QRISTINE

Thoth Shnorakalution ko bari maxtankneri hamar.Baits anbarebaxtabar chhajoxvets im gnal@ invh vor hamgamankeri patcharov.Baits me te es aidkan el anchashak em? vor portsum es im achkere batsel.Qo kartsikov hay lines u ashkert pak? uxaki amen inch iren chapn u sahmane petq e unena.

Sorry if i was not specific enought they were walking side by side. Wow it is so amazing how people changed for one year period of time. I was watching the program on Russian channel ORT the program called secretary camera- hidden cameras. They ended research at the end of 2001 and the results were out of 90% of population preferred to ask question from the person who was dressed in suit ,on the other hand the other 10 % chose the other way around. Anyways my bottom line will be we as educators, etc… we perceive the way as 90% people did. In our eyes the person who was dressed like a gothic= the person who dresses like immodest. I am not saying we don’t have to show respect toward gothics in fact we do, but the point of this experiment is, what would be our first impression of the way people are dressed. I believe we all see the life the way we are, for example if I do not like dressing immodest styles I do not think I am going to like the person who does. (I am not talking about respect don’t confuse this ,it is about disliking improper dressing styles) It is very interesting to know let’s say you with your husband/wife or future husband /wife going for a date, and she dressed as I call improperly. You notice that people are starring at her because of her /his attractive completely uncovered body. What would be your reaction?

It sounds like I do not hear much of Armenians point of views on this matter(no offence).I am sure that most of the Armenians will never allow to see their partner dress in appropriate ways, and if the man/woman mistakenly thought by that immodest look she/he is going to impress their partner, and were dressed for the date in the style that was not suppose to, then he/she certainly would care how other’s look at their spouses. Don’t you think Armenians are Temperament (taqarun) ? Specially when it comes to their partners? As one of Armenian I would say that we as Armenian like to see limited levels of styles in clothing. I will read your feedbacks after I return back from Armenia. Take care.

Hi Let’s test our critical thinking about clothing and find out how we observe things in life. Welcome to share your thoughts. (please be sincere with your answers. The young lady walks at the middle of the night on the street. She finds herself being lost in the new town. In order to get a direction she needs ask for help. The young lady sees two men walking toward her, she decides to ask for direction from one of them. One of the man wears a suit and have a classical look, on the other hand the other stranger dressed like gothic. (taparakan, poxotsain,) Question Who should the young lady ask for help first and why?

STORMY Methinks you wouldn't have been able to become a professional tennis player or swimmer. Don’t worry about myself I don’t have desire for being professional tennis player or swimmer. As a teacher my delicate look, and modesty in dressing is very pleasent for myself, and for the environment I worked for many years. DON’T BE JEOULOUS YOU CAN ALSO FIND SUPPORTIVE VIEWS IN OUR NET THAT MIGHT SUPPORT YOUR POINTS , BUT PLEASE DON’T MISS ALSO MY LINES. I GAVE YOU SOME GUDLINES WHICH WAS POSTED BY OUR FAMIOUS PHILOSHPERS, AND I DON’T DENY THE REALITY THAT I HAVE MENTIONED THEIR STATEMENTS INSTEAD I AM HAPPY :)THAT I HAVE A GREAT LEVEL OF KNOWLEDGE CONSIRNING MODESTY IN DRESSING. I AM SURE THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE WHO LIKES TO SHOW THEIR BODIES PARTLY UNCOVERED OR DRESS IN TIGHT FITTING, BODY-REVEALING, FORM-FITTING SWEATERS. I AM SURE YOU WILL FIND THEM VERY MODEST IN DRESSING;HOWEVER, IF YOU ARE AGAINST TO MY PERSPECTIVE, AND DO NOT PREFER SUITS IN THE PUBLIC, THEN I AM SURE YOU WILL ADMIRE THEIR STYLES, AND I GUESS YOU CAN ALSO EDUCATE YOUR SOUROUNDINGS THAT IT IS A GREAT WAY TO PRESENT THEMSELVES IN THE PUBLIC, BUT UNFORTUNANTLY YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND THAT MOST MODEST AND PEOPLE WHO HAS HIGH STANDARD OF MORALS HAVE THE SAME THINKING CONSIRNING TO CLOTHES AS I DO. I DON’T CARE HOW YOU PREFER TO WEAR YOUR CLOTHES BUT I PERSONALLY DISLIKE INMODEST STYLE IN DRESSING SPECIIALLY IN PUBLIC AREAS.

