"ya" te "e"

[Harut]

do you guys remember the rule for those two sufixes?

 

when to use "ya", when to use "e".

 

for example, "voske" - "voskya", "metaghe" - "metaghya",...

 

thank you

[nairi]

"ya" and "e" are both adjectives. "ya" is grabar/classical Armenian, "e" is modern Armenian.

[Arpa]

From Dzon by D. Varouzhan;

 

"Eghegnya grchov ergetsi parqer.

Qezi @ndza, im Hayrenik

Sosyats antaren eyi zayn ktrer...

Qezi @ndza hin Hayrenik,

Eghegnya grchov ergetsi qourmer,

@nd eghegan pogh luys elaner.

 

The last line refers to Vahagni Ts@nound@ by Khorenatsi that goes, (second stanza;)

 

@nd eghegan pogh dzoukh elaner,

@nd eghegan pogh botz elaner,

Ev i botzouyn vazer khartyash patanekik...

--------

Nairi is right, well, partially. It all depends on the context, i.e. what you want to say.

"ya" is a suffix, hetadas masnik (grabar) to form an adjective, atsakan just like the "en" suffix in English, as in gold/golden, voski/voskya. The "e" ending is the grammatical declension/holovum as serakan, trakan, batsarakan and gortsiakan, in that light it would be voski, vosku, VOSK-E, voskov. VOSKE=FROM GOLD and VOSKYA=GOLDEN

[Harut]

thanks you people.

 

i remember we studied this back in 5-6 grades in school in Armenia, but i just can't recall it.

there was a rule for it, i believe.

 

but what you said Arpa, makes sense.

"ya" is sufix that makes it "atsakan" and "-e" is the ending for "goyakain holov". let's see if i remember anything.

 

ughghakan - voski

serakan - vosku

trakan - voskun

haytsakan - voskun

batsarakan - voskuts/voske?? (is this where it fits??)

gortsiakan - voskov

nergortsakan - voskum/vosku mej

 

thanks

[nairi]

Dear Harut and Arpa,

 

Voske and voskya are both atsakan (adjectives). I looked it up again. There really is no difference, not even in context, about when to use grabar and when to use modern. Some standard phrases or expressions like "voskya hatoom" use grabar. Other dialects and so on, may or may not use grabar randomly. But "correct" modern Armenian always uses "e", unless it's a standard phrase or expression dating from classical times, or some poet trying to be more poetic (e.g. "Tsootsamati vra kar ... voskya mi matani" - Vahan Totovents. Or "Paytya seghani vra d@ervats er mi hin deghin inknayer" - Yeghishe Charents). As simple as that.

 

Btw, "gold" in English is a noun and "golden" is an adjective. Therefore both "voskya" and "voske" should be translated as "golden".

 

[ July 29, 2002, 01:29 PM: Message edited by: nairi ]

[Harut]

hmm. nairi, you make me think.

 

it could be that they both are adjactives ("voske", "voskya"), but i'm sure there is a rule concerning the usage of those two sufixes("-e", "ya").

there must be some difference.

 

consider this, "yes unem voskya zardeghen". we don't say "voske zardeghen".

we say "yes unem voske banali", but not "voskya banali".

[nairi]

Dear Harut,

 

"Voskya zard(eghen)" is grabar Armenian. "Voske zard(eghen)" is standard modern Eastern Armenian. If you speak Western Armenian or another Eastern Armenian dialect it's possible that you still use the classical form. But in standard modern Eastern Armenian (ashkharhapar) it's "voske zard(eghen)". The same with "voske banali" and "voskya banali". There probably still are dialects that use "voskya banali", but not in ashkharhapar.

 

As for "yeghegnya", it's again classical Armenian. "Yeghegn" is classical Armenian, "Yegheg" is modern. "Yeghegnya" and "yeghegya" are both classical. "Yeghege" is modern.

[SAS]

Nairi,

 

hamenayn deps tarberutyun ka:

 

Teryani hetevyal togher@ terevs qez hamozen:

 

Achqerd pakir, indz qnqush grkir,

Yes qez kpatmem voskE heqiatner:

 

Inch mnac indz - voskYA mi canc, urish vochinch,

Margartashar husgheri gandz- urish vochinch:

 

__________________________________________________

Arajin depqum,

 

Yes qez kpatmem voskE heqiatner

 

hamarzheq e

 

Yes qez kpatmem voskI heqiatner:

 

Aysinqn, heqiatner@ vosku nman lav en, bayc voskuc chen karogh linel:

 

Isk yerkrord depqum canc@ karogh e inchpes voskuc linel, aynpes el metaghic, telic yev ayln:

 

H.G. Yete dzerqis tak liner "Hayoc lezvi" dasagirq kkaroghanayi tal tesakan dzevakerpum:

[nairi]

Sireli SAS,

 

"Voske heqiatner", like "golden tales", could be interpreted as "tales made out of gold" or "great/wonderful tales" depending on the context. If you use your imagination you can turn tales into "voski", but in this case, indeed, Teryan meant "great/wonderful tales" and therefore it's a metaphor. But even in this case "voske" remains an adjective.

 

As for "voskya canc", again it's grabar Armenian. Teryan could've easily used "voske" here as well and it still would've meant the same. But he's a poet and poets like to play with old and new forms, creating new words and expressions as they go along.

 

Anyway, who am I to speak? I'm neither a professor of Armenian language nor have I got the best books. Harut, aren't there any professors where you live? Maybe you should ask one of them. I'm quite curious about the difference myself.

 

[ July 30, 2002, 12:19 PM: Message edited by: nairi ]