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#1 Arpa

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 11:39 AM

Anyone know the identity and the background of this correspondent at Hetq?
Is he in fact an Armenian or is he using that sacred name of Hrant Dink to cover his real identity? Is he an undercover agent of ankaka?
Հրանդ Կատարիկյան Hrant Katarikyan
Hetq” seems to have a much appreciated style of Investigative Reporting.
This article by Hrant is highly disturbing to say the least, where he laments the fact WE, be it citizens of Armenia and the Diaspora did not participate in that farcical fantasy show in thousands and millions to show them that we exist. Like those SSO-s care? All they care is our Dollars and Drams. I can’t blame the Armenians from Polis attending, after all they are citizens of that “country” and they had to support their “patriarch”.
Let me ask this for the zillionth time. Does anyone among us know anyone personaally that attended that “circus”?
BTW. Their media is still reporting that “thousands” did attend. Like, how about less than a “hundred”, all from stambol? We also read that some local “furks” and Kurds also came, but they fail to say that those are “hidden Armenians”.
Here is a story about one of those so called ”furks”;
http://news.am/eng/news/31462.html
http://hetq.am/en/society/akhtamar/

Edited by Arpa, 20 September 2010 - 12:05 PM.


#2 Yervant1

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 01:52 PM

Anyone who doesn't think like you, must be a non Armenian! Or an agent of the enemy! What a nonsense to say the least.

#3 Armat

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 02:06 PM

Boycotting the event was shortsighted. RA Religious orgs should of endorsed and went there despite of cross controversy because we should care about us Armenians and celebrating the Aktamar church!not what Turks did or didn't do.
Unfortunately it became too political and ruin the incentive.

#4 Arpa

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 04:57 PM

AH!! SO!!!
Now we wake up after the SHOW is over.
Sad to say I had to use such provocative language.
I had been daily posting references to the event under the Topic of BORDERS
http://hyeforum.com/...showtopic=22700
With not even a word, not a whisper in response.
Maybe now we can hear our opinions about that “Greatest Show on Earth” that even Barnum and Bailey could not produce.
Me? I would not have taken part in that SHOW for all the “tea”** in China, beside that church is one of my least desirable landmarks.

There is a crude saying; “After the holiday is over, apply the henna where the sun does not shine”.
Maybe now we can hear our pros and cons about attending, not attending.
**There is no (letter)“T” in “china.” :P :D

#5 Armat

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 06:21 PM

AH!! SO!!!
Now we wake up after the SHOW is over.
Sad to say I had to use such provocative language.
I had been daily posting references to the event under the Topic of BORDERS
http://hyeforum.com/...showtopic=22700
With not even a word, not a whisper in response.
Maybe now we can hear our opinions about that “Greatest Show on Earth” that even Barnum and Bailey could not produce.
Me? I would not have taken part in that SHOW for all the “tea”** in China, beside that church is one of my least desirable landmarks.

There is a crude saying; “After the holiday is over, apply the henna where the sun does not shine”.
Maybe now we can hear our pros and cons about attending, not attending.
**There is no (letter)“T” in “china.” :P :D

If I lived in Armenia I would of gone just to see Մեր երկիրը.Unfortunately here I am trapped by time+work+family+money issues.

#6 Zartonk

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Posted 20 September 2010 - 10:14 PM

We just don't get it, do we?

#7 Arpa

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 07:01 AM

HUH!! :huh: Fatima singing "old Armenian Ballads"?

Our guide was a young local woman called Fatima. She had won over her guests by singing some lovely renditions of old Armenian ballads

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/9029559.stm
Published: 2010/09/25 10:53:46 GMT
Turkey's gesture to an uncomfortable past
By Jonathan Head
BBC News, Van, Turkey
The Turkish government wants to improve relations with Armenia, but is it ready to leave behind decades of nationalist dogma and fully confront the country's past?
From the vantage point of the ancient castle, perched atop a rocky outcrop, you can see the whole of the city of Van, spread out between the dazzling blue of the great lake and the jagged mountains to the east.
It is a featureless sprawl of ugly apartment blocks that you might find in any provincial Turkish city. Nothing suggests that it has any history going back more than a few decades.
If you then look to the south, directly beneath you is an area of rough grass, criss-crossed by a maze of paths, with just a few fragments of buildings still visible.
This is Old Van, a city that, until its destruction, had been continuously inhabited for more than 3,000 years.
And a large part of the people who inhabited it were Armenians - it had once been at the heart of a great Armenian empire.
Today there are almost none.
The only two buildings still standing there are mosques. Of the dozen or so churches, there is no trace.
The story of how the Armenians vanished from their historic homeland is not discussed in Van today.
The city proudly describes the waves of invaders who have passed through - Parthians, Greeks, Romans, Persians, Seljuk Turks - but the Armenians who dominated the city just a century ago are hardly mentioned.
“ At least half of the original population died in what many historians call the modern world's first genocide ”

