learning?

 

Walls (Berlin) have come down, curtains(Iron) have been torn apart, we were in disbeleif then as we are in a dream now. More walls will come down, more curtains will be torn. What do we know about them, what are we doing to benefit from the chaos that will ensue? What are our plans? Speaking of walls and curtains, when the Iron Curtain did break the earliest manifestations were when the Azeris on both sides of the Iranian borders poured over it, Russia could not stop it until Iran delineated their national boundariers once again.

 

Look at the story below. Can you see another "wall" coming down, another "curtain" being torn apart? How long do you think the Iraq-Turkey border will hold? How long before the Iraqi Kurds will breach and tear that wall down? Reminds me of Pres. Reagan's call; "Mr Gorbachev, tear this wall down!" Can you hear someone saying; "Mr. Turkoglu (whatever the hell his name may be) TEAR THIS WALL DOWN!" Of course, Mr. Turkoglu would love for the wall to come down so he can put his grubby hands on the oil fields. But once the wall is torn down there will be a two way traffic. How far will the south to north traffic go? How Kurdish are the Turkish Kurds? How Kurdish are the Arabic Kurds? What is a Kurd?

 

Look at the map of Kurdistan(?) one more time. Will "Erivan" be the capital of "kurdistan"?

 

What are WE doing about it?

=========

PLAN B

by SEYMOUR M. HERSH

As June 30th approaches, Israel looks to the Kurds.

Issue of 2004-06-28

Posted 2004-06-21

 

See full story here;

 

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/

 

The Israeli decision to seek a bigger foothold in Kurdistan—characterized by the former Israeli intelligence officer as “Plan B”—has also raised tensions between Israel and Turkey. It has provoked bitter statements from Turkish politicians and, in a major regional shift, a new alliance among Iran, Syria, and Turkey, all of which have significant Kurdish minorities. In early June, Intel Brief, a privately circulated intelligence newsletter produced by Vincent Cannistraro, a retired C.I.A. counterterrorism chief, and Philip Giraldi, who served as the C.I.A.’s deputy chief of base in Istanbul in the late nineteen-eighties, said:

 

Turkish sources confidentially report that the Turks are increasingly concerned by the expanding Israeli presence in Kurdistan and alleged encouragement of Kurdish ambitions to create an independent state. . . . The Turks note that the large Israeli intelligence operations in Northern Iraq incorporate anti-Syrian and anti-Iranian activity, including support to Iranian and Syrian Kurds who are in opposition to their respective governments.

 

 

In the years since the first Gulf War, Iraq’s Kurds, aided by an internationally enforced no-fly zone and by a U.N. mandate providing them with a share of the country’s oil revenues, have managed to achieve a large measure of independence in three northern Iraqi provinces. As far as most Kurds are concerned, however, historic “Kurdistan” extends well beyond Iraq’s borders, encompassing parts of Iran, Syria, and Turkey. All three countries fear that Kurdistan, despite public pledges to the contrary, will declare its independence from the interim Iraqi government if conditions don’t improve after June 30th.

[Stormig]

The difference of a defined identity? Is that it?

[koko]

stealing armenian infants, young girls and boys, taking their entire belongings and killing innocent people just to be able to have their lands, and labeling the name armenian and changing it to kurdish, if that makes them more closer to armenians,

Arpa, yes , then... what you say is true.

Edited June 23, 2004 by koko

[Arpa]

Under International topic we saw Thoth's stories about bombs in Istanbul.

Here is a related story that may be one of the main topic at the conference.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/06/23/...reut/index.html

[THOTH]

Yes very interesting Arpa. Poor Kurds - I really do feel for them....no easy solutions - and many enemies, many issues. Regardless of their past outrages against Armenains - Kurds are a people deserving more then their current lot.

 

And in fact Kurds are ethnically very close to Armenians - perhaps besides the point but it is true - and they have adapted much of the Armenain culture (as they became sedentary) and in some case carry on in place of Armenains in Eastern Anatolia where once Armenains were. Of course its very sad (bittersweet at best...) when one sees Kurds carrying on inhabitance of towns and villages and farming the land that were once Armenian...but at the same time you can also see that in a sense they are carrying on the tradition of culture/civilization that has existed there for milenia. And when I was there lookign upon the villages and the fields and the sheperds with their herds I saw Armenians of the past living on the land the very same way. Yes - the thought of them (effectively) supplanting us hurts a great deal - but just the same - in a sense the tradition carries on....amd how many of them actually have some (or a great deal) of Armenian blood in them?

