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#21 MosJan

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 03:09 PM

US Administration trying to buy time for Turkey's parliament to act 05.03.2010 00:25 GMT+04:00 Posted Image Posted Image /PanARMENIAN.Net/ White House spokesman Robert Gibbs suggested the administration was trying to buy time for Turkey's parliament to act. In October, Turkey and Armenia signed Protocols for normalization of relations, but Turkey has yet to ratify it, AP reported.

"Our focus is on continuing to make progress on an issue that has, for almost 100 years, divided two countries," Gibbs said. "Through some very tough diplomatic work by Secretary Clinton, we've made progress. We're on the cusp of normalization."



#22 MosJan

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 03:11 PM

Resolution 252 cannot prevent Armenian-Turkish normalization 04.03.2010 22:38 GMT+04:00 Posted Image Posted Image /PanARMENIAN.Net/ "Voting for the Armenian Genocide resolution at U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Foreign Affairs, we are not opposing the Turkish state,” Keith Ellison the congressman from Minnesota said during a hearing at the Foreign Affairs Committee of U.S. House of Representatives.

According to the Congressman, this resolution cannot prevent the ongoing process of Armenian-Turkish normalization. "No matter what, we must promote the Armenian-Turkish reconciliation," he stressed.

The Armenian Genocide (1915-23) was the deliberate and systematic destruction of the Armenian population of the Ottoman Empire during and just after World War I. It was characterized by massacres, and deportations involving forced marches under conditions designed to lead to the death of the deportees, with the total number of deaths reaching 1.5 million.

The date of the onset of the genocide is conventionally held to be April 24, 1915, the day that Ottoman authorities arrested some 250 Armenian intellectuals and community leaders in Constantinople. Thereafter, the Ottoman military uprooted Armenians from their homes and forced them to march for hundreds of miles, depriving them of food and water, to the desert of what is now Syria.

To date, twenty countries and 44 U.S. states have officially recognized the events of the period as genocide, and most genocide scholars and historians accept this view. The Armenian Genocide has been also recognized by influential media including The New York Times, BBC, The Washington Post and The Associated Press.

The majority of Armenian Diaspora communities were formed by the Genocide survivors.



#23 MosJan

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 03:23 PM

just USA poking turky, tesnes es angam inch hashiv unen

#24 MosJan

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 03:23 PM


23 կողմ, 22 դեմ. Ցեղասպանության բանաձևն ընդունվեց
[ 2010/03/05 | 00:48 ] աշխարհ, քաղաքականությունPosted ImageԱՄՆ Կոնգրեսի Ներկայացուցիչների պալատի Արտաքին հարաբերությունների հանձնաժողովում այսօր Երևանի ժամանակով 23:15 սկսվել էր Հայոց ցեղասպանության վերաբերյալ թիվ 252 բանաձևի քվեարկությունը: Շուրջ մեկ ժամ և 30 րոպե տևած քվեարկությունից հետո 23 կողմ, 22 դեմ ձայնով բանաձևն ընդունվեց:

Դեմ քվեարկողների մեծ մասը հղում էր կատարում հայ-թուրքական նախաստորագրված արձանագրություններին` նշելով, որ պետք չէ խոչընդոտել դրանց վավերացման գործընթացին:



#25 Em

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 03:59 PM

so wan is turkey going to recall his ambassasstor



They did so just as you were posting that question.

#26 Yervant1

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 04:43 PM

Turkey Recalls Ambassador Over U.S. 'Genocide' Vote
by The Associated Press

March 4, 2010

Turkey is recalling its ambassador to the United States for consultations following a House resolution declaring the killing of Armenians by Ottoman Turks around the time of World War I "genocide."

The move came minutes after the House Foreign Affairs Committee approved the resolution Thursday with a 23-22 vote. The passage came despite the Obama administration's plea to Congress not to offend Turkey, a NATO ally, by approving it.

A statement from Ankara said Ambassador Namik Tan was being recalled with immediate effect.


The resolution now goes to the full House, where prospects for passage are uncertain.