This is not surprising really, when you consider that the Ottoman Empire's biggest minority was driven out of Anatolia in 1915 on ghastly death marches.
At least half, maybe much more, of the original population died, in what many historians call the modern world's first genocide.
Today the inhabitants of Van are mainly Kurdish, some probably the descendants of those who killed and seized the property of the Armenians.
The current Turkish government is the first one to seek some kind of accommodation with its Armenian past.
It needs to if it is to fulfil its ambition to be a regional power and to be part of the European Union.
That is why it permitted a Christian service to take place last Sunday in the beautiful little church on Akhtamar Island in Lake Van.
It is the only historic Armenian building still standing in eastern Anatolia, and among the most holy for Armenian Christians.
'Bittersweet'
I happened to be in a bus with an Armenian choir from Istanbul who had been invited to sing at the service.
They were being treated as VIPs - the municipal government wanted them to feel welcome - and we were being given a tour.
Our guide was a young local woman called Fatima. She had won over her guests by singing some lovely renditions of old Armenian ballads.
But when she pointed out the wasteland that is the old city today, all she could say was that the Armenians had, in her words, "disappeared".
For a few moments the bus went quiet then everyone broke into song again.
None of the Istanbul Armenians wanted to talk about the past. They are a very small community, acutely aware of their vulnerability.
The Armenians who had come from the United States for the service were more forthright.
"It's bittersweet, coming here," said one man whose grandparents had fled from Van during the killings.
"We're like parallel cultures, we even look the same," he said, "only we hate each other."
He said there had been strong pressure on him from other American Armenians not to come - they saw the one-off church service as a cynical publicity stunt by Turkey.
At times on Sunday it did seem like that.
The local government had invited an army of journalists to witness the service who threatened to overwhelm the congregation. It also invited local Muslims, who talked and laughed all the way through it.
No-one made any effort to respect the sanctity of the ceremony.
A local boatman told me he was puzzled by the way they were praying. He had never seen a Christian service before. "And why are they crying," he asked? He had no idea.
No discussion
The Turkish government still fiercely defends its version of history - that what happened in 1915 was a tragedy, not a war crime.
In Van, it points out, the Armenians took up arms. For a while they controlled the city and later they helped enemy Russian forces to occupy it.
In the chaos of war, it says, large numbers of Turkish Muslims also died.
But the annihilation of the Armenians is simply blanked out of the history taught in Turkish schools.
There is no discussion, and real dangers await those who try to start one.
It is less than four years since the Armenian journalist Hrant Dink was murdered in Istanbul by a young nationalist for calling for just such a debate.
"This church service is pointless if the Turkish government only wants to appear more tolerant," one Armenian journalist told me.
"It has to change the mindset of the people. Make them confront their past."
In the dreary avenues of modern-day Van, that process has not started yet. Its history is still buried under layers of concrete and by Turkey's uncompromising nationalist dogm

Published: 2010/09/25 10:53:46 GMT

© BBC MMX

#8 Arpa

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 10:38 AM

Աթ մե Մոխիէ

If I lived in Armenia I would of gone just to see Մեր երկիրը.Unfortunately here I am trapped by time+work+family+money issues.

Dear Armat, please elaborate.
Why would you have gone? With what purpose? How would your presence have changed the overall picture? What would your purpose be, to bolster their deception? According to the prducers of that comedy, the Holy Cross is a furkish museum, built by some unwelcome alien "idiots". Not a Church.
What do you mean by "Մեր Երկիրը"? Where did you read, be it in their media or the world media anyone say that it is "Մեր Երկիրը"? Do you have enough military power to reconquer "Մեր Երկիրը"?
No, no a wooden or stone Cross will not do it. They will and have said what to do with the Cross.
Why would you want to go there? To weep your eyes dry?
Do you know Siamanto's "Ափ մը Մոխիր Հայրենի Տուն"?
And, if you believe all those lies, and think they will someday place the cross on top!!
I Have a slightly used bridge in Brighton, or Satani Kamourj to sell you.
Here is the kind of crosses we need, that they'll understand;
http://www.fotosearc.../15477-65dg.jpg

Edited by Arpa, 26 September 2010 - 01:12 PM.


