Has anyone come accross with this poem of Hovhaness Toumanyan?
There's a "very good" character of an Armenian woman in this poem (I meen the queen). And not only, it is a general character for all women.
"Tmkaberdi arume"
Started by
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, Aug 12 2000 08:51 AM
20 replies to this topic
#2
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Posted 12 August 2000 - 09:34 AM
hmm Tmbkaberty Arum @te tmbkaberty Ankum@ ? lav chem hishum / sakayn kareli e p@rp@tel .
#3
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Posted 12 August 2000 - 09:53 AM
In that poem Tumanyan said:
"Yes barutian khoskn em asum" (in entry part)
[This message has been edited by Ararat (edited November 10, 2000).]
"Yes barutian khoskn em asum" (in entry part)
[This message has been edited by Ararat (edited November 10, 2000).]
#4
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Posted 12 August 2000 - 11:04 PM
Sulamik,
"Arumn" er te "ankum@"?
Chgituem inch er bayc hayern ays poemum shat vat qashvum ein taguhu patcharov.
"Arumn" er te "ankum@"?
Chgituem inch er bayc hayern ays poemum shat vat qashvum ein taguhu patcharov.
#5
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Posted 12 August 2000 - 12:53 PM
T@mbkaberti Arum / kam T@mbkaberti Gravum@
yete chem sxalvum janachvat s xosk@ > te chlini Kin@ yev Ginin el ov karor e kortsanel Hayin < kartsem iyspes er
Hye (95% Tatull 2 1/2% torgom kam 2 1/2 % Atom vstah chem anun@ inch er ) ishxanin xmtsnum en knanikov ban man taq jur sarr@ jur sauna baseyin / ishxani knoj@ apakormnoroshum en yev verch @lav chi linum gravum en t@mbkaberd@ . bayst te norits verchum menk Hayers Bayorakan Hardanak tarank parsikneri dem.
Manramasn chem hishum 15 tary e anstel yerevi vor kardatsel em .
[This message has been edited by MosJan (edited August 12, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by MosJan (edited August 12, 2000).]
yete chem sxalvum janachvat s xosk@ > te chlini Kin@ yev Ginin el ov karor e kortsanel Hayin < kartsem iyspes er
Hye (95% Tatull 2 1/2% torgom kam 2 1/2 % Atom vstah chem anun@ inch er ) ishxanin xmtsnum en knanikov ban man taq jur sarr@ jur sauna baseyin / ishxani knoj@ apakormnoroshum en yev verch @lav chi linum gravum en t@mbkaberd@ . bayst te norits verchum menk Hayers Bayorakan Hardanak tarank parsikneri dem.
Manramasn chem hishum 15 tary e anstel yerevi vor kardatsel em .
[This message has been edited by MosJan (edited August 12, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by MosJan (edited August 12, 2000).]
#6
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Posted 14 August 2000 - 12:47 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Berj:
Sulamik,
"Arumn" er te "ankum@"?
Chgituem inch er bayc hayern ays poemum shat vat qashvum ein taguhu patcharov.
Originally posted by Berj:
Sulamik,
"Arumn" er te "ankum@"?
Chgituem inch er bayc hayern ays poemum shat vat qashvum ein taguhu patcharov.
Tmbkaberdi Arum@
Xostanum em gtnel qo uzats togher@
#7
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Posted 14 August 2000 - 12:49 AM
"Ov khaxter qaj zinvorin te ch@linein kinn u ginin"
#8
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Posted 14 August 2000 - 01:51 AM
Sulamik jan,
Noric shat mersi.
Ays poem@ kardalov hangum em ezrakacutyan vor azgayin arzheqner@ ashkharhi zhoghovurdneri metsamasnutyan, ayd tvum nayev hayeri mot, pahpanum en tghamadrik, isk kanayq karogh en harmarvel cankacats iravichaki.
Noric shat mersi.
Ays poem@ kardalov hangum em ezrakacutyan vor azgayin arzheqner@ ashkharhi zhoghovurdneri metsamasnutyan, ayd tvum nayev hayeri mot, pahpanum en tghamadrik, isk kanayq karogh en harmarvel cankacats iravichaki.
#9
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Posted 15 August 2000 - 01:40 PM
Berj (Your name is Armen, right?..use it!!)
