Nakharar

Something caught my eye when they finally displayed Saddam and I don't know if anyone else noticed it. The man doesn't dye his hair!!! For god's sake to be in that condition at age 66 must be something of a miracle.

Though Aram I purports himself to be the Catholicos of the Holy See of Cilicia, don't they along with the Patriarchates of Jerusalem and Istanbul accept the primacy of the Catholicosate of Echmiadzin, which is after all "primus inter pares" first among equals? Which implies that there is no absolute authority invested in the Catholicos of Echmiadzin. I don't know much about ecclesiastic affairs but the authority in establishing new prelacies and all other church affairs lies with all of the four patriarchates combined when they hold the holy synod meetings once a year. These arguments about being the original church vs. just demonstrates that this has nothing to do with religious matters but are simply ideologically motivated. The church is not a gentleman's club. It's survival and honor doesn't rest on the petty arguments of a few people who pick sides as if they are in a soccer match. Thank God <_< I am an agnostic.

They are hardly my allies. As for the things you pointed out I am not familiar with them but I'll take your word. I was just referring to the hopelessness and absurdity of these causes. They have no moral qualms whatsoever and could care less by sacrificing their whole population just for their "cause". But how the Russians got into the Caucasus and what they are still doing to the Chechens is inexcusable. The Russians will never be able to surpress the Chechens and the Chechens will never gain independence. The only ones I feel sorry about are the innocent civilians. They are the sacrificial lambs in these conflicts. We should know better then engage in these causes. Look where it got us with the irresponsible actions of our political leaders and their delusionary ideas. They took the Russians and other Allied powers words at face value and instead they succeeded in destroying the Armenians.

Never heared of Cherkessk before. They must be one of those measly tribes running around in the Caucasus. Good luck before the Russians come and get you! As for Greater Turkey, they have already achieved all their aims. There are no Turkish people living outside the Turkish border. As for Turan they should better give up their pipedreams.

The only way for countries becoming smaller and smaller... http://karty.narod.ru/listgreat-e.html Maybe I should post this in the humor section instead?

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My mother's grandparents were one of the survivors who fled Musa Dagh and settled in Beirut. My father's grandparents from Marash were considerably more luckier as they crossed over the Syrian border when the French were still in control of Marash. After a few years stay in Syria they also settled down in Beirut. My parents who were recently married when the civil war broke out in Lebanon in 1975 decided to leave the country of their childhood permanently when they first settled down in Austria where I was born and lived there until the age of 5 and later we moved to the United States. Currently I live in Germany (Yuck!) where I work but plan to get back to the States as soon as possible.

We sometimes act as if each Armenian is part of an extended family and therefore people find the right to stick their nose in all matters that do not concern them at all. One of the downsides of this closeknit community life are the constant jealousies and the petty quarrels usually over trivial matters. True some people use their wealth (fancy cars and hanging the diplomas of their children on walls, etc. ) to showcase them to neighbors and friends. It's better to ignore these people alltogether. They are a sad bunch who are not worth paying attention. We know that we can fall back on the support of our families (I don't mean material support) in case when things go wrong. In Europe where I can currently live the opposite is the case, where once you reach the age of 18 you are booted out of your parents house. My parents never "pushed" me in that sense, but like Phantom my alternatives were also pretty clear.

That was an excellent post. I was mainly referring to Armenians who have become famous in the U.S. It's more than obvious that we as Armenians have achieved enormous success especially in comparison to Caucasian Americans. Almost all of the Armenian Americans in my surroundings fit the situation you described. There are some exceptions of course such as the recent immigrant arrivals from Armenia and Lebanon, but they will catch up within a generation. We were all in the same situation one time. In my case my parents were. The opportunities presented to us in this country have enabled us to prosper and excel. The positive inducements for this can be found in the favorable political and social conditions. The importance we attach to education is another reason. Many Armenians aim for postgraduate degrees and want to prove themselves in all endeavors. I agree that by adopting American values and the American work-ethic has greatly benefitted Armenians. But this wouldn't be complete without an additional impetus. I can't point it out either but we are somehow more driven than other ethnic groups. Maybe it has to do with being a minority. The bad experiences of Armenians in the past could be another factor. Even the Armenians in the Ottoman Empire were successful and productive members of their society despite the hardships they faced. The discrimination and obstacles they faced made them more resolute in overcoming these. We are more conscious of our surroundings than the average American since we come from a different culture. While the mainstream American is perfectly content to spend his life in stupefying procrastination we are in constant need to prove ourselves not only to others but to ourselves. Being a minority we are not only invisible to most Americans but also indifferent to them. We are all a product (directly or indirectly) of the Genocide and most of us wouldn't be here if it weren't for it. We want to make up for all the losses that our ancestors faced and all that that has been denied to us by transcending these.

