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Armenians Without Ian Last Names....


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#1 Bones98

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Posted 23 September 2003 - 06:08 PM

Well I'm parska hye, and my name is Hakop Syed Rizvi Kirakosian...
If ur confused my last name is Rizvi and my mom's is Kirakosian.
And I was wondering if any of u don't have IAN last names.

#2 gamavor

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Posted 23 September 2003 - 06:22 PM

Welcome to HyeForum Bones98!

Nice to meet you! I'm Moonahye (i.e. from the Moon, not to be confused with the sect:)


Yo-Ho-Ho and a bottle of Rum.... :)

#3 vava

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Posted 23 September 2003 - 08:38 PM

Don't mind Gamavor, Bones... You'll eventually understand his sense of humour (maybe). I personally have an IAN name - but I know a few Parska-Hyes who don't - and there are many famous names throughout the history of Armenians who did not have the IAN suffix (eg Bagratuni, etc.)

Welcome to Hye Forum :)

#4 Sip

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Posted 23 September 2003 - 10:37 PM

"syed rizvi" is not an armenian last name so obviously it doesn't have the "ian". As far as I know "Syed" is used to denote descendent of the prophet mohammad or something. It has some religous connotation but it's a pretty common prefix (as I have seen it a lot).

But Kirakosian is an Armenian name and I fully understand why you wouldn't want that to be your last name in Iran :o :D That basically is as bad as it gets in Farsi. :rolleyes:

Welcome to the forum!

#5 Arpa

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Posted 24 September 2003 - 07:47 AM

"syed rizvi" is not an armenian last name so obviously it doesn't have the "ian". As far as I know "Syed" is used to denote descendent of the prophet mohammad or something. It has some religous connotation but it's a pretty common prefix (as I have seen it a lot). 

But Kirakosian is an Armenian name and I fully understand why you wouldn't want that to be your last name in Iran  :o   :D  That basically is as bad as it gets in Farsi.  :rolleyes:

Welcome to the forum!

Shame on you Sip!! :):)
Having a surname like Kirakosian in Persia is like having a surname like Pusdikian in America. :):)
Many have amended it.
On a more serious note, "syed" is from the Arabic "sayyed", which is often abbreviated to read "seed/seedi" to mean "lord/my lord"/master" which the Pakistanis and other Indian Muslims have adapted to fit in their names. It is still used in Arabic speaking cultures as a term of respect, i.e seedi, my lord, just like the Armenian Ter or Tiar.
As to "rizvi", it sounds like a person from a certain place. Is there a place called "rizv"?
Syed/sid has even penetrated European culture. Does anybody remember the Movie
about the Spanish Moor called El Cid?

#6 Arpa

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Posted 24 September 2003 - 07:53 AM

Here is all you need to know about the moor Els Cid, Al Sayyed and more.

http://www.legends.d...ladins/cid.html

#7 nairi

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Posted 24 September 2003 - 08:00 AM

I don't have a IAN name either. And quite honestly I really don't mind. I like the flexibility of being able to "hide" my Armenianess when I want to. Among Armenians I usually add the -an to avoid confusion, even though this is more often than not unnecessary.

#8 Sip

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Posted 24 September 2003 - 09:00 AM

Arpa, thanks for the info.

#9 Bones98

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 06:48 PM

Shame on you Sip!! :):)
Having a surname like Kirakosian in Persia is like having a surname like Pusdikian in America. :):)
Many have amended it.
On a more serious note, "syed" is from the Arabic "sayyed", which is often abbreviated to read "seed/seedi" to mean "lord/my lord"/master" which the Pakistanis and other Indian Muslims have adapted to fit in their names. It is still used in Arabic speaking cultures as a term of respect, i.e seedi, my lord, just like the Armenian Ter or Tiar.
As to "rizvi", it sounds like a person from a certain place. Is there a place called "rizv"?
Syed/sid has even penetrated European culture. Does anybody remember the Movie
about the Spanish Moor called El Cid?