#9 Arpa

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 01:32 PM

Anyone who doesn't think like you, must be a non Armenian! Or an agent of the enemy! What a nonsense to say the least.

Yervant, please elaborate. When everyone, all the way from Ejmiatsin to Antelias, to Jerusalem, to all the world wide dioceses and prelacies saw the hypocricies and lies, how is it that that reportage not justify our boycott? Did they know something we didn't? What did we lose that we already did not have? How did we "miss that golden opporunity"?
Singing Der Voghormia and waving wooden crosses does not count.

Edited by Arpa, 26 September 2010 - 01:37 PM.


#10 Yervant1

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Posted 26 September 2010 - 03:20 PM

Yervant, please elaborate. When everyone, all the way from Ejmiatsin to Antelias, to Jerusalem, to all the world wide dioceses and prelacies saw the hypocricies and lies, how is it that that reportage not justify our boycott? Did they know something we didn't? What did we lose that we already did not have? How did we "miss that golden opporunity"?
Singing Der Voghormia and waving wooden crosses does not count.

You don't get it do you? This is what you said "Anyone know the identity and the background of this correspondent at Hetq?
Is he in fact an Armenian or is he using that sacred name of Hrant Dink to cover his real identity? Is he an undercover agent of ankaka?"
. You have every right to stress your point of view about any subject or topic just like any other person, why is it that when the other person's point of view differs from yours, then that person becomes the agent of Ankara or a non Armenian?
You are very rude and uncivil towards other members points of view. Your language is gutter language! Do you ever wonder why members avoid responding to your posts? You are an old bully in a little world. This might sound harsh but it needed to be said, I hope you get the message.

#11 MosJan

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Posted 27 September 2010 - 12:40 PM

Arpa Papik no need to be aggressive

#12 Yervant1

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Posted 28 September 2010 - 09:20 AM

AKHTAMAR ET AL: NEW HOTSPOTS FOR ARMENIAN CULTURAL TOURISM?
Hrant Katarikyan

http://hetq.am/en/society/akhtamar-3/
[ 2010/09/27 | 14:06 ]

Turkey Keen on "Exploiting" Remnants of a People Dispossessed

While I confess I don't watch much Armenian TV, the one program I do
tune into is the interview show moderated by Petros, you know the
guy who likes to wear the suspenders a la Larry King. If the guest
is interesting, then the 30 minutes or so is worth it.

The other night the topic promised to be an interesting one - the
recent spate of Armenian cultural monuments being renovated in Turkey
and Ankara's agenda in the matter. The panellists, all purported
experts in the field of history and tourism, were to discuss this
and related issues and compare the sector of "cultural tourism"
in the two neighbouring countries.

While the general theme was interesting, the panellists, on the whole,
were less than engaging.

Akhtamar, Diyarbekir, Malatya, Kayseri...

Let's frame the debate, if you will.

The Holy Cross Cathedral at Akhtamar, Van, has been renovated
with financing by the Turkish government. It is now classified as a
museum belonging to the state. On September 19, some 1,500 Armenians,
mostly from Turkey, and lesser numbers from the diaspora and Armenia,
travelled there to attend the first religious service on the island
in over 95 years.

The St. Giragos Armenian Apostolic Church in Diyarbakir is currently
being rebuilt, almost from the ground up. This huge edifice, dating
back to the 16th century, is being restored under the auspices of
the Armenian Church Patriarchate in Istanbul through the Foundation
Board of the church, made up of Armenians who formerly resided in
Diyarbakir. Only a handful remains today.

Since St. Giragos belongs to the Istanbul Patriarchate, unlike
Akhtamar, it is not available for Turkish government funding. However,
a lengthy process ensued to get all the local construction and other
permits required.

In November, 2009, the St. Gregory Armenian Apostolic Church in Kayseri
was reopened and re-consecrated after being renovated. At present,
renovation work is being carried out on the Armenian Church in Malatya.

So what exactly is going on in Turkey?

