A poem about Ani?

[bellthecat]

I found this in an old book about the city of Ani, published in Istanbul in 1910. What sort of things does it say? Has anyone seen an English version of it? Who was "Hay Ashovgh", the poet?

 

http://virtualani.homestead.com/files/anipoem1.gif

http://virtualani.homestead.com/files/anipoem2.gif

[Kazza]

I don't know Steve. I really wish I could help you, but I don't know very much armenian at all. But If you know the basics (I'm sure in your travels, you must have had to speak a little to get by?) this copy of the armenian alphabet with pronounciations might be able you help you a little. http://www.arminco-usa.com/tourarmenia/dem...ge/language.htm http://www.arminco-usa.com/tourarmenia/demo/language/language.htm

 

This is the link for the site.

 

http://www.arminco-usa.com/tourarmenia/dem...ge/language.htm

 

[ June 01, 2002, 04:36 AM: Message edited by: Kazza ]

[Accelerated]

Bell,

 

why do you care for Armenian history? Are you a historian of sorts?

[gamavor]

I don't trust Brits. They were in the bed with turks for so long ,why should I trust them now. The only thing they are interested in about Armenian history is to make Armenian cause weaker.

 

PS: This might be a relpy from an ordinary Armenian!

[gamavor]

Steve,

 

I can only tell you that it is very sad.

[Guest Fadi]

Well just saw this thread.

 

Steve the poem compares Ani to a women, etc...

 

Do you want a translation ?

[Arpa]

SO WHAT ELSE IS NEW!

HAVE WE STOPPED CRYING AND LAMENTING!

This poem should be juxtaposed with that Protestant hymn that goes; "Lal@ chi prker zis"

(Weeping will not save me). When did we adopt lamentations as our "national anthem"??!!

 

This is an old poem. As the note at the end suggests the author(s) is unknown. It could well be a folk song developed and embelished in time. It is very poor in esthetics and liguistics but the message is there as suggested by the footnote that our nostalgia for Ani is nothing new. The poem was probably composed during mid or late 19th c. when there was renewed interest in our heritage and history. The poem is usually accompanied by a drawing of a very Armenian looking woman dressed in period costume of a mix of folk dress and regalia. The woman is very sad, sitting on a fragment of a fallen column amid many other fallen columns and and stone fragments of once majestic palaces and other monuments. Her facial features are a cross between Mother Hayastan and Mona Lisa with long black hair flowing down the sides and tear drops streaking down her cheek.

It is suggested that the poem is recited by the woman symbolizing Ani Kaghak. As indicated above the poem has a very commonplace language and poor estehtics. It is in the western vernacular sometimes even interspersed with Turkish words. Here is an equally poor translation. It is at times also known as Hayoun Voghb@, Lament of the Armenian.

 

ODE

(to the) CITY OF ANI

 

Ani Kaghak, sitting down, she cries,

No one around to say; "Dont't cry, Don't Cry!"

You say it's so little, let her stay and cry,

Akh! When will I hear "Don't cry, don't cry".

 

With much pain I am on fire, I burn,

I have no one loyal to trust

Who would approach this wretched me?

Who'll ever say; "Don't cry, don't cry"?

 

(Hordorak/Advice)

 

Akh Hay Tgha, have mercy on me,

Look and see how's your Ani,

I have cried enough, you with no mercy.

Is not your alas for Ani!?

 

Days of mourning and fear I've had,

My eyes with tears blinded,

Orphan has always been my lot,

I've been forsaken by my luck .

 

I have lost many a king, blind owls circling my head,

Once I was unequalled your City of the east,

Now I am ruined to the ground,

Sitting alone and weeping here aloud.

 

You came, you saw and now you leave,

You say "goodbye" with lots of tears,

For the sake of God, do not forget..

When you get near our Masis...

 

Tell that my Brave Ararat,

"My poor Ani is down and cries",

When will that mount give the tidings,

"Oh my Ani, enough you've wept"?

[bellthecat]

Thank's a lot Arpa Is it your transation, or did you get it from somewhere?

 

Actually, I had already asked some questions about this "mother Armenia" figure in a previous post, ages ago (though didn't get much in the way of a reply). Since then I have seen more examples of her.

By the start of the 20th century she had begun to stand up (see the cover of "souvenir of Ani" by K. Basmadjian, 1904), and by WW1 she had started to walk (see the first illustration in "Armenian Legends and Poems" by Zabelle Boyajian, 1916). But she does not seem to have survived the war.

 

If you have any more info, I'd be interested! There is an article (in Armenian) about her, which I have not seen, but would like to get hold of: it is "The concept of Mother Armenia in Armenian emancipation" by M. Hagopian, in Etchmiadzin periodical, issue No 4, 1985.

 

Steve

[bellthecat]

Yes, if you can better arpa's!

[bellthecat]

Thank's for your interest Kazza. But I can't understand Armenian beyond a few basic words - there is not much need of it in Turkey, after all. I found an English to Armenian translation page a little while ago: http://www.troy.am/dictionary/

 

But it doesn't do Armenian to English And I can't get the Armenian words to displa -, the site doesn't use unicode to display the Armenian letters (see the recent postings on the armenian-diaspora forum on this subject).