Turkey, which has a crucial role in U.S. interests in the Middle East and Afghanistan, had warned that the resolution's approval could jeopardize U.S.-Turkish cooperation and set back negotiations aimed at opening the border between Turkey and Armenia.

Armenian American groups have for decades sought congressional affirmation of the killings as genocide.

#27 MosJan

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 05:11 PM

They did so just as you were posting that question.




good :) one less turk in USa

#28 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 05:55 PM

good Posted Image one less turk in USa


inch ansirt mard es )))))))

Harut Sassoonian said "the man was here to enjoy America, look what they did to him" ))))))) turqi qtic berin


The same must have been done with Serj Sargsayan. Look how much harm the SOB brought to the Genocide issue.

#29 ED

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 06:08 PM

this means nothing yet, I'll wait and see if palosi will bring this for actual vote on the floor, we have been there before people dont forget! Clinton, Bush, Bush jr. almost every sitting president has gotten involved and managed to stop the VOTE.

If you ask me, I hardly give a damn about this 23-22 vote for this commity and lets ask our selfs a question shell we?

what will we gain from NON BINDDING resolution even if congress would pass it?

Mtatsenq te inchpes zorananq mer nerka Hayreniqov, ashxarum voch mi petutyun che tvel hox arants aruni, aryamb er vor Artsaxe azatagretsinq, hima tox gan u het "uzen".

turq@ mnuma turq...10000000 tari el antsni et haremum arajatsats azg@ chi poxvi, menak mi hat METS rumb a petq u verj!!!

#30 Zartonk

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Posted 04 March 2010 - 09:06 PM

US Congress warned over Turkey-Armenia 'genocide' vote


Armenian-Americans have lobbied for official use of the world "genocide"
The Obama administration has called on a Congressional panel not to describe the killing of Armenians by Turkish forces during World War I as genocide.
US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton urged the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee to hold off a vote on the issue, the White House said.
She said the non-binding resolution would harm talks between Turkey and Armenia.
The resolution is fiercely opposed by Turkey, a key ally of the US.
In 2007, a similar resolution passed the committee stage, but was shelved before a House vote after pressure from the George W Bush administration.
Turkey has warned of consequences for US-Turkey ties if the latest resolution is passed.
During his election campaign President Barack Obama promised to brand the mass killings genocide.
'Too important'
On Thursday, committee chairman Howard Berman urged fellow members of the committee to endorse the resolution despite the White House warnings.



Q&A: Armenian genocide dispute
"I believe that Turkey values its relationship with the United States at least as much as we value our relations with Turkey," he said.
The Turks, he added, "fundamentally agree that the US-Turkish alliance is simply too important to get side-tracked by a non-binding resolution passed by the House of Representatives".
Even if the committee approves the resolution, it is unclear whether it will go forward to a vote in the House of Representatives.
A Turkish parliamentary delegation has gone to Washington to try to persuade committee members not to approve the resolution.
It calls on Mr Obama to ensure that US foreign policy reflects an understanding of the "genocide" and to label the World War I killings as such in his annual statement on the issue.
Nationalist sentiment is intense in Turkey and, if the resolution passes, there will be an emotional reaction, even by those who have been arguing for reconciliation with Armenia, says the BBC's Jonathan Head in Istanbul.
In October last year, Turkey and Armenia signed a historic accord normalising relations between them after a century of hostility.
Armenia wants Turkey to recognise the killings as an act of genocide, but successive Turkish governments have refused to do so.
Hundreds of thousands of Armenians died in 1915, when they were deported en masse from eastern Anatolia by the Ottoman Empire. They were killed by troops or died from starvation and disease.
Armenians have campaigned for the killings to be recognised internationally as genocide - and more than 20 countries have done so.
Turkish officials accept that atrocities were committed but argue they were part of the war and that there was no systematic attempt to destroy the Christian Armenian people.

#31 Yervant1

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Posted 05 March 2010 - 08:42 AM

Turkey warns U.S. against genocide vote

05/03/2010 7:40:55 AM

CBC News
Turkey's foreign minister warned the Obama administration on Friday of negative diplomatic consequences if it does not do more to block a U.S. resolution branding the World War I-era killing of Armenians as genocide.


Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said Turkey would assess what measures it would take should a resolution approved Thursday pass in the U.S. House of Representatives.

"We expect the U.S. administration to, as of now, display more effective efforts. Otherwise the picture ahead will not be a positive one," Davutoglu told reporters.

The U.S. foreign affairs committee panel approved the resolution declaring the Ottoman-era killing of Armenians genocide with a 23-22 vote. The resolution is now set to go before the full House.

Obama has urged the congressional panel not to approve the resolution, saying he did not want to upset promising talks between Turkey and Armenia on improving relations and opening their border.

Turkey also remains a key Muslim ally for the United States in the Middle East, and Washington was expected to press Turkey to support sanctions against Iran to be approved by the UN Security Council, where Turkey holds a seat.

Canada recognized genocide in 2004

Historians estimate that up to 1.5 million Armenians were killed by Ottoman Turks in 1915 at the end of the First World War.

The deaths are widely viewed by genocide scholars as the first genocide of the 20th century. But Turkey denies that the deaths constituted genocide and contends the toll has been inflated and the casualties were victims of civil war and unrest.

Canada recognized the deaths as genocide in 2004, after Parliament voted 153-68 to adopt a Bloc Québécois motion that condemned the act as "a crime against humanity."

Twice since then, Turkey has recalled its ambassador to Canada in response to what it viewed as overt shows of support for the branding of the event as a genocide, most recently in April last year after Canadian officials reportedly attended an event in Ottawa organized to mark the fifth anniversary of parliament recognizing the 1915 killings as genocide.

Canadian officials have repeatedly stated, however, that the country's position on the mass deaths of Armenians more than 90 years ago was not an indictment of modern Turkey.

The U.S. foreign affairs committee approved a similar genocide measure in 2007, but the House chose not to vote on it after facing pressure by top officials in the administration of then President George W. Bush.

With files from The Associated Press

#32 gamavor

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Posted 05 March 2010 - 10:27 AM

[quote name='Yervant1' date='05 March 2010 - 08:42 AM' timestamp='1267800167' post='268389']
Turkey warns U.S. against genocide vote

This is a joke. All "cons" expressed in that room that led to 23:22 were a JOKE and humiliation to our nation.

Hillary Clinton said something to the effect that you see the peace process between Armenia and Turkey will be derailed if such thing is voted. I say BS. Neither Turkey nor Armenia has ratified the Protocols. Moreover, it looks like Turkey would never ratify them unless she is pushed to.
Secondly, the concerns about using Turkey's airspace are outright lie. Turkey refused to allow American troops into Iraq through her territory, which have caused higher dead toll on the part of Americans. Nevertheless, the most fun part is the American CEO's objections to the resolution. As if, they are selling their military hardware to Turkey, not because their staff is reliable and competitive but because Turkey likes America very much. If they do not buy from USA where else, they can buy it. Russia or China? Then what happened to Nato membership?

#33 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 05 March 2010 - 11:59 AM

[quote name='gamavor' date='05 March 2010 - 08:27 AM' timestamp='1267806435' post='268392']
[quote name='Yervant1' date='05 March 2010 - 08:42 AM' timestamp='1267800167' post='268389']
Turkey warns U.S. against genocide vote

This is a joke. All "cons" expressed in that room that led to 23:22 were a JOKE and humiliation to our nation.

Hillary Clinton said something to the effect that you see the peace process between Armenia and Turkey will be derailed if such thing is voted. I say BS. Neither Turkey nor Armenia has ratified the Protocols. Moreover, it looks like Turkey would never ratify them unless she is pushed to.
Secondly, the concerns about using Turkey's airspace are outright lie. Turkey refused to allow American troops into Iraq through her territory, which have caused higher dead toll on the part of Americans. Nevertheless, the most fun part is the American CEO's objections to the resolution. As if, they are selling their military hardware to Turkey, not because their staff is reliable and competitive but because Turkey likes America very much. If they do not buy from USA where else, they can buy it. Russia or China? Then what happened to Nato membership?
[/quote]

What we witnessed yesterday, was a well orchestrated show. Obama and Clinton have played on two different grounds to put more preasure on turkey. It wasn't a victory for us, yet the turks have suffered a humiliating defeat.

