nairi Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 I'm not sure how long internet will still exist, or how it will develop in the future, so I'm afraid this may come as a waste of time. Perhaps some of our tech members can comment on this. Is it worth creating an extensive online Armenian dictionary, or E-Dictionary, if you will? The most famous one in English is the Oxford English Dictionary. They have canceled all their paper work and are now only renovating and expanding the online version. Yes, you need to pay a fee to use this dictionary, but in my opinion, it's only fair if you consider what you get for it in return. See HERE for an idea of what this dictionary is all about. Click on Word of the Day to get an idea of how each word is presented. Keep in mind however that the "inside" of this dictionary is much more vast and extensive. It has pronunciation, etymology, timeline, quotations, synonyms, antonyms, idioms, and so much more. A simple word like "word" may have over 70 entries. Additionally, it includes words and expressions from all English varieties (British, American, Australian, Irish, Indian etc.). Indeed, it took over 100 years to finish the first draft, but if you see the result, you'll know that it was absolutely worth it. Feel free to surf around that site and ask yourself if an Armenian version is worth it, especially now that we have unicode... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 I don't have tech knowledge and have experimented only a little with importing and exporting between formats/programs, but I guess that as long as the database is in a valid extensible markup language, it can be used with/for and beyond the internet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Also.... Yes, I think it would be worth it - very much so - for people to compare standard Eastern vs. Western and vice versa. Also given foreigners who want to learn Armenian, ready access to the stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 There are a couple of e-dicks out there ... I'll post links ... i was trying to convert one to my PDA . Very easy to make them to be online versions. The problem is their data bases ...right now, like 9k words. By the way, I wrote this post by hand in cursive as this thing l am using has no keyboard!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 By the way, one of the arm-eng eng-arm e-dicks that I found I was able to decipher the format of their d-base so I can read all the words etc. and like put it in Exel format. Their user interface was not that good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted December 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Sip jan, I'm aware of some of these E-Dicks , I'm talking about a REAL E-Dictionary. Extensive, informative, kind of like the OED. A huge piece of work and something that will need just a little more time, effort and sweat than the many free online dictionaries. I'm talking about recording every word (if possible) in the Armenian language, standard and dialects, and continuing the legacy as long as the language is still alive and evolving. What I want is a reliable, solid, professional piece of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Nair i, I see what you are saying. I don't think it will pay off financially. So question is, who is going to do it. I think best bet for it to happen is "Open-source" like. In other words, make it completely open and free but encourage contribution by anyone, anywhere ... problem will be that no 2 Armenians ever agree on anything!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted December 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 So question is, who is going to do it. All the professional linguists, grammarians, lexicographers etc. that we have. It should be institution sponsored. The OED is sponsored through Oxford University, so why can't we have a Yerevan State University Armenian Dictionary, or something like that? As for the financial aspect, in part state or institution sponsoring, and the rest individual users. The only problem is that unlike English, Armenian is a tiny regional language. OED's main financial support comes from universities and colleges that buy it for their computers. There's not that many private users. I don't know, I'm not sure how to solve the financial side of it, but there must be a way.... Hell!! We're such a primitive people!!! We don't even have a proper up-to-date dictionary!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Bark Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 All the professional linguists, grammarians, lexicographers etc. that we have. It should be institution sponsored. The OED is sponsored through Oxford University, so why can't we have a Yerevan State University Armenian Dictionary, or something like that? As for the financial aspect, in part state or institution sponsoring, and the rest individual users. The only problem is that unlike English, Armenian is a tiny regional language. OED's main financial support comes from universities and colleges that buy it for their computers. There's not that many private users. I don't know, I'm not sure how to solve the financial side of it, but there must be a way.... Hell!! We're such a primitive people!!! We don't even have a proper up-to-date dictionary!!! Four models: Private enterprise No money in it. Won't happen. "Benefactor" model It's time to move beyond it. State-sponsored The state institutions, rather people in them, are sponsoring only themselves at the moment. Open-source The only feasible way at the moment. If you build it they will come. Once an open source dictionary takes momentum, the "official" types, typically in shock and horror of what they feel are inaccuracies will hopefully get off their behinds and start contributing. One can only hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arpa Posted December 13, 2003 Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Nair i, I see what you are saying. I don't think it will pay off financially. So question is, who is going to do it. I think best bet for it to happen is "Open-source" like. In other words, make it completely open and free but encourage contribution by anyone, anywhere ... problem will be that no 2 Armenians ever agree on anything!!! Indeed! That was going to be my next question but as always Sip the Dip beat me to it. :) Do we expect as indicated "I'll get it for wholeslae" in another thread, we expect someone to do it for us just for the love of it? Afte all, aren't we all brothres/sisters? But before we come to that, our dictionaries have to be totally and radically revised. As stupid as I am I spot many errors and lackadaisical entries. Remember that "dialect" is defined as "gavarabarbar" while the latter as Nairi correctly pointed, is better described as "regional", unless, of course, you consider Armenian to be a region/gavar of Latinia(?). We take too much for granted, specially when it is printed in a hard cover $60.00 book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted December 13, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2003 Open-source The only feasible way at the moment. If you build it they will come. Once an open source dictionary takes momentum, the "official" types, typically in shock and horror of what they feel are inaccuracies will hopefully get off their behinds and start contributing. One can only hope. You want to start? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Bark Posted December 15, 2003 Report Share Posted December 15, 2003 (edited) You want to start? Want to? No. Because I am a working stiff and a busy parent just barely able to keep up. Would like to have been able to? Yes. But that doesn't do much good. On the other hand, we have all the basics of such a project right here on this board. A new "Section", say "Armenian Dictionary Project" can be opened, and each word would be a separate "Topic". It would have its own set of "moderators", which would essentially be the equivalent of "editors". Edited December 15, 2003 by Twilight Bark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sip Posted December 15, 2003 Report Share Posted December 15, 2003 TB that's a very interesting idea!!!! Take a look at this site: http://www.urbandictionary.com/ Setting up something similar to that won't be too hard. You can define your own words. And then people vote on the definitions. I think this may work! Have a special interface to enter armenian words .... probably have armenian-english ... english-armenian versions ... Hmmmmmmmmm ... you got me thinking!!!! But how to filter it and ensure the highest quality... Arpa, thanks for "sip the dip" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Bark Posted December 15, 2003 Report Share Posted December 15, 2003 (edited) The urban dictionary site seems a little too anarchic, which is just fine for a slang dictionary. I think we need the discipline and stuffiness of a bunch of "editors" if it is to remain respectable. Going with the theme of this forum, each word would have two entries (Topics). One a technically "closed" one (modifiable by the editors) that gives the most recent consensus definition, examples, etc, and one for submitting opinions and proposed definitions and example sentences. As you suggest, a site dedicated to the project could be made optimal for the purpose in the "technological" sense. On the other hand, with a little work, this forum probably has enough flexibility to set up the project, and it has the advantage of already existing with a core group of participants. In any case, I would not want to impose work on anyone, as I would not be able to contribute much "labor" myself. I am just expressing a few quick thoughts. Edited December 15, 2003 by Twilight Bark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamavor Posted December 16, 2003 Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 Nairi, you are late. There are already few Armenian E-Dictionaries on - line! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted December 16, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 Nairi, you are late. There are already few Armenian E-Dictionaries on - line! Who, you? Gams, you're such a riot. I never know when to take you seriously and when not to TB, thanks for your contribution. I'm not sure if HF is the best place to start something like that (wouldn't it take way too much space?), but it's an idea, I guess... In any case, I'm certainly not qualified for it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamavor Posted December 16, 2003 Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 Who, you? Gams, you're such a riot. I never know when to take you seriously and when not to Naircho, There are some Anglo-Armenian-Russian dictionaries on-line, and I posted a link somewhere... don't remember. But anyway, why are you so sceptical about the future of the Internet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Bark Posted December 16, 2003 Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 I'm not sure if HF is the best place to start something like that (wouldn't it take way too much space?) It's not the ideal place. But it may nevertheless be the best place; I don't know. And I don't think it would take too much space. Text is pretty lean compared wih graphics. But now I am giving away somebody else's hard disk space, so I should stop here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twilight Bark Posted December 16, 2003 Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 Nairi, you are late. There are already few Armenian E-Dictionaries on - line! I think what she had in mind was a more thorough work, comparable to or better than "real", published dictionaries. At least that's what I had in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted December 16, 2003 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2003 I think what she had in mind was a more thorough work, comparable to or better than "real", published dictionaries. At least that's what I had in mind. But anyway, why are you so sceptical about the future of the Internet? Not so much skeptical as questioning. Technology changes etc. But if what Stormy says is true, then I guess everything on this system can be "transported" onto a newer system. Anyway, I was just wondering, that's all TB, this got me thinking (oh no!! ), but we do actually have a few amateuristic e-dictionaries that no one seems to care for much. Wouldn't one of them be good enough to improve? I don't know, maybe there's already people working on a project like this; I just haven't heard anything... Anyway, my first question was: is it worth it? Or to rephrase: are we, Armenians, worth a dictionary like that? :) Is there enough demand? And would we benefit from it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tty01 Posted December 24, 2003 Report Share Posted December 24, 2003 Hello, Dear Armenians. I am Russian, but I lived in Yerevan for year or so (Araratian massif, Malatia). There, I saw Ararat mountain, I was visiting the sport stadium "Rasdan" and other interesting places, including Echmiadzin, Sevan Lake. I would like to offer a technical platform for creating online/offline Armenian dictionary. Glossword - it is open-source software, written in PHP like this forum. In addition to English, it is possible to manage definitions written in Russian (at least 2 million diaspora), French (I know a lot of Armenians live there too), and any other language (Armenians are everywhere). As for financial aspects, I know success story, when a dictionary management powered by Glossword helped to release the hardcopy of book called "Playground Slang". More details, screenshots, examples are here: http://glossword.info/dev/ Armenian-English and English-Armenian Dictionary http://glossword.info/list/91/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamavor Posted December 24, 2003 Report Share Posted December 24, 2003 Well, Russians are everywhere too http://www.troy.am/dictionary/ http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-...an+Dictionaries Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormig Posted August 8, 2004 Report Share Posted August 8, 2004 So what did people think of the birthrightarmenia.org dictionary (which I still can't access )? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nairi Posted August 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2004 I'm looking for something much more detailed. Going along with TB's suggestion: maybe this birthrightarmenia is a good place to start improving... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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