Qristine: I certainly respect your ideas, but I disagree with them. If you don't like to dress "inmodestly" (as you call it), that is fine and is respected. On the other hand, it is not fair to put your ideas/judgements on people who like to dress different than you do. To be honest with you, I don't like to dress sexy too because I don'feel comfortable that way and because I think that a lot of women do it just because society "tells" them that a woman should always care about her image. I believe that people can like me for other reasons than my physical appearance. However, I support women who dress up as they want to (conservative, liberal, sexy, naked, hippy, etc.) because I am no one to pass a judgement. If they are happy, I am happy for them. Let people be who they want to be as long as they don't hurt anybody else. On the other hand, it is not fair to put your ideas/judgements on people who like to dress different than you do HI LORELEY I DO NOT HAVE ANYTHING AGAINST ANYBODY, BUT IF YOU GO TO PUBLIC AREAS I DON’T CONSIDER TIGHT SKIRTS OR UNCOVERED CLOTHES ARE EXCEPTABLE IN SUCH ENVIRONMENT. I AM GLAD TO HEAR THAT YOU ARE ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE WHO LIKES TO DRESS COSERVATIVE.I DO NOT JUDGE ANYBODY I DISLIKE THAT WORD VERY MUCH, IT IS WHAT I WOULD PREFER. I BELIVE THERE ARE GREAT DIFFERENCE OF MEANINGS BETWEEN THIS TWO POWERFUL WORDS. LORELY HOPEFULLY YOU UNDERSTAND ARMENIAN PLEASE GO AND READ MY LAST POSTS AND I AM SURE YOU WILL BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND HOW I REALLY THINK. MY POINT IS THAT THERE IS NO FRIEND TO YOUR TASTE. AND I DON’T CONSIDER IT IS JUDGEMENTAL STATEMENT. I CAN CLARIFY THIS TO YOU. EXAMPLE, I LIKE TO WEAR DRESSES IN PUBLIC AREAS, HOWEVER MY FRIEND MIGHT FIND ATTRACTIVE VERY SHORT SKIRTS OR NECK BARED CLOTHING. IT IS ALL MATTER OF TASTE. DEAR MEMBERS, I AM SERIOUSLY DISOPOINTED WHEN PEOPLE ARE MISINTERPETING MY STATEMENTS, PRETENDING, AND TRYING PUT YOU DOWN. WE ALL HAVE OUR PERSPECTIVES AND THEY SHOULD BE RESPECTED. THERE ARE SO MANY CASES THAT I HAVE DISAGREED WITH PEOPLE STATEMENTS, BUT I DID NOT PUT THEM DOWN..AND PLEASE TELL WHAT YOU REALLY THINK, BE COURAGEOUS I GET SO MANY PRIVATE MESSAGES STATING THAT THEY HAVE AGREED WITH MY OPINIONS, BUT THE UNFORTUNATE PART IS MOST OF THEM DON’T TAKE THIS COURAGE AND USE IN HYEFORUM. I think that a lot of women do it just because society "tells" them that a woman should always care about her image. I AGREE WITH THIS ONE WITH YOU THAT SOCIETY TELLS YOU THAT YOU SHOULD CARE FOR YOUR IMAGE, BUT THERE SHOULD BE CERTAIN LEVELS. SOCIETY MIGHT GIVE US TOO MANY OPTIONS, BUT AS HUMAN BEINGS WE HAVE TO SEE MODESTY IN CLOTHING ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO THE PUBLIC AREAS. AND OUR FUTURE GENERATION WILL LEARN FROM US. I PERSONALLY HAVE WITNESSED IN SO MANY CASES THAT MANY OF THE TEACHERS WERE NOT EXCEPTABLE TO SCHOOLS ONLY BECAUSE OF THEIR DRESSING STYELES. THEY MIGHT HAD A GREAT BEHAVIOUR, BUT FROM THE FIRST IMPRESSION MOST OF THEM WERE REJECTED, SO I BELIVE 90% OF OUR POPULATION REALLY CARES HOW PEOPLE DRESSED NOW DAYS. I DON’T THINK WE SHOULD ALWAYS FOLLOW WHAT THE SOCIETY TELLS US TO DO.

