Tarc And After....

[Z'areh]

Today just mentioning TARC is the equivalent to swearing.

 

TARC is gone but the subject of a dialogue must be discussed, and somehow a way must be found.

 

I think TARC was a very good exercise in an attempt for a dialogue. That some sort of a dialogue needs to be established with the Turks is not only beneficial but also imperative. How do you expect the borders to be opened without establishing a dialogue? I think if we shun away from future attempts that will only highlight our own insecurities and back fire against us.

 

What TARC taught both Armenians and Turks?

 

1- Any Turkish attempt at "burying" the issue of the Armenian genocide through establishing a dialogue as a veiled plot is doomed to failure.

 

2- Any sponsorship by a third party in bringing the two sides together is also doomed since such a third party interests can only serve them first. Any Armenian believing in a third party's honest brokerage is living in a pre-Khrimian Hyerig era.

 

3- Armenia wants the borders opened, Turkey will not do that until the two demands are fulfilled (Artsax and Genocide). A seemingly deadlocked situation can be reversed if Armenia moves a little on a subject that the Turks hold dearly, the European accession. The Armenian government should take the initiative to actively support the acceptance of Turkey into the EU.

 

That will be seen as a compromise and can act as an ice-breaker. A common thread might be possible to find for a discussion between the two sides around the issue of trade.

 

On the other hand if opening of the border is not a crucial aspect to Armenia's economic growth (which is hard to believe, especially now that the Azeris are poised to "buy" from the Georgians in a dept relief scheme the only outlet to the outside world: the port of Batum) then Armenia can simply hold the present course and wait for a future miracle.

 

The only alternative for a 100% reversal of the situation in favour for Armenia, in my opinion, is nothing short of a future war (in the direction of North or/and West) in which Armenia would emerge as a winner.

 

The amount of emotions around anything that is Turkish is so high that we ought to be very careful not to harm ourselves in the process of guarantying our future.

 

We take pride in ourselves in being bright and intelligent, we must find a way to deal with the Turks.

Edited May 20, 2005 by Z'areh

[Artaxias]

Nobody wants the borders opened.

Who told you Armenia wants to open the borders and flood the market with cheap sub-standard turkish products not to mention a potential influx of stone age savage kurds?

Seriously why open the borders?

[Z'areh]

Who wants the borders open? every body except the Dashnaktsoutioun.

 

I'm surprised that you don't know about the Armenian government's policy on this issue. Officially Armenia has been demanding the border to be opened for some time now, remember Kocharian's recent speach about "the only closed border in Europe" etc..

 

Dashnaktsoutioun is opposing the opening with an understanding that an open border would actually work in weakening the Armenian government 's hand. It's not the flooding of cheap goods that worries the Tashnaks it's the economic growth that each individual Armenian would start to feel due to the limitless possibilities that a wide and working outlet Turkey can provide to Armenia. Remember Serj Sakissian the Min. of Def. saying if Turkey joins the EU then Armenia would have a border with Europe?

 

So it's the political leverage that Turkey would have over Armenia that the Tashnaks are worried. Unfortunately doing business via Georgia does not promise any bright future, and now Azerbaijan is soon getting total control over the port of Batum, you can guess what they would do the first day they take hold of this port.

 

So what is the alternative, Russian version of the Martial plan? where they would drop goods and supplies from the air?

 

Finding a dialogue with the Turks, more importantly inderstanding how the Turks tic is crucial to us, with emotions so high giving a little (EU issue) might bring us big political/economic dividends.

[Artaxias]

The way I see it, with the borders open Turkey can swallow Armenia.

We need it as a transit to EU because the degenerate Georgians are no good as usual, they need it in order to develop their Eastern provinces.

 

The Kocharian administration cannot go ahead and say we don't want to open the borders of course. They must show the world that Armenia is under a catastrophic blockade

 

I say all options with Georgia should be exhausted first. They need to be choked by Russia and Armenia. Stop supplying them with food, gas and electricity!

I hope that country will crumble in the very near future.

[Armen]

I say all options with Georgia should be exhausted first. They need to be choked by Russia and Armenia. Stop supplying them with food, gas and electricity!

I hope that country will crumble in the very near future.

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This is a very effective way of making Armenia an Iranian of Turkish province.

[gamavor]

Zareh, you are living in a fantasy world. Armenia should try to benefit from development of vertical type of relationships, both georaphicaly, economically and geopolitically, i.e. Georgia and Iran. That suits best the Russian interests too and we need to take full advantage of it without abandoning completely the "complementary" approach of Armenian Foreign policy for which I bow my head to Minister Oskanian.

 

Turkish east is as developed as South Sahara. There is no benefit or urgency to open the border with Turkey. Besides the obvious negative effects, Armenian goods should travel vast distance before they reach the attractive Turkish market and at the end they won't be competative.

 

Let Europeans and Americans pour their tax money into development of Turkish east and then we may consider opening of the border.

 

Georgian Government recently made an invitation to Armenia for leasing of some of her Black Sea ports and the offer didn't seem to attract too much interest for unknown to me reasons. Instead the Armenian government invited the Diaspora Armenians to invest in such projects.

[gamavor]

....and just to add something. The ONLY way to Armenia's independence, international recognition of Genocide, return of the occupied Armenian territories, etc. IS denouncement of Republic of Armenia of all international agreements for non-proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and investment in a national nuclear program. Until then we will knock on closed doors foolishly and with no avail.

[Stormig]

Substandard Turkish goods have NOT stopped flooding the Armenian market. If anything, they have become of a heavier price, and that is a disadvantage for the average Armenian Hovsep.

Why in the world anyone would want an unstable neighbour in Georgia is beyond me. And why in the world anyone would actually want a border anywhere in the world closed is beyond my understanding. It can't go on like this forever and has to open, sooner or later. Armenian alternatives, which may have developed in the meantime, for what floods in from Turkey shouldn't crumble - they would be home-made and should naturally be in a position to compete and not be substandard if they can even exist. Do not overlook the fact that it is the physical border that is closed - bus lines and flights between Yerevan and Istanbul operate twice a week, and in the latter case by an airline none other than Armavia. There isn't even reciprocity where that is concerned. Play-acting by Kocharian my arse.