Sure it's part publicity stunt, to show the international community
that official attitudes have changed in Turkey vis-a-vis its religious
minorities. And of course, these and other steps have been taken to
facilitate Turkey's drive for EU ascension.

Turkey recognizes the benefits; does Armenia?

But I believe that at the core is the recognition, especially on the
part of regional and local authorities, that it just makes plain
good business sense. Local officials in Van are unambiguous about
their expectations in this regard. A renovated Akhtamar translates
into increased tourist dollars pouring into the local economy. The
same holds true for other cultural and religious sites throughout
Turkey, many located in the economically depressed eastern regions
experiencing Kurdish unrest and demands for improved living conditions.

This motivating factor was overlooked by the TV show panellists.

The tourism expert, while rightly pointing out that Armenia had a long
way to go in providing a level of services and facilities equalling
that in Turkey, couldn't explain why prices for such inadequate
services were so high in Armenia.

During my week's stay in Turkey, taking part in an "Armenian-Turkish
Dialogue Program" organized by the Hrant Dink Foundation, I saw that,
as a tourist, you get what you pay for. The one thing that remained
constant was the level of service - whether in hotels, restaurants
or local shops. People want your business and they spare no effort
to accommodate you.

In this respect, Armenia has a long road to travel. The tourist sector
in Armenia thus suffers from a double whammy - relatively high prices
coupled with inadequate levels of service.

The government in Yerevan may talk of developing the tourism sector
here, and it makes sense to do so given that there is huge potential
to tap into. But it seems that all the talk is just that.

But even the smallest of changes in attitude can make a world of
difference - a smile instead of a frown on the face of a hotel
receptionist and restaurant staff that offer solutions rather than
excuses. The list is long, but let me give one little example that
demonstrates a wider problem.

Attitudes in Armenia must change and fast

My return flight from Istanbul landed in Yerevan around two in the
morning. Grabbing my bags, I walked a good ½ mile or so through a
corridor flanked with aluminium panels before reaching the parking
lot. There were no cabs in site. I waited for about 20 minutes and
nothing. I guy walked up to me and asked where I was headed too. He
got on the phone and turned to me saying there was a taxi on the
upper level.

'Great, tell him to drive down' - I said

'No, you'll have to walk up there, it isn't far - he answered.

'Why? Don't you see I'll have to carry these bags up there' -
I exclaimed.

'Hey, that's the story. You want to wait here all night? - he retorted.

This attitude just won't cut it. Imagine if it was a foreign tourist
on the short end of the stick. They'd probably turn around and get
the next plane out.

Tourism pumps over $1 billion into the Turkish economy every year
and the numbers of foreign tourist keeps rising; 20 million this
year alone.

Hundreds, if not thousands of Armenians from the RoA, already spend
their hard earned AMD in Turkish resorts like Antalya.

Will Armenians from the rest of the world now join their ranks,
preferring to visit Aghtamar and other sites in western Armenia over
the ROA?

Small groups of the descendants of Genocide survivors having
been making such "pilgrimages" to the towns and villages of their
forefathers in what was once the Ottoman Empire for years. Their
numbers may actually increase now that Turkey has understood it makes
for good publicity and business.

It remains to be seen if tourism in Armenia will suffer as a result.

It would make sense both in terms of price and service. They would
get a bigger bang for their buck in Turkey. And the attraction of
visiting the "lost homeland", a dream for many for so long, cannot
be discounted either.

Reclaiming the national patrimony: step by step

Petros asked the panellists on his show what the sense was to restore
a church, however magnificent, if only a handful of Armenians remain
in Akhtamar.

They talked about how it might spur "concealed" Armenians to re-enter
the national fold, but failed to mention a very important point.

The St. Giragos Church Committee has uncovered a huge number of
property deeds that the church once held. Some of the real estate has
already been returned to the church and is generating an income flow.

The return of former church properties is a slow and arduous process
but an important one. The Istanbul Armenian community is doing the
same with a number of properties seized by the Turkish state.

Maybe some of those Armenian lobbying groups should allocate a
percentage of their operating budgets to such efforts. It may not be
as glamorous as sitting in Washington DC making speeches and rubbing
shoulders with politicos but such efforts need to be expanded wherever
possible.

As I said before in another article, let's start to finally reclaim
that which is possible in Turkey. Boycotting events like in Akhtamar
is easy and leads nowhere. We have to engage ourselves in the process
now unfolding in Turkey, no matter how small the window is.

