Aaron

Hi all Sorry for this pressing message (will return to "memories of Hayastan" as soon as possible, promise!), but I need info very fast (possibly in the following hour and even less). I'm doing some research on armenia's electoral code and I read that the 131 members of parliament are elected in the following manner : 75 single mandate constituencies, 56 proportional representation! I understand more or less how this would work and why some political parties are interested in the increase of the proportional seats system..... but I would like someone to explain me concretely how the sharing between parties occurs, what do electers see on the voting sheet they are given (individual's name, political party, etc). Don't want to pressure anyone, but I need this fast....... I already looked around the web.... the "electoral code" link does not work, could not find detail on www.gov.am.......... so best thing would be a short explanation! thanks for your time A.

note: i didn't mean "harout should be more creative" but rather "the government should be more creative" A.

First suggestion Be more creative and find a viable solution to the dual citizenship issue...... we have the majority of our nation living outside Armenia and therefore we need a custom made solution for the armenians! it's logical, isn't it? A.

Ok, I can take rejection, no problem! I'm just trying it a second time........ in case nobody saw this topic the first time Take care A.

well I once saw a documentary about a french-armenian who was a presence to major political gatherings. I don't know what his job or position was but apparently he enjoyed participating to such ceremonies by sneaking in or using a connection. He was often in group pictures with renowned world leaders despite the fact the fact taht he had nothing to do there! I don't remember his name or face but maybe he is the guy standing second to the left of ter petrosian (from ter petrosian's point of vue), the guy standing next to the black guy! Other than that, I don't know A.

Hi to everyone I don't know if this topic already exists or not (if yes ignore the message), but I wanted to attract your attention on a new website www.armenia2020.org which i find quite impressive. In sum, it is a study of possible developement scenarios for the republic of Armenia until 2020. The coordination team is formed by professional armenians from around the world. You have to register (it takes a few seconds) in order to read the articles, the booklet and the interviews. The booklet (around 140 pages) can also be found on www.acnis.am. Also I would encourage you to participate in the forum built for that purpose. I think that it is very important for armenians to do such projection work related to the future of our small and fragile republic, of course some views might be exagerated, fictional, groundless, hypothetical, optimistic, childish, etc. But the fact that some people have not spared any effort to bring this up is what really counts. hope to hear your opinion A.

More on Aivazian on www.artsakhworld.com the special articles...... it is very interesting! But reading him, you have the impression that a cataclysm is about to happen to the armenians very soon and you do feel a strong sense of urgency (not to say panic).... the effect of is maybe even beyond the positive aspect the feeling should lead to in our hearts. About the beating of the politicians.... I agree! have a nice weekend

Since we did deviate from the original tpoic about birthright armenia, i'll give an opinion on the opening of the turkish border. Yes, the opening of the border could have a negative impact on armenian economy although there is no escape from that, sooner or later Armenia will have to open to all of the world. In my eyes it is not an excuse to keep the border close. The genocide issue is not in my eyes a major obstacle to the reopening of the border, i have never met an armenian who was against the reopening of that border (even in the more "nationalist" circles, in diaspora or armenia). From reading many posts in this topic and in previous sections as well i ask myself how the following misconception occured: the people of armenia willing to open the border and everything being ready except for some stubborn, unrealistic and selfish diaspora armenians who don't want that to happen. This is obviously not true. Turkey does not want that border open because: - It hurts Armenia in many ways - It helps Azerbaijan in a concrete manner (by weakening its enemy) as well as from a psychological support view - It does not at all go against Turkey's interests (economic, political, etc), except in the hypothetical case of having the EU asking for a mandatory opening for possible membership That is it, Turkey does not need Armenia (a poor market of 2 million people) just like it does not need Madagascar or Burkina Faso. And to their senseless statements about "The relations between Armenia and Turkey might deteriorate if armenians don't lay down genocide recognition claims" the obvious answer is that there are unfortunately no relations at all and that things could not get worse anyways. Boghos, I read your post from july 30 about the armenians not being one, the diaspora having many faces and not acting as a single entity, the non existence of such a homogenous thing called diaspora and i totally agree, its very true, i had felt this but you just put it in words. The last sentence of your post about karabaghtsis being the most influential diasporans in armenia was a bit shocking in the sense that you consider karabagh not a part of armenia (and i'm aware it isn't on paper!). This is totally against what armenians (of the world and from any political party or religious group) have believed in since 1988. Have a good day A.

ya, i know, i know, we've all heard it a million times: There should be no social pressure on singles to find someone, and who could possibly disagree with that. But since we are speaking about finding "the other half" which i presume is supposed to be someone that perfectly matches one's idea of the opposite sex (or the sex one is attracted to, to be general and politically correct), we must speak of the notion of compromise in a relationship. I was just discussing it with a girl a few days ago... the fact that relationships are very much resembling to shopping: we go around, try different "products" and pick the one which is most appropriate to our immediate needs.... needless to say that the "product" usually changes when the needs change! I know, i sound materialistic! Why do i have a feeling that i deviated from the topic? Anyways, the point being that "the other half" doesn't necessarily exist in the utopic sense of the expression, it can be soemone who is similar to you or even opposite, but you manage working out the relationship because everyone does make efforts on a constant basis. And i mean real efforts or "zichum"s. I think that is a very important part of the relationship..... you notice that i didn't use the word "love" which is perhaps a primitive form (or maybe an upgraded version) of "relationship". Whatever, i'm starting to play with words and I am dead tired... I'll finish some other time. Gnam knem ara (rabiz to the bones hein angel?) A.

