What should happen to the other 7 districts in Karabagh?

[Guest]

The Armenian Government will give the 7 districts outside of Karabagh back to the Azeriz if a peacefull solution is found. I am totally against this. I understand that we need economic relations with Turkey and Azerbaijan but I think we Armenians have a way to go around them. If we give those 7 districts back they will be filled with refugee Chechens who then will break into Karbagh to make a new Chechenya. I know this for sure. Armenian cant afford to give any land at this point. 5,000 more Russian troops will be entering Armenia from Georgia. This is a perfect sign that Russia is going the way Chechens are going to prevent a new motherland for Chechens. No land should be given back. I believe just like Vladmir Putin that one day the world is going the be in a war. The name Muslim-Christian War. So Russia is doing the best thing by clearing Muslims off its territory. Armenians get involved go to www.anca.org and go to groong.usc.edu to find out whats happening back in out motherland.

[Guest]

I understand what you mean. But that too much. We are strugling to keep Gharapagh and you want more? Our goal is to finaly take back a part of what's ours and make peace with Turkey and Azerbaijan. The Chechens won't be a menace.

Why can't Russia just give them a their land? This small people is incapable of spreading Islam all over Russia!

[Guest]

I guess I am just so baffled by this whole Karabagh fiasco. I don't understand why Armenians find it so necessary to fight for land that I am not totally convinced is historic Armenian territory. I am not saying it really is historically Azeri either, check me if I am wrong, but weren't there an ancient people called Albanians (No relation to the European Albanians) that inhabited the region? On the other hand it seems that Nakhichevan is well within traditional Armenian territory, for goodness sake it is a hop,skip and jump from Mt. Ararat. I think there should be a nice even trade, Armenia gets Nakhichevan and Azerbaijan gets Karabagh, then let it go and move on for crying out loud! I guess this is the American side of me talking, but bury the hatchet already!

[Guest]

quote:

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Originally posted by farsisteve@aol.com:
I guess I am just so baffled by this whole Karabagh fiasco. I don't understand why Armenians find it so necessary to fight for land that I am not totally convinced is historic Armenian territory. I am not saying it really is historically Azeri either, check me if I am wrong, but weren't there an ancient people called Albanians (No relation to the European Albanians) that inhabited the region? On the other hand it seems that Nakhichevan is well within traditional Armenian territory, for goodness sake it is a hop,skip and jump from Mt. Ararat. I think there should be a nice even trade, Armenia gets Nakhichevan and Azerbaijan gets Karabagh, then let it go and move on for crying out loud! I guess this is the American side of me talking, but bury the hatchet already!