 

As for NATO - it is my belief that the alliance's days are seriously numbered...with the Iraq debacle only quickening the rift...

[Arpa]

Yes very interesting Arpa. Poor Kurds - I really do feel for them....no easy solutions - and many enemies, many issues. Regardless of their past outrages against Armenains - Kurds are a people deserving more then their current lot.

 

And in fact Kurds are ethnically very close to Armenians - perhaps besides the point but it is true - and they have adapted much of the Armenain culture (as they became sedentary) and in some case carry on in place of Armenains in Eastern Anatolia where once Armenains were. Of course its very sad (bittersweet at best...) when one sees Kurds carrying on inhabitance of towns and villages and farming the l

======

 

And when I was there lookign upon the villages and the fields and the sheperds with their herds I saw Armenians of the past living on the land the very same way. Yes - the thought of them (effectively) supplanting us hurts a great deal - but just the same - in a sense the tradition carries on....amd how many of them actually have some (or a great deal) of Armenian blood in them?

What can I say?

Kurds and Armenians have had similar fates in the past, shafted by treaties and anti-treaties, and history is about to repeat one more time.

Kurds can do themselves and us a big favor; Instead of trying to reinvent the wheel all over again, read Armenian history. Better yet, study that history together with the Armenians and avoid the mistakes of yesteryear.

 

Just in case that link may be removed here is the story;

Maybe now we can watch that "movie" (Treaty of Sevre et al)all over again

 

Bush visit to Turkey caps thaw

Arrives in Ankara on Saturday night, talks with Erdogan

Wednesday, June 23, 2004 Posted: 11:36 AM EDT (1536 GMT)

 

 

ANKARA, Turkey (Reuters) -- U.S. President George W. Bush's visit to Turkey this weekend caps efforts to mend fences between the NATO allies after strains arising from the Iraq war.

 

Diplomats say Bush will hear anxious calls to deliver on U.S. pledges to crush Turkish Kurdish rebels in northern Iraq, but the overall mood will be warm.

 

"I would say that, despite continued concerns over northern Iraq, the two countries have never been so close," said Huseyin Bagci of Ankara's Middle East Technical University.

 

"Public opinion in Turkey may be anti-American these days, mainly because of Iraq, but this government is not."

 

A U.S. diplomat based in Ankara echoed his optimism. "Things are better than we could have predicted last summer," he said.

 

Traditionally warm ties hit rock-bottom last July when U.S. troops outraged Turkish pride by detaining 11 Turkish commandos in northern Iraq, throwing bags over their heads.

 

A small number of troops had been in the are for several years operating against Turkish Kurdish rebels.

 

The detention came a few months after the Ankara parliament stunned Washington by rejecting a U.S. request to let its troops attack Iraq, on a second front, from southeastern Turkey.

 

But Turkey, bordering on Iraq, Iran, Syria and the volatile Caucasus region, remains of key strategic interest to Washington.

 

Bush and Erdogan have worked hard to put things back on track, culminating in an invitation for the Turkish leader to the White House in January and then to a June summit of the Group of Eight leading industrial nations in Georgia.

 

Erdogan, leader of a Muslim country held up by Washington as a model of secular democracy for the rest of the Islamic world, joined the G-8's discussions on Bush's plans to promote democracy in the Middle East -- a theme likely to resurface in Ankara. (Bush urges stronger NATO role in Iraq)

 

Bush arrives in the Turkish capital on Saturday night, holds talks with Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, then flies to Turkey's business hub, Istanbul, for a NATO summit on Monday and Tuesday. (Bomb wounds Turkish officer)

 

Personal chemistry

 

The personal chemistry between the leaders is good.

 

"Bush and Erdogan get on well together," said Bagci, noting they were both straight-talking, religious-minded conservatives. Bush is an evangelical Christian and Erdogan a pious Muslim.

 

On the big issues, there is plenty for them to agree on.

 

Washington strongly backs Turkey's drive to win a date to start entry talks with the European Union and Bush has heaped praise on Erdogan's government for its human rights reforms.

 

The main thorn in relations remains Iraq, especially the Kurdish-dominated north which Ankara fears might secede and fuel separatism among Kurds in southeast Turkey.