Men strike back! How many men does it take to open a beer? None. It should be opened by the time she brings it. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Why is a Laundromat a really bad place to pick up a woman? Because a woman who can't even afford a washing machine will probably never be able to support you. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Why do women have smaller feet than men? It's one of those "evolutionary things" that allows them to stand closer to the kitchen sink. ------------------------------------------------------------------- How do you know when a woman is about to say something smart? When she starts her sentence with "A man once told me..." ------------------------------------------------------------------- How do you fix a woman's watch? You don't. There is a clock on the oven. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Why do men break wind more than women? Because women can't shut up long enough to build up the required pressure. ------------------------------------------------------------------- If your dog is barking at the back door and your wife is yelling at the front door, who do you let in first? The dog, of course. He'll shut up once you let him in. ------------------------------------------------------------------- What's worse than a Male Chauvinist Pig? A woman who won't do what she's told. ------------------------------------------------------------------- I married Miss Right. I just didn't know her first name was Always. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Scientists have discovered a food that diminishes a woman's sex drive by 90%. It's called a Wedding Cake. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Why do men die before their wives? They want to. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Women will never be equal to men until they can walk down the street with a bald head and a beer gut, and still think they are sexy. ------------------------------------------------------------------- In the beginning, God created the earth and rested. Then God created Man and rested. Then God created Woman. Since then, neither God nor Man has rested. ------------------------------------------------------------------- Send this to a few good men who need a laugh and to the select few women who can, as they say, Handle The Truuth.

I want to rephrase what I have said before. All the Armenians who have accomplished something in the U.S. made it as Americans not as Armenians. They have chosen to adapt to the American mentality and discard all the habits that are impervious to progress and personal fulfillment. We are all shaped by the environment we live in. This isn't bad in itself and applies to all the other ethnic groups equally. Especially in the U.S. the force that pulls us towards this current is very strong. We are all aware of this process and because of this we become more defensive and take affront to every criticism made. As a result we have become more hostile towards others, mostly our fellow Armenians. Though we cannot stop this assimilationist trend we can try to stem it. We can choose to live in an ethnic ghetto instead where we can congregate only with our kin. It may be good for self-preservation but what a miserable existence that would be. Our choices in life would be severely limited by our parochial outlook and lack of real-life experience. We might as well live in a zoo with an endangered species program. We have the advantage of living in multicultural society where there are less obstacles to social mobility and less entrenched prejudices. This is mainly due to ignorance and because there is no single ethnic group that dominates over the others. But I'm not disregarding the imprint of the main dominating culture. We should take advantage of all the things this country offers us and take the best of both worlds without sacrificing too much of our (Armenian) identities.

Domino, don't let that person get to you. What he says or does has no importance at all. He is a miserable excuse of an agent provocateur. We are bound to be enemies with that ethnic group till the end of times. So the best thing we can do is to give them the cold shoulder.

