Ludwig9

http://www.memocast.com/cat.aspx?id=18077 For those who enjoyed the VEM program on mp3 the TV episodes are available now. Also memocast.com offers other Armenian shows, documentaries and programs.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,245047,00.html Three Arrested in Turkey for Murder of Outspoken Journalist Hrant Dink ISTANBUL, Turkey — Istanbul governor Muammer Guler said three people were arrested in connection with the murder of journalist Hrant Dink earlier on Friday, CNN-Turk television reported. No further information was provided on the arrests. Earlier in the day, two people were arrested, only to be released when officials decided they had no connection to the crime. Dink was one of the most prominent voices of Turkey's Armenian community, and a frequent target of nationalist anger. Dink faced constant threats and legal proceedings as one of the most prominent voices of Turkey's shrinking Armenian community was shot to death Friday at the entrance to his newspaper's offices, police said. Click here for more news from Europe. Dink, a 53-year-old Turkish citizen of Armenian descent, had gone on trial numerous times for speaking out about the mass killings of Armenians by Turks at the beginning of the 20th century. He had also received threats from nationalists, who viewed him as a traitor. Dink, who edited the bilingual Turkish-Armenian newspaper Agos, said in his last column on Jan. 10 that he had become famous as an enemy of Turks and had received no protection from authorities despite his numerous complaints about the threats against him. "My computer's memory is loaded with sentences full of hatred and threats," Dink wrote. "I am just like a pigeon. ... I look around to my left and right, in front and behind me as much as it does. My head is just as active." He ended the column by predicting this would be a difficult year, but he would survive it. "For me, 2007 is likely to be a hard year. The trials will continue, new ones will be started. Who knows what other injustices I will be up against," he wrote. Dink's killing drew condemnation from Europe, Armenia, the United States and numerous media freedom and human rights organizations. Thousands of Turks marched down the street where he died, blocking traffic and carrying posters bearing his photo. In October 2005, Dink was convicted of trying to influence the judiciary after Agos ran stories criticizing a law making it a crime to insult Turkey, the Turkish government or the Turkish national character. He was given a six-month suspended sentence. The conviction was rare even in a country where trials of journalists, academics and writers have become common. Most of the cases, including that of the Nobel Prize-winning novelist Orhan Pamuk, were either dropped on a technicality or led to acquittals. Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan condemned Dink's death as an attack against Turkey's unity and promised to catch those responsible. He said he had appointed top officials from the Justice and Security ministries to investigate the killing. Click here for more news from Europe. "Once again, dark hands have chosen our country and spilled blood in Istanbul to achieve their dark goals," Erdogan said. Dink cried during an interview with The Associated Press last year as he talked about some of his countrymen's hatred for him, saying he could not stay in a country where he was unwanted. "I'm living together with Turks in this country," Dink told the AP. "I don't think I could live with an identity of having insulted them in this country ... if I am unable to come up with a positive result, it will be honorable for me to leave this country." The New York-based Committee to Protect Journalists said 18 Turkish journalists have been killed for their work in the past 18 years. "Like dozens of other Turkish journalists, Dink has faced political persecution for his work and now appears to have paid the ultimate price for it," CPJ Middle East Program Coordinator Joel Campagna said. "Turkish authorities must ensure that this crime, like past ones, does not go unpunished." Two people detained in the killing were later released because they had no relationship to the crime, news reports said. Turkey's relationship with its Armenian community is fraught with tension and painful memories of a brutal past. Much of Turkey's once-sizeable Armenian population was killed or driven out of the country from 1915-1923 in what an increasing number of countries are recognizing as the first genocide of the 20th century. Turkey acknowledges that large numbers of Armenians died but vehemently denies it was genocide, saying the overall figure is inflated and the deaths occurred in the civil unrest during the collapse of the Ottoman Empire. Turkey, which is overwhelmingly Muslim, and Armenia, which claims to be the first country to official adopt Christianity, share a border, but it is closed and the two countries have no formal diplomatic relations. Can Dundar, Dink's friend and fellow journalist, said he wished Dink had left the country as he once promised he would in the face of the threats, protests and legal proceedings against him. "Hrant's body is lying on the ground as if those bullets were fired at Turkey," Dundar told private NTV television. Dink's body was covered with a white sheet in front of the newspaper's entrance. NTV said four empty shell casings were found on the ground and that he was killed by two bullets to the head. Workers at the newspaper, including Dink's brother, who has also been put on trial in Turkey, wept and consoled each other near his body. Fehmi Koru, a columnist at the Yeni Safak newspaper, said Dink's slaying was aimed at destabilizing Turkey. "His loss is the loss of Turkey," Koru said. Dink had complained in a letter that he received no responses even after complaining to authorities about threats of violence made to him, NTV reported. A colleague at Dink's newspaper, Aydin Engin, said Dink had attributed the threats to elements in the "deep state," a Turkish term that implies shadowy, deeply nationalist and powerful elements in the government.

