Pontian Genocide

[MyTerrain]

Why doesn't our government officially recognize this? I mean aside from Greece's being one of our closest allies in the world, we have a moral obligation to honor the deaths of those innocent people as well.

[gorgona]

I was quite surprised that the Armenian government has yet to recognize the Pontian Greek genocide. Greece was among the first nations to recognize the Armenian genocide. And Greek-Americans have always been quite vocal in our support of the US government’s recognition of the Armenian genocide, and we will continue to do so until full acknowledgment is achieved.

 

Armenians tend to know history very well. And although the Armenian people are empathetic to the Pontians, the politicians (being what politicians are) might not fully comprehend the will of the Armenian people. They must be made aware that acknowledging the Pontian genocide will not detract from the horror of what happened to the Armenians. It will broaden outsiders’ awareness of the hell Turkey was and might help to hasten Turkey’s acceptance of it’s past sins.

 

I entreat you to demand that your government officially recognize the unspeakable inhumanity that befell the Pontians. Let them know that the Armenian people do not only decry the crimes inflicted on them, but they condemn all such atrocities.

 

 

 

[MyTerrain]

I was quite surprised that the Armenian government has yet to recognize the Pontian Greek genocide. Greece was among the first nations to recognize the Armenian genocide. And Greek-Americans have always been quite vocal in our support of the US government’s recognition of the Armenian genocide, and we will continue to do so until full acknowledgment is achieved.

 

Armenians tend to know history very well. And although the Armenian people are empathetic to the Pontians, the politicians (being what politicians are) might not fully comprehend the will of the Armenian people. They must be made aware that acknowledging the Pontian genocide will not detract from the horror of what happened to the Armenians. It will broaden outsiders’ awareness of the hell Turkey was and might help to hasten Turkey’s acceptance of it’s past sins.

 

I entreat you to demand that your government officially recognize the unspeakable inhumanity that befell the Pontians. Let them know that the Armenian people do not only decry the crimes inflicted on them, but they condemn all such atrocities.

 

Welcome gorgona, I believe the reason for this is that you Greeks don't lobby, don't organize rallies, don't push for recognition. There are very few Greeks in Armenia most of whom are politically inactive. And many people don't even know what Pontian genocide is. But I hope this situation will change with Greeks becoming more and more active in their pursuit of justice.

[gorgona]

Welcome gorgona, I believe the reason for this is that you Greeks don't lobby, don't organize rallies, don't push for recognition. There are very few Greeks in Armenia most of whom are politically inactive. And many people don't even know what Pontian genocide is. But I hope this situation will change with Greeks becoming more and more active in their pursuit of justice.

 

It’s not really an issue of how many Greeks live in Armenia. The Greek government’s recognition of the Armenian genocide was not contingent upon how many Armenians lived in Greece. And I don’t think that Armenians living in Armenia aren’t aware of what happened to the Ponians. They seem to be very well educated to me.

 

At any rate, Greeks certainly can do better in bringing attention to the matter. Who knows? Maybe when Turkey starts begging for EU membership again would be a good time to bring it up.

 

 

 

[Arpa]

Please, don't force me to respond under this Subject Topic. I will gladly come back when WE, Greeks and Armenians have genocided every one of those SOBs.

Why is this thread under the Subject Topic of the G?

Does it not belong under History?

This may all be academic by now.

There would have neither been a Pontian Genocide nor an Armenian Genocide…IF…

Those Greek(Byzantine) and Armenian would mind their state business instead of fighting each other to see which is the more “örthodox”. When the Armenians used the furks to teach the Byzantines a lesson, and in turn the Byzantines used them to teach the Armenians a FATAL LESSON.

Read about Armenian- Byzantine ( and furkish) affairs.;

http://www.virtualani.org/history/part1.htm

Just in case, here are the relevant passages.

==

Ani Under Byzantine Rule

King Hovhannes died in 1041, and the then Byzantine emperor Michael IV claimed sovereignty over Ani. Hovhannes had died childless so the people of Ani put forward the son of Ashot, Gagik II, as his successor. A Byzantine army sent to capture Ani was defeated in 1042. (Armenian chroniclers speak of Byzantine losses of more than 20,000 men, but Byzantine chroniclers are silent about the whole event). Pro-Byzantine Armenians in the city persuaded Gagik to go to Constantinople to sign a peace treaty; on arriving there Gagik was imprisoned. The Byzantines again attacked Ani, and again they were defeated, but in 1045 the city's population, realising that they were leaderless and surrounded by enemies, decided to surrender Ani to the Byzantines. King Gagik II was given a palace in Constantinople and the city of Caesarea (modern Kayseri) as compensation. After the Turkish invasions into the Byzantine empire, he was murdered in the Greek held castle of Cybistra in northern Cilicia. Constantine, the son of Rupen, one of Gagik's generals, was later to be the founder of the separate Armenian kingdom in Cilicia.