CHASHAKIN ENKER CHKA.

Dear Thoth I have no Idea what you are talking about Tigraness I don’t know if you exchange your phone number in order to get a support BUT IN MY CASE I have no clue about that,but thanks that will be great if I can find someone like that and exchange the numbers. Thanks a lot for the advice I highly respect that. ARE THERE ANY VOLUNTEERS LOL What is great about my characteristic is that I am always real. What you fail to understand is that the human body is beautiful (and [particualrly] beautiful human bodies are down right awesome! LOL) I did not fail to understand that human body is beautiful, but on the other hand I don’t really get your point if we as human beings have a beautiful body then we have to be exposed? or do we need to wonder around naked? Is that what you prefer? THEN I WILL SUGGEST TO YOU WONDER AROUND NAKED AND EVEN DON’T WORRY ABOUT SPENDING MONEY AND TIME FOR YOUR CLOTHING, AND EVERYBODY WILL BE ABLE TO SEE YOUR BEAUTIFUL PARTS OF BODY LOL Latter-day Saints believe that modest dress reflects commitment to a Christlike life and shows respect for self, for fellow beings, and for God. In their homes and in the Church, they are taught that modest dress has a positive effect on both self-esteem and behavior. According to LDS theology, the body is more than a biological entity; it is a temple that houses an eternal spirit (cf. 1 Cor. 3:16-17). Physical intimacy is reserved for marriage (see chasity). Modest dress serves as a physical and spiritual guard against immoral behavior and its inherent physical, emotional, and spiritual harm. Because modesty in dress cannot be reduced to a matter of particular styles, individuals are encouraged to use discretion to determine appropriate dress in varying situations. Emphasizing the importance of modest dress, President Spencer W. Kimball stated, "I am positive that personal grooming and cleanliness, as well as the clothes we wear, can be tremendous factors in the standards we set and follow on the pathway to immortality and eternal life" (1979, p. 3). Servants of God have always counseled his children to dress modestly to show respect for him and for themselves. Because the way you dress sends messages about yourself to others and often influences the way you and others act, you should dress in such a way as to bring out the best in yourself and those around you. However, if you wear an immodest bathing suit because it's "the style," it sends a message that you are using your body to get attention and approval, and that modesty is not important. Immodest clothing includes short shorts, tight pants, and other revealing attire. Young women should refrain from wearing off-the-shoulder, low-cut, or revealing clothes. Young men should similarly maintain modesty in their dress. All should avoid tight fitting or revealing clothes and extremes in clothing and appearance. As Latter-day Saint youth, you can also show respect for the Lord and yourselves by dressing appropriately for Church meetings and activities, whether on Sunday or during the week. If you are not sure what's appropriate, ask for guidelines from your parents, advisers, and bishop. Men A clean and well-cared-for appearance should be maintained. Clothing is inappropriate when it is sleeveless, revealing, or form fitting. Shorts must be knee length or longer. Hairstyles should be clean and neat, avoiding extreme styles or colors, and trimmed above the collar leaving the ear uncovered. Sideburns should not extend below the earlobe or onto the cheek. If worn, moustaches should be neatly trimmed and may not extend beyond or below the corners of the mouth. Men are expected to be clean shaven; beards are not acceptable. Earrings and other body piercing are not acceptable. Shoes should be worn in all public campus areas. Women A clean and well-cared-for appearance should be maintained. Clothing is inappropriate when it is sleeveless, strapless, backless, or revealing; has slits above the knee; or is form fitting. Dresses, skirts, and shorts must be knee length or longer. Hairstyles should be clean and neat, avoiding extremes in styles and colors. Excessive ear piercing (more than two per ear) and all other body piercing are not acceptable. Shoes should be worn in all public campus areas. When strong young priesthood holders see a girl immodestly dressed, most will not want to date her because her standards are not consistent with their eternal perspective. Immodesty in women cheapens their image. It causes embarrassment and loss of respect. It is not likely to win them the hand of a worthy, honorable young man who desires to marry a righteous young woman in the temple. You young ladies may have a hard time buying a modest prom dress. May I suggest that you make your own? You may need some help, but plenty of help is available.

