37 replies to this topic

[nairi]

I have this one taghand (talent) which is turning off guys who like me and whom I like. I may have mentioned this before. I don't remember if that was in private or public, but here it is:

I have this major insecurity problem, which is basically abandonment. It's my biggest fear, so I tend to do two things with guys I like: 1) disgrace them (in public), 2) say or do something that is simply a turn off. It's my way of testing their loyalty. How far can I push their buttons before they decide to leave me? Passing my test basically consists of not leaving me, ever. It can take years before I finally trust a guy 100% and give my full loving self to him. But in order to reach that point, the guy has to have shown me that he is capable of dealing with my worst sides. However, I put the standard so high, and increase the level as we get closer and closer, that eventually most guys are like: "You know what? Forget it. You're just nuts."

I think that's why I've been a miserable failure at flirting and having a relationship in the last seven years or so. I was much, much less tense before. I was careful not to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Now it just comes out, or to quote Lindsay Lohan in "Mean Girls": "Word Vomit". It's literally that and I don't realize how bad it was until the guy makes it clear that he wants nothing to do with me anymore.

On the other hand I feel that I can't afford to waste my time on someone who can't tolerate my bad sides or just can't tolerate me, period. But I also know that a relationship is a mutual thing, and I know how hurt or turned off I would be if someone else did that to me. So my conclusion is basically to either lower my standards drastically, or adapt myself to them, instead of expecting them to accept me good or bad. My last resort is staying away from guys and relationships altogether. I've always hated flirting anyway. If it's meant to happen, it'll happen. With or without flirting.

[Maral]

I know exactly what you mean,I have a cousin like that...she's married now,but she makes everyone,ESPECIALLY her husband miserable as hell.
He must be a saint,I cant' imagine why he's still around.
I can't tell if it's an attitude,an insecurity or just a miserable miserable outlook.
Don't take anything I say personally...cause I dont' know you...but the person you just described is my cousin.
Maybe people who act like think that they really are all that?Most aren't.
Do they really think they have something no one else has?They don't.
Or that they don't deserve someones attention?or thier love?Everyone deserves someone to love.
I don't get it.
Can't they convince themselves just to enjoy the ride and be thankful for what and who they have in thier lives?I just don't get it...life is tough enough as it is,why make yourself and the ones who are around you miserable?

[nairi]

Well, that's the whole problem, I don't think I'm all that! If I thought I was I wouldn't be afraid of guys leaving me! Or would I?

Plus, like I said, I would give my full loving self to him once I know he's going to be there. I will support him through thick and thin, I would never ever put him down in public. If anything, I would defend him with all my might, even as I might still have some private criticism toward him. I'm extremely possessive and extremely jealous. I need someone who can deal with that and make me feel secure.

[DominO]

I have this one taghand (talent) which is turning off guys who like me and whom I like. I may have mentioned this before. I don't remember if that was in private or public, but here it is:

I have this major insecurity problem, which is basically abandonment. It's my biggest fear, so I tend to do two things with guys I like: 1) disgrace them (in public), 2) say or do something that is simply a turn off. It's my way of testing their loyalty. How far can I push their buttons before they decide to leave me? Passing my test basically consists of not leaving me, ever. It can take years before I finally trust a guy 100% and give my full loving self to him. But in order to reach that point, the guy has to have shown me that he is capable of dealing with my worst sides. However, I put the standard so high, and increase the level as we get closer and closer, that eventually most guys are like: "You know what? Forget it. You're just nuts."

I think that's why I've been a miserable failure at flirting and having a relationship in the last seven years or so. I was much, much less tense before. I was careful not to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Now it just comes out, or to quote Lindsay Lohan in "Mean Girls": "Word Vomit". It's literally that and I don't realize how bad it was until the guy makes it clear that he wants nothing to do with me anymore.

