Farsi words in Armenian

[Guest]

This is a bit of a spin off from the "Turkish words in Armenian" topic, as many of those given are really Persian words that Turks borrowed. This topic is a bit different from the Farsi/Armenian cognates, which are not borrowings, but similar words and roots that seem to suggest a common relationship with these two Indo European languages. The following are only some of the hundreds of Farsi words my family uses when speaking ARMENIAN( I emphasis that), do any of these look familiar to other Armenians?

 

hala-still, masalan-for example, chai-tea, kahoo-lettuce, takht-bed, moz-banana, portegal-orange, holoo-peach, haveej-carrot, nanaw-mint, aslan-at all, hamam-bath(could be Turkish), holeh-towel, bademjan-eggplant, felfel-pepper

 

There are many, many others!

[Guest]

No. Non of these words (you mentioned) in use in Armenian literature, but some of them use people with less education.

 

However I told about those words (roots) which are in Armenian literature (and it is not clear who borrowed whom these words). Such words for example are:

Dabir=Dpir (Dprots)

D'asht=Dasht

Darvaze=Darpas

Afsoos=Apsos

 

etc.

[Guest]

Ararat jan,

 

I am not talking about Literature, I am talking about everyday speech. Don't tell me you as a person born in Iran do not use "hala" when talking, and you are an educated person!

[Guest]

Dear HB

Thank you for your compliment (educated person).

I don't use hala in my speech, although many Armenians who weren't born in Iran sometimes use this word.

I am trying to use literature Armenian as much as I can. By the way, when I speak Persian, I also try to speak literature Persian, and not slang language as some Persians do.

It could be some times we use slang language in jokes, or about funny events, but I always remember my first Armenian teacher in Tehran, who said: "try to speak your/any language clear (literature), even if some of your family members will teas you for this".

 

But there are about 700-800 words in both Armenian and Persian literature that in use in both languages. And this is normal.

 

Ararat

[Guest]

HalfBreed,

From your your list only few words are in Armenia, namely:

 

hala (or hla)- still, (interestingly enough it's often used in combination with Armenian word for "still" - der. Like "hala der")

 

chai-tea, I'm pretty sure Armenians of Armenia borrowed this word from Russian. Where did the Russians get it from, is a different issue.

 

takht-bed, but in Armenia it's not used for just any kind of bed. It's some sort of small couch, often covered with a carpet and more often is used to sit rather than sleep on it. Like in expression "nstats takhtin spasum em bakhtin" By the way bakht- is this a persian word, too? Sounds like.

 

nana (without w) - mint. Yes, I heard this word from villagers. "Daghdz" is more widely used, though. Literature word is "ananukh".

 

OK, now I have a couple of words, which I'm sure you guys can tell me whether they are persian or turkish:

 

hayat-yard "bardz", jeb-pocket "grpan", marj-bet "graz", trashvel-shave "saprvel", zibil-garbage "aghb", harif-fool "himar", balish-pillow "bardz"

Thanks

[Guest]

Of the words you gave these are used in Farsi, though of course they could be borrowed from Turkish(or probably Persian words used in Turkish):

 

jib-pocket, bawgh-yard though when we speak Armenian we say "bak", bawlesh-pillow

 

The other words must be Turkish as garbage in Farsi is "ashkhal" and "ahmagh" is "fool"(actually so is "Tork" but lets not go there!)

[Guest]

I don't think "chai" is Russian, I think it is actually Hindi in origin and transmitted to other languages via the Mughals into Arabic, Persian and Turkish. Interestingly enough it is "cha" in Portuguese, probably a result of the Moorish occupation.

[Guest]

"Cha" is Chinese!

 

Hayaat, jeb, zibeil, hareif, bademjaan, felfel are all Arabic I checked them in university with my friends from almost all arabic coutries starting from Jordan ending with Morroco. They all have the same words for this.

 

Arab/Arm/Eng

bademjaan/smbouk/eggplant

jezaar or gyazar/stebghin/carrot

khiaar or khiyaar/varoung/cucumber

 

Check out the long "a" or long "e" in the arabic words.

[Guest]

Well Berj, just because those words are in Arabic doesn't mean that they couldn't be from Persian originally after all, what did those lizard eating camel jockeys know about eggplant,cucumbers, and carrots(by the way in farsi we say havij for carrot)? Most cuisine words in Turkish and Arabic come from Persian, I still maintain that. Ancient Persia had an advanced culinary tradition testified by Herodotus and other Greek historians. All the while the Arab bedouins lived off of roots, lizards and camel's milk. I am of course not talking about the Lebanese, who are really Phoenicians or Egyptians who are, well, Egyptians!

[Guest]

Farsi jan,

I'm not telling you that those words were brought by Koureishi tribe from Arabic Penninsula in 630-640. They were just another burst of Arab-Semit tribes from there. Long before they came there were Semitic tribes who spoke almost the same language, like Arameans, Shumerians or even Assirians, who were civilised enough to have agriculture.

I just think Iranians lost some original Farsi words because of Islam and Arabisation and also, as a Farsi speaker, don't you feel that these words are not Farsi. They don't sound like, beacause they are too "sweet"-sounding for Persian. I just don't know how to explain that.

 

P.S.Forgive my "teacher's" way in my previous post, I was just short of time.

 

[This message has been edited by Berj (edited August 14, 2000).]

[Guest]

Bademjan, xiar, hayat, jib, balesh, baxt, taxt, Darvaze, Dasht, and afsus are persian

 

chai is chinese

 

aghb I don't know

himar is arabic

saprvel I don't know if it's Persian, but there is a word, Sopur in Persian which means clean maker, it maybe Armenian or from an other language which I don't know

mint is na'na in persian without w

[Guest]

EVERYONE THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW FOR YOUR IMFORMATION

[Guest]

EVERYONE THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW FOR YOUR IMFORMATION people like half breed were living in other countries of the world and gradually adopting to their language, and starting to use some of that foriegn country's words to express themselves. As you may of noticed, in the United States some Armenians sometimes throw some english words they speak wile speaking in Armenian. For example two friends using a computer to do something( game, program usage, ect.) one might say something like this"spasi Hakop, arajina CANCEL ara heto gna batsi my documents" The word CANCEL that was used in that sentence is wrong. If this guy created children in the future and continues using his illiterate Armenian, the kid will eventually think that this is the way to speak and use vocabulary. Now people who have lived in other countries 8 generation or more, and coming back to Armenian and speaking, Armenians might look at them weirdly and saying "Who were these idiots. Cant even speak articulately." And now is the end of the world because of the uneducated people's population arising and not reading Armlenian literature, not listening Armenian music. not rabiz by the way, that is not Armenian, even rabiz lost its defenition . It is really DUDUK music.