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Ancient Records Of Armenians And Armenian History


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#1 Ararat_arev

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Posted 08 March 2007 - 02:53 PM

-Records from other powerful nations mentioning our more ancient history:-

Sumerian inscription 'Haya' as early as 3000 BC way before 'Hayasa' of Hittite inscription 1400 BC

Akkadian inscriptions from as early as 2400 BC mention the 'Armani' (aka Armani-Subartu or Arme-Shubria) near Lake Van

Tutmoses III of Egypt (1500 BC) mentions the people of 'Ermenen' paying tribute when he held his court at Ninevah, and says that in their land "heaven rests upon its four pillars." (note: Tutmose III was the first Pharaoh to cross the Euphrates to reach the Armenian Highlands)

Old Persian name 'Armin' meant "dweller of the garden of Eden" (Persians also used this form 'Armin(a)' for Armenia)

Menua, king of Urartu (our Khaldi tribe cousins) mentions the 'Armeni' native in the "land of Ari" (Ariyan)

Hurrian-Aryan links

Hurrians also known as Armani-Subari were an Armenian tribe, "Har"an was the capital located near UrHai/Urfa at the time. "Har"-minni is the alternative way of saying "Ar"mani, which the "H" is silent and its pronounced as "Ar"mani. To this day Assyrians call Armenians by "Armani" (aka Armani-Subartu or Arme-Shubria) from the 2300 BC Akkadian inscriptions referring to them as Armani. Some scholars reveals that Hurrians are the same as Subarians, which reveals that "Armani"-Subartu is Hurrians. The land of Ararat or the Armenian Highland is the home of the "Aryan"(Indo-Europeans) people. Armenians refer to themselves as "Aryaee" (Aryan) in their language. The root word "Ar" meaning Sun, Light, Fire (the same as the word "Hurri/Hur") which is used in a lot of words such as Ararat, Aratta, Armenia, Armeni, Armen, Arev, etc etc. The root word which in Semitic form is "Ur". Also, language changes over course of 1000 year time periods and when moving to different lands. Even today Armenians have different sounds with words like "H" and "Kh" = "X" (example of the word Hurri/Khurri). Arevmdahye's are South-Western Armenians and Arevelahye's are Eastern Armenians in Iran and modern Armenia. Since ancient times words were pronounced slightly different but yet same meanings and same ethnic peoples. So the words Hurrian and Aryan are pronounced different but yet remain the same word and meaning.

Tigran the Great's crown (look here Armenians for his image) is exactly of the "Hurri"-Mitanni seal with the 2 eagles and sun with the 8 (number of eternity) rays. Hurri-Mitanni kings names like Artatama translates to "most righteous", which the first part of the word Arta is righteous is in Armenian. It is interesting to point out also that Artatama's (Armenian Aryan-IE name) title was "King of the Hurri", which yet again reveals that Hurrians are linked with Aryans. Tusratta translates to "ten chariots", and Tus is Ten in Armenian. Hurri/Hur the very word used now in Armenian, was the same word and meaning in "Hurri"-Mitanni times. The Khaldi (from the Nairi people), an Armenian tribe from the Hittites, mixed with the Armenians later in their history, that is why people refer to them with the term Indo-"European". Armenians refer to themselves as "Aryan" people. The Indo and Persian Aryans seperated from them during 1200 to 800 BC. That is why a little later the Persians established there empire in 500 BC.

The Armenian legacy of Sumer-Hurrian-Hyksos heritage in the second millennium B.C. had already developed a rich architectural style. This in turn spread and influenced the nearby cultures of ancient Near East. Building techniques and architecture as such reached a high degree of development during the period of the Araratian (Urartian) Kingdom of Van (XIIIth -VIth centuries BC).

The great Armenian civilization of Sumer was inherited and continued to progress under the powerful Armenian kingdoms of Hurri-Mitanni and Haiasa (ethnically and linguistically tied to their Indo-European kinsmen -- the Hittites) in the Second Millennium B.C.

We think that much before the Achaemenians, in the times of Hurri-Mitanni, the name Mihr was already known to the people, particularly to those living in the regions of Hurri-Mitanni or Armani-Subari (and later Arme-Subria) where Sasun is located, in the form of Mitra (or perhaps even as Mher). Otherwise, it would not have been so readily accepted by the people during the Achaemenian period or later.

The word Ar-ma-ni is a compound noun, where the first component Ar is none other than the name of the natioanal sun-god of the Armens,-AR- and the second component -ma-(me a varient) ssignifies 'build, make, beget, offspring, son'. Ma, with this meaning, was known to many peoples of the Ner East in antiquity. The goddess of birth and fertility, so well known in Asia Minor, was called by this very same name-Ma.(Ma also occurs in its reduplicated from -Mama or Mami in Assyro-Babylonian inscriptions). This root-word (and also its variant -me) is found also in Sumerian language with the same meaning. It results that Ar-ma (and its variant Ar-me) means 'built by Ar, born of Ar', or 'Ar's offspring', 'Ar's/Ara's son' ('the son of the sun', Arevvordi). The ending -ni (the plural-forming or toponymic suffix-ni is found in Subarian-Hurrian-Nairian place and tribal na We find the plural form ni also in Armenian.