Ays hartsum yevs menk hamamit chenk linelu
Ayd KINNE for pahpanume azgayin arzheknere (I know, I know, I shouldn't talk, right?) Well, think about it. The woman is the real backbone of the family. She's the one who'll bend every whichever way to please her husband (how many armenian men do you know who will do that for their wives?), she's the one who will give in at the end to her husband to preserve the sanctity of their marriage, to keep the family intact (again, how many arm. men will do that?), she's the one who most often teaches the children the values and morals we all take with us into adulthood, she's the one who instills in the children a sense of pride in their culture. The list goes on and on. Have I made my point yet
(I'd suggest moving this to a separate topic, as I think there's a lot to be said here)
Ays hartsum yevs menk hamamit chenk linelu
Ayd KINNE for pahpanume azgayin arzheknere (I know, I know, I shouldn't talk, right?) Well, think about it. The woman is the real backbone of the family. She's the one who'll bend every whichever way to please her husband (how many armenian men do you know who will do that for their wives?), she's the one who will give in at the end to her husband to preserve the sanctity of their marriage, to keep the family intact (again, how many arm. men will do that?), she's the one who most often teaches the children the values and morals we all take with us into adulthood, she's the one who instills in the children a sense of pride in their culture. The list goes on and on. Have I made my point yet
(I'd suggest moving this to a separate topic, as I think there's a lot to be said here)
#10
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Posted 16 August 2000 - 05:41 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Gayane:
[B]
Berj (Your name is Armen, right?..use it!!)
/B]
Originally posted by Gayane:
[B]
Berj (Your name is Armen, right?..use it!!)
/B]
Sir, yes sir! ) joking
I can't get why have you come to conclusion that somebody wishes you shouldn't talk.
Yes, women WERE the backbone of the family once, but not any more. There are no backbones in the families at the present, or maybe economic necessity is the only backbone.
And also if a woman gives in only IN THE END, the necessity of giving in can be questioned, because in those times usually it doesn't help any more.
No need to seperate this as a topic, we can discuss it in the context on "Tmkaberdi arum@".
Armen
#11
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Posted 17 August 2000 - 12:42 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Berj:
Yes, women WERE the backbone of the family once, but not any more. There are no backbones in the families at the present, or maybe economic necessity is the only backbone.
Originally posted by Berj:
Yes, women WERE the backbone of the family once, but not any more. There are no backbones in the families at the present, or maybe economic necessity is the only backbone.
Armen jan,
I thought we were talking about (and referring to) the poem which was written in the early 1900's. I think most of us will agree that armenian women had a major role in the preservation of the armenian culture AND the family unity.
This role may have changed but not that drasticly.
Aneta
#12
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Posted 17 August 2000 - 12:45 AM
Parzvets vor im grqerits voch meki mej ch@ka ayd poem@ Bayts xostanum em Yerevanum yeghats jamanaks anpaymen gtnel ayn hator@ vori mej ka "Tmbkaberdi Arum@" ... yev mi mas tpel dzez hamar
Aneta
Aneta
#13
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Posted 17 August 2000 - 03:52 AM
I have it! In russian...lol
I think Toumanian was very very upset about his wife when he wrote it...
I think Toumanian was very very upset about his wife when he wrote it...
#14
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Posted 29 August 2000 - 10:12 AM
Sulamita,
It is in the v.1 of the four volume edition of Tumanyan's works. If you have a fax number, I can fax it to you.
It is in the v.1 of the four volume edition of Tumanyan's works. If you have a fax number, I can fax it to you.
#15
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Posted 30 August 2000 - 02:05 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MJ:
Sulamita,
It is in the v.1 of the four volume edition of Tumanyan's works. If you have a fax number, I can fax it to you.
Originally posted by MJ:
Sulamita,
It is in the v.1 of the four volume edition of Tumanyan's works. If you have a fax number, I can fax it to you.
I greatly appreciate your willingness, but there is no need to go through the trouble. I will get hold of a hard copy soon
Aneta
#16
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Posted 30 August 2000 - 05:34 AM
It was when I visisted Toumanyan's village , that I got into soul of his poem.
For me this work is a philosophical thesis, especially when he repeats:
"abrek dghek payts mez bes chabrek".
For me this work is a philosophical thesis, especially when he repeats:
"abrek dghek payts mez bes chabrek".