 

Steve

[Guest Fadi]

Nope Steve, can't better, this is about what I understood from it, I even think its English version(Arpa translation) sound more professional then its Armenian conterpart.

 

[ June 04, 2002, 08:26 AM: Message edited by: Domino ]

[Kazza]

Oh ok! No Problem. You see, I thought you would definatley know some of the basics at least- so this is where I thought the alphabet would come in useful. (Might it actually be a good idea to learn some? - It would help you a lot for translatig meanings of all these historical docoments you research, plus if you knew some basics you could make a bit of money teaching. Beginners level pays highly!) O well, that's a bit of a surprise that's it's not used. But why should I be surprised really. It's widely used in Russia, Azerbaijan and Khazakstan, and other caucasian countries, and apparrently a lot in Afghanistan! I also think afghans are mixed with armenians (Brwon skin, Blue and Green eyes) (Embarrasment. But the Taliban all come from Saudi arabia I think) At least that's what i heard

[Kazza]

Arpa, that's brilliant! Where DID you find it?

 

Do you like the poem? The First Two paragraphs pterry much say it all in my eyes though, the rest just repeats itself. does the "Comonplace language" Suggest a "peasant" dialect , not very well written? or just poor translation? It is very lamenting but that is just the style of the poem I suppose. Fair dues when she (Ani) is crying and nobody is comforting her or caring. Just expressing our pain at our land being taken and that is just that.

[Arpa]

Arpa, that's brilliant! Where DID you find it?

To answer both you and Bell. If you mean the English version, you can blame me for all the sins.

 

Do you like the poem?[/b}

Do you want an honest answer?

NO!

Just as I abhorr any "lamentations". I have already written about nerekatsi's "Lamentations".

The First Two paragraphs pterry much say it all in my eyes though, the rest just repeats itself.

does the "Comonplace language" Suggest a "peasant" dialect , not very well written? or just poor translation?

"poor translation"?

I said it was mine!!! No I didn't. So I say it now.

It is poor, just as I am, and I take full blame.

It is very lamenting but that is just the style of the poem I suppose. Fair dues when she (Ani) is crying and nobody is comforting her or caring. Just expressing our pain at our land being taken and that is just that.

About time we got out of the "crying" mode and proceed with the "trying" one.

 

I searched the internet for a "Mayr Hayastan". One will find several pictures of her atop the Haghtanaki Aygi/Victory Park, where our Harazat Mayr replaced that "Anharazat Hayr", Joseph the Butcher. I also found the following. No author/artist listed. Is it May Hayastan or Mother Hutustan?

 

http://www.tacentral.com/echmiadzin/hayastan.htm

 

I found that painting of Mayr Hayastan/Ani Kaghak. In addition and correction to my description above, this Woman is less tearful, even if sad and nostaligic. She sits on ruined fallen monuments, her hand at her sad yet beautiful face. The twin peaks in the background to her left, our right, symbolizing Eatern Armenia, to her right, Western Armenia. On the foreground, again to her left, numerous fragments of fallen monuments, some labeled Vagharshapat, Nakhijevn, Artashat and pictures of what seems to be Ejmiatsin. To her right, fragments labeled Tigranakert, Sis, Van etc. Further forward a fragment of what seems to be royal regalia surrounded by broken weapons like swords spears and armor.

BTW. Her clothes are colored Karmir, Kapuyt Dzirani.

 

I tried to find a more uplifting and promising poem about Ani. There seem to be few. There seems to be precious little to gloat about Ani. It is a wonder the Turks have not yet found a Turkish word/name to relabel the ruins. May I suggest they rename it "Ana" that means "mother" in Turkish. It completes the bastardization. They renamed Aghouri Ler, Aghri Dagh. What is holding them up from turkifying the entire region and five thousand years of history?

 

Daniel Varouzhan may have avenged for us all with his epic poem of "Ani-i Averakneroun Mej". Parts of the poem are lamentatious as expected while others are angry, rebellious and full of hope.

Some excerpts;

"Voghjuyn Ani, gerezmnots,

Our k@ pttin voskornern haghth antsyalin...."

Greetings Ani,the graveyard

Where rot the bones of a victorious past...

....

He invokes many biblical allegories and refers to the depictions of God as as "caricatures/dzaghrankar".

 

"Hayreniki ays voch@nchin bohin dem

Ibr arajin sermentsou

Khosq m'or steghtse, nerdashnake, bortkalov

Poshineren Ani-i

Qanan m@ nor ev azat"

Against this noisy nothingness of the Fatherland

As a first seedling

Words to create, errupt with harmony,

Of the dusts of Ani

A new Canaan and free

 

 

 

--------------------

[bellthecat]

Here is that more animated female personification of Ani by the artist Zabelle Boyajian ("Armenian Legends and Poems", London, 1916).

 

http://virtualani.homestead.com/files/MotherArmenia_Armenian_legends_and_poems.jpg

 

The words below the picture must be from another poem about Ani. They are:

 

The ages pass, no tidings come;

My brave ones fall, are lost and gone.