#34 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 05 March 2010 - 12:08 PM

this means nothing yet, I'll wait and see if palosi will bring this for actual vote on the floor, we have been there before people dont forget! Clinton, Bush, Bush jr. almost every sitting president has gotten involved and managed to stop the VOTE.

If you ask me, I hardly give a damn about this 23-22 vote for this commity and lets ask our selfs a question shell we?

what will we gain from NON BINDDING resolution even if congress would pass it?

Mtatsenq te inchpes zorananq mer nerka Hayreniqov, ashxarum voch mi petutyun che tvel hox arants aruni, aryamb er vor Artsaxe azatagretsinq, hima tox gan u het "uzen".

turq@ mnuma turq...10000000 tari el antsni et haremum arajatsats azg@ chi poxvi, menak mi hat METS rumb a petq u verj!!!



During the Artsak war, the turkish army twice wanted to cross the border with Armenia, and open a second front. Even with a NON-BINDDING RESOLUTION you can kill the turkish dream of ever attacking Armenia.

And yes, you are right, 'turq@ mnuma turq'. The old saying comes to mind "where the turk goes, no green grass grows". They are who they are, and the chances are, they'll never change. With a legar term, lebaling the turks as a butcher, will prevent them from attacking Armenia.

#35 Yervant1

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Posted 06 March 2010 - 10:52 AM

It seems that the message is getting through their heads that the only way is by facing it.

MEDIA ASK: WHAT NEXT FOR GENOCIDE VOTE?

BBC NEWS
http://news.bbc.co.u...ope/8551926.stm
2010/03/05 15:41:06 GMT

Armenian and Turkish media express a sense of deja vu over the vote
by a US congressional panel which described the killing of Armenians
during World War I as genocide.

But while Armenian expectations appear low, Turkish commentators speak
of a movie re-run and feel that the "genocide problem" will continue
to haunt the country unless something positive is done about Turkey's
relations with Armenia.

Armenian newspaper and TV reports present the vote as the result of a
"war" between competing lobbies, but some point out that the resolution
had previously received committee support without making the next,
critical step of being approved by the full House of Representatives.

Nothing new

"It is generally believed that the resolution approved yesterday
will have the fate of the previous ones. With the approval of this
document Washington merely makes an attempt to pressure Turkey into
ratifying the Armenian-Turkish protocols (on normalising relations),"
says Haykakan Zhamanak , a major Armenian daily.

The Armenian daily Aravot - in a piece headlined "Turks urged to
reconcile with history" - says: "The resolution was introduced in
the foreign relations committee of the House of Representatives three
times over the past 10 years and was approved - like yesterday."

In days leading up to the vote the media gave wide publicity to
campaigns by the Armenian lobby in the US.

And in a report on the successful outcome of the vote, the daily paper
Azg says: "Three Armenians who witnessed the Genocide, two women and
a 105-year-old man, were present in the House of Representatives
yesterday - to see and to feel how the US approaches the tragedy
they experienced."

Reaction in the Turkish press was mixed, with one commentator
suggesting Turkey should address the moral question behind the vote.

Others believed the irksome "genocide" issue could be eased by
diplomatic means.

Movie re-run

Ismet Berkan, writing in Turkey's Radical , said Turkey was in
the habit of threatening anyone who alleged genocide against the
Armenians. "But whether we like it or not," he said, "the subject
of the resolution is a moral one - we should provide a moral answer
to it. But no, we continue to withhold that answer. And we do this
knowing that this policy has not brought us anything."

Mehmet Ali Birand, said in Turkey's Posta that the vote was a
"rerun of the genocide movie" which "will constantly keep running at
theatres". He predicted that pressure on Turkey would mount, and that
it would therefore be best "if we are realistic and try to implement
the protocol with Armenia".