Turkey Former Foreign Minister offered to deport 70 000 Armenians migrants [ 09 Oct. 2006 17:50 ] “Turkey should deport 70 000 Armenian migrants if the bill on punishment for denying Armenian genocide is adopted by France Parliament,” Yashar Yakish, Turkey former Foreign minister and chairman of the Parliament’s Adaptation Commission to the EU said, APA reports. He said 70 000 Armenians work illegally in Armenia. “They will have problems when Turkey government sends them back to Armenia. Armenians should realize its responsibility,” he said. /APA/ http://en.apa.az/news.php?id=15197 Can anybody tell me whats wrong with this article?

Good point

Maybe the Azeris were counting the farm animals as people too because there isn't a distinguishable difference.

Ortnyaleh Haroutiouneh Krisdosi!!!!

I am there!

That was cool.

There is also the book, The Chroniciles of Matthew of Edessa, which is a diary kept by an Armenian knight during the Cilician kingdom.

There is a 2 volume book edited by Richard Hovanessian, The history of the Armenians. I would recommend volume 1, regarding the Cilician Kingdom of Armenia. The greatest asset that the West had during the times of the Crusades were the Armenians. The Armenians were familiar with the economics, politics and culture of the Eastern world. The West recognized the Armenians as the strongest Christian faction in the East, and establised a relationship with the Armenians. A couple of interesting facts, one of the most famous Roman emperors, Frederick Barbarossa, drowned while trying to bring a coronation crown to the Armenian prince Levon II who later was crowned by the Pope of the Latin Church, as King Levon the Magnificent. The Armenians, not only during the time of the Crusades, had the greatest cavalry, in which any civilization surrounding the Armenians considered the Armenian cavalry one of the greatest military assets. During sieges the weapons of the West were very inadequate. According to the book edited by Richard Hovanessian, the West had to bring in Armenian engineers to build the siege weapons. During this time the Armenians produced not only some of the greatest kings of its civilization, but also the greatest saints of the Church; Saint Gregory of Narek, Saint Nerses of Lambrom, and Saint Nerses the Graceful. The West never had any gothic architecture until they saw the Armenian churches and castles. After the exposure of the West to Armenian architecture, architecture of the Western Church took a new design and size. Not to mention the castles which the towers built at the end of castle walls were changed from rectangular in the West to circular in which were of Armenian design. These are some rough ideas, if you want more details let me know I will go through my library.