My blood is chilled, my voice is dumb,

And friend or comfort I have none.

[bellthecat]

Arpa, I have "tidied up" some of your translation a bit! Is there anything that you think I have changed too much? Who or what is "Hay Tgha"? Also, I don't understand the third line of stanza one.

 

Ani Kaghak, sitting down, cries,

No one around to say; "Don't cry, Don't Cry!"

You say it's so little, let her stay and cry,

Akh! When will I hear "Don't cry, don't cry".

 

I am on fire with so much pain, I burn,

I have no one loyal to trust,

Who would approach this wretched me?

Who will ever say "Don't cry, don't cry"?

 

Akh Hay Tgha, have mercy on me,

Look upon your Ani.

You, with no mercy, have I not cried enough?

Do you have no pity for Ani?

 

Days of sorrow and terror I have had,

My eyes blinded with tears,

To be an orphan has always been my lot,

Fortune has forsaken me.

 

I have lost many a king, owls circle my head,

Once I was unequalled, your City of the east,

Now I am ruined, cast to the ground,

Sitting here alone and weeping aloud.

 

You came, you saw, and now you depart,

Saying "goodbye" with many tears.

For the sake of God, do not forget...

When you approach our Masis...

 

Tell to my brave Ararat

"Poor Ani has fallen and weeps",

When will that mountain give the tidings,

"Oh my Ani, you have wept enough"?

[Kazza]

About time we got out of the "crying" mode and proceed with the "trying" one

 

Ha ha ha Arpa! So true. I think perhaps mmore people would have so much more respect if those poets would, give them a better allover impression.

 

There seems to be precious little to gloat about Ani.

Any land I suppose is anything to gloat over to Armenians. Armenia of today is so small and I think it's a half or even a quater of the size compared to Armenia many years ago, before bits and pecies here and there were lost in various invasions. I think the feelings of armenians are that it keeps on getting taken and that a metaphoric woman has been wailing for years, and nobody cares. No wonder that "woman" feels like a victim. O well, you know how the story goes. i think in the 19th century, the caucasus was supposed to be very beautiful. That is what they say.

 

Steve, did I tell you already I read that book as well? I was going to write about it but had to return it. It was very good. I think that girl needs a good old haircut though.

[bellthecat]

The Zabelle Boyajian book? I wonder, can you get a colour photocopy of that picture? My reference library won't give me one because it is still in copyright.

 

A haircut possibly But she is supposed to be very art nouveau and that requires all women to have long flowıng hair!!

 

...And art nouveau is another thing that dıd not survive the First World War

[Kazza]

Well I just saw that haircut, and thought it was funny, mermaid and stereotypical, lol!

 

As for that Zabelle Boyajian book, I'm sure I can get it out again and send you some colour photocopies, If you like.

[bellthecat]

Thanks Kazza :-) There is a copy of it in the hayashen library, so maybe I'll ask them to scan the picture - it will be easier than you going to the trouble of getting hold of the book again and photocopying it. There is now a list of the English books in the library on their website (www.caia.org.uk) - it's in the "about us" section, in the "library" subsection.

[Kazza]

oh, thanks for that information about their list of books steve. I'll definatley be lookingfor that!

 

And also, thanks for your consideration about me going to all the trouble to get it out again and photocopy it. to be honest it WOULD be a bit difficult for me, i am banned from the library (don't ask...) so it helps us both really.

[nairi]

Arpa!!! : You missed 2 stanzas!

 

Here are the missing parts between "I've been forsaken by my luck" and "Once I was unequalled your City of the east":

 

I have lost kings

??? (I have no idea what this line means)

Who will always sing: "Ani passed,

Ani was ownerlessly destroyed."

 

I am Ani very populated

I stayed a bitter ruin;

My cry, my sob and noise (nairi: the idea is intensity. It grows louder and louder. See how you want to translate that),

Like ownerless orphans.

 

Steve, hay tgha means "Armenian boy" and this is really the only indication that Ani may be seen as a woman in this poem. The pronoun in the "intro" is genderless. The Armenian 3rd person singular is genderless. So it's impossible to know whether Ani is feminine or not. In the second part, it's Ani speaking about herself/himself/itself in the 1st person singular. Again, very ambiguous and the only lead to think it's a girl, is the "hay tgha". Why would a man call another man? Though it is possible. It's not a love poem as far as I can see, but a lamentation on the destruction of Ani.

[bellthecat]

This is Ani here - she's quite definitely female.

 

http://virtualani.homestead.com/files/MotherArmenia_Armenian_legends_and_poems.jpg

[bellthecat]

And again here:

http://www.virtualani.freeserve.co.uk/accounts/basmadjian_booklet.gif

Edited August 28, 2004 by bellthecat

[nairi]

Stepanik I'm not saying the poem is not about a woman. I'm saying that the poem has no indication to such. Maybe the author had a woman in mind and every one else who heard it was passed on this information. Very possible. But the author doesn't specify it. That's all I'm saying.