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Dual Citizenship


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#61 SirunTgha

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Posted 05 February 2008 - 11:39 AM

QUOTE (' date='Oct 5 2000, 03:14 AM)
This is not a new topic, but in light of Kocharian´s promise to bring it forward in Novemeber it is probably worth discussing it.

My take: citizenship should be based on blood ties or long term residence; voting rights only for citizens living in Armenia; military service remains compulsory; citizenship should be automatic and free for genocide survivors.


I agree it should be for genocide survivors, but what if let's say for exemple a British comes to reside in Armenia and wishes to stay, shouldn't he be allowed to earn his citizenship? I thnk the blood ties should not even be a critera.

Kocharian is a kharabaxtsi, he sens young men to be slaughtered in kharabax, he's a mafioso and I hate him.

Military service should be a must, which is the case right now. I strongly support an obligatory military service for all Armenians residing in Armenia. Now there's a problem to that, as you may know, the Armenian army is a total mess, young men are being very ill treated e.g. beatings, RAPE, and even murder. Many suicide attempts have been taking place in the last 10 years in our military. Thousands of Armenian families have left the country to protect their children from it, which is my case, i'm now 19 years old. I had two cousins, one died in his first 3 months, he was an officer and it seems he was beaten to death, my second cousin, his brother, returned home completely insane, he was beaten, raped and it took at least 3 months for psychiatrists to bring him back to light.

The point i'm making, since Armenia is a small country and except with Iran, it has no positive diplomatic relations with its surrounding countries, Turkey, Georgia. Which is why all men, residents of Armenia should be able to defend their motherland, god forbids, during a war.

In order to achieve that, the governmen must establish strict rules and policies to protect young men serving their country, when such ideaology will be applied, i'll be the first one, without hesitating, go serve for my country. Until then, forget it.

Let us not forget, after the collapse of the soviet union in the early 90s, random men on the streets were taken by force, and the key word here is: by force, into the army, they were drafted to fight in kharabax, and many have not returned. Now I will not engage into the discussion regarding the kharabax war, but I am making it obvious for you my Armenian brothers and sisters, that our army needs a huge touch of humanism.

#62 gamavor

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 06:48 AM

Armenian Dual Citizenship Made Easy!
Vahan Bournazian



Lately Yerevan is abuzz with the issue of dual citizenship and all of its many alleged complications. But, dual citizenship does not have to be difficult, and dual citizenship in Armenia can be easier than most people think.

First, what is dual citizenship? Dual citizenship exists by default when two or more states just happen to recognize the same individual as their own citizen. For example, if I am a citizen of the U.S., the U.S. will continue to recognize me as such so long as I do not formally renounce my U.S. citizenship before a competent U.S. authority. My relationship with the U.S. does not change just because I also become an Armenian citizen, because the U.S. is under no obligation to recognize what Armenia chooses to do. In the realm of public international law, every state is sovereign and of equal authority. This means that the U.S. cannot stop Armenia from considering me its citizen, too - should Armenia choose to do so. Of course, this works the other way around, too. Armenia can consider its citizens to always be Armenian citizens, and choose not to recognize what status other states may bestow on its citizens, because - after all - Armenia is sovereign state, too. In other words, what Armenia wants, Armenia gets . . . inside its territory.

So, how does dual citizenship work in a practical sense? If I am a citizen of the U.S. and a citizen of Armenia , then when I enter or exit the U.S. I show my U.S. passport (because for that sovereign I am their citizen) and when I enter or exit Armenia , I show my Armenian passport (because an Armenian citizen is who I am here). This simple formula currently works all over the world for a multitude of states and their multiple citizens. In fact, its more likely than not that this framework is already in play for a number of Armenian citizens who have acquired a second citizenship elsewhere, unbeknownst to Armenian authorities.

So, how do we make the law conform to reality? It can be quite easy. We don't need to write a new law; all we need to do is edit the laws Armenia already has. As we see below, deleting a few lines here and there and adding a few words now and then produces a straightforward legal framework that allows for Armenian "dual citizenship" to exist, immediately:

The R.A. Constitution :

• The Armenian Constitution does not prohibit dual citizenship anymore. The inverse is that, hey . . . it can happen. That's all we need. (Despite the constitutional reference to regulation of dual citizenship by law, Armenia cannot regulate "dual citizenship" - nor can any other state - because "dual citizenship" exists de facto in the international plane beyond the reach of any state's national legislation; Armenia can only regulate "citizenship" - its citizenship.)

Law of the Republic of Armenia on Citizenship of the Republic of Armenia (see the attached law with proposed editing)

• Next . . . from Article 1 of the Armenian Citizenship law (general citizenship provision), delete the one sentence that prohibits an Armenian citizen from simultaneously holding citizenship of another state.

