SevShoon

THE PERFECTION-vs.-CREATION ARGUMENT 1.) If God exists, then he is perfect.. 2.) If God exists, then he is the creator of the universe. 3.) A perfect being can have no needs or wants. 4.) If any being created the universe, then he must have had some need or want. 5.) Therefore, it is impossible for a perfect being to be the creator of the universe (from 3 and 4). 6.) Hence, it is impossible for God to exist (from 1, 2, and 5). PERFECTION/CREATION INCOHERENCE ARGUMENT 1.) God, by definition, is a perfect being. 2.) God, by definition, deliberately created the universe. 3.) So, if God were to exist, then he would be a perfect being who deliberately created something. 4.) To be perfect, one cannot have any needs or wants. 5.) To deliberately create something, one must have at least one need or want. 6.) Thus, it is impossible for a perfect being to deliberately create anything. 7.) Therefore, God cannot exist. GOD's omnipresence (ever -present) ARGUMENT FROM THE SELF 1.) If God exists, he is omnipresent (occupying all space). 2.) Since God occupies all space, past, present, and future, there is nothing that is NOT God. 3.) God therefore, cannot have a sense of the independent self. 4.) Since God has no sense of the self or non-self, he cannot have a consciousness. 5.) In conclusion, God cannot have a mind and would resemble nothing more than the non-conscious Universe. GOD is omniscience (all knowing) 1 John 3 3:20 in F21 whatever our heart condemns us; for God is greater than our heart and knows all things. Counter Arguments ON HELL 1.) God is all-knowing. 2.) Before I was born God knew I wouldn’t believe in him. 3.) I was born to go to Hell. Comments: (Sure you may say I have a choice, but I think I`ve proven already that I really don`t. I`m simply fulfilling the will of God by being an atheist aren`t I? If I`m not, I shouldn`t exist: For God would have known that before I was created that I wouldn`t believe in him.) ON THE GARDEN OF EDEN 1.) God is omniscient (all knowing) 2.) God knew that before he created man that they would eat of the tree of knowledge. 3.) God placed the tree of knowledge in the Garden anyway. 4.) God wanted sin to enter the world. Comments: (If God didn`t want sin to enter the world, why create Adam and Eve at all? He knew what would happen. Why place the forbidden trees in the Garden in the first place?) Why I had no choice arguments ON MAN'S FREEWILL 1.) God has an unchangeable plan for everything past, present & future. 2.) Everything that occurs past, present and future will be part of God's unchanging plan. 3.) Thoughts and actions occur and are part of God's unchanging plan. 4.) Thoughts and actions cannot be anything other than what God has planned. 5.) Free-will doesn't exist. FREEWILL ARGUMENT FOR THE NONEXISTENCE OF GOD 1.) The Christian God is a personal being and is omniscient. 2.) Personal beings have free will.(according to most Christians) 3.) To have freewill, a personal being must be able to make a choice. 4.) A being who knows everything can have no "state of uncertainty". It knows its choices in advance. 5.) God has no potential to avoid its choices, and therefore has no free will. 6.) Since a being that lacks free will is not a personal being, a personal being who knows everything cannot exist. 7.) Therefore, the Christian God does not exist. INFALLIBLE KNOWLEDGE / FREEWILL ARGUMENT 1.) God knows infallibly what will occur in the Universe before it occurs. 2.) God can’t change the future because he knows everything absolutely. 3.) God has no Free-will. GOD is unchangeable Numbers 23 :19 23:19 " God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent; Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good? ON GOD'S IMMUTABILITY - Unchangingness 1.) If God exists, then he is immutable. 2.) If God exists, then he is the creator of the universe. 3.) An immutable being cannot at one time have an intention and then at a later time not have that intention. 4.) For any being to create anything, prior to the creation he must have had the intention to create it, but at a later time, after the creation, no longer have the intention to create it. 5.) Thus, it is impossible for an immutable being to have created anything (from 3 and 4). 6.) Therefore, it is impossible for God to exist (from 1, 2, and 5) All Powerfull Ceds Arguement Jeremiah 32:17 'Ah Lord GOD! Behold, You have made the heavens and the earth by Your great power and by Your outstretched arm! Nothing is too difficult for You, Summary It cleary states that nothing is too difficult for God Jaiyeson Argument Question 1) Can god create a boulder so heavy that even God himself could never lift it? 2) If nothing is to difficult for god then the answer would be yes 3) There now exist a boulder to difficult for God to lift 4) Jeremiah 32:17 is a logical error. God is not all powerfull However lets say you answer the question with a no. 1) Can god create a boulder so heavy that even God himself could never lift it? 2) No, because God cannot create something he could never lift. He would always be able to lift it. 3) There is something to difficult for God. He can never create something he could never lift. It is beyond his scope 4) Jeremiah 32:17 is a logical error. God is not all powerfull Counter argument to Jaiyeson with Jaiyeson counter-counter arguments 1)God would never put itself into that scenatio thus the scenario would never happen. 1- The statement presented in Jeremiah 32:17 allows the argument to exist. 1-c) If God refused to do it he would acknowledge the scenarios existence. 1-d) If God said the scenario does not exist. Then once again God acknowledges the existence of the scenario