On the other hand I feel that I can't afford to waste my time on someone who can't tolerate my bad sides or just can't tolerate me, period. But I also know that a relationship is a mutual thing, and I know how hurt or turned off I would be if someone else did that to me. So my conclusion is basically to either lower my standards drastically, or adapt myself to them, instead of expecting them to accept me good or bad. My last resort is staying away from guys and relationships altogether. I've always hated flirting anyway. If it's meant to happen, it'll happen. With or without flirting.

That's not your problem dear... the problem is that you are overanalysing yourself.

[Anileve]

I have this one taghand (talent) which is turning off guys who like me and whom I like. I may have mentioned this before. I don't remember if that was in private or public, but here it is...

Vay vay vay! I understand you better than you can imagine. The thing is...think of yourself as an oyster, hard to open but with persistency, patience and intelligence the shell is cracked and an explorer will be rewarded with a priceless gem. Crap I know it sounds a bit a bit on a vulgar side, but that is not what I meant. I'll elaborate later.

Edited by anileve, 15 September 2004 - 04:43 PM.

[Maral]

Well, that's the whole problem, I don't think I'm all that! If I thought I was I wouldn't be afraid of guys leaving me! Or would I?

Plus, like I said, I would give my full loving self to him once I know he's going to be there. I will support him through thick and thin, I would never ever put him down in public. If anything, I would defend him with all my might, even as I might still have some private criticism toward him. I'm extremely possessive and extremely jealous. I need someone who can deal with that and make me feel secure.

Well let's see...first of all you will NEVER know that he'll be there always...he will be there now just as you will be there for him now,one never knows what the future holds...so that might cut down on the stress a bit.There are a lot of things we dont have control over and the sooner we give into that concept the calmer we will be.IMHO
Why does someone have to 'deal' with the jealousy and possessivness...I think it would make one a better person, a calmer person, a more pleasant person to be around if one worked on dealing and letting go of those insecurities...this comes from exprience ,trust me...there is no way someone can be in a 23 year relationship without learning that you can't have your way all the time and also grasping the concept of 'the world doesnt' revolve around me' ...

[Anileve]

Well let's see...first of all you will NEVER know that he'll be there always...he will be there now just as you will be there for him now,one never knows what the future holds...so that might cut down on the stress a bit.There are a lot of things we dont have control over and the sooner we give into that concept the calmer we will be.IMHO
Why does someone have to 'deal' with the jealousy and possessivness...I think  it would make one a better person, a calmer person, a more pleasant person to be around  if one  worked on dealing and letting go of those insecurities...this comes from exprience ,trust me...there is no way someone can be in a 23 year relationship without learning that you can't  have your way all the time and also grasping the concept of 'the world doesnt' revolve around me' ...

A very wise post Maral jan, I agree 99%. But there is just one percent which bothers me, what if you honestly believe that the world "revolves around me", can you work around that one? By the way the best kind of relationship is when a man loves a woman a little more than she loves him. I've seen it in marriages and have experienced it myself, and it seems to be an ideal sort of unity. Crap Maral, 23 years, now that is a darn scary figure.

[Armen]

I think  it would make one a better person, a calmer person, a more pleasant person to be around  if one  worked on dealing and letting go of those insecurities...

Maral jan, can you define which insecurities are good and which ones are bad? Because the greatest insecurity that can happen to a person is love and attraction. For example if you love your son or daughter that's a very big insecurity and if you become calm and let this love go it will make you strategically more secure in life. If you call all kinds of passions (like jealousy, desire of control etc) insecurity in negative sense and "deal" with them you will be left with a piece of meat and not a human being.

Everything has its degree. I think Eve had something about this in her signature...

[Maral]

ANILEVE<I have never heard that when a man loves a woman a little more than she loves him it works for a better relationship...interesting,I must ponder on this for a while...but I think it's right on the mark!Good job

ARMEN,I didn't say that certain insecurites were good and certain ones were bad...another one to ponder on tonight.

Hey you guys are smart!