 

In Turkish eyes, Washington's failure to stem the violence in Iraq has increased this risk. Erdogan is likely to seek more reassurances from Bush that the United States remains fully committed to Iraq's territorial unity, diplomats say. (U.S. raises figures for 2003 terrorist attacks)

 

But they say the United States is likely to politely brush aside Turkish demands for a crackdown on Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK) guerrillas hiding in northern Iraq, as Washington has too many other problems right now to take them on.

 

Turkey blames the PKK for a separatist conflict in southeast Turkey that killed more than 30,000 people, mainly Kurds, in the 1980s and 1990s. The violence, subdued since 1999, has ticked up recently after the rebels ended a six-year unilateral ceasefire.

[Arpa]

Yes very interesting Arpa. Poor Kurds - I really do feel for them....no easy solutions - and many enemies, many issues. Regardless of their past outrages against Armenains - Kurds are a people deserving more then their current lot.

Kurds have no one to blame but themselves.

"poor Kurds"? Why?

They claim to number 20 million, twice the population of Belgium. We can only wish we had those kinds of numbers within a defined area.

They are so confused they don't know which way to turn. Are they Persians, Arabs or Turks? They claim to be IndoEuropeans yet their affinity to the above pwople is simply based on religion (the hell with all religions!). They did that to us, even though they may have been ethnically closer to us they chose to side with the Moslem Ottomans. And now, even though we are ethnically and perhaps culturally related they will once again choose to antagonize us and, when the occasion arises will they once again agree to share destiny and territory with us?

I can write forever, but suffice it to say, they brought it on themselves and, I am sure they will repeat it again and again, and again.

Some people learn from past experience. It seems Kurds (and Armenians) were AWOL when brains were being allotted.

[Stormig]

Blood, land and scythe, and a note or two. That makes Kurdish culture and fate similar to those of Armenians? Well I'll be...

[Twilight Bark]

Kurds in Turkey, as a "collective", as a "culture", deserve nothing. They had been parasites feeding on the blood and flesh of Armenians, until they fully and enthusiastically conspired in finishing them off. Turkish and Kurdish cultures deserve each other. If they want to make each other miserable, let them.

 

Any similarity between Armenians and Kurds simply indicates an earlier theft by Kurds, be it brides, culture, land, or artifacts. Spare your compassion for more deserving cultures, not vultures. And in that context, there surely were a few Kurdish tribes that were friendly and humane. If you must sympathize with Kurds, sympathize with an "ashiret" that proved itself to be more than a bunch of bullies.

[nairi]

Has anyone seen "Vodka Lemon"? I've never even heard of it. I just now found out it's playing in Holland on July 18. Here's one site out of many that talks about it:

 

http://www.cineuropa.org/article_sp.asp?la...ocumentID=37291

[koko]

Kurds in Turkey, as a "collective", as a "culture", deserve nothing. They had been parasites feeding on the blood and flesh of Armenians, until they fully and enthusiastically conspired in finishing them off. Turkish and Kurdish cultures deserve each other. If they want to make each other miserable, let them.

 

Any similarity between Armenians and Kurds simply indicates an earlier theft by Kurds, be it brides, culture, land, or artifacts. Spare your compassion for more deserving cultures, not vultures. And in that context, there surely were a few Kurdish tribes that were friendly and humane. If you must sympathize with Kurds, sympathize with an "ashiret" that proved itself to be more than a bunch of bullies.

good point.

 

 

tooth and some others in this forum should grab a book and learn of what happened during the armenian genocide and after...

 

kurds are as bigger liers as the turks. You say dont blame the turks today, well,,,

how can we not when they so eagerly carry on their tradition of lying, manipulating and deseaving the hole world, ON OUR BEHALF.

[THOTH]

If you don't think I understand what the Kurds (funny I typed turks at first) did to us - during the Genocide and before (the mention of parasites etc - understood) then you are gravely mistaken. And there is no question that they gleefuly pounced when the oppurtunity was there. Don't you think it hurt me greatly when I saw our lands and towns and villages and there were no Armenians there? I understand and appreciate all of these things...still I cannot blame Kurdish people today who are just people living their lives - and I particualrly cannot feel animosity towards people - who like us (like we were) - are without a homeland to call their own - and who are being repressed. These are just people - and they are people who are really alot like us (even if this is a result of theft or what have you...) - regardless - but that was the past - will these blood fueds just go on forever? Sure I can be bitter about what Kurds have done - much like Turks - though with some differences of course...but even with Turks - do we not rise above and say we do not hold those who live now responsible - that it is their government and those who actively deny - and who continue to hate - that it is these types who deserve our animosity - not those who are ignorant - or in the case of many Kurds today - who relise what was done - and who are shamed and do regret - as many do...