Other things besides cars and darkness encourage unchastity and immorality. One of them is immodesty. The young people today seem to talk about sex glibly. They hear it in the locker rooms and on the street, they see and hear it in shows and on television, they read it in the ****ographic books everywhere. Those who do not resist this influence absorb and foster it. The spirit of immodesty has developed until nothing seems to be sacred. One factor contributing to immodesty and the breakdown of moral values is the modern dress worn by our young women and their mothers. I see young women, and some older ones, on the streets wearing shorts. This is not right. The place for women to wear shorts is in their rooms, in their own homes, in their own gardens. I see some of our LDS mothers, wives, and daughters wearing dresses extreme and suggestive in style. Even some fathers encourage it. I wonder if our sisters realize the temptation they are flaunting before men when they leave their bodies partly uncovered or dress in tight-fitting, body-revealing, form-fitting sweaters. There is no reason why a woman needs to wear an immodest gown because it is the style. We can be in style yet not be extreme. We can create styles of our own. A woman is most beautiful when her body is properly clothed and her sweet face adorned with her lovely hair. She needs no more attractions. Then she is at her best and men will love her for it. Men will not love her more because her neck is bare. Girls, if the young man is decent and worthy of you, he will love you the more when you are properly dressed. Of course, if he is a vicious man he will have other ideas. It would almost seem that some phases of immodesty in dress, in both men and women, border on exhibitionism, the perverted behavior in which people satisfy their lustful desires in displaying their bodies to others. One has indeed slipped a long way down the ladder when he resorts to this detestable expression, though fortunately he can regenerate and restore and transform himself with total repentance, and can be forgiven. Still, no one but a depraved person could approve of the practice or grant its acceptance. But is this ugly displaying of one's private body to others so far removed from those instances of men who do their yard work wearing only pants and shoes, and those who drive about in cars with the upper part of their bodies uncovered? Is this exhibitionism so different and far removed from that of those young and older women who resort to wearing tight-fitting clothes which accentuate the human body, and those who show their backs and bosoms and lower limbs? Style is blamed for these extremes, but we wonder again if there might not be some satisfactions, sexual and otherwise, in what seems a wanton disregard of modest decency. Are the very scant bathing suits worn for style or to shock or stir or tempt? Can there be in all these expressions total innocence and total modesty? There are laws against indecent exposure, but why jail the man who exhibits his body so very little more than the women who show so little less? Is it possible that in all these immodesties there might be at least some of the same desires which prompt the exhibitionist to uncover his body and flaunt it before people? We cannot overemphasize immodesty as one of the pitfalls to be avoided if we would shun temptation and keep ourselves clean.

Qristy jan menq el nuyn enq asum vor Axchikner@ / Kanayq petq che vor mez Tramardkanst miyayn artaqin tesqov daten sakayn tesq ka yev ka TESQ - yete axchik@ kam kin@ hagnvum e chapits durs bats - inqnaberabar da miyayn yev miyayn mek ban e nshanakum iskmenq tramardiqs bats hagnelu kariq chunenq - te hagnen el tramardu ter chen el dni Yes haskatsel em inch eik grel uxaki es uzetsi avelatsnel inchpes mer antsialnern ein asum.BAITS TSAVOQ SRTI AISORVA DRUTIAMB METSAMASNUTIONE HATKAPES ERITASARDUTIONE CHI UNDUNUM AID. ES HAMAMIT EM KEZ HET KIANKUM KAREVOR E DATEL TE AID TVIAL ANDSNAVORUTIONE INCH MAKARDAKI TER MARD E, INCH MTATSELAKERPI ANDSNAVORUTIAN HET ENK SHPVUM.

SEAPHAN MORE I READ ABOUT YOUR FOOD RECIPES MORE I GET HUNGRY. I would like to know if you have the recipes of Armenian QUFTA, XAPAMA AND PITI. I WOULD APPRICIATE IF I HAVE THOSE RECIPES.

I'm so sick of guys judging me by my looks! Can they for once (!) concentrate on my personality?? Hi NAIRI I HAVE A SUGGESTION FOR YOU. DON'T GET UPSET WITH GUYS WHO JUDGE YOU BECAUSE OF YOUR LOOK. THEY SHOULD KNOW THAT BEAUTY OUTSIDE LASTS FOR A SHORT TIME BUT THE BEUATY INSIDE LASTS FOREVER.