• From Article 10 ("recognition of citizenship"), delete the last phrase of each subparagraph that prohibits recognition if the individual has obtained another citizenship. (Regulations can create an application process later).

• From Article 14 ("restoration of citizenship"), delete the last phrase that prohibits "restoration" of Armenian citizenship to one who was formerly "deprived" of it.

• From Article 23 ("cessation of citizenship"), delete both :

• Subsection 1 about changing citizenship as a basis of cessation

• Subsection 4 (cessation due to some other article in this law)

• From Article 24 ("changing citizenship") delete the first sentence and move the last sentence to the very end of Article 25 regarding "loss of citizenship".

• From Article 25 ("loss of citizenship"), delete subsection 3 and replace it with something about a citizen being able to renounce citizenship - maybe something like: "The citizenship of the RA may be considered lost: 3) if under oath an individual renounces RA citizenship before a consular or OVIR official."

Electoral Code

• Amend Article 2 of the Electoral Code to reflect that citizens residing in Armenia for, say . . . two years (or whatever length of time seems reasonable to make citizens stakeholders in local politics) before any given election, and present in Armenia on election day, have the right to vote and to be elected. (After all, it's only fair that those who live in the country and experience the consequences of republican governance should be the ones voting and running for election. Conversely, those who remain outside the country for a significant amount of time easily lose touch with the daily realities that government needs to address. The simple scheme of resident voting - and office holding - is a straightforward and easy way to protect the participatory rights of those who most directly experience the election results.)

On Tax and Military Service

There is no need to change anything here at the moment. Taxation is based on length of residence. It's not an issue of citizenship, so let's not make it one. Also, Armenia already has a number of treaties regulating double taxation and double military service. For those dual citizens not covered by these, generally, the domestic law has principles to avoid or resolve conflicting demands on dual citizens. Potential conflicts can be reduced further as the need arises through amendments to the domestic laws or treaties - not as a pre-requisite to dual citizenship, but as the result of actual needs and experience of dual citizens. There is no need to over-legislate now by trying to solve problems that do not yet exist, and may never exist.

Also, diasporan Armenians who find Armenian military service unappealing can apply for special residency status as an alternative to citizenship. Special residency status is as close as one can get to citizenship - just minus the right to vote and to be elected.

Now all the legal redrafting is done!

Notice how most of the work was merely deleting restrictive measures from the citizenship law. A process for becoming a citizen already exists, and this is all we need. Here is the Armenian law on becoming a citizen as it already exists:

Article 13 of the Armenian Citizenship law states that you can apply for citizenship if you have resided here for 3 years, are proficient in Armenian (meaning you don't even have to be fluent), and are familiar with the RA Constitution - so make sure you download a copy from the Internet. These standards are easy to meet compared to those required by most other countries, including the U.S. But, guess what . . . it's even easier for a diasporan to become a citizen. Article 13 also states that if you are of Armenian origin than you are exempted from the residency requirement. Well, in that case, the only diasporan prerequisites are proficiency in Armenian and being familiar with the RA Constitution.
How much easier can it all be? The only other thing left to do is to put the application on the government's web site. The time for debate has long ended. Let's just get out the red pen, take care of this, and then move on to more important stuff - like building a nation.


http://www.armlawrev...citizenship.htm

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#63 gamavor

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 07:32 AM

http://armeniaforeig...zenship-arm.pdf

this is the Armenian text of the Law!

#64 Ashot

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 11:18 PM

Gamavor jan, I don't think that is the new version of the dual citizenship - the article describes - if you are an Armenian Citizen, and you are accepted to another country, which accepts dual citizenshi, as a citizen you have to inform Armenian Authorities that you are a dual citizen. It does not specify if you are a citizen in another state then you can come to Armenia and become a citizen of Armenia as well!!! The issue of dual citizenship is, if you are a citize of another Nation other then Armenia, how can you become a citizen in Armenia as well!!! Armenia doesn't mind if you are accepted in another state as a citizen and keep your Armenian citizenship, but it doesn't accept other people coming in and having a citizenship in Armenia along with another citizenship!!!
Anyways, thank you for the post, it is a very good information!!!

