Freedom of religion ... a myth?

[THOTH]

Well Accelerated -

 

Let me just say that I am the last person to be an apologist for the Aztecs - they were a brutal abberation - IMO - a tribe forged from persecution - alien to the area where they eventually established (as basically a thocratic-military elite) - seems to me every group with similar background ends up pretty twited. (ie - Mongols etc)

 

That being said the practice of cannabalism and killing in the name of religion are actually pretty widespread phenomonon (and as I early demonstrated existed in the Bible - and somewhat sanctioned by Jehova/Yahwe). And to furthur show that Christianity has had similar (gross) morality to the Aztec let me just mention the examples of the Inquisition, various supression of heretical sects (such as the Albegsians (sp) in France, and of course the conquest, enslavement and suppression of other cultures in Africa, Asia and the Ameicas - all done under the auspicies of the Chrisitian cross - I suspect one could easily make the argument the more have been killed in the name of Chriatianity then all the other religions of the world (in history) combined. I expect you to concede this point. Of course initially we were discudssing morals among individuals (it seemed) not overarching societies - and in this case I still maintin that most all people share very similar moralities - with certainly some cultural variations. The like of the 10 commandments and such are seen in most other societies (except maybe where they reflect the conceit of Jehova/Yahwe). You must remember that by and large - most of the (early) old testament is borrowd and summarized (with emphasis changed to reflect the self-centered Jehova/Yahwe perspective...though it was another God actually - forgot his name at the moment - begins with an "E" I think - but it will come to me) from earlier Summarian legends - other parts from Greeks, Egyptians, and others - this is well proven. I suggest you read some comparative mythology sometime Joseph Cambells books in particular. (Hero with a thousand faces, Occidental & Creative Mythologies - etc)

[Sip]

http://zr2.cs.ucla.edu/Sip/zr2/roflmao.gif I was really laughing out loud when I read that (laughter continued through the rest of the thing). Thanks for that!!!

 

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[ July 25, 2002, 10:03 AM: Message edited by: Sip ]

[Accelerated]

The Inquisition was sanctioned by the Church not the Bible (New Testament). The leaders of the Church (Popes) are not infalable and are humans like anyone else, prone to mistakes.

 

By the 18th and 19th Centuries, when Europe indeed had the upper hand in technology the Europeans involved in the suppression of other peoples cared much more for material wealth and little for Christianity (in many cases Christianity served to defend the suppressed, eg.PM Gladstone). Also, one must consider the state of world history if the Aztecs had the technology available to the Europeans.

[THOTH]

quote:

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Originally posted by Accelerated:

Also, one must consider the state of world history if the Aztecs had the technology available to the Europeans.

Certainly no worse then Hitler...

 

Point being - I do not buy the argument that morality only exists because of Christian teachings/dogma. This statement is entirely incorrect - IMHO. All societies/religions/peoples are possesed of moral and immoral elements (in varrying degrees - though human nature is human nature - and some obviously need more "guidance" then others and in certain societies where these definitions (laws/accepted practices/degree of social control exhibited from group to individual - often at family level and often by example) are less the norm you will see more [what may be commonly viewed as] abberrent behaviors). Obviously also there are variations in customs and what might be viewed as acceptable behavior differes somewhat from group to group (doesn't necesssarily mean that one way is right and the other wrong). Though i think there are certainly many common norms. In fact your dinking/partying would be heavily looked down upon by many who consider themselves "true" Christians (a pretty boring/sad lot really, for the most part...though not without certain virtue I admit).

 

[ July 25, 2002, 06:36 PM: Message edited by: THOTH ]