HI everyone, it smells so good seems like we are going to open Armenian Restorant especially having such a great cooks as you are hmm there won't be any problem of doing it. The topic got so interesting, and seems like I am learning new kind of dishes that I have never heard before in my life time I should post those kind of topics very often because at the end it gets too interesting and challenging. lol

GREAT NEWS FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Angel Venable December 16, 2002 (202) 393-3434 INS LIST DOES NOT INCLUDE ARMENIA Federal Register Mistake Outrages Armenian Community Washington, DC — A spokesman from the U.S. Department of Justice confirmed reports today that Armenia is not on the list of countries whose non-immigrant male nationals over the age of 16 residing in the U.S. must register with the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service. Armenia's name was mistakenly included in the Federal Register issued December 16. The Federal Register is the official daily public record charged with publishing such notices. The Armenian Assembly has been assured that this mistake will be corrected as soon as possible. “We are outraged that this mistake was made in the first place. This is a very serious matter and we pledge to seek full remediation of this deleterious action,” Assembly Board of Directors Chairman Peter Vosbikian said. “The Assembly’s Washington, Los Angeles and Armenia offices worked around the clock contacting state and federal officials to express our disbelief that such an action had been taken. We worked to resolve the situation quickly and quietly with as little publicity as possible in order to avoid any negative ramifications. We have succeeded in our effort and will now work with the administration and congress to rectify this misstep. We trust that such an egregious error will not occur again.” “We would like to thank those in the Administration, the diplomatic corps, our friends in Congress and all the Armenian-American community leaders who worked together with us to clarify this matter. When the community speaks with one voice, it is very powerful indeed,” he added. The Assembly has requested a meeting of Armenian-Americans with the White House to discuss the events of the past few days and to reiterate our commitment and full cooperation with the national security of our country. The Armenian Assembly of America is the largest Washington-based nationwide organization promoting public understanding and awareness of Armenian issues. It is a 501©(3) tax-exempt membership organization. NR# 2002-166b Index of Press Releases Armenian Assembly of America 122 C Street, NW, Suite 350 Washington, DC 20001 Copyright © 2002 Armenian Assembly of America Now I can go to sleep lol MAY PEACE PREVAIL ON EARTH

Hi Rubo YOU DEMONSTRATED GREAT POINTS CONSERNING TO XENOPHOBICS I COMPLITLY AGREE WITH YOU.