Again, I have also mentioned this before. If people are expressing the view of tolerance regarding accepting other religions, make sure that everyone understands by default to be tolerant is to be tolerant of everyone’s view even views that are contrary to each other. If a person is considered tolerant of other views then they must be tolerant of all views. Unfortunately, this is not the case in this thread where bigotry and hypocrisy are quite evident in the non-toleration of the Christian view. And to reply to Yervant1’s statement about questioning a persons Armenianism, then what are we all doing here at this forum? I am a firm believer that we should always questions ourselves to understand ourselves better as an ancient civilization rather then the only binding factor that Armenians have now is the Genocide. And how the Armenian can become feeble minded into “fit” in with everyone else thinks and accepts, and to “tolerate” others who go against their own historical culture. If people want to express tolerance then tolerate the muslim Armenians and the Jewish Armenians and the Hindu Armenians and the Atheists Armenians and the list goes on and on. But if a person states that they are a muslim or Jew who is Armenian then by default most Armenians would not consider them Armenians, that is just a simple fact. And this is not only in the context of religion but in other areas. Most Armenians (in the Diaspora) don’t have an understanding of their culture let alone Christianity. They have no clue about Ar, Khaldi, Movses Khorenatsi, Mher(besides Arpa ). Just like how most people here have no understanding that the unify element in the Armenian culture is Christianity and the Church. You don’t want to believe me fine, no one is forcing you. But to go around and disrespect what your ancestor fought for and believed with sarcasm and to state that you know better the scholars and what is historically accurate is purely egotistical and self centered. I know now most of you are going to think that “someone” said “something” to hurt my feelings, but for those people rest assured this is the type of conversation I have before with other people. And once again, I am not forcing anyone to be Armenian or Christian, but don’t change the meanings of these words to accommodate your own personal needs.

It’s not an attitude I am just re-iterating a fact. Again, I am saying that no one is forcing anyone to be an Armenian or a Christian. If we are to assume that Armenians who are not Christian are Armenians as well, why don’t we accept the Armenian muslims, such as the Hamshems is eastern turkey, and the Armenian Jews who are currently living in Armenia? Or how about the Turks, who have Armenian blood in them, or the Persians whom the Armenians have the closest historical relation too? Movses Khorenatsi, who is considered the Father of Armenian History, was a bishop of the Armenian Church, as was Yeghishe and David the Invincible, who studied under Mesrob Mashots. So to some degree the documentation of Armenian history didn’t start until a person from the Church wrote it down. If you think this entire conversation is useless don’t partake in it.

Here is an excerpt from an article that was written a couple of years ago. Armenia2020 Church, State and Religion in Armenia Issue Paper prepared by the Arak-29 Foundation (Yerevan) Research Team Leader: Thomas J. Samuelian, J.D., Ph.D. Fr. Mesrop Aramian Fr. Dajad Davidian Manuk Hergnyan, Ph.D. Tamar Hajian, J.D., LL.M. Jason Demirchian, M.Div. "In virtually every sphere of Armenian life from the 4th through the 18th century, the church and clergy, led the nation, creating the alphabet, language, literature, translations from foreign languages, scholarship (e.g., science, history, philosophy, theology, music, art, architecture), and social services institutions (hospitals, schools, universities, orphanages, old age homes). In the 19th century, parallel to the Church, a significant non-ecclesiastic scholarly and literary life developed. As the creator and heir to Armenia’s large cultural inheritance, the Church continues to be the protector and purveyor of Armenian culture, in Armenia and to Armenians dispersed throughout the world and in particular the Mid-East. " So as I have said before, for those who criticize Christianity and the Armenian Church, please feel free to use another language, history, music and culture that the Church has fought to preserve. Again, no one is forcing anybody to be Armenian or Christian.

Well then, there were alot of non Armenian Kings whom Armenians think are Armenian, not to mention Sahak Partev, who is a Parthian, contributted to the invention of the Armenian Alphabet.

Dear sSebB, I commend you on your perseverance in defending Christianity; stay strong in your conviction. Here is a little excerpt from the evening hour of the Book of Hours – Jhamagirk. Lord if you open my lips, I will sing about your all Mightiness.

When I mention God I am speaking of Christianity. I have had previous conversations when what a person understood as God and what I stated were two different meanings that is why I was asking for clarity. And if your definition of a believer is synonymous with the word Christian, then let’s state it as such. "Human beings, all over the earth, have this curious idea that they ought to behave in a certain way, and can't really get rid of it." C.S. Lewis

Hello and welcome Dreamcatcher. I don't understand your question by asking - what they mean under "God". Secondly, what do you define as a believer?