 

I have some Kurdish friends (originally from Iran). And when they talk about their families - what they do togther - and such - well I can't help but see them as very much like us - even if some of this is because of what they assimilated from us. And these are good people - aware people - knowledgable people - who know what was done to the Armenians - very much so...and they now find themselves in a similar plight as we once were in - and to some extent still are (not the same at all of course)...but still they are befrit of nation and at the mercy of others and their culturte is supressed. And I have met other Kurds - here in the states primarily - who always react with compassion and understanding when I tell them I am Armenian - and they view us as brothers. Sure - obviously this was once not at all the case...but when does it stop? Can we hope to survive and prosper if we continue to keep all animosoties alive? Shouldn't we thus hate the Persians, the Russians, the Greeks and just about everyone else we have encountered in our history? Sure - our experience with the Kurds has been most recent - and more directly affecting those of us today...but we cannot hate people just for the sins of their forefathers and shouldn't turn a blind eye to the inequities being experienced by others just because of our past history with them.

[Twilight Bark]

If you don't think I understand what the Kurds (funny I typed turks at first) did to us - during the Genocide and before (the mention of parasites etc - understood) then you are gravely mistaken. And there is no question that they gleefuly pounced when the oppurtunity was there. Don't you think it hurt me greatly when I saw our lands and towns and villages and there were no Armenians there? I understand and appreciate all of these things...still I cannot blame Kurdish people today who are just people living their lives - and I particualrly cannot feel animosity towards people - who like us (like we were) - are without a homeland to call their own - and who are being repressed. These are just people - and they are people who are really alot like us (even if this is a result of theft or what have you...) - regardless - but that was the past - will these blood fueds just go on forever? Sure I can be bitter about what Kurds have done - much like Turks - though with some differences of course...but even with Turks - do we not rise above and say we do not hold those who live now responsible - that it is their government and those who actively deny - and who continue to hate - that it is these types who deserve our animosity - not those who are ignorant - or in the case of many Kurds today - who relise what was done - and who are shamed and do regret - as many do...

 

I have some Kurdish friends (originally from Iran). And when they talk about their families - what they do togther - and such - well I can't help but see them as very much like us - even if some of this is because of what they assimilated from us. And these are good people - aware people - knowledgable people - who know what was done to the Armenians - very much so...and they now find themselves in a similar plight as we once were in - and to some extent still are (not the same at all of course)...but still they are befrit of nation and at the mercy of others and their culturte is supressed. And I have met other Kurds - here in the states primarily - who always react with compassion and understanding when I tell them I am Armenian - and they view us as brothers. Sure - obviously this was once not at all the case...but when does it stop? Can we hope to survive and prosper if we continue to keep all animosoties alive? Shouldn't we thus hate the Persians, the Russians, the Greeks and just about everyone else we have encountered in our history? Sure - our experience with the Kurds has been most recent - and more directly affecting those of us today...but we cannot hate people just for the sins of their forefathers and shouldn't turn a blind eye to the inequities being experienced by others just because of our past history with them.

Thoth,

 

This is not about what you understand or don't understand (you have a habit of saying "Don't you think I know that too"). This is not about you at all. This is not about individuals. This is not about whether individual Kurds are just ordinary folk going about their business. And this is not about keeping old animosities. This is about whether a culture has the moral standing to demand respect. After a certain point, probably a few centuries ago, but certainly by 1900, Kurds as a collective, as a group, as a "culture", had lost any moral ground to demand respect other than by the usual means, i.e. the gun. Turkish culture belongs in the same class, but did receive the "respect" that it demanded, again by the usual means, the gun. I see no reason to grant the Kurdish culture any "respect" out of some moral argument, for the simple reason that they do not deserve any such thing by virtue of their past behavior that more or less defines their culture. If and when they earn "respect" I will grant the kind of respect that they earned. From the corner they painted themselves in, the only "respect" they can (re)earn is the kind that you show to a bandit with a gun.

