KnightOfArmenia

Sako: Anyone who puts the people before himself, and uses every opportunity to further the Cause, is a great man. I respect you for what you've accomplished, and what you are doing to help us all.

What part of "I'm a nationalist before I'm anything else" was unclear? Oh, you can stay here, Thoth. Sepan and Ararat call me more than the Rocky mountains.

Meh. I'm a nationalist before I'm anything else; to those who have grown deaf to the call of the mountains, it may just be "land," but to me, it is the personification of four thousand years of our continued existence. And for that, I would not only advocate armed struggle, but would fight to the death myself.

I find it unbelievable that people are being scolded because they not only know about the Genocide, and that they try to inform the world of it, but that they actually feel something about it. Ignore them, Sarkis; we need more proactive ones like you, and, in fact, more Armenian youths that care about the past and feel that an integral part of themselves were killed. The memory of the numerous Armenians murdered, flung into rivers or caves or buried under the desert sands, should create a feeling of anger in all of us. Despair is the feeling of a victim; anger is the feeling of a well-aware adult. I feel the same way when I think of all the families that were wiped out, all the homes that are now populated with vermin; I am enraged when I see the crescent moon polluting the air around Ararat, that Haik Nahapet rests beneath a foreign flag. You are doing a great job, and you have the right attitude. We need more like you; especially strong ones. When the time comes, you'll be lifting more than weights, you know.

Not true, Accelerated. First, we were able to win a war against a far more powerful and numerically superior neighbor, who received a lot of additional manpower from Islamic fundamentalists (we kicked the crap out of al Qaeda, haha); second, our economy has managed to grow (albeit slowly) despite the multiple embargo we are facing. Don't fool yourself; Greece wants Constantinople back, very very bad. It realizes that it cannot take turkey on alone; too many of those bastards. But, if it and Armenia join forces, and if, say, the Kurds rise up at the same moment, then things will be different. If America fully withdraws it's support, then turkey is SOL; and don't think that Russia won't plow through Georgia and take some turkish territory. The Georgians are harboring terrorists, and in this day and age, the US won't say anything if Russia promises it's future support and uses the same excuse that the US does.

...Right... You know that quite a few of the Young Turk officials that participated, either directly or indirectly, in the Armenian Genocide were converted Jews, right? The blame lies on the shoulders of turkey. How dare you think that we are stupid enough that you can hijack our views and the tragedy that befell our people to back your stupid little war for a patch of dirt that, beyond two cities (Jerusalem and Nazareth), we don't really give a flying frig about. Who in the hell do you think you are that you think you can fool anyone? I can just as easily create a photo showing Ariel Sharon shaking hands with Heinrich Himmler; it's called Photoshop, you sack. Whether those pictures are accurate or not, they don't matter one bit. Un-freakin'-believable...

The only reason I call him "hypocrite" is because he says two completely polarized things in a single thread; he talks about (what I assume) is a large Armenian community (Glendale, I think, but I'm not sure) and how everyone there is a heathen and not a Christian (because Lord knows only he is a Christian and anyone who disagrees with that is going to Hell!), and then turns around and says how we shouldn't single out a single member of our community because we need them all.

Oh, and america-hye: "They purport to be Christians but display all the modus operandi of heathens. Included in this group is the head of an eyecare project in Armenia." is in direct contrast with "...it is IMPERATIVE that no existing member of that group be shunned." Stop contradicting yourself and at least stand by what you say, you hypocrite.

I don't quite believe that, gamavor. Diaspora is also useful for swaying international opinion; I'm sure that you don't think the Armenian community in Europe had nothing to do with the general European recognition of the Genocide. Or, as in the States, we do as much as we can so the general population know the truth, which, when an alliance starts to go sour (such as the US-turkish alliance is), the public opinion sways towards us faster than it otherwise would. As I've often said... I sincerely hate George W. Bush. But if he were to summon an international coalition to march on the turks, I'd join the USMC the next day. Ohh... Can you picture it? US Patriot Missiles slamming down into Ankara, Armenian and Greek "coalition" troops marching in to restore order in the area. I wouldn't give one fig that the Fatherland would be playing second fiddle, and marching on the orders of Washington; the ends justify the means in this particular case, and if saying "yes" to Bush means getting Greater Armenia back, I'm all for it. We'd have eternity to build up our population and flex our muscle in the area after the Tricolor flies in Van again.

Psh. I can change the world. No problem. Look at it realistically... Genghis Khan wasn't known for love. But he changed the world forever.

Since I don't care at all what you think you KNOW, I'm again repeating the dictionary definition of "judge," rather than what you, in your arrogance, try to give as the definition of a word that is older than you. Friggin' incredible that you say "no, that is a wrong definition, what *I* think is the right definition!" judge ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jj) v. judged, judg·ing, judg·es v. tr. "To determine or declare after consideration or deliberation." Oh, and I'm a liberal Kucinich volunteer. Stop judging people.