#65 crusader1492

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 02:15 PM

Local Publisher Becomes First to Receive Dual-Citizenship to Armenia

BY ARA KHACHATOURIAN


GLENDALE--A recent visit to Armenia by Lincy Foundation Vice-President and the Publisher of the Glendale-based California Courier had more in store for him than a busy schedule of meetings and appearances. While in Armenia, Harut Sassounian became a citizen of Armenia--one of the first to receive dual-citizenship under a new law ratified in February 2007.
Sassounian, who is also the Executive Director of the United Armenia Fund, has traveled to Armenia countless times since 1989. This last visit, however, was very special.
“I knew about the law,” Sassounian said, “but I didn't know that the government has started enacting it.”
After hearing that, in fact, mechanisms were in place for this process, Sassounian decided to apply in Armenia.
He explained that the process required the completion of a lengthy application, background checks, medical forms and other information. Before the completion of his trip, he was granted citizenship, perhaps becoming the first Diasporan-Armenian to receive citizenship based on this new law.
Sassounian explained that this was not the traditional “10-year” residency that is granted or sometimes bestowed to by government official. “I am a full-fledged citizen,” he explained.
On February 26, 2007, the Armenian parliament overwhelmingly approved the bill on dual citizenship, which allows members of the Diaspora to hold citizenship.
An announcement issued Wednesday by Armenia's Consulate General in Los Angeles indicated that Armenian embassies and consular mission were not accepting applications for dual-citizenship.
Armenia's Consul General in Los Angeles, Armen Liloyan, told Asbarez that no one had yet applied for dual citizenship in Los Angeles, adding that now that the processes and mechanisms for that application have been directed to the consular offices, he welcomed all Diasporans to take advantage of this provision.
Armenia's Ambassador to the US, Tatul Markarian, echoed Liloyan's statements and added that no one has yet received dual citizenship, effectively making Sassounian the first Diasporan to receive dual-citizenship.
Liloyan explained that he and others in the Consulate will be making the rounds on various Armenian television programs to promote dual-citizenship and answer the public's questions about the process.
He also explained that this provision is mainly for Diaspora Armenians, adding that former Armenian citizens who are living in the Diaspora can apply for re-instatement of their citizenship, which he said was a simple logistical process.
The dual-citizenship law stipulates that people of Armenian descent over the age of 18 can apply for Armenian citizenship and must have a three-year permanent residency in the country.
The applicant must be able to speak Armenian and have familiarity with the country's constitution. Citizenship may be granted to couples, where one of the spouses or their children is citizens of Armenia.
The bill denies Armenian citizenship to people whose activity may damage the country's national interests. Dual citizenship law allows for participation in the elections, with proof of residency. However, dual citizens cannot seek elected office. Dual citizens may hold ministerial posts, but cannot run for parliament or president.
People with dual citizenship may serve in the Armenian army, but they are exempt from it if they have served 12 months in the armed forces of the country of their primary citizenship or 18 months as alternative military service. It also says citizens of Armenia who have received a second citizenship would not be exempt from mandatory service in the Armenian armed forces.
The Armenian Revolutionary Federation, which was the main proponent of the right to dual nationality, welcomed the adoption of the bill and on that day its deputies celebrated it with an improvised reception promptly held in their parliament offices.
"This law is an opportunity to consolidate our nation," then ARF faction member Ruben Hovsepian, said. "This legislation will allow Armenian living in different countries to consider themselves full-fledged citizens of Armenia," he said.
Armenia's Foreign Minister Vartan Oskanian also has welcomed this provision.
In an interview with the Tehran-based Huys newspaper in October, Oskanian stressed that dual citizenship will allow the dispersed Armenian population around the world to strengthen its ties with the homeland.
Oskanian said dual citizenship would allow Armenia to strengthen its resources and maintain its position in the ever-evolving world.
“One part of our new resources will come from Armenia and the other part from the Diaspora,” added Oskanian.



Friday, March 28, 2008


#66 hipeter924

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 10:01 AM

As I understand citizenship generally, it should be allowed to people who reside within a nation for a set number of years and have filled out the right information to the government, in some nations there additional requirements like good health or possible benefits to the country. If you are born in a nation to a citizen of that nation then you should be entitled to citizenship. In Armenia's particular case it could afford to be lenient on Genocide survivors and their immediate families, but distant relatives could be dividing line I think. As for Dual citizenship or citizenship in multiple nations, it shouldn't be any of the governments business unless someone holds citizenship in Azerbaijan or one of Armenia's enemies/hostile neighbors.

My mother once held Saudi citizenship, later acquiring US citizenship, technically I could be a citizen of three nations if she reinstated her citizenship. It's not necessarily hard at all to be a citizen in one or more nations, also just because you are part of another nation doesn't mean you love/like one less. I love New Zealand and the United States, and I don't consider myself any less patriotic by being part of another nation, I doubt Armenians are any less patriotic if they have citizenship in Iran for example.

Edited by hipeter924, 21 April 2011 - 10:12 AM.





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