hi everyone I was in Armenia last summer and i did hear people talk about the estblishment of a panarmenian fund intended for the national army. In sum, there would be a sort of telethon throughout the world which would have the objective of collecting a considerable sum (i don't know how much exactly, i suppose in the 10s of millions) to allocate for the needs of today's army. The amount would be frosen and the interest could be used year after year for higher educational purposes of armenian officers and other immediate needs of the army (clothing, nutrition, medical, construction, etc). I'm not an army freek or preacher of violence, but i find the idea is good, and regardless of the sum collected, the benefit would be mostly moral for the soldiers and would raise awareness and hype in the diaspora for one of the most important institutions (if not the most) of our present day republic. what do you think? I will develope my other thoughts later on

Rubo jan i agree 100% with all you said about karabagh! A.

Hey there no reunion of armenian forum members without me, and yes i am inviting myself and imposing my mass on you guys! joke! i am from montreal and would "die" to participate to that meeting but i'm currently out of town for a while, so i reluctantly "authorize" a reunion in my absence! enjoy A.

I just learned that they aknowledged their mistake and the AAA was notified, so its all over A.

MJ how do you explain your point of vue, how would it be good for armenia? the reason i put the "can be debated parantheses" is that I know some armenians have a different point of vue than the majority (that is being against turkish integration in the union). Can you elaborate on that.

Again Genocide! I'm currently in Europe,and the application of Turkey to the EU is on the headlines of all the newspapers politicians of all the countries are discussing the topic, they are always questioned about it during interviews. It is easy to see that it has become a major debating topic. This morning, the EU (at the Copenhague summit)rejected to give in to Turkey's and United State's pressure and set the reevaluation date to its entry for december 2004, in 2 years. Well, i had a long dicussion yesterday night with an african friend of mine about the enlargement of the union, if it was strategically (economically, politically, etc) positive for Europe, and then we focused on turkey's candidacy. His point of view was that Turkey is an asset for Europe, from an economic point of vue, as well as from a geopolitical perspective (controling the dardanelle's channel, borders with middle eastern oil producing countries, military, etc). I convinced him that Turkey did not have a european charachter (and still it is hard to define what is European), its culture is more of a middle eastern culture than european one (not that there is anything wrong with that). And we came to the conclusion that if Turkey joined the union, it wouldn't be because of the official, and politically correct reasons that the union likes to present to the pubic, but rather for mutual interest. It is true that Turkey has enormous problems with human rights and especially its past(not only with armenians) but i think those are excuses used by the europeans not to accept Turkey, their motivations are more pragmatic. And i certainly don't think Europe cares a bit for Turkey's bad record. If we blame Turkey for mistreating minorities, or its past, then why not Poland, Bulgaria, Romania who arn't very good with their gypsie minorities either, and as for the past; which country does not have blood on its hands. Ok, i was playing the devil's advocate (i think what i said previously though), but i think there is a point in accepting Turkey in the union, even if i'm against it because it goes against the interests of the republic of Armenia (could also be discussed!). As for the genocide, you can't see it in the media, as if the armenians were in a monostruggle, no one noticing that they have an opponent and being themselves the only ones knowing that they are fighting. in sum, neglected. Of course, armenians here will fight (politically) for the genocide to become a precondition for turkey's adhesion to Europe, but i sincerely doubt that it will work, unless Europe is definitely not interested in Turkey and is ready to use all excuses (including historic ones like armenian genocide)it can find not to open the door, in which case i think the Turks would do all in their power to empty their frustration on the small republic to their east (given the genocide issue represents a major obstacle to their joining in). Well, i know many ideas are contradictory with Armenia's interests (even though i am a patriot), but i think we have to analyse the situation by being honest with ourselves. Clarify my thoughts please! i will reply by tuesday, won't have access to computer utill then.

Hi to everyone This is urgent, i'm translating (as a part time job) a french computer related site to english. although my knowledge of english is good, the terms are so technical that i use dictionaries and "technical terms" sites on the web. i would like to know if i can translate a web page by using a software, (i tried the altavista translator, its a word by word translator, very dangerous to use in the sense that you pass more time understanding what it gives you!!),or if going on each page one by one and modifying with "front page" is the only solution if we want professional and quality work (and it is my case). thanks aaron

MJ and alpha did you read the article i told you about, Eduard you should read it too and tell me what you think Rubo i agree with you on what you said in your private message, i was still in Armenia during the early stages of the karabagh mouvement and even though a kid, i could feel the hype at the time. Reading this expert's work, i have the impression that it is very close of the official approach of Armenia to the problem, that of Kocharian, and i personnally think it is a good mutual compromise solution. Once again, i don't think the opponent will accept it. From what i hear coming out of Azerbaijanian media, their remedy of the problem is very different than the one we put forward. the topic seemed very intense and interesting enough for me to close the election parantheses and get back to it. will discuss later!