We like being Armenian and staying Armenian. What's so bad about that? Tigranes I personally don't see anything bad instead I am proud of my heritage. My Father a Great Man always made sure we are Armenians never forget where we came from. The tales of the road my grandparents had to travel. The lost they had to deal with.The joy they had after thirteen years apart due to the Turks. They found each other again after those years. Im proud to be Armenian and so proud of my Family,the pain and the lost will never be forgotten. Why are Armenians xenophobic? We Armenians are not xenophobic!!! If we would like to keep our culture alive it does not give you the Right MJ TO CALL US XENOPHOBICS. For many individuals around the world, interracial marriages merely seem as a dishonor to one’s cultural heritage. For others it might not seem as a controversial issue. What many individuals don’t realize is that disapproval of miscegenation isn’t xenophoic, rather a mere act of staying faithful to one’s culture. In order to obtain peace and understanding we must apply the Golden Rule. We mustn’t judge others merely for being them selves. As the Golden Rule states, “do unto others as you would have them do unto you” we must think of how it would affect us if we were perceived as someone or something we are not. Certainly we wouldn’t want to be judged as xenohobics just because we choose to be loyal to our heritage. Furthermore, we must think of the consequences; how it will affect the community and also one’s character growth. Our actions not only affect the one person we choose to judge, but our community and ourselves as well. By judging a group we build walls of segregation, and we deny the truth. We build a misunderstanding and tension in our community. Fabrication towards such nationalities creates a deeper gap between one another. What we must do is immerse ourselves into another culture, learn about their origins and morals, in order to understand them. Eventually by taking such actions we will have respect and understanding for one another. But if we choose not to take such a path, we will be lost. By not showing respect towards certain groups we will eventually get into the habit and become a person who doesn’t care about ethical principles. Furthermore, if we choose to judge a group before we understand them it will become a tendency for us to judge before we know all the facts. As respect is given to people who choose to marry outside of their race, it should also be displayed towards those who choose not to. Some individuals choose to marry within their race simply because they are comfortable with someone who values similar morals. Also for those same individuals life wouldn’t be the same if they chose to marry into another race. For example, for rejecting their own race they would be looked upon by their people as cowards. In addition, they would have to give up their life style, which consequently means having no contact with family and friends. Basically, it would mean abandoning one’s former life in order to commit to an interracial relationship. Furthermore, as stated by Gosier Elijah, in “Not even Cupid brings much racial unity” in the eyes of African American women, “black men are guilty of racial treason, rejection and hatred of their own race.” What people should keep in mind is that it isn’t easy for many individuals to associate with someone outside of their nationality, because of pressure from family members or simply because of discomfort. We shouldn’t assume those who refuse interracial marriage as xenophobic, rather we should be respectful towards the decisions they make. For many nationalities such as Armenians, choosing to marry someone outside of their nationality is a controversial issue. Armenians have survived through gruesome and atrocious wars, therefore marrying outside one’s race would be an utmost disrespect towards their ancestors who fought to keep their heritage alive. Hence, no person has the right to judge such nationalities as xenophobics. Even though many don’t live in their country, that doesn’t mean that they have forsaken their cultural heritage and their upbringings. Armenians like Zionists have a vision of returning to their homeland someday. Many did not choose to leave their country rather they were forced by the Ottoman Empire, and those who willingly left were people whose homes and lives were completely destroyed by the oppression of other countries bordering them. We Should first learn the history of a group before we judge them. Every individual has the right to associate with whomever they please. This doesn’t give the right for others to take advantage of the situation and look upon certain groups who predominantly marry within their own nationality as xwnophobics. We must take into consideration that everyone is different, and by so we must not label a group with the first thought that pop into our heads. Whenever we come across such confusion we must think of the Golden Rule, and how our judgments will affect the person we choose to talk about.

Words cannot convey our sense of loss for the innocent victims. Our hearts and prayers are with them. Thank you

Thank you Vava I think the 'problem' here is either a LANGUAGE BARRIER or not taking the time to READ and UNDERSTAND people's posts! Funny thing is Qristine and I share the same view on marrying armenians (though I'm not putting other people down for marrying outside! that's their business)....I'm baffled as to why she cannot see that??? but, that's unfortunately another common trait among us...to put one another down and pass on judgement without knowing the other person...this soooooo reminds me of my armenian school teachers...especially the nuns! and I was a good kid I guess I am writing in German and perfectly unable to read in English. Not a bad Idea. I understand when people are confused they are trying to make you wrong so anyways Doctors dont get upset with their patients I hope you understand the meaning of this saying. And show me the lines or places that I have stated that I put others down who did not marry an Armenian. "that's unfortunately another common trait among us...to put one another down and pass on judgement without knowing the other person...this soooooo reminds me of my armenian school teachers" I dont know if you are passing the judgement to other people, but in my case it is not a common sourse. And I dont know in what kind of enviornment you were raised in Armena because I never even went to the school over there so there is no possibilities that you WERE IN MY CLASS .