I have made no comment on your personal character. If an action is contrary to good, then yes, it is considered evil. Ok, then what would you call the “something” greater then us? I will have to disagree with you on your statement – Anything that is not destructive and proves itself good for humanity of earth can be considered good – if humanity decides to destroy evil, then destruction would be defined as something good and therefore making what is good and just, relative. Just as one day a good decision can be made, and then the next day that same decision can be considered a bad decision. People are intrinsically erroneous, and to have any society or a civilization define what morality is then that would mean taking into consideration that the morality being defined can be considered wrong or immoral due to the group creating is able to make an error. I believe law and order comes from God.

Hello Anoushik, I tried to short in my explanations rather than rambling on. Ok, if we agree that the majority of humankind is negative, knowing that at one time or another it will be destructive, then why would want to put our faith in knowing well enough that it’s bound to destroy itself sooner or later? In my opinion, evil, in the simplest terms is an action. The reason why anything can be considered evil is because its actions are contrary to what is good. I would like to also add by not acting or deciding on something is also considered an action as well, basically no action is an action. Additionally, action doesn’t necessarily mean some type of physicality; an action can take place in a person heart or mind. Now in order for man to know what evil is man would have to know its contrast with good. In Christianity the definition of what is good is God. The root of evil is the first contrary action to God, by the Devil revolting against God. And the root of all sin is our will being done against God’s Will as in the Garden of Eden. Now it might seem as God wanted us to be robots to His Will, but how would a robot distinguish between what is right or wrong? God gave man freewill and man does whatever he desires with it. Man can either glorify God or be destructive, the choice however is in mans hand. Secondly, by defining God as the ultimate Good then, by doing Gods Will are we not trying to create a better place for us to live in? Evil continues to exist because something is committing it. Basically, there is hunger in the world because man has let it happen; there are wars in the world because man creates them. If you believe that life has a point, then you believe you have a purpose in it. And if you believe that you have a purpose in life then there exists something within you, and us, which has placed that purpose in us and, if something has placed a purpose in us then that something must be greater then us because it knows our purpose and we don’t. This is a topic that can be discussed extensively. I would recommend reading a book written by C.S. Lewis called The Problem of Pain (The author who wrote, The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe). I think you would very well enjoy this book, I have bought the book on CD and do enjoy listening to it. How would we know what love is if we didn’t experience suffering? If we felt love all the time and knew not the opposite then how would we know if we have really loved? Basically, if a person feels warm and fuzzy inside when someone loves them, it is because a person knows what it feels like to be cold and alone. Would a fire really be called a fire if it didn’t burn? We know what love is because we have experienced suffering. And about accepting the one type of humanity, my point is that there are many views regarding humanity. My question is who decides that any of them are right or wrong. Can they all be right? Absolutely not, because human beings have conflicting views of each other and it is a natural part of humanity to divide a person into groups, that is basically how a societies and civilizations are defined. I understand the point you are making, that you mean humanity defines the best qualities in. But who defines what those qualities are? And what might be considered best for one might mean the worst for another.

You have asked some excellent questions. So, I will need some time answer them due to the depth of the questions being asked. Thank you.

Can you elaborate on what you mean by a right belief with many takes? Having faith in humanity would mean believing people and there actions. Unfortunately humanity is known to make horrendous mistakes and have cruel actions. And, if there is any good in humanity then where does it get its intention? And who’s humanity would we believe in, Bush, Osama bin Laden, Hitler, Gandhi, Jesus or my own? And if we accept any one type of humanity then it means to deny all others types of humanity. Secondly, humanitarianism didn’t build homes for orphan’s, or gather food for the poor, until the 19th century, most of this work was done religious organizations. And those who have made a positive contribution to humanity to make it better had some type of religious conviction. The realization that you have had is just a change in your faith not to believe in God.

Amen. Yev yevus khaghagootyamp uzDer aghachetsook.

Hello Vanetsi, I agree with you with regarding the supposed "Christians" who turn Christianity into something you would buy on the Home Shopping Network, but I disagree with you regarding a persons heart that defines their faith, because the heart, just like the mind, can be tricked.

Is his works available in English?

How do we know he is Armenian, Sarkis is Greek as well.