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Recently I have discovered for myself that Hans Holbein painted Armenian carpets in some of his famous works. For instance the famous painting of Ambassadors depicts the two French ambassadors to the English court, Jean de Dinteville (1504-1555) and Georges de Selve (1508/09-1541). Clearly the carpet in the painting is Armenian which is proven by Armenian "T" letter incorporated in the carpet design. Armenian "T" which is similar to Latin "S" is for "Ter Astvats" (Our Lord) and identifies Armenian christian carpets. http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/art/h/holbein/ha...5a/6ambassa.jpg http://www.i-a-s.de/IAS/Bilder/HOLBEIN/Ambassadors.htm HOLBEIN, Hans The Ambassadors 1533 Oil on wood 207 x 209.5 cm National Gallery, London Another beautiful example in the portrait of the Merchant Georg Gisze, 1532 Oil on wood, 96,3 x 85,7 cm Staatliche Museen, Berlin http://www.kfki.hu/~arthp/html/h/holbein/h...535/2gisze.html I find this simply amaising! Holbein being undoubtfully one of the greatest masters of his time, depicted Armenian carpets

Dear Arpa. I dont think we have to look for a proof that those carpets are Armenian. They are. One of the biggest experts on the Oriental carpets Volkmar Gantzhorn (who published a book called Oriental Carpets, TASCHEN, 1998) clearly states that the usage of "T"="S" in oriental carpets is an identifying mark for the christian Armenian carpets. He goes further by insisting that Armenian Plateau was the origin for virtually all the carpet making in Orient. He provides maps, traces and alalysis of the ornaments used in carpet waving. It would not be an exaggeration to say that 70% of that thick volume is dedicated to the Armenian carpets. The author illustrates his point by paintings as well but Holbein works are not mentioned in his book. I highly recommend this book, its widely available on the market. Unfortunately I dont have a scanner at the moment so I cannot scan the maps which show the migration of carpet waving from Armenia to the Orient, Middle Asia and Europe. Here is a paragraph from the foreword: " As cult objects of Christian oriental churches, these carpets, along with other textiles, constitute what may well be the most important Armenian contribution to the history of the world art. This book attempts to make good the injustice done to a people who, in the course of their more than two thousand year history, have suffered more than any other as a result of their geographic location butween the Orient and the Occident. The Armenians have countless times been divided, exploited, robbed, exiled, deported, enslaved, murdered and mistreated. They have been even robbed of their art, the autorship for which has been attributed to the conquerors during the years which followed, either due to an ignorance of the facts involved, or to the manipulation of these facts. This unique collection of patterns and designs, characteristic of oriental carpets, is a part of the Armenian heritage and identity, and it should now be understood as such." Volkmar Gantzhorn. "Oriental Carpets" http://www.abrilbooks.com/images/books/Oriental2.gif http://www.roslin.com/bookinfo/bookinfo4.htm I have searched the web for "Holbein + Armenian" and here are the results: Introduction to Armenian Rugs http://zangezur.tripod.com/rugs/armrug.html "The merchants in Armenia, in particular, used this dispersed network of expatriated Armenians to their advantage as they acted as the middle-men for trade between the Mediterranean, Asia, and Europe. By the 14th century this trade network was firmly established between Northern and Southern Europe. Thus, many Armenian rugs made their way to Europe. This is evidenced by the appearance of Armenian rugs in many European paintings, the most notable of them being Hans Holbein's (1425-1524) portrait of George Gyze, a merchant who is depicted as sitting at a table covered with a popular Armenian Kuba rug [2]." Oriental Rug Review, Back Issues, Vol. 8-16 Ron O'Callaghan Oriental Rug Review Asian Trade Sinclair Hill Rd. New Hampton, NH 03256 (603) 744-9191 ronocal@lr.net http://www.rugreview.com A White Ground Small Pattern "Holbein" Rug in a c. 1500 Northern Italian Painting, by Peter E. Saunders http://www.rugreview.com/orr/or134cov.jpg and of course- turks claiming this for their own- without a mention that Armenians had anything to do with those carpets - (the only place "Armenian" is mentioned is in context of "Armenian allegations", whatta surprise!) http://www.kultur.gov.tr/portal/arkeoloji_...sp?belgeno=3005 There is much much more.... I am flying to Paris in few hours, so my time is short, but I will try to post more info when I return. [ March 13, 2003, 02:20 PM: Message edited by: Rouben Malayan ]