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Man shut up already dude. If you are farsisteve I guess you are not so Armenian steve then shut the hell up. You just have a big mouth, you're 32 but you dont know what you're talking about. Nobody likes a smart ass. At first I liked the points you were making. You like to answer to everyone, fine.
But now this is too much.Enough. Who are you to be criticizing? Wise asses who talk so much and just criticize dont know what they're saying. You think Armenians shot themselves in the foot huh? Have you been in Artsakh? Do you know how impossible it was to live there in azerbaijani rule? You're such an idiot, you should know Armenians never react with violence first. You really really dont know what you're saying my friend. First it happened with petitions and a referendum. Then the azeri government mobilized a full military offensive on the Armenian civillian population. This was a genocidal offensive. How many azeri politicians have been taped saying every Armenian will be strung up from a tree in Artsakh? Why were there hate rallies in azerbaijan where 200,000 people filled baku's city centers. They were chanting "Kharapagh without Armenians" "Justice for Azerbaijan=death for Armenians". Why did hooligan mobs loot every Armenian house there? That was the second Armenian genocide.
You havent seen it. Pregnant women's stomachs were cut again. I have relatives who have seen it. You think you're smart?
You're telling us advice on what to do? That Armenians should forget crimes against humanity and build an economy? Armenians must never sell out for money! I guess cuz you're so persian you think its ok to do that. If you are confused by the "Kharapagh fiasco" as you said it, then dont talk. Albanians never lived there. Its Armenian heartland. You dont understand why Armenians fought you say- well if you lived there you would understand. If Iran is your land like you say and you cry everytime you see Tehran, then why do you ask that we dont do the same for Armenia? You say you would fight for Iran- Artsakhtsis fought for Artsakh. If you dont understand why that land is so valuable, look at your persians who speak a turkish dialect (a.k.a. azeris)and how many times they tried to hold it. Ask them why its so valuable if they're so close to you persians. And by the way, they're not because azeris hate persians and theres always demonstrations against them in baku. Thats why Iran is friendly with Armenia.
Now let me just answer to what you said. Artsakh is the center of the Armenian culture. Thats why the Artsakh liberation movement became a pan Armenian unification movement. That issue united all Armenians into one struggle. Would this happen if it was not historical Armenian land? Either get your history really solid or observe facts really well and you'll see. Many times in Armenian history, Armenia would be conquered by a force but Artsakh would be free thanx to the courage of its people and its rugged mountains. In Artsakh is where you will find real Armenians. They dont emigrate. They never leave their land. Are you blind? Did they leave when all they had was hunting rifles and azerbaijan had a serious army? I know you would leave lol in that situation, you would go back to iran which is a hop skip and a jump away from the border. There will never be any land swap. Not only will we keep Artsakh which we protected with our blood because it is the center of our civilazation, we will also keep Naxichevan , Javakh which is in Georgia and we'll get back Western Armenia. Let no one ever doubt this. Once you are convinced, only then can we move forward. Let every Armenian search their souls and cleanse themselves of any doubts about our final just victory. We have come too far to be extinguished by a nomadic tribe of mongols.
We wont move according to selfish practicality. We will move according to justice. We will not let one inch of our country be divided by the world's powers so that we get some money. Armenians are starnge people. We have lived in poverty and in slavery for countless centuries, but now that we have freedom, everyone wnats to leave our country. This is a very dangerous contradiction. I was born in Bulgaria which is very similar to Armenia. Before I read about the Armenian Genocide, i read about the slavery of the Bulgarians in ottoman turkey. All of eastern europe has been enslaved by turkey. Armenians have all eastern europe as their ally- bulgaria, greece, serbia, macedonia. Let no one lecture me on this-I come from there, I know ok? If you're born in Iran, then dont lecture me on eastern europe and Armenia, i wont lecture you on Iran.
Dont let what you hear from people and what you read all around you disturb you-Armenians will never give up their struggle because it is a just one. It is a struggle to live, a struggle for survival. No one can ever exterminate Armenians. Then why are you advising us on what settlement we should pursue for our cause? Dont worry about Armenians, go drink starbucks coffee and watch Artsakhtsis transform all of Armenia. Thats the source of our nation. They are the strongest Armenians. In Hayasdan people are desperately trying to live day to day, they dont think about things the way we do here in the diaspora. We can speculate, they cant- they have more at stake. Id like to see you live under two blockades and watch the world do nothing, farsisteve. How will you speculate then?

[Guest]

Wow Arman, you are a typical fanatic Armenian! How dare you question my Armenianess! Yes Arman Armenians are innocent angels, never ever the aggressors, if you believe that I will sell you some property in Nakhichevan. It is bull headed fanatics like you that are dragging Armenia down into the gutter of third world mediocrity. Yes I love Iran, but I love Armenia too, and want what is best for its people. There is a point when you have to say enough is enough already. Thousands if not millions of my Irish ancestors were starved by the English, but the Irish are practical in maintaining good ties with modern day England ( THe Irish republic that is, Northern IReland is filled with hate filled fanatics like yourself, you would love it there.) As for me staying and drinking Starbucks coffee, Armenia will never have that or other comforts until fanaticism and hatred that people like you spew out dies, the rest of the world in too busy investing in Georgia and Azerbaijan, and good for them! It is fanatics like you that make me ashamed of being Armenian. I will comment all I want on this website, I have a right to do so, as much as you have a right to your brainwashed rhetoric!

[Guest]

By the way Arman, I never said that I would fight for Iran, especially not the present islamic government. I will only fight for The United States of America, we will always kick ass in this country. I guess this shows when you scratch the surface of my American core comes through. How proud I am of being an American. This country has done some horrible things, but we will always rule over third rate countries like Armenia,Turkey, Azerbaijan, what have you mediocre countries done lately? Nothing! Go ahead and dream about your Hayastan, it will never be a first rate country, dream about being like the Jews. Even Ireland will kick your asses!