A day or two after the Akhtamar ceremony, a well known ARF official
in Yerevan went on TV and declared that the "process to reclaim the
church had just begun". This boast struck me as more than odd and
just more hollow rhetoric. Why weren't he and the rest of the party
faithful on the island on September 19 doing just that with their
presence? The "process" as he describes it started without them and
most likely will continue without them as well.

Armenia need to re-examine what's at stake

We all know what is at stake and what Turkey's agenda is. 95 years
after the Genocide and experiencing ultimate assimilation, we have
nothing to lose and everything to gain.

The question we must ask ourselves, in the end, isn't what Turkey's
agenda might be in tapping into the cultural and historical inheritance
of other peoples, some who passed through as conquerors and others,
like the Armenians, who called the land their native home, only to
be dispossessed through genocide and eviction.

Rather, we must ask ourselves here in Armenia, just how effectively
and correctly we are presenting our national inheritance, that which
remains in Armenian hands, to the world at large.

Rather than finding fault with our neighbour to the West for
"exploiting" the remnants of Armenian civilization now in their hands,
we should be looking inward and asking tough questions of ourselves.

We have a wealth of untapped cultural and historical resources at
our disposal. But look at the reality facing us.

Let's clean up our own act first

The Sevan shore is an eyesore and a national disgrace. It seems that
every square inch of tourist shoreline has been taken over and turned
into an unappealing mish-mash of campgrounds, food stalls and parking
lots. Go to Garni and hike down into the gorge and you'll encounter
mounds of garbage. I already described the scene at the airport. Do
the Turks know something we just can't fathom?

Armenia can have hundreds of medieval churches and ruins; it can
have natural wonders like the Garni "symphony of stones" or the
blue waters of Sevan, but it all means nothing if the government and
people continue to treat such wealth in the most cavalier of fashion,
not comprehending the intrinsic value of what they have inherited.

Rather than regarding the natural and man-made wonders in Armenia as
garbage dumps or sites to be exploited for a fast buck, the government
and the private sector must forge a long-term vision of how to present
the wonders of Armenia to the rest of the world in an ecologically
sustainable and economically rational manner. Finally, the people
of Armenia must be involved in the process; they must understand the
benefits to be reaped.

Perhaps this is the biggest difference of all between here and there.

On that side of the border, people understand what it takes to
attract and keep the tourists coming, and their money - a smile,
a helping hand, picking up the trash; all the small gestures that
leave lasting impressions on a foreign visitor. Good management and
a government committed to such success also play a vital role.

Yes, attitudes and mind-sets are slowing changing here in Armenia
for the better. The government professes that the development of the
tourism sector is vital to the long-term economic sustainability of
the country as a whole.

The problem is that in this day and age "slowly" just isn't fast
enough.

#13 Arpa

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Posted 29 September 2010 - 08:35 AM

The Holy Virgin , Սուրբ Աստուածածին/Mother of God church at Ani;

Posted Image

- Asbarez Armenian News - http://asbarez.com -
Turkish Nationalists To Pray In Medieval Armenian Church

ANKARA (RFE/RL)–Members of Turkey’s main nationalist opposition party are reportedly planning to gather in an 11th century Armenian cathedral Friday for a politically motivated Islamic prayer that is bound to infuriate Armenians, RFE/RL reported.
Turkish newspapers reported on Tuesday that authorities in the northeastern Kars region have received a formal permission application from the local branch of the Nationalist Movement Party (MHP).
They said its chairman informed dozens of local MHP activists and supporters that the prayer service will take place at the Holy Virgin Cathedral in Ani, the ruined capital of a medieval Armenian kingdom located near the city of Kars, on the existing Turkish-Armenian border.
Built in 1001 A.D. by one of the most celebrated architects of medieval Armenia, Trdat, the church was the largest building in the walled and once prosperous city. It is one of the few surviving examples of the ancient Armenian civilization that existed in what is now eastern Turkey until the 1915 Armenian Genocide.
According to some historians, it was converted into a mosque after Armenia was invaded by the Seljuk Turks in the late 11th century. Official Turkish sources still refer to it as Fethiye Mosque.
Some Turkish newspapers suggested that the MHP’s intention to use it as a Muslim worship site is a response to the September 19 mass in the 10th century Holy Cross Armenian church in Van. However, party leaders attributed the politically explosive move to domestic politics and, in particular, their tense relations with the ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) led by Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan.
In the words of Ara Gocunyan, editor of the Turkish-Armenian “Zhamanak” daily, the AKP’s victory in Turkey’s recent constitutional referendum was a serious blow to the MHP. “Apparently, the party is thus trying to revive its fortunes,” he told RFE/RL’s Armenia service.
Citing the Turkish press, Gocunyan said Turkey’s Culture Minister Ertugrul Gunay has warned that the Friday prayer at the Ani church will be deemed illegal if it turns into a “collective demonstration.” Turks can pray there only as “individual citizens,” Gocunyan quoted Gunay as saying.
Newspaper reports also said that the MHP’s top leader, Devlet Bahceli, will also attend the prayer. However, the party has not yet confirmed those reporters, according to Aris Nalci, a journalist with another Istanbul-based Armenian paper, “Agos.”