#17
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Posted 04 October 2000 - 04:55 AM
Tmbkaberdi Arum@ (1902)
Naxerganq
Hey, paronner, akanj areq
Taparakan ashughin,
Sirun tiknayq, jahel t@gherq,
Lav ush dreq im xaghin:
Menq amenqs hyur enq kyanqum
Mer ts@nndyan puch orits,
Hertov galis, ants enq kenum,
Es antsavor ashxarhits:
Ants en kenum, ser u xndum,
Geghetskutyun, gandz u gah,
Mah@ mern e, menq mahin@,
Mardu gortsn e misht anmah:
Gortsn e anmah lav imatseq,
Vor xosvum e daredar,
Yernek nran, vor in gortsov
Kapri anverj, andadar:
Charn el e misht aprum anmer,
Anetsq nra char gortsin,
Vordid lini, te hern u mer,
Te murazov sirats kin:
Yes lavutyan xosqn em asum,
Vor jptum e mer srtin.
Ov chi sirum, tekuz dushman,
Lav ararq@ lav mardin:
Ey, lav kenaq, akanj areq,
Mi ban patmem himi dzez,
Xosqs, teseq, ur e gnum,
Qaj vorskani gyulli pes:
(sharunakem?)
[This message has been edited by Sulamita (edited October 04, 2000).]
Naxerganq
Hey, paronner, akanj areq
Taparakan ashughin,
Sirun tiknayq, jahel t@gherq,
Lav ush dreq im xaghin:
Menq amenqs hyur enq kyanqum
Mer ts@nndyan puch orits,
Hertov galis, ants enq kenum,
Es antsavor ashxarhits:
Ants en kenum, ser u xndum,
Geghetskutyun, gandz u gah,
Mah@ mern e, menq mahin@,
Mardu gortsn e misht anmah:
Gortsn e anmah lav imatseq,
Vor xosvum e daredar,
Yernek nran, vor in gortsov
Kapri anverj, andadar:
Charn el e misht aprum anmer,
Anetsq nra char gortsin,
Vordid lini, te hern u mer,
Te murazov sirats kin:
Yes lavutyan xosqn em asum,
Vor jptum e mer srtin.
Ov chi sirum, tekuz dushman,
Lav ararq@ lav mardin:
Ey, lav kenaq, akanj areq,
Mi ban patmem himi dzez,
Xosqs, teseq, ur e gnum,
Qaj vorskani gyulli pes:
(sharunakem?)
[This message has been edited by Sulamita (edited October 04, 2000).]
#18
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Posted 04 October 2000 - 11:34 PM
Anshusht-> Yev naxapes shnorhakalutyun
#19
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Posted 09 October 2000 - 08:56 PM
I
Nadir Shah@ zorq havaqets,
Zorq havaqets anhamar,
Yekav Tmbka berd@ patets,
Inchpes gishern en xavar:
--Hey, qaj Tatuj, kanchets Shah@,
Anmah eir qez kartsum?
Yek, berel em yes qo mah@,
Inch es tarel amrotsum:
--Mi partsena, goroz Nadir,
Patasxanets en hskan.
Glxov@ shat amper kantsnen,
Sar@ misht ka ansasan:
Asav, kanchets ir qajerin,
Tur@ kapets havluni,
Trav, hetsav n@juyg ir dzin,
Dasht@ ijav aryuni:
U qarsun or, qarsun gisher,
Kriv tvin andadar,
@nkan qajer, antiv qajer,
Berdi glxin havasar:
iran, Turan voghj yekel en,
Tatuln anhaght, ann@kun,
Zorq u baban xortakvel en,
Nra berd@ misht kangun:
U misht urax, haghtanakov
Ir amrotsn e darnum na.
Spasum e entegh kin@,
Jahel kin@ sevachya:
II
En tesak kin,
Yes im hogin,
Te ashughn el unenar,
Arants zenqi,
Arants zorqi,
Shaheri dem kgnar:
Siro hrots,
Krak u bots --
Enpes achqer te jptan,
Mardu hamar
Orva pes var
Gisherner@ lluys k@tan:
Vardi terter --
Enpes shurter
Te haghtutyun qez maghten,
El qez voch shah,
Voch ah u mah,
Voch zenq u zorq k@haxten:
(sharunakeli)
Nadir Shah@ zorq havaqets,
Zorq havaqets anhamar,
Yekav Tmbka berd@ patets,
Inchpes gishern en xavar:
--Hey, qaj Tatuj, kanchets Shah@,
Anmah eir qez kartsum?
