Lebanon

[Z'areh]

Mighty Hizballah takes West Beirut, or in other words Hizballah takes their own home. How heroic!

 

Hassan Nisrallah is most comfortable in pushing for a military confrontation, because he is weaker in a political arena. I think besides the fact that a military deterioration is bad for everybody in Lebanon, it is a major mistake for the anti-government opposition, led by Sheikh Nisrallah to bring the country on the brink of the abyss. AGAIN!

 

Syria on the other hand, watches from a distance and declares this crisis as an "internal problem of Lebanon" while their proxies do the dirty job in destroying Lebanon, of course the US only promises good things without delivering anything, except armament to the army that is nowhere to be seen.

 

 

The Lebanese simply refuse to learn their past lessons, the only ray of hope under these circumstances that can put a halt to the spiral towards self-destruction, is the realization what another civil-war would bring to Lebanon and everyone involved.

 

Just as in 1975 we are hearing today from top government officials that involving the army at this point ("at this point", can you believe it) would fragment that institution. As if the non-fragmentation of the army prevented in the past and would prevent today the recurring of another civil war (at this point I can only scream!!!!!!) The entire population is left to the mercy and the whims of private armies and the national army is again being held back by bickering political "elite". Why then simply not do away with such a sham of an institution if they are not going to be trained properly and be used when needed??

 

 

one would think avoiding 1975 would be a top priority!!! But then this is Lebanon.

 

 

.

Edited May 9, 2008 by Z'areh

[Anonymouse]

Lebanon is just an example that multicultural 'nations' cannot stand (an artificially created state per the mandate of European powers). Iraq is another. The Soviet Union was another. France will be another as the French population wanes and the non-French increase, as the riots indicate. America will be another in the course of time, just as Rome was another a long time ago.

 

Simple hard and fast rules, perfected and reaffirmed by the pendulum of time, but always forgotten by people.

 

 

[Yervant1]

Almost 75% of Lebanese army is from the Shiia sect, do you expect the army to fight their own brothers?

[Z'areh]

Almost 75% of Lebanese army is from the Shiia sect, do you expect the army to fight their own brothers?

 

That's the problem, loyalty of people in Lebanon goes more towards feudal and religious affiliations rather than towards upholding the concept of a "nation", or the idea of being Lebanese first. Unfortunately. It does not help when there are political entities or, so-called parties, such as the Syrian Socialist Party of Lebanon (go figure!) which is currently fighting alongside Hizballah.

 

But the problem is also compounded by the absence of law and order. The tendency in Lebanese politics has always been using or interpreting the existing laws as they wish. The latest example is the Hizballah's interpretation of laws in their own way when they installed radar and telecommunication systems in and around the airport and the city...to fight Israel.

 

Of course!

 

To Anon above, the fact that nations have multiple ethnic groups in their armies is not the problem, the absence of laws that govern a country is. Therefore it is a nonsense to include countries such as France in that equation.

 

 

 

 

/

 

 

 

[Yervant1]

That's the problem, loyalty of people in Lebanon goes more towards feudal and religious affiliations rather than towards upholding the concept of a "nation", or the idea of being Lebanese first. Unfortunately. It does not help when there are political entities or, so-called parties, such as the Syrian Socialist Party of Lebanon (go figure!) which is currently fighting alongside Hizballah.

 

But the problem is also compounded by the absence of law and order. The tendency in Lebanese politics has always been using or interpreting the existing laws as they wish. The latest example is the Hizballah's interpretation of laws in their own way when they installed radar and telecommunication systems in and around the airport and the city...to fight Israel.

 

Of course!

 

To Anon above, the fact that nations have multiple ethnic groups in their armies is not the problem, the absence of laws that govern a country is. Therefore it is a nonsense to include countries such as France in that equation.

 

 

 

 

/

The real problem started for the area particularly for Lebanon when the Europeans redrew the map of the region in the 20th century in order to safeguard their own interests and established puppet kingdoms or governments. It was France who put forward the unwritten rule in the constitution that the president should be Christian Maronite, the prime minister a Sunni Muslim and the speaker of the parliament a Shiia Muslim.

Don't forget that the Northern part of Lebanon was Syrian lands before the Lebanese Republic establishement. Believe me the Lebanese people will find peace amongst themselves if the outside forces leave them alone.

 

[AK-47]

Ahh it's summer again in Lebanon. The trees are blossoming, the heat is stronger than ever, the girls are looking damn fine... and gunfire can be heard from every direction. Smoke is everywhere on the streets but it does not carry the awesome smell of shish taoukh, kebab or shawourma but the smell of tires and shells.

