60 replies to this topic

[Sip]

Everytime someone says the word "romantic" I immediately think pink butterflies, red roses, dark chocolate, VW Bugs, rainbows, cute midget riding a big bicycle pulling a white pony, lots of colorful baloons, confetti falling from the sky, and fireworks in the background.

Then I get very sick almost the point of throwing up, since I don't like any of those things. Well, maybe seeing a midget riding a big bicycle pulling a white pony would be cool but the others ...

These western interpretations of "romantic", "love", blah blah blah make me sick ... I just don't think all this ever-lasting love (the one true love, love at first sight, etc etc) crap between a man and a woman, a man and a man, a woman and a woman, a man and a donkey, is true. It is something that society teaches us (from a very young age). How old were you when you were first told you have to get married? How old were you when you were first told you are going to fall in love with someone special? Do you even remember? It seems like that type of stuff is just drilled into the heads of childeren as they grow up ...

It is something we expect and believe and that's why it sometimes happens. Let's not confuse attraction and love ... I don't think this modern concept of Love (and all the romantic stuff that are usually associated with it) existed before organized religeon and modern societies started insisting that it is the way things have to be. Just look at ancient Rome, Greece, and writings from long long ago ... you almost never see this modern concept of love between a man and a woman in any of those scriptures. The bond always existed as purely a matter of practicality ... man the provider and protector, woman in charge of raising the young. So I have no idea what the words (love, romance, etc) mean!

Basically, I just don't think any particular type of social behavior is encoded in the genes. There are definitely biological behavior and needs that take over at different parts of life, but the rest is all in the mind and different from person to person.

I admit, I am not a literature or history person or an expert on the subject by any means but that's just my feeling about the whole thing. Not saying I don't like the way things are now but it is not in the human nature as many claim it to be (calling it natural). It is definitely learned behavior in my opinion... therefore everyone will have a different interpretation and view on the subject

On second thought, maybe I should stick to 1's and 0's

[ March 03, 2002, 09:24 PM: Message edited by: Sip ]

[Alex]

Heratsats Erevantsinerin

Mer qaghaqy hin hishuq eq ardioq?
karmir qareric karutsvats paroq
Mer aiginery kanach, mrgarat
mer poghotsnery urakh, mardashat

Ekan tarinery anhuis mtutian
Ekan tarinery dajan pordzutian
Ev duq heratsaq mi lur tkhrutiamb
“Ur hats-entegh kats” hogebanutiamb

Es dzez chem dati, u chem pnovi
Togh astvats ughin dzer lusavori
Togh heru erkrum, ail qaghaqnerum
Duq gtneq hangist ev bargava&um

Togh lini shitak &anaprhy dzer
Togh linen urakh tsnoghnery tser
Vor “merats” erkrits fakhan gnatsin
Ev zavaknerin sovits prketsin

Baits hervum nstats dzer bazmotsnerin
Hishum eq, gitem, mer qaghaqy hin
Dzez huis eq talis tkhur khorhelov
Vor &isht eq arel tuny toghnelov

Es uzum em Dzez mi gaghtniq batsel
Te ev ain karogh e dzez tsav pat&arel
Erevany kar, ka ev klini
Apsos, arandz dzez na piti kangni

Shatrvannerov Hraparaki
Gortsaranov mer hin Kon’iaki
Mer “Monument”ov u “3-rd Mas”ov
“Norki Massiv”ov u “Bangladesh”ov

Avan-Zeitun-ov, “Banjaranots”ov,
“Cheremushka”iov, “Tasvets kvartal”ov,
Mer “Sari Tagh”ov, “goghakan” “Kond”ov,
Saiat-Novaiov u Abovianov

Mer Karapi Li&n u mer Operan
Mer Kino Moskvan u “Prospekty” – kan!!!
Khanjiani aigin tsaghkats e norits
Ev garnan qamin pchum e Norkits

Erevany kar, ka ev klini
Anhamar darer na piti kangni
Ir aiginerov kanach, mrgarat
Ir poghotsnerov urakh, mardashat

Kga jamanak duq khaskanaq
Ev dzer Erevan kveradarnaq
Pataskhan tveq duq dzez, amen voq
Arants Erevan aprum eq ardioq?