Anyone care to explain what's all the deal about the getting on one knee, pulling out a ring, and asking "THE QUESTION"? Why? What's that all about? There aren't rules set in stone that predefine what a proposal is. But there should be. Just like many things in life, there are things that resemble proposals, but aren't, and the confusion can cause a lot of trouble. But first let me lay down my own rules for proposals, and then I'll explain my reasoning behind them. 1. You must have a ring when proposing. 2. You must get down on one knee. 3. You shouldn't do it in a public place where the proposal is the "main event." Now let me explain why I think these rules should be followed (though there are exceptions, two out of three is your best bet.) First, the rule of having a ring. Most guys I know don't see why the ring is so necessary if the proposal is sincere. This is true. If the proposal is completely sincere and thought out, then technically the ring is a technicality. But usually the ring is actually a sign that the proposal is sincere, and planned. Why? Because a true proposal is not a spur of the moment thing. It is preceded by a lot of thinking about the girl, marriage, and whether you want those two to come together in some way. Most guys would admit that proposing frightens them a little. The decision is nerve-wracking enough, followed by the purchase of the ring (the possible asking permission from the father) and then the problem of deciding how to do it. But the asking is decidedly easy when none of that stuff comes first. In that special moment when you look in her eyes, know you love her, and the thought of marriage seems appealing, saying "Marry me?" is a very simple thing. And also not very sincere. Sincerity comes when you've already done the purchasing, planning and thinking, and you still want to marry her. I know this because if just asking "Will you marry me?" was a proposal. Now for rule number 2. Okay, I admit that it sounds a little harsh to make this a "rule" so let's just call it a strong suggestion. This is not about sincerity, but about making it more "real." While the ring helps with the reality of it all, getting down on one knee is the icing on the cake. The second a guy gets down on one knee it brings the proposal to her attention. I think this tradition might have come about just because it makes a great segue. You don't have to think of a way to bring up "Marry me" you just have to get down on one knee. Right then and there the proposal has started with minimal effort. The guy is now free to say his peace, or just start asking. If you think getting down on one knee is embarrassing, try saying your peace and then getting down just for the asking part. Though I didn't make it a rule, I highly recommend preceding the proposal with an "I love you because" speech that will outline why exactly you think she's so great. Not only will this warm her up for the proposal, but if you do it before you get down on one knee, she may think you're just incredibly sweet, and not realize it's a proposal. Getting down on one knee is also great if you're nervous. If your girl is the antsy type she may say yes the second you hit the ground, because she knows what's coming. Finally, I feel very strongly about my public place rule, almost as strongly as having a ring. This rule has come about through observing actual public proposals. I don't mean seeing a guy propose to some girl in the park. If you don't know them, even if you can hear and see what's going on, it's not truly public. I'm talking about proposing at a family gathering, or better yet - onstage. I've encountered this type of proposal while at college. A few times a year we would have a "Friday Night Live" performance, that was basically our own version of SNL. The auditorium would be packed with about 2,000 people, and this is where someone got the idea of proposing. The first time the guy did it after the show, before anyone left. He called his girlfriend up and proposed. The second time was a year later. A couple was in a skit, and at one point the skit took a slight turn and the girl looked confused - until the guy pulled a ring out of his pocket. He dropped to one knee, popped right back up again, and they walked offstage. Yeah, he had a ring and got down on one knee - but where was the romance? First of all he had no time to say anything but "marry me" and luckily she said yes in front of all those people. Then the skit continued and everyone laughed about it. In fact at the next show the host called his girlfriend up and strung the audience along, making them think he was going to propose. The guy thought this was a cute idea - instead it became a joke. Sure a proposal should be memorable (Hence my previous rules) but the fact that you propose right will be memorable, not the setting. Sure it will make for a great story, but it will also make for an embarrassing one if she says no. It also kills all the romance of the moment when all eyes are on you, and you don't have the ability to say anything really personal. And while the guy who proposed at Friday Night Live may have thought it was cute, he unfortunately made it memorable - for the audience. They broke it off a few months later - and while normally there may be a few hundred people who knew about it - in their case the entire school knew about the engagement, whether they knew them or not. By making the proposal public, you make everything that follows just as public. With all of that said - I don't want anyone to think my rules are terribly rigid - just guidelines. Let's say you propose in the ocean. I personally think that's a wonderful idea. You're alone, it's romantic, and you just have to make sure your trunks have a pocket that close for the ring. I highly doubt anyone will care that you didn't get down on one knee (especially me.)

Hmmm, maybe you meant this as a joke! otherwise, it sounds totally ignorant, or maybe you only read what you write... being a teacher as you have on your profile, it's sad and surprising to see ...anyone...really directly make such false and uncalled for judgements...it would be nice if a certain degree of courtesy and respect was observed! It is truely absort for me for those people who do not hold on their positions which one of them end up being you. Vortex ksherke tsanr e ain koxmn es sharjvum. Why do I waste my time and fight for my nationality if they are the ones who are trying make you wrong? AM I IN DIFFERENT FORMUM? OR IT IS TRUELY ARMENIAN FORUM?