Ani Captured By the Turks

Raiding parties of Turks, originating from central Asia, began to reach Armenia and Byzantine Anatolia in the second half of the eleventh century. The Byzantine Empire was not successful in stopping the advance of the Turkish Seljuk armies that were ever increasing in size and in confidence. In the summer of 1064 a large Seljuk Turkish army attacked Ani, and after a siege

of 25 days they captured the city.

In the year 1071, at the Battle of Manzikert, the Turkish armies won a decisive victory over a combined Byzantine and Armenian force, and the Byzantine emperor Romanus Diogenese was taken prisoner. There was now nothing to protect Armenia, and much of the Byzantine Empire, from the waves of Turkish invasions.

Edited March 18, 2009 by Arpa

[Johannes]

Thank you, Arpa, for your informative and aimful post.

 

I would prefer to have Pontian (or Greek) neighbors, instead of the others. I would prefer listening to Iorgo Dalara, than of one those...

 

Indeed, as it said, religious creeds and imperial ambitions divided us.

 

Our "lovely" partner in the region, Turkey, showed us; the true creed, and the true religion and the imperial ambitions...

 

Now, after hurtful historical lessons, we can do nothing, except, stopping believe, that we are the only "true believers".

 

 

[gorgona]

Please, don't force me to respond under this Subject Topic. I will gladly come back when WE, Greeks and Armenians have genocided every one of those SOBs.

Why is this thread under the Subject Topic of the G?

Does it not belong under History?

This may all be academic by now.

There would have neither been a Pontian Genocide nor an Armenian Genocide…IF…

Those Greek(Byzantine) and Armenian would mind their state business instead of fighting each other to see which is the more “örthodox”. When the Armenians used the furks to teach the Byzantines a lesson, and in turn the Byzantines used them to teach the Armenians a FATAL LESSON.

Read about Armenian- Byzantine ( and furkish) affairs.;

http://www.virtualani.org/history/part1.htm

Just in case, here are the relevant passages.

==

I’m not sure what your point is. Are you saying that because Greek and Armenian Christians fought amongst themselves 1000 years earlier that it negates the Ottomans’ attempt to exterminate them? And yes, this is history, but the Pontian and Armenian genocides are inextricable from each other.

 

The discussion at hand is that Turkey needs to stop hiding behind their finger (to paraphrase a Greek expression). And the rest of the world needs to help them into the 21st century by officially recognizing what happened to the Armenians, Greeks and Assyrians. They can’t just delete it from their history books and their national consciousness and expect the rest of the world to pretend it never happened.

 

 

[Z'areh]

I’m not sure what your point is. Are you saying that because Greek and Armenian Christians fought amongst themselves 1000 years earlier that it negates the Ottomans’ attempt to exterminate them? And yes, this is history, but the Pontian and Armenian genocides are inextricable from each other.

 

The discussion at hand is that Turkey needs to stop hiding behind their finger (to paraphrase a Greek expression). And the rest of the world needs to help them into the 21st century by officially recognizing what happened to the Armenians, Greeks and Assyrians. They can’t just delete it from their history books and their national consciousness and expect the rest of the world to pretend it never happened.

 

I think the more we talk about the Pontic Greek genocide, along with the Assyrian and the Armenian, the more it becomes clear to the world that the so-called "Armenians stabbing the Turks in the back" nonsense is unattainable. Clearer picture emerges about the Turks wanting the Christian lands without Christians in it, period. I am not trying to sound like this is a Christian-Muslim conflict, but in this case the murderers happen to be Muslim and they used the religious differences masterfully to reach their goal.

 

I live in Canada, Armenians are very active in politics here, so are the Greek Canadians, but I have yet to hear anything about the Pontian Genocide pushed by the Greek community here in Canada on provincial or federal level. Having said this, I think it is time the Armenian government recognized the genocide of Greek and Assyrian citizens of the Ottoman Empire.

Edited April 15, 2009 by Z'areh