Author Unknown

[ May 20, 2002, 01:22 AM: Message edited by: Alex ]

[Nané]

hmmm ... txur e

[ July 16, 2002, 09:31 PM: Message edited by: Sulamita ]

[Nané]

 

Ay orinak yes SIRAHARVATS em hayeren lezvin yev lezvamtatsoghutyan@.
 

Inch LURJ popoxutyan masin e xosq@?  
Che, yes chem amusnatsel ... kam nshanvel ... kam inch vor nman mi ban  
Bayts karogh es shnorhavorel yete uzum es ... qani vor "yes ays kyanqi xent siraharn em ... unem @nkerner indznits xelar."

Yes siraharvats em im qaghaqin...

Yev sharunakabar siraharvum em ...
Dranits lav ban?  

[ February 15, 2002: Message edited by: Sulamita ]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... I have been reading some of my old posts and realizing that this Forum is an "open" diary of my past days ...

Edited by Sulamita, 11 December 2004 - 01:18 AM.

[Anna_Karenina]

Arajuts asem vor knereq vor offtopic em:)
Kardalov ays teman, tesa de inchqan eq bolord sirum dzer qaghaq@, karotel eq, vomanqd yergum yev artasanum eq nyunisk Yerevani masin. Shat urax em tesnel aysqan ser depi dzer qaghaq@, bayts mi harts....

Inchn e dzez xangarum vor gnaq apreq Yerevanum?? Kam aysinqn inchn e dzez stipel teghapoxvel urish yerkir?? Hetaqrqir e imanal dzer patasxanner@.

Gayane, again I am sorry for going offtopic, I can't seem to open up my own topic.

Edited by Anna_Karenina, 13 December 2004 - 08:02 PM.

[Armen]

aa

Already?

[Anna_Karenina]

Already?   

ohh, my internet is too slow:(

[Armen]

ohh, my internet is too slow:(

Can I offer my hand ... brrr. .. I mean my help countess?

[Anna_Karenina]

Can I offer my hand ... brrr. .. I mean my help countess? 

ohh what a gentleman:)

[gamavor]

I think true romance is something that we yearn about, but we are afraid to make it happen because it may go the wrong way and spoil to whole romance.

Edited by gamavor, 13 December 2004 - 11:14 PM.

[Nané]

1. Inchn e dzez xangarum vor gnaq apreq Yerevanum??

2. Kam aysinqn inchn e dzez stipel teghapoxvel urish yerkir??

3. Gayane, again I am sorry for going offtopic, I can't seem to open up my own topic.

1. $$$$ enq havaqum

2. mama & papa

3. Gayanen tvyal pahin teghum chi, bayts taratsqum a. Ir koghmits yes qez nerum em. Isk nor topic piti vor arants dzhvarutyan karoghanas batsel. Armenin dimir inq@ hajuyqov kogni

[Anileve]

I think true romance is something that we yearn about, but we are afraid to make it happen because it may go the wrong way and spoil to whole romance.

The only true and everlasting romance is the one with yourself, everything else is just random sparks. This should also go in the Words of Wisdom thread.

[Anileve]

Everytime someone says the word "romantic" I immediately think pink butterflies, red roses, dark chocolate, VW Bugs, rainbows, cute midget riding a big bicycle pulling a white pony, lots of colorful baloons, confetti falling from the sky, and fireworks in the background.

This is just an interpretation of a teenage girl who still plays with Barby dolls. Who provided you with that primitive and distorted definition? However, I am not going to dispute dark chocolate and red roses especially when they are much-needed accessories in a very interesting activity....we call romance.

[gamavor]

The only true and everlasting romance is the one with yourself, everything else is just random sparks.

Eve, you need to get rid of Ayn Rand sometime in the future.

[Anileve]

Eve, you need to get rid of Ayn Rand sometime in the future.

Wow, your attorney skills never fail you. Such precise attention to detail. She IS my idol. Actually lately I have been slacking off severely and throwing myself into the pages of Spy novels. Written by women may I add, which is very interesting since there aren't many in that genre. I blame Business Law for plunging me into complete boredom, due to which I must get myself lost in something so thrilling that it takes me away from the intricacies of that dreaded science. No offence of course.