I never thought it would be this easy... We haven't been this close to winning in decades!

Matthew 7:1, "Judge not that ye be not judged." Romans 2:3, "And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?" judge ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jj) v. judged, judg·ing, judg·es v. tr. "To determine or declare after consideration or deliberation." hy·poc·ri·sy ( P ) Pronunciation Key (h-pkr-s) n. pl. hy·poc·ri·sies "The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess." Congratulations, you hypocrite! You just crapped over your entire rant, and once again showed why no one listens to you! Way to go!

That is, actually, not true at all; Greeks wouldn't even accept other Greeks that weren't of the same city-state; the only way to become a citizen was to be born in that city and be the son/daughter of two citizens yourself (Pericles was the greatest Athenian leader in history, and is revered to this day; his son, however, was not a citizen, because he married a woman that was not an Athenian). They were the same throughout the Roman days, when they looked down their noses at the Romans who had conquered them.

Boghos, there was a difference in the Armenian and Jewish genocides, in so far as the ways that they were carried out. "Concentration camp" has become synonymous with "genocide" for many of these people, and if you weren't rounded up, put into a camp, and gassed, but were, instead, rounded up and left in the desert to die, or shot en masse, then it isn't the same thing. If the latter gains international backing as well as the former, they feel they might be in trouble.

It's not just for water that Israel stands against the Armenian Genocide; the policies they are pursuing against Palestinians now aren't what anyone would consider "mild." There is a fear among the government that if the Genocide gains full international recognition and reparations, either of land or of money, are paid, then the Palestinians would have a case against Israel some time in the future.

You are the one who brought the subject up; if you did not (in some part) consider yourself to be a Jew, then you wouldn't have brought up the fact that it (supposedly) links you to other converted Jews. That simple.

Right. You go on being a converted Jew, since our culture is becoming accepted (in the European intelligentsia, at least) as an older one, since Armenian communities are being found that predate Jewish settlements by rather many centuries.

Actually, I'm not; the Human Genome Project is one of my passions. But the most they have been able to do is track the general migration of humanity; each migration is accurate to within 50,000 years. So out of Africa, to the Middle East, to the Caucasus and Asia and Europe, over the Bering Strait into America, etc. However, the mapped genome has not been studied and understood enough yet to be able to determine the migrations routes that have occurred in the past 5,000-7,000 years, which is the period in question. That is why history is the important factor here, not science; we can carbon-date things to see about how old they are, but we need history to know who built those items.

Races don't have specific DNA. Slanted eyes, body hair, skin tone; all of these come from a specific set of genes (maybe even one or two), not from the entire DNA. And since we are not yet sure which genes exactly cover this, to blindly say "DNA disproves blah blah" shows ignorance, America-Hye. Oh, and Armenians are a mix, but all of the same stock. Before they were all united as a single people, the Armenians were very divided (think Greece in the ancient days; they were physically different, and each city-state was a country unto itself. The Urartians, as is being shown now, were just the largest of these tribes, and eventually were able to successfully conquer the rest; after several hundred years of unity, when the Urartians collapsed, the various tribes remained united (in culture; the strong individualism of the various tribes has remained, although most of the differences have vanished through intermarriage; some aspects still remained, like the tall Zeitountsis and Sasuntsis, or the light-eyed girls of Kars) and became Armenians, though still under different Nakharars. Modern evidence is disproving the old theory that everyone came from Greece, since this is based on Greek reports that always claimed that they were the basis of the world. Now there is more proof that peoples living in the Caucasus moved west, and several centuries later moved back east. Have you ever read the Greek reason of why we are called Armenians? They say because we are of the stock of Arminius of Thessaly, and are simply "wayward sons."

OK, maybe she has a good personality... But Acc, the "Quick!...someone!....kill It!.....aaaahhh!", all I have to say is ROTFLMAO.

Exactly; that is why I said let us have all of our homeland back, and they can do whatever they want with what's left. That is my motto on *all* land claims, worldwide. Greeks want Constantinople back? Let us have Armenia first. Native Americans want the US back? Let us have Armenia first.

On the one hand, they kicked us when we were down, and participated in the Genocide; on the other, they have admitted what they have done, and asked us for forgiveness. Their constant claims to Armenia as being "Kurdistan" is annoying, but once we get our land back, let 'em have the rest of turkey to play with.

About the forgiveness issue: As I have oft responded to this bait, the turks don't acknowledge that there was any CRIME to forgive. If they admitted what they did and sought to restore the relations that they destroyed, then, perhaps, the Armenians would forgive them. But until they do not confess their sins, there can be no forgiveness.

LMAO. Didn't work out very well then, did it, Harut?