So help me if I stay awake all night thinking of these things,I'm gonna strangle the both of you!

See you learn something new every single freakin' day!

[Azat]

Nairi jan, I am neither an expert on this or anything. It is somewhat normal and a bit healthy to be insecure about oneself. After all if you are not you will be perceived as a person with huge ego. However to be so insecure that you drive away potential soul mates is not right either.

I think you first step is to recognize that which you have these insecurities and then next it is to work on that.

You are very young and have alot going for yourself why be so down on yourself?

Oh yes, once you learn how to do all this will you teach me too.

And BTW: I enrolled in MAC repair classes at the local university today for some reason.

[Stormig]

Nairi, I am not like you in that I don't put people to the test, nor am I possessive and/or jealous (I used to be). I agree with Armen on the love<-->insecurity train of thought. Afraid of guys leaving you... I don't know... I've been having various thoughts recently (you know why). Like, two worst-case scenarios on opposite sides of the spectrum. All possibilities forbid, assume your loved one perishes in a horrible way and you mourn him for months, years. That is one way of living/experiencing life where it forks off. However, assume for some reason that he didn't perish that day, was saved, and did something horrible to you the next day. You'd end up hating them the rest of your life (well, almost). I've read a story of a mother who saved her kids from a house fire and then abandoned the family the next year with her lover. Things really do happen and they don't have to make sense. The question you have to ask yourself is - is all that really worth your pain? I can't ever say that nobody should be moved when some loved one dies (though not hating someone when they do a nasty thing to you could be healthier - for one's sake) or they have a sudden break-up. I'd be shattered over and over again even if I've just brought up this.
I've been recently reading the unpublished novel of someone I know - a total devil, total rake, yet even in there, in his fantasia, he recalls lost love with a sizzling pain ("forsaken bride, boo hoo hoo"). I haven't finished it so I don't know all yet as to why this person thinks the way he does. I don't know. I'm suspecting that due to his own insecurities he might have just drawn his course when young and avoided serious bonding. Maybe he's going to look upon himself with contempt in later chapters. What can I say, I'd almost say I envy him - he's healthy as hell, super upbeat, enjoys his life. But he gives himself away in his novel, methinks. Whatever. I don't know. You can't really be prepared for all this unless you become like this acquaintance of mine, I think.

[nairi]

Trust is the key word here. I'm not looking for perfection in a guy. I'm looking for trust. He has to trust me, and I have to trust him. I'm not expecting a perfect relationship or a perfect guy. I know that's impossible. Besides, it's not like I'm perfect. Far from it, as you have seen But trust. I need to trust him and I want him to trust me. Trust that we will be there for each other no matter what.

Oh and Azat: 1) I'm becoming a spinster, or already am one, according to some in the family, and 2) thanks for enrolling in Mac repair classes! Although you seemed to be doing just fine without them in my dreams

Anyway, thanks for sharing all your experience, advice and support. I know what I have to do, now I just have to do it. That's the hardest part...

[Armen]

Nairi, love (any kind of love) is the only fealing that no one has fully comprehended yet, right? Or it is the least explained one.
The variations, experiences and probabilities of people's desitiny in love and marrige are so many that you cannot even generalize to make these experiences worthy of a normal discussion. You have people who planned everything with testing their partner and it tured out be a disaster some 10 years after the marrige. You have people who never tested anyone and are happy all their life and have overcome mutiple hardships together.

[Stormig]

Trust is the key word here.