Yek, berel em yes qo mah@,
Inch es tarel amrotsum:
--Mi partsena, goroz Nadir,
Patasxanets en hskan.
Glxov@ shat amper kantsnen,
Sar@ misht ka ansasan:
Asav, kanchets ir qajerin,
Tur@ kapets havluni,
Trav, hetsav n@juyg ir dzin,
Dasht@ ijav aryuni:
U qarsun or, qarsun gisher,
Kriv tvin andadar,
@nkan qajer, antiv qajer,
Berdi glxin havasar:
iran, Turan voghj yekel en,
Tatuln anhaght, ann@kun,
Zorq u baban xortakvel en,
Nra berd@ misht kangun:
U misht urax, haghtanakov
Ir amrotsn e darnum na.
Spasum e entegh kin@,
Jahel kin@ sevachya:
II
En tesak kin,
Yes im hogin,
Te ashughn el unenar,
Arants zenqi,
Arants zorqi,
Shaheri dem kgnar:
Siro hrots,
Krak u bots --
Enpes achqer te jptan,
Mardu hamar
Orva pes var
Gisherner@ lluys k@tan:
Vardi terter --
Enpes shurter
Te haghtutyun qez maghten,
El qez voch shah,
Voch ah u mah,
Voch zenq u zorq k@haxten:
(sharunakeli)
#20
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Posted 12 December 2000 - 03:09 AM
III
U krvi dashtum shahi arajin
Arin mi angam govq@ siruni.
Nran` ir tesqov, hasakov asin,
Chi hasni ch@qnagh hurin Irani:
Tsov en achqer@ Javaxqi dster
U korchum e mard nra hayatsqum,
Jakat@ jermak en dzyunits el der,
Vor bartsr Abuli gagatn e tsatskum:
Na e shunch, hogin ishxan Tatuli,
Nra sirovn e harbats en hskan,
Nra jpitn e qajin uzh tali,
Vor dasht e ijnum aryutsi nman:
Te tires, mets shah, du nra srtin,
Tatuln el anzor k@nkni votid tak,
Hangist ktires yev Tmbuk berdin,
Vor ches karenum esqan jamanak:
IV
Espes e asel hnuts ed masin
Farsi byulbyul@, anmah Firdusin.
Inch@ khaxti kyanqum herosin,
Te ch@ linin
Kinn u ginin:
Arevi nman jakat@ paytsar,
Nayum e xroxt, kangnats inchpes sar,
Ov kani nran getnin havasar,
Te ch@ linin,
Kinn u ginin:
Parum e ases kriv gnalis
Get@nqits verev trchum man galis.
Ov tsats kberi bran trchelis,
Te ch@ linin
Kinn u ginin:
Tekuz yev arar ashxarh ga vran,
Kerta dem u dem, tur chi tal iran,
Rustem Zaln el chi haxtil nran,
Te ch@ linin,
Kinn u ginin:
(sharunakeli)
U krvi dashtum shahi arajin
Arin mi angam govq@ siruni.
Nran` ir tesqov, hasakov asin,
Chi hasni ch@qnagh hurin Irani:
Tsov en achqer@ Javaxqi dster
U korchum e mard nra hayatsqum,
Jakat@ jermak en dzyunits el der,
Vor bartsr Abuli gagatn e tsatskum:
Na e shunch, hogin ishxan Tatuli,
Nra sirovn e harbats en hskan,
Nra jpitn e qajin uzh tali,
Vor dasht e ijnum aryutsi nman:
Te tires, mets shah, du nra srtin,
Tatuln el anzor k@nkni votid tak,
Hangist ktires yev Tmbuk berdin,
Vor ches karenum esqan jamanak:
IV
Espes e asel hnuts ed masin
Farsi byulbyul@, anmah Firdusin.
Inch@ khaxti kyanqum herosin,
Te ch@ linin
Kinn u ginin:
Arevi nman jakat@ paytsar,
Nayum e xroxt, kangnats inchpes sar,
Ov kani nran getnin havasar,
Te ch@ linin,
Kinn u ginin:
Parum e ases kriv gnalis
Get@nqits verev trchum man galis.
Ov tsats kberi bran trchelis,
Te ch@ linin
Kinn u ginin:
Tekuz yev arar ashxarh ga vran,
Kerta dem u dem, tur chi tal iran,
Rustem Zaln el chi haxtil nran,
Te ch@ linin,
Kinn u ginin:
(sharunakeli)
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