[Siamanto]

I think true romance is something that we yearn about, but we are afraid to make it happen because it may go the wrong way and spoil to whole romance.

gamavor,
Is it wrong that it may go wrong? Isn't that part of the experience?

(Of course, it sounds better with Music!)

Chet Baker : You Don't Know What Love Is.

You don't know what love is
Until you've learned the meaning of the blues
Until you've loved a love you've had to lose
You don't know what love is

You don't know how lips hurt
Until you've kissed and had to pay the cost
Until you've flipped your heart and you have lost
You don't know what love is

Do you know how a lost heart feels
The thought of reminiscing
And how lips that taste of tears
Lose their taste for kissing

You don't know how hearts burn
For love that can not live yet never dies
Until you've faced each dawn with sleepless eyes
You don't know what love is

......

http://www.allthelyr...s-213668-lyric/

Edited by Siamanto, 15 December 2004 - 12:33 AM.

[Anileve]

Chet Baker : You Don't Know What Love Is.

      You don't know what love is
      Until you've learned the meaning of the blues
      Until you've loved a love you've had to lose
      You don't know what love is

      You don't know how lips hurt
      Until you've kissed and had to pay the cost
      Until you've flipped your heart and you have lost
      You don't know what love is

      Do you know how a lost heart feels
      The thought of reminiscing
      And how lips that taste of tears
      Lose their taste for kissing

      You don't know how hearts burn
      For love that can not live yet never dies
      Until you've faced each dawn with sleepless eyes
      You don't know what love is
   
      ......

http://www.allthelyr...s-213668-lyric/

I know this was addressed to gamavor, but I'll be obnoxious enough to step in anyway. I am familiar with that sort of love and it is truly invigorating, however it has an lifeline of a candle flame. Illuminates for some time and then, simply extinguishes. I don't know if it's love or a highest degree of infatuation. And by the way, my favorite piece by Chat is "My Funny Valentine." Nothing like it.

Actually this is how this sort of love ends:

Last Goodbye by Jeff Buckley
============

This is our last goodbye
I hate to feel the love between us die
but it's over
Just hear this and then I'll go
You gave me more to live for
More than you'll ever know

This is our last embrace
Must I dream and always see your face
Why can't we overcome this wall
Well, maybe it's just because I didn't know you at all

Kiss me, please kiss me
But kiss me out of desire, babe, and not consolation
You know it makes me so angry 'cause I know that in time
I'll only make you cry, this is our last goodbye

Did you say "no, this can't happen to me,"
and did you rush to the phone to call
Was there a voice unkind in the back of your mind
Saying maybe you didn't know him at all
You didn't know him at all, oh, you didn't know

Well, the bells out in the church tower chime
burning clues into this heart of mine
Thinking so hard on her soft eyes and the memories
offer signs that it's over... it's over

[Siamanto]

I am familiar with that sort of love and it is truly invigorating, however it has an lifeline of a candle flame. Illuminates for some time and then, simply extinguishes. I don't know if it's love or a highest degree of infatuation.

Love has many Moments: some painful, some peaceful, some...
Yes, there's a thin line between a dream and a nightmare; but I still enjoy dreaming!
If it simply "Illuminates for some time and then, simply extinguishes" then maybe it's only infatuation. Love's painful/joyful Moments can last many years, if not an...
Does it "have the lifeline of a candle flame?" But , aren't we all butterflies?

Actually this is how this sort of love ends:

Last Goodbye by Jeff Buckley
============

This is our last goodbye
I hate to feel the love between us die
but it's over
Just hear this and then I'll go
You gave me more to live for
More than you'll ever know

This is our last embrace
Must I dream and always see your face
Why can't we overcome this wall
Well, maybe it's just because I didn't know you at all

Kiss me, please kiss me
But kiss me out of desire, babe, and not consolation
You know it makes me so angry 'cause I know that in time
I'll only make you cry, this is our last goodbye

Did you say "no, this can't happen to me,"
and did you rush to the phone to call
Was there a voice unkind in the back of your mind
Saying maybe you didn't know him at all
You didn't know him at all, oh, you didn't know

Well, the bells out in the church tower chime
burning clues into this heart of mine
Thinking so hard on her soft eyes and the memories
offer signs that it's over... it's over

Does not have to end in a tragic manner!
I believe that Matt Johnson describes it "better???"