Another commentator, Ferai Tinc, writing in Turkey's Hurriyet,
concurred that the problem should be solved within the framework of
pursuing good relations with Armenia, adding that the issue would
escalate and damage Turkey's diplomatic ties. "And it will not end
even when the US approves the [genocide] claims because the issue
will be carried to the UN and other international platforms."

BBC Monitoring selects and translates news from radio, television,
press, news agencies and the internet from 150 countries in more
than 70 languages. It is based in Caversham, UK, and has several
bureaux abroad.

#36 Em

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 03:28 AM



About Blame and Blindness: HR252 has no relevance to “protocols”
By John Hughes
ArmeniaNow Chief Editor

Yerevan, Armenia ain’t Washington, D.C., any more than this newsroom is a Congressional Committee hall.

But in the world we live in here, most accept what nobody, there, is saying. This:

“Normalization” talks between Armenia and Turkey, failed quite a while before a late-afternoon vote in D.C. had congresspersons talking about that possibility.

Not since last October, when State Department led “protocols” offered promises that soon became impossible to fulfill, has there been reasonable belief that Armenia and Turkey were skipping hand in hand on a yellow brick road to lollipops and Technicolor dreams.

Yet from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton in Costa Rica, to President of Turkey Abdullah Gul in Ankara and repeatedly invoked by congresspersons who reveal their shallow understanding of the Armenian reality, the collateral damage feared to the protocol process was raised as an emergency brake on House Resolution 252 by those who wrongly think that October roadmap is still leading anywhere.

When Congressman Delahunt, for example, argued that the resolution would impede the protocol process, had he been in recess nearly a month ago when Turkey’s Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu called the process dead? (Davutoglu was displeased that Armenia’s Constitutional Court opined that the documents were constitutional so long as they allowed Armenia to maintain its resistance to Genocide deniers.)

And when Congressman Burton said the protocol process would be damaged, had he no clue that Armenia herself has just this week passed legislation that provides an escape clause against enforcing the protocols even if they are ratified?

These are not steps that imply compliance on either side of the State Department’s Kumbaya dance.

It is reasonable that Secretary Clinton wishes to see her hard-fought diplomacy find a payoff. It was she, after all, who spent an October Saturday afternoon hold up in a staff car with cell phones at each ear, just to get the Turk and the Armenian FMs to follow through on signing.

It is not reasonable, though, that all sides shouldn’t admit that the protocols were flawed, scrap them with dignity if possible, and regroup knowing that at least 23 U.S. congresspersons on a House committee see the bigger picture. Which is this: A government, a nation, a race, can either be the aggressor or the martyr; it can’t be both (with the possible exception of Al-Qaeda as today’s reality suggests).

Practically no one in that hearing chamber on Thursday claimed that what happened to the Armenians was anything but genocide. Still, those who voted against the resolution justified their vote by the political equivalent of saying “you murdered, raped, burned, exiled my family and stole their land but, eh, you have feelings too, so let’s be nice to each other”. And it is that loophole in morality that somehow, after nearly 100 years of denial, finds Turkey claiming rights as the aggrieved. And here’s a bewildering aspect: The men and women in D.C. feel it cushions the blow of accountability if references condemn the “Ottomans”, rather than the Turks. Oddly, though, by reacting with indignation, President Gul links his people to the stained past none should want a part of.

“I consider the decision (to endorse HR252) unreasonable. It lacks respect to the Turkish nation . . .”

No. It lacks respect – for none is deserved – to the criminals whose bloodline modern Turks unfortunately share, but for whom descendants should not be held in contempt.

No modern Turk should be condemned for the Genocide anymore than a modern American should be condemned for slavery, for the Trail of Tears, for historic resistance to civil rights, for inequality of women, for a misguided president starting wars that cannot be won...

Unless that modern Turk embraces denial, the bedfellow of guilt.

By retracting its ambassador from Washington – as it did within minutes of the Committee vote – and by threatening diplomatic repercussions, Ankara in effect has said to Washington in March what it said to Yerevan last October: Share our blindness to history so that we all might squint our way to a brighter future.

Yerevan didn’t buy it. But, as said, Yerevan ain’t Washington.







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