"A mighty pain to love it is, and 'tis a pain that pain to miss; but of all the pains, the greatest pain is to love, but love in vain." -Abraham Crowley "So much of what we know of love we learn at home." -unknown "You don't marry someone you can live with - you marry the person who you cannot live without." -unknown "Love is blind, but friendship closes its eyes." -unknown "Life has taught us that love does not consist in gazing at each other but in looking outward together in the same direction." -Saint-Exupery "A kiss is a lovely trick designed by nature to stop speech when words become superfluous." -Ingrid Bergman "Love built on beauty, soon as beauty, dies." -John Donne "He that falls in love with himself will have no rivals." -Benjamin Franklin "I never knew how to worship until I knew how to love." -Henry Ward Beecher "Woe to the man whose heart has not learned while young to hope, to love - and to put its trust in life." -Joseph Conrad "True love is like ghosts, which everybody talks about and few have seen." -La Rochefoucauld "Who ever loved that loved not at first sight?" -Christopher Marlowe "Tell me whom you love and I will tell you who you are." -Houssaye "We perceive when love begins and when it declines by our embarrassment when alone together." -La Bruyere "Better to have loved and lost, than to have never loved at all." -St. Augustine "To love another person is to see the face of God." -Les Miserables "Love is but the discovery of ourselves in others, and the delight in the recognition." -Alexander Smith "When we are in love we often doubt that which we most believe." -La Rochefoucauld "Sympathy constitutes friendship; but in love there is a sort of antipathy, or opposing passion. Each strives to be the other, and both together make up one whole." -Samuel Taylor Coleridge "Friendship often ends in love; but love in friendship - never." -Charles Caleb Colton "The richest love is that which submits to the arbitration of time." -Lawrence Durrell "There is no disguise which can hide love for long where it exists, or simulate it where it does not." -La Rochefoucauld "A very small degree of hope is sufficient to cause the birth of love." -Stendhal "There is no remedy for love but to love more." -Thoreau "Blushing is the color of virtue." -Diogenes "Death is a challenge. It tells us not to waste time... It tells us to tell each other right now that we love each other." -Leo F. Buscaglia "Love cures people - both the ones who give it and the ones who receive it." -Dr. Karl Menninger "Spread love everywhere you go: first of all in your own house. Give love to your children, to your wife or husband, to a next door neighbor... Let no one ever come to you without leaving better and happier. Be the living expression of God's kindness; kindness in your face, kindness in your eyes, kindness in your smile, kindness in your warm greeting." -Mother Theresa

TOOTH "With this attitude then why should any else ever care for what has happened to Armenians or what Armenians think?" Excuse me should I care for Turks? Or foe Jews? I am Armenian I do need to know what happened to Armenians if you dont consider your self as one of them so dont even try to confuse others. Hi GAMAVOR GOOD FOR YOU BRAVO quote:

I meant Gamavor and Hyebruin sorry about that hagarak.

Hi Loreley In THIS CASE NOONE WILL BE ABLE TO CHANGE MY VIEWS ABOUT MARRING A TURK I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THAT. I Had A muslim frinds but the question is would I marry a Turk no thank you. And what Hyebruin and Hagarak are saying is who they really are why would you feel offended? thats what makes me think really hard arn't you happy that there are people who will like to marry somenone from their own ethnik background and religion? Hagarak I guess we can not keep them from marring a Turk ka chka mtqnere arden drel en lol:wobble:

My my - and who do we chastise for holding such attitudes? Thats right - Jews & Israel - now you are expressing the same kind of "exclusivisity" - and I find this very sad. Of course there are a great many differences - but the point Sip was making is completely valid and true. If all peoples who have been greviously wronged by another people (or had "their" lands taken away etc) were never able to (eventually)forgive etc - then mankind would be cursed to constantly be hating and fighting forever wars (makes me think of the H.R. Haldeman series of books...but your probably not familiar with them I wouldn't think..) - in fact this very type of situation leads to perpetuation of conflicts the globe over... I have some Jewish friends who refuse to this day to buy any type of German product and are very uneasy about Germans while others drive German cars and have vacationed to Germany. Though I understand the former attitude I think it is a shame that at some point folks can't seperate the people of today with events and people of the past. Certainly Turks and Turkey make this more difficult for us because they have not come to terms with what was done - but ultimatly it is their problem and should not be ours (to the point where it makes us twisted). Thoth the point is I am trying to illustrate is if we are currently talking about Armenians stay on armenian topic I seriously not into what other nationalities did to each other far as I know we were talking about marring forighners. I wonder if there was a case that you never disagreed with Seaphan chlini es groxe nuin mardna?