 

Like in 2006 with Israel, like in 2007 with the so-called "Fatah al-Islam", 2008 is no different. Israeli-American-Saudi proxies create an excuse to start war against the Iranian-Syrian proxies in Lebanon...the only difference being the latter is the majority in the country and arguably the only ones who really care about Lebanon.

[AK-47]

It does not help when there are political entities or, so-called parties, such as the Syrian Socialist Party of Lebanon (go figure!) which is currently fighting alongside Hizballah.

LOL, koneh anun@ "Syrian" togh chi tnen. I even saw pics of Al-Assad in Lebanese streets...

The latest example is the Hizballah's interpretation of laws in their own way when they installed radar and telecommunication systems in and around the airport and the city...to fight Israel.

Actually in 2006, the airport was the first target of Israel as it was totally crippled and the city was bombarded non-stop and not just the so-called "Muslim areas"... So they have a good point to install security there. And the firing of the security head of the airport based on his alleged political beliefs was just another drop that spilled the water.

[garmag]

LOL, koneh anun@ "Syrian" togh chi tnen. I even saw pics of Al-Assad in Lebanese streets...

 

For your information Syrian Socialist party of Greater Syria, "Ghaoumi" was a party that pursued and still does, the union of Iraq, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon as one entity...

In 1960/61 they tried a coup in Lebanon that failed.

 

[AK-47]

For your information Syrian Socialist party of Greater Syria, "Ghaoumi" was a party that pursued and still does, the union of Iraq, Syria, Jordan and Lebanon as one entity...

In 1960/61 they tried a coup in Lebanon that failed.

Makes much more sense, thanks for the info garmag.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_Social_Nationalist_Party

[Z'areh]

Hizballah and the government are trying to find a face saving exit from this chaos and the army might just be that exit, managing temporarily the country's affairs, calming things down. That wouldn't be a bad thing at this point. But Hizballah is not going to negotiate with Seniora's government and definitely not disarm. Instead they are going to push for a complete electoral reform for a just representation in the government as they see it. What might end up happening is Maronites loosing the presidency, because Hizballah wants direct elections by the people for the post of the President. In other words the Taif agreement will have to be nullified and the entire constitution will have to be reworked.

 

Oh boy! talk about opening yet another can of worms. Will they be able to pull this off without further bloodshed? the answer depends on the will of the Lebanese (all factions) to resist foreign meddling. Will the Christians cooperate? graceful cooperation was never in the books to start with but with such fragmentation among all groups (even within same religious factions) might force people to compromise and build something worthwhile for all.

 

 

Edited May 10, 2008 by Z'areh

[Eurocentric]

How come the ARF is part of the "March 8 Alliance" headed by Hezbollah?

[Z'areh]

How come the ARF is part of the "March 8 Alliance" headed by Hezbollah?

 

"March 14" alliance is the ruling pro-government alliance headed by Saad Hariri, ARF is not part of that, until recently the ARF was allied with Free Patriotic Movement and its leader Gen. Michel Aoun. But last week Aoun has split with Michel Mur about whom the ARF's Pakradounian has said that Armenians have a forty year strong friendship with, where does that leave the Armenians??? Both Aoun and Mur where allied with Hizballah, Why? because of the pro and anti Syrian elements within the Christian factions and the Phalagists having chosen the pro-government and anti-Syrian Hariri camp.

 

a mind numbing chess game, if indeed Armenians are good in that game then we may come out of this with the least damage. One might hope.

 

 

[AK-47]

"March 14" alliance is the ruling pro-government alliance headed by Saad Hariri, ARF is not part of that, until recently the ARF was allied with Free Patriotic Movement and its leader Gen. Michel Aoun. But last week Aoun has split with Michel Mur about whom the ARF's Pakradounian has said that Armenians have a forty year strong friendship with, where does that leave the Armenians??? Both Aoun and Mur where allied with Hizballah, Why? because of the pro and anti Syrian elements within the Christian factions and the Phalagists having chosen the pro-government and anti-Syrian Hariri camp.

Indeed. ARF has also split with Aoun and returned to neutrality with Michel Murr.

 

The ARF was previously with Aoun and Hizballah because of some electoral disputes with the Hariri clan who were forcing the ARF to join them but which would result in less seats for the 80% ARF voice within Armenians. I think it was some dispute similar to that. Worthy to mention that Hasan Nasrallah has a good relationship with Armenians, having spent most of his childhood in Bourj Hammoud. He can speak Armenian too.

Edited May 11, 2008 by AK-47

[AK-47]

a mind numbing chess game, if indeed Armenians are good in that game then we may come out of this with the least damage. One might hope.

Won't be a problem for us. We can play this game pretty well as we did during the 1975-1990 civil war.

 

We're number one in the world in chess anyway

[Johannes]

http://www.armtown.com/news/am/yer/20080516/1802/

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