Syed is actually arabic? I thought it was Persian....
I also forgot to telll you guys that I am a muslim because I was raised in
IRAN, but my grandma always tells me "Papat, Kesi Geghtot Turkeren Anun a Tuh'vel" and I always laugh at that. :lol:
Oh you know whats also funny? You know how armo grandparents
would talk bad about Turkish people and turn around and speak turkish
when they are arguing.

#10 Azat

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 07:39 PM

Bones I too find that funny and strange.

I was at a wedding about 6 months ago and one of the guests had brought a baby and one of the elder ladies inside the church said "MashAlah lave metatsela". And if I am not mistaken Mashalat is turkish for "something Allah". It just struck me really weird that they would praise allah in armenian church.

#11 Sip

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 07:52 PM

Azat, I think it comes from Arabic. If I'm not mistaken, it's something like "whatever god wants" or something. There is another very common one "Inshalla" which is more used when you hope god will do something (god willing).

#12 Arpa

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 08:01 PM

Mashallah is Arabic, "ma sha' Allah". It literallly means "Astvats mi arastse", "God forbid". It is used in a partial context to mean "God forbid that something bad to happen".
As to using Allah in a Christian church, go to Armenian church in Istanbul and see what word they use to describe Astvats in their sermons delivered in the Turkish language, or a Christian church where the language is Arabic. Allah is a common noun now whereas before Islam it was the proper name of a specific deity just as Astuas used to be the proper name of an Armenian (main)god and now it is a common noun to mean God, anybody's God be it Christian Moslem or other.

Edited by Arpa, 06 January 2004 - 02:16 PM.


#13 TimeForChange

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 08:05 PM

NAIRI,

I don't understand: why would you want to hide your ''armeniannesss''?

From what I know, armenians without ''ian'' removed it during the Genocide in order to hide the fact that they were armenian (hoping that they'd survive this way). But, now that your life is not threatened, it's a shame that you want to "hide" it?

Having the ian allows us to recognize each other. Suppose, for instance, that you call your bank and the guy serving you is armenian. How would he know that you are armenian? Both of you are speaking english.

#14 Azat

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 08:08 PM

thanks for the explanation Arpa. As always we know we can count on you.

Thank you

#15 Arpa

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 08:17 PM

Azat, I think it comes from Arabic. If I'm not mistaken, it's something like "whatever god wants" or something.  There is another very common one "Inshalla" which is more used when you hope god will do something (god willing).

Exactly.
Ironically the two phrases are antitheses of sach other, they are both based on the middle syllable "sha'", to will.
Whereas insha'Allah means God willing, the other, in a twisted way means "may God not will" (that something bad happen), with the negative "ma" priefix it is almost like rubbing ones' vorik when a compliment is given so as to propect from evil eye. In other words when one says "mashallah inch siroun erekha e" , it actually means "God forbid" that something bad happens to this beautiful baby.

#16 DominO

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Posted 26 September 2003 - 08:21 PM

I don't have a IAN name either.

If you want a IAN, I will give you one. :D :lol:

Sorry just jocking, I could not stop myself replying to that. :)

#17 gamavor

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Posted 27 September 2003 - 12:44 AM

Complexes, Complexes, Complexes.... :)

#18 inchkachka

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Posted 17 October 2003 - 06:14 PM

I think not all Armenian names that don't end in IAN/YAN are changed from the original -- Cluny for example (yes, George Clooney has an Armenian name, though I don't know if he's actualy Armenian or not).

Agassi / Agazzi may also be like that (like Andre Agassi the tennis player, or the semi-famous Agazzi who is a producer in Hollywood).

#19 Armo77

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Posted 01 December 2003 - 09:04 PM

IAN last names RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;)

#20 Armine3773

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Posted 02 January 2004 - 01:37 AM

My last name ends in -OV...I'm Armenian but a lot of people think I'm russian because of the -ov ending..My dad explained to me that back in the day when my grandpa lived in Russia they made him change his last name to russian.




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