-----
And this, even if it may better belong under Comedistan. Remember, being called "ermeni" is the ultimate insult;
http://news.am/eng/news/32557.html

Most fierce Anti-Armenian activist of Turkey is Armenian?
September 29, 2010 | 14:14
Turkish press has spread reports on Armenian origins of Devlet Bahceli, leader of “Nationalist Movement Party”. The reports say that he is of an Armenian descent and his predecessors have changed their religious beliefs, Turkish studies expert Ruben Melkonyan told the reporters on Wednesday. Devlet Bahceli has recently stated that he decided to start parliamentary election campaign by uttering a prayer in Cathedral of Ani on October 1.
“Anti-Armenian and anti-Christian sentiments in the Turkish society are reflected in domestic policy. The opposition tries to use religious service in Surb Khach church against the ruling party,” the expert noted.
“The attempts by the Nationalist Movement Party to speculate about the issue show that the majority of Turks are not tolerant towards Christians and Armenians. Bahceli is trying to promote the image of his party by declaring his intention to pray in Cathedral of Ani, as the society was enthusiastic about his initiative,” Melkonyan said. “Probably, he wants to pray in a church of his predecessors. We should ask him “Who will he address in his prayer?” We wish him to finally determine his real identity by praying,” the expert stressed.

How about we go to Ani and sing Ter Voghormia here?
http://www.virtualan...que/mosque7.jpg

#14 Yervant1

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Posted 29 September 2010 - 10:26 AM

Let them pray! Let them advertise our churches and our existance for thousands of years on those lands to the whole world even more, for free I might add. I hope journalists ask that idiot bahceli! Where are the people who built these churches and about their whereabouts? The more they react the more it will be talked about.

#15 Arpa

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 08:43 AM

Let them pray! Let them advertise our churches and our existance for thousands of years on those lands to the whole world even more, for free I might add. I hope journalists ask that idiot bahceli! Where are the people who built these churches and about their whereabouts? The more they react the more it will be talked about.

Yes, by all means! Let them. Let's remember to bring a thousand media with TV cameras.
---
Aghtamar from another angle;

Posted Image

Are Aghtamar-Van, Ani and Ararat part of Armenia? See highlights below.. Wlsonian Armenia;
http://upload.wikime...dan2english.jpg
http://news.am/eng/news/32675.html

Turkish nationalists distraught due to Armenian liturgy

September 30, 2010 | 12:10
Turkish nationalists do not know a moment’s peace because of the recent liturgy in Surb Khach (Holy Cross). Hearing their statements mixed with fear one can say western Armenia is on the point of being joined to Armenia.
Chairman of the Nationalist Movement Party (MHP) Devlet Bahçeli is the “father” of such talks. He announced his intention to start work in the Turkish parliament, in cooperation with the heads of the party’s 40 regional chapters, by meeting for a namaz at Surb Khach church on October 1, in response to the Armenian liturgy.
The Turkish Minister of Tourism and Culture immediately responded to the Turkish nationalist’s initiative. He stated that Bahçeli has the personal right to a prayer at any clean place. However, mass religious services with the participation of all the party members run counter to the Turkish Constitution and to the Law on Parties.
The heads of some of the party’s regional chapters responded to the minister’s statement. They are mostly critical of the minister for permitting the liturgy in Van, which has no Armenian community, or the liturgy in the Sümela Monastery in Trabzon, which has no Greek community. Specifically, the MHP member Arif Akkus asked the Turkish authorities who are the Armenian churches opened for and how many people profess Christians without a place for religious services.
The MHP member Erkan Akcay claims the liturgy in the Sümela Monastery was a reminder of Pontus. The liturgy in the church on Akhtamar Island, with an Armenian structure in the east, revealed Armenia’s aims, the Turkish MP said.
The Turkish nationalists’ fear of Armenians and Armenia is expressed in the statements they make and events they organize. For example, after American-Armenian mountaineers installed the Armenian national flag atop Mount Ararat, the frightened nationalists climbed the mountain, carrying banners saying “no” to those who had installed Armenian flags on Mount Ararat. Last year, when the Armenian-Turkish protocols were signed, Devlet Bahçeli addressed Premier Recep Erdogan and stated the committee of historians that was supposedly to be formed was to discuss such issues as whether Ararat was part of Armenia or not, whether eastern Turkey was western Armenia or not.
A namaz the Turkish nationalists plan to organize in the Ani is evidence of their fears to losing the lands they acquired by killing 1,500,000 Armenians.