 

Armenians certainly needed to earn the same kind of respect from their neighbors, and failed at that (and therefore I believe they lack the moral right to demand territories outright; i.e. they didn't fight for it in big enough numbers by far). But that is a different story.

 

Again, I have nothing but affection for an individual that is being harrassed unjustifiably. However, I question the necessity to cling to a cultural identity that has contributed a net negative to humanity. Therefore, I see no moral reason to feel sorry about the collective plight of that identity. However, I do see a rational reason for preserving Kurdish cultural identity for the simple reason that its assimilation into the dominant Turkish culture would likely make the latter even more arrogant than it is already.

[THOTH]

However, I do see a rational reason for preserving Kurdish cultural identity for the simple reason that its assimilation into the dominant Turkish culture would likely make the latter even more arrogant than it is already.

LOL - good one.

 

OK - I think I see your point (is this the same as me saying don't you think I already know that? LOL) ....and I can understand your view...but I still see it differently...

[Arpa]

Can we hope to survive and prosper if we continue to keep all animosoties alive? Shouldn't we thus hate the Persians, the Russians, the Greeks and just about everyone else we have encountered in our history? Sure - our experience with the Kurds has been most recent - and more directly affecting those of us today...but we cannot hate people just for the sins of their forefathers and shouldn't turn a blind eye to the inequities being experienced by others just because of our past history with them.

Forgive and forget?

 

Forgive?

 

By all means! We already have.

Have we forgiven the Greek, the Roman, the Byzantian, the Persian, the Arab, the Russian?

 

Shall we forget?

 

Only if we want to relive all those atrocities over again.

As to Kurds, we have already forgiven, there are those who are actively trying to collaborate with them, yet as I have said on numerous occasions, do remember, not to say hit them over the head with every little historical detail.

Do the Kurds have a forum similar to this?

Does anyone read it?

What do they say about us?

Do they view us as allies or foes, a nuisance?

Do they even talk about us as we do about them?

Are they willing to collaborate with us to liberate our respective lands?

Do they acknowledge that we both have claims over the same lands?

Are they willing to share, form an alliance against the common evil?

What role can we play in the struggle?

Remember that Armenia is a sovereign state, Kurdistan is not.

Sovereign states have ways and means of procuring and providing tools of struggle. Even if Iraqi Kurds may have means of procuring those tools now, that may be temporary and it may turn around, to shoot themselves in the foot again.

Does anyone know knowledgable and influential Kurds? Let us invite them here and hear what THEY have to say about the matter.

It reminds me of an old Armenian saying; "The bride is all dolled up but there is no groom in sight". Or as Anush(opera) would sing; "Es inch tesak harsanik e voch hars unink voch pesa.?" (What kind of wedding is this, we have no bride nor a groom?)

[Stormig]

Does anyone know knowledgable and influential Kurds? Let us invite them here and hear what THEY have to say about the matter.

Oh oh oh! One of the first things I would ask is why their vocal groups still remember with respect, posters, and flags the human blimp sitting in a plane flying out of Kenya and pledging his allegiance was for Turkey and why they are so pathetic and desperate.

[koko]

Tooth,

so a kurd from iran has a right to say that his homeland is armdhan hayaastan?

 

I for one dont fall for the propaganda that is all around the world, i do not belive in evething i read, becauase i am much smarter than that...and i know some facts and can put one and two together.

 

Just as the azeris were fed up with natioanlistic turkish propaganda ,and it resulted in the mass killings of armenians in azerbadjiani cities.

here in sweden a kurd can claim western historic armenia to be kurdistan, but nevertheless he doesnt know anything about armenia and surely not even heard the name.

Maybe that has changed with all the armenian students around talking about armenia ..etc. but their ignorance is due to the propaganda that is fed up by the state, and the political powers.

 

we , my family, have kurdish friends, turkish friends, etc. as well but that doesnt make it acceptable to hear them make up stories and take advantage of my people.

[THOTH]

When did I say a Kurdish homeland in Western Armenia? I'm refering to Northern Iraq (primarily)....

 

...and just because the Kurds have a deficit of good leadership does this mean they should get no consideration? Does the same apply to the Chechens?

 

Look - all I have expressed is my sympathies for these people - regardless of our past history - and I feel for these people who - like us have been without a homeland of our own....I haven't proposed any specific solutions and I know that there are a great many landmines and issues out there...