The the - August & September
Suddenly last summer
I started going out of my head
In a tiny hotel room
Lying naked on a bed
I knew what you were doing, and I knew what you’d done
Your life with me was ending, your new life had begun
But I was cursing your name, and I was cursing that room
And I was praying for the strength to stop loving you

I started writing you the letter
Which turned into the book
I was gonna reach across the ocean
And force you to look

But what kind of man was I?
Who would sacrify your happiness to satisfy his pride
What kind of man was I?
Who would delay your destiny to appease his tiny mind

Then you came back to me and I went down on one knee
With a glint in my eyes and a rose between my teeth
And I pushed out my tongue for you to see
That I’d been dying of a thirst for your company
Then you quenched my loneliness with your tears
And our clothes fell away as we rolled back the years
But we could’t deny it because we could not admit it
If our love was too strong to die
Or we were just too weak to kill it
Was our love too strong to die?
Or were we just too weak to kill it?

Every moment in that room
I closed my eyes in prayer
Every moment I awoke
I clenched my teeth in prayer

What kind of man was I?
Who would sacrify your happiness to satisfy his pride
What kind of man was I?
Who would delay your destiny to appease his tiny mind

Who could delay your destiny to appease his aching swollen pride
Who could delay your destiny to appease his screaming little mind

You’re mine

Edited by Siamanto, 15 December 2004 - 02:07 AM.

[Anileve]

Love has many Moments: some painful, some peaceful, some...
Yes, there's a thin line between a dream and a nightmare; but I still enjoy dreaming!
If it  simply "Illuminates for some time and then, simply extinguishes" then maybe it's only infatuation. Love's painful/joyful Moments can last many years, if not an...
Does it  "have the lifeline of a candle flame?" But , aren't we all  butterflies?
Does not have to end in a tragic manner!
I believe that Matt Johnson describes it "better???"

Siamanto, I see you have a problem finishing up your sentenses, or are they left on purpose for a reader to only guess their conclusion? Very poetic.
I don't know about you dear, but I am no damn buttrefly, I am a tiger and I say that Matt Johnson's words are Grrrrrrrrrrrrrreat! Ok, that was a tad corny.

On a more serious note, what I meant is that if love is composed of such explosive interchanging feelings perhaps it's not love at all, perhaps it's just an intense infatuation. In love we are more tranquil and secure of our feelings, sure we have our ups and downs but they are not as drastic as Chat's description. This is essentially what I was saying to vava in the "passion" thread. It's a roller coaster ride which is highly enjoyable but very draining at the same time and is bound to crash with the same speed it took off. I am also dwelling in the corners or romance.

[Siamanto]

Siamanto, I see you have a problem finishing up your sentenses, or are they left on purpose for a reader to only guess their conclusion? Very poetic.

Maybe you should look for Ariane's thread - i.e. the beginning - to find the ends! How can a sentence be finished when the subject is open ended? Another open ended sentence!
We're not discussing computers, Politics or Science!

I don't know about you dear, but I am no damn buttrefly, I am a tiger and I say that Matt Johnson's words are Grrrrrrrrrrrrrreat! Ok, that was a tad corny.

" I don't know about you dear, but " I don't express a natural resistance when compared to what may be perceived as "fragile" and "pretty!" In any case, in the context "butterfly" symbolized the fatal attraction to an illusive happiness - i.e. Fire wearing the Mask of Light.
Tigers can also be seduced...by fire or...

On a more serious note, what I meant is that if love is composed of such explosive interchanging feelings perhaps it's not love at all, perhaps it's just an intense infatuation. In love we are more tranquil and secure of our feelings, sure we have our ups and downs but they are not as drastic as Chat's description. This is essentially what I was saying to vava in the "passion" thread. It's a roller coaster ride which is highly enjoyable but very draining at the same time and is bound to crash with the same speed it took off. I am also dwelling in the corners or romance.

I don't have time to discuss such a complex subject, right now! For now, just consider that
1- Maybe different individuals EXPRESS and DESCRIBE similar EMOTIONS and EXPERIENCES differently!
2- Maybe different individuals EXPERIENCE similar SITUATIONS differently!
So there are many layers - of possible distortion - between what HAPPENS, how it is EXPERIENCED and what is SAID!