Indeed. Only thing I can say about it is that I have to learn to not get to trust people so quickly.
I, too, don't believe in the perfection thing. All that's needed is a guy who can understand me and treat me right for the right reasons. (Though even when seemingly there, it has ended in misery. )

[bellthecat]

I have this one taghand (talent) which is turning off guys who like me and whom I like. I may have mentioned this before. I don't remember if that was in private or public, but here it is:

I have this major insecurity problem, which is basically abandonment. It's my biggest fear, so I tend to do two things with guys I like: 1) disgrace them (in public), 2) say or do something that is simply a turn off. It's my way of testing their loyalty. How far can I push their buttons before they decide to leave me? Passing my test basically consists of not leaving me, ever. It can take years before I finally trust a guy 100% and give my full loving self to him. But in order to reach that point, the guy has to have shown me that he is capable of dealing with my worst sides. However, I put the standard so high, and increase the level as we get closer and closer, that eventually most guys are like: "You know what? Forget it. You're just nuts."

I think that's why I've been a miserable failure at flirting and having a relationship in the last seven years or so. I was much, much less tense before. I was careful not to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Now it just comes out, or to quote Lindsay Lohan in "Mean Girls": "Word Vomit". It's literally that and I don't realize how bad it was until the guy makes it clear that he wants nothing to do with me anymore.

On the other hand I feel that I can't afford to waste my time on someone who can't tolerate my bad sides or just can't tolerate me, period. But I also know that a relationship is a mutual thing, and I know how hurt or turned off I would be if someone else did that to me. So my conclusion is basically to either lower my standards drastically, or adapt myself to them, instead of expecting them to accept me good or bad. My last resort is staying away from guys and relationships altogether. I've always hated flirting anyway. If it's meant to happen, it'll happen. With or without flirting.

Don't people test things because they know that there is a likelyhood of their failure, with bad consequences resulting from that failure? I think that there must be something that makes you doubt that that these guys, so far, are really worthwhile for you and are what you want and are worth risking a lot of emotion and time on.
So don't lower your standards, Nairi! We wouldn't want a lowering in testing standards for vital components in cars or aeroplanes would we - and what is more vital that securely knowing that you are with the right person for you. Especially if it is the possibility of a for ever and ever thing that you are hoping for. Also, there is a danger that just the desire to be in love with someone (anyone) blinds you to the reality of the situation, so keep up the testing.

If someone loves you then shouldn't he love your bad sides as well, since he should appreciate how lucky he is to be so close to them? (Though I suppose it does depend on what sort of bad those "bad sides" are!).

[bellthecat]

Nairi jan, I am neither an expert on this or anything.  It is somewhat normal and a bit healthy to be insecure about oneself.  After all if you are not you will be perceived as a person with huge ego.  However to be so insecure that you drive away potential soul mates is not right either.

I read it that she was insecure about other people, and not that she was insecure about herself. In this I'm reminded about her "liars and braggers" thread, i.e., if you doubt the sincerity of a person then how can you be trusting and secure with them.

Aren't people with huge egos also often the sort who are secretly very insecure?

Edited by bellthecat, 16 September 2004 - 08:23 AM.

[gurgen]

Aren't people with huge egos also often the sort who are secretly very insecure?

That's true, these are the people who bully even sadder people in school.

[Azat]

Oh and Azat: 1) I'm becoming a spinster, or already am one, according to some in the family, and 2) thanks for enrolling in Mac repair classes! Although you seemed to be doing just fine without them in my dreams

Okay this is a true story and needs to be posted here even though it is not really related to the topic.

I use to work at a large software company few years back and we had a very good pc/lan operations group. One day one of the really pretty ladies was having a problem with her home PC and one o the PC Lan guys had volunteered to go and fix the PC at her home because she used her home PC to do alot of work.

Anyways. HE gets there and starts to work on the PC and Silvia excuses herself for a minute and goes to the bathroom for a minute while the technician is still working on the PC. She comes out 2 minutes later and what does she see? The technician is totally naked(everything), sitting in front of the PC and still trying to fix it as if nothing has changed.

Don't ask me why I thought of this story just now.

Oh yes he was fired the next day.

[DominO]

Weird things like this can only happen in companies where Azat works.

[mx5]

Nairi,For me the first impression was very important and sometimes ever lasting,you sure didnt have much chance with me..!!!