[Guest]

Calm down guys! Don't use bad words.

LET'S JUST DICUSS. Otherwise I'll close this topic. I made these forums for discussion but not for fights.

Thank you.

[Guest]

Dear Hye Forum users

 

I apologize for the previous response. I know it seems like I am belittling Armenia, but Arman's attack on me made me so angry. I love my Armenian heritage. It was a cheap shot on my part. I am so angered by his fanaticism. I feel he unfairly attacked my Armenianess, and made cheap shots at my love for Iran. Maybe I haven't lived in Armenia and seen the horrors of Karabagh. I am sure the Azeris have been barbarians. But I know enough about Human nature and history to know that Armenians can commit attrocities as well, just like any other group of people. THey are not somehow holier than anyone else. My great great grandfather was Chickasaw Indian. There have been few people as oppressed as the Native Americans, particularly my ancestor's tribe. They were forced to march, along with the Cherokees on the famous Trail of Tears , from Tennessee to Oklahoma. Thousands died of hunger and exhaustion. But I know that the Chickasaws also committed their share of crimes, including enslaving others, Blacks and other Indians. Arman, do you seriously believe that Armenians have never committed any atrocities during the Azeri conflict? Check the United Nations war crimes list or Amnesty International, I suppose they are all Turk lovers of course! WHy don't you and the other fanatic Armenian warmongers shut up already? It is because of people like you on both sides, that thousands of innocent people on both sides also have suffered.

[Guest]

Befor anything BArev dzez

Armen D.Bravo Kettses

Us for you farsisteve so much of a Armenian using a E mail addres of farsiSteve@aol.com

is that FarsiSteve@AbadanOnLine.com?

to kiromu-dahanat do you know what your tolking abaout ?

Be nice,

and if your not Armenian enugh to gave your life for Armenia stay the hell away.

let us do what we can for Armenia & Artsax

[Guest]

Dear Jan "Fanatic" Fedayi

 

Sorry for me having an e-mail with "farsi" in it. Inch vat ban! Ha inch tsutsakhali es Abadani mech em aprum! Ha ha very funny. Typical humorless Armenian you are.

[Guest]

fanatic or not janfedai is the one giving his life for Armenia and you on the other hand farsee have given up on Armenia, it looks like you'd rather give your life of USA...

[Guest]

The End!

[Guest]

So much talk of who is willing to die for whom. I prefer to talk about life and peace. That is the future of our planet, because war has much more grave consequences(via nuclear weapons) than it ever did before. I am scared that petty countries like Armenia, Azerbaijan, India, Pakistan are going to drag the rest of the world into their vindictive little wars. Russia will of course back up Armenia, and I imagine the U.S will back up Azerbaijan, then we will have a nuclear holocaust and then we will see how important Karabagh is! We will all be in the same boat, dying of nuclear fallout radiation. There comes a time when a person must let go and move on. That is all I am saying. Mexico gripes occasionally about the U.S having appropriated their territory(California, Texas etc) but I hear few but the most radical Chicano activists calling for a war with the US to gain those territories back. Of course they aren't stupid because they know the U.S will crush them! Shouldn't we be talking of life and building? Sorry for my provocative words. I know that no matter what I say that some of you are blinded. How much hostility I feel towards me being from Iran too. Sorry, that is where I was born. I didn't know the Iranians were bad too. Who isn't evil to you guys? the Greeks? ha ha I bet they will knife you in the back soon too, they are busy making friends with the Turks. Soon Armenia will be friendless, unless we have a change of heart. I am going to avoid this politics forum, and concentrate on the positive forums of language and music from now on. I feel that I am being attacked by fascists who are ready to crucify me for not maintaining the status quo. Shaat thukhurem,neroghustsum vor kezi neghatsnelem! Mnak uzumim im sirtus batsvem, yev inchu aram? THis has been the typical reception I have gotten from my supposed people. This is why I am farsisteve instead of Armeniansteve! God Bless America, Iran, Armenia and more importantly our Planet. In heaven there are no Armenians or Iranians or Jews or any other nationalities only people!