The military reason is just a pretext to conceal their real motives for the deportation. There was probably no better period to eliminate the Armenian population than during the First World War, where the likely benefactors of the Armenians were in the opposing camp facing the Ottoman Empire and Germany. Given the precarious situation of Armenians as being brandmarked for treachery and with no hope of external support the CUP seized the chance that it got. The pretenses and legal jingoisms that they have been using are very intelligent and are still effective to this day muddling the minds of third parties. The civil war hypothesis and the war zone explanation for example. Those memoirs by Djemal and Talaat *****'s were written not as testimonies but as accounts to clear them of any guilt whatsoever and curry the favours of the Western powers. Especially Djemal ***** given his political clout is in no position to claim innocence and evade responsibility. The extreme measures he took in surpressing the Maronite revolt in Lebanon and the massacre of civilians there is evident. The reasons for recognition varies from person to person. I agree with you that few Armenians are interested in recognition as a moral restitution but want to get something in return (material gains, territory, who knows?). I find this self-destructive for our own psyche. A simple and sincere apology from the Turkish side will suffice for me. That is from anyone who wants to make an apology on behalf of their ancestors. They don't have to and I can understand if they don't want to use that highly charged word. As long as they or anyone else accepts that it is morally wrong to kill innocent people for whatever justification.

Compared to other ethnic groups we are also at a very dismal situation. Especially when you compare us to the Italians, Jews and Greeks. Unfortunately those famous "Armenians" that are known in the United States have no real attachment to being Armenian, eg. Cher and Andre Agassi. Sure they are known all over the world, but what is their contribution to Armenians and Armenian culture? To be successful in the United States you have to be an assimilated Armenian. Well there are no famous Turks because they have missed out on all the important stages of history such as the Renaissance, the Enlightenment and the Industrial Revolution. We also missed out on these but we had the advantage of being a Christian minority without the shackles of religious dogma that restrained us and prevented progressive change. On the question of why the Turks didn't advance despite all the profit they gained out of looting and "taxation" is that you can't build a solid foundation from such activities that isn't based on your own toil and incentive. That is why all these nomad empires in Central Asia starting from the Mongols and the Golden Horde failed as empires after only a generation. Another reason, which you have pointed out correctly, why the Turks are still lagging behind and procrastinate is that they don't invest in human capital, that is their own people.

Don't worry they don't believe it themselves (nor does anyone else for that matter). It's part of the game that Turks have been playing and playing it well. Those examples will give the Turks the semblance of the benevolent and congenial side and endear them to unwitting third parties. But granted the discourse that the Turks have been following is much more intelligent than that of the Armenians. They don't engage in diatribes when they have to convince others of their inculpability. The civil war example is a clever one. It serves their purpose very well in convincing others that the Ottoman Empire in its dying days was fighting for its survival and in light of advancing Russian armies they had to take the 'unfortunate' but drastic action of 'relocating' the Armenian population, because they were regarded as a potential fifth column. They even go as far as portraying Talaat's orders for the deportation as a humanitarian act since it only (!) included the Armenian Apostolic community and excluded all those Armenians from Istanbul and Ismir. Which is false of course. I guess they expect us to thank them. Another myth the Turks love to use is that of the Turkish-Armenian (or Greek) brotherhood. This in itself is highly unlikely where in the Millet system and a set religious hiearchy placing the Christian communities at an inferior status there was minium interaction and sympathy between these groups. However there was extensive cultural interaction between all these groups from all sides. My mum only cooks Haigagan dolma and Baklava is neither Greek or Armenian. All these syrupy sweets originate either from Lebanon or Syria. Even though dolma might have a Turkish meaning I don't think that the Turkish nomads in Central Asia ate rice filling wrapped in vineleaves.

Can't blame him though. Literary figures right of center are increasingly lonely and melancholic. They don't have the luxury of congregating in such intellectual gangs as the Bloomsbury Circle (hardly a loss in my opinion). His novels are a sham and the screenplays donned by his hand are even worse.

There is one example I can think of, where an Armenian from Lebanon who still possessed the title deeds of his ancestors' properties in Turkey went to court to reclaim these. What is extraordinary is that this person not only challenged the Turkish courts but won his claim. But I seriously doubt that the Turkish Registry Office didn't destroy the remainder of land and property deeds beforehand.

Too bad Armenian girls like you didn't perish in the genocide. They were probably too busy satisfying their Turkish overlords. Survival at a cost or in your case survival at your own pleasure. Why am I even going on, you probably got a mouthful of things to do. You must be putting your experience into good use.