quote:The Artsax movement started in 1988...and by 1991, when the first major armed conflicts were reported, our tashi(dashnak) brothers weren't ready for a war. it is not true Eduard.

since, at some point in the debates, the topic went on the resolution and possible solutions to the Karabagh problem i would ask some of you to go on www.artsakhworld.com and read Armen Ayvazian's (armenian politicologue) work "possible solutions to NKR problem". I would want to have your opinion about such a plan, MJ, Alpha, Rubo tell me honestly what you think of the author's suggestions and if they are realistic. What concerns the debate over dashnaks (i don't belong to any armenian party or organization), wether they have a role in the genocide or not varies from person to person. I personally think the genocide happened mainly because of the armenian revolutionary movements that started from 1890, wether dashnak, hnchag or others, they became a headake for the turkish government for a quarter century (25 years) and the result was a close cooperation of armenians with Russia and the awakening of armenians in general. I think the turks realised that the peacefull armenians had regained national consciousness and that it was a matter of time before they gained independence, therefore they opted for the extreme solution. Now it would be illogical to say that the armenians should have never rebelled against the ottoman empire, they should have stayed quite, even if that option might have been the most efficient. The revolution was the natural consequence of an unnatural situation imposed on armenians by turks, the whole world was boiling in revolutionary ideas, it was the mainstream political current and in many cases it succeded, many nations gained independence and freedom: unfortunately, armenians failed (to the initial goals they had). i don't think, therefore, that Dashnaks are to blame. They tried their best (with most armenians)and since the armenians had not tried for a very long time (almost a millenium) and had forgotten what struggle for independence meant, they didn't stand a chance against the extermination plan that a few turks prepared and applied on them.

i just found a book written by an armenian that lives in Estonia, gohar marcossian. the book is called " penelope prend un bain" (penelope takes a bath)its translated to french from russian and it was in a bookstore(not armenian). I was impressed, i mean how many books by armenian authors do you see in north america, and the story is pretty good too! apparently it won a prize in Russia you guys should read it!

about radio yerevan there is a member in the forum from sweeden, i don't remember his 9or her) name,but i recall going to the profile and checking the personal website, there were some radio yerevan jokes there i remeber one what is the difference between capitalism and socialism? in capitalism man exploits man, in socialism its the opposite.

Whoot I'm from Montreal and i'm going too have fun!

Lets not a skip this news just like any other. It is one of the sadest aspects af Armenia's present harsh situation: the brain drain which is a national tragedy. We've discussed this before in a topic. The problem resurfaces in media and thank god it does. quote Very true, I've personnally seen many scientists in Armenia, struggling with difficult conditions and still producing high quality research articles, papers with clearly acceptable international standards. I don't know what can be done to save the scientific community there. Any suggestions, MJ say something!

The question of armenian identity in the diaspora has risen many times in this forum. Never has an answer or clear description of the situation been given by any member. No one knows how many armenians there are in such-such community and what are the stats on those who feel armenian, those who participate in armenian organizations, teach armenian to their children, etc. I will wright about the preservation of the diaspora because the subject discussed is closely related to it. Some of you may say " participation does not reflect my feelings towards armenia, i can be a very good armenian without necessarily getting involved in the community" true, and many, as a matter of fact the majority, do think like this. The situation described is a luxury armenians can not afford if willing to stay armenian, not getting involved is allowed for nations that are on their soil but definitely not for us. As boghos said the diaspora will dissapear some day which leads to the same conclusion that one needs to be on a land belonging to him in order to evolve as a "citizen" of that land. Yes, you might think your safe against assimilation, but what about your children and their children... I don't know about boghos but i believe that diaspora's final hour can be extended by having more efficient organizations (other than church) or most importantly participation and dedication from armenians around the world. I firmly believe that no matter the billions $$ and efforts spend, a nation can not suvive if not on a territory (physically) belonging to him. bottom of the line, and it might sound harsh, we should have never lost western Armenia. lessons for the future: lets try not to lose karabagh. And also, whatever that conversation was about cool or uncool culture i'll reply tomorrow. meanwhile I'm waiting for answers, comments and insults talk to you tomorrow Excuse me if i deviated from the topic :happy:

Paul if the war starts both armies will fight hard. those who believe a quick armenian victory is possible basing on what happened during the first war are wrong. Azerbaijan would never attack if not confident and sure of substantial gains. On the other hand those who believe an Azeri victory is possible are also wrong, they might take cities, provinces, regions but clean net and final victory is impossible, a guerilla war would start creating hell for azeri troops. This is the last thing we need, it would totally and slowly destroy and drain armenia's energy. It is too late to bring the situation to what it was before 1988, the idea of independence is anchored through the minds. So peace is the best way, but i definitely think azeris must show more flexibility in negotiations.