#16 yergatuni1

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Posted 30 September 2010 - 08:58 PM

This is the beginning of Armenian resurgence in the old homeland, local turks and kurds are questioning there ethnic identity and the AG is being discussed more in that country. At first I didn't like the fact that any Armenians were participating in the Sourp Khach ceremony, but now it looks like this ceremony has stirred the pot. If the turks react angrily now to all this and revert back they will look worse than before. the only way is to allow more liturgies to take place and eventually some of the those old churches will be given back to the Armenian Church....If local Armenian churches are revived in old Armenia that is the beginning of a resurgent Armenian presence.

#17 Arpa

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 09:43 AM

The silver lining?
The old adage goes; “Every cloud has a silver lining”
http://familytravels...10/01/cloud.jpg
Despite that they have attempted to rename and furkify Aghtamar “ak-damar”, and despite that at one time they tried to rename Ani something like “ana/aneh” to mean “mother”, seems like they have given up and refer to the Armenian City as “ANI”.
No matter how they try, they cannot hide. Look at this headline where the word ermeni”is used, while at one time "gavur/infidel" was the substitute.

Bahceli'den Ermeni sınırında namaz - Bahceli, Ani harabelerinde Cuma icin izin istedi Kiliseden bozma cami icin istenilen bu izin yeni bir tartışmayı alevlendirdi!..

.
Translation- “bokhcheli” asked to conduct “namaz” at the … church converted to “mosque” (?) Ani Cathedral… I don’t quite understand “Ermeni sinirinda”. “sinir” in their non-language means “sinew/nerve”.
Note how they are reciting the word “ermeni” whereas a few years ago there was not such a word or people.
Another subject.
As to the origin of the name ANI, we will come to that even if there is very precious about it.
Observe the picture here but don’t be fooled with their pants and neckties. Deep down, I mean down they are still the pantless savages.
http://news.am/pic/news/32893.jpg
BTW. In their culture and language the necktie/cravate/փողկապ is known as “medenyet yulari” to mean the “(dog) leash of civilization”.
http://www.sybarites...7/07/hleash.jpg

Edited by Arpa, 01 October 2010 - 10:04 AM.


#18 Yervant1

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 10:59 AM

I don’t quite understand “Ermeni sinirinda”.

It means at the Armenian border. Look at the "i"s without the dodts on top of it, and it sounds as "eh".

#19 Arpa

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Posted 01 October 2010 - 02:25 PM

It means at the Armenian border. Look at the "i"s without the dodts on top of it, and it sounds as "eh".

Yes, Yervant. “Demarcation line” How did you know that? I didn’t. I still can’t make a connection to its etymology. My miniscule dictionary does not refer to it** but the internet does. I hate to advertise their non-language, but just so we know what it means when we see it in their news.

sınır çizgisi (line of demarcation, borderline, boundary line, demarcation line, line),…, sınır (limit, border, boundary,).
---
Sinir in English nerve, sinew, temper, fury, tantrum, pet nervous, neural border, frontier, borderline, boundary, limit, borderland, boundary...


**BTW. Conversely looking up “border” at the that miniscule dictionary it does list the word as such.

Edited by Arpa, 01 October 2010 - 02:27 PM.


#20 Yervant1

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Posted 02 October 2010 - 10:40 AM

Yes, Yervant. “Demarcation line” How did you know that? I didn’t.

Let's say that I know a thing or two about that nonlanguage. :o




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