Hurri is the Sun with the wings the very Hurri-Mitanni symbol. Hurri/Hur/Har = Fire, Sun, Light just like "Ar" to this very day in Armenian.

To clarify the issue since there is a lot of confusion, dividing "Aryan" people like the Indo-Aryans only being Hurrian-Aryan is misunderstood. Its not only Indo but "Aryan" is from the Armenian highlands, the Aryan peoples spread across to Persia and India etc. The "Indo" Aryans and Persian Aryans migrated south from Armenians (Aryans) around 800 BC to their lands.

There is no question that the Hurrian and Urartian languages were very similar, and some have used this evidence that the Hurrian Armenian tribes had origins in the Urartu area in and around Lake Van before migrating to South-Western Armenia. The Hurrian timeframe in Syria (South-Western historic Armenia), the area that the Hurri-Mitanni kingdom of Armenia was present (c. 2300-1200 BC) predates the timeframe of Urartu in Eastern Armenia (c. 1000-585), it is more often considered likely that the Armenians of Urartu had origins there, and fled from the South-Western Armenian Highlands into the Eastern part of Armenia after the Hittites and Assyrians conquered the region. Chronologically, the Urartian language seems to be a continuation of Hurrian dialects, and not the other way around.

Image:Hurrian-AncientArmenian.jpg

Last point is that those who wrote the inscriptions were the elite. The common people didnt understand all of it at that time. There are even Armenian words today that are not understood, because of writers using difficult words.

[edit] Extra info

Map showing "Nairi" near Lake Van part of Hurri-Mitanni and (K)Hayasa is there also http://satrapa1.com/....do/mitanni.jpg

This clearly shows at the time of King Bartarna 1450 BC the beginnings of Hurri-Mitanni, that they already had the area around Lake Van. That was there to begin with and then they stretched further west.

Egyptian sources apply the term 'nhr', Naharina or Nairi (from the Assyro-Akkadian word for 'river' or 'land of rivers' Tigris Euphrates and Armenian Highlands) referring to Hurri-Mitanni with Naharina (Nairi).

[edit] References

* Rafael Ishkhanyan, "Illustrated History of Armenia," Yerevan, 1989

Rafael Ishkhanyan points out the Sumerian words in Armenian, and its link with Hurrian as well

* Martiros Kavoukjian, "Armenia, Subartu and Sumer", Montreal, 1989

* Martiros Kavoukjian, "The Genesis of Armenian People", Montreal, 1982

* Hovick Nersessian, "Highlands of Armenia," Los Angeles 1998

Hovick points out that in the cuneiform inscriptions of Mitanni and Urartu are found Armenian words, and even some sentences which are used today in Armenian.

* Artak Movsisyan, "Sacred Highland: Armenia in the spiritual conception of the Near East," Yerevan, 2000.

Artak reveals the Mitanni kings IE names are in Armenian

* T. V. Gamkrelidze and V. V. Ivanov, The Early History of Indo-European Languages, Scientific American, March 1990

Look in Hurrians http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurrians

Now look down there in External links it has

http://www.humnet.uc..../VVI_Horse.pdf

Once you get there search Hurrian-Aryan and you will see it stands for Mitanni and the scholar explains it all in detail. And Aryan is the same as Indo-European. He explains all this there.

* Vahan Kurkjian, "History of Armenia," Michigan, 1968

http://penelope.uchi....RARM/home.html

"The Hurri-Mitanni kingdom of Armenia kept close contact with its western neighbor, Hittite or Hatti land. Masses of population were often transplanted from one country to the other. "

* Jacquetta Hawkes, "The First Great Civilizations," London, 1967

"Yet the Hurrians did not disappear from history. Away to the North in their Armenian homeland, they entrenched themselves and build up the kingdom of Urartu."

http://en.wikipedia....acquetta_Hawkes

* M. Chahin, "The Kingdom of Armenia," London, 2001

"The new kingdom of Urartu, which proved to be the stronghold of the Hurrian race."

Hurri n.

( pl. same or Hurris) a member of a people, originally from Armenia, who settled in northern Mesopotamia and Syria during the 3rd-2nd millennium bc and were later aborbed by the Hittites and Assyrians. (See also Mitanni.) Hittite & Assyrian Harri, Hurri The Oxford English Reference Dictionary, Oxford University Press 1996

* E. A. Speiser, "Hurrians and Subarians," http://en.wikipedia....ki/E.A._Speiser

"The evidence as a whole admits of only one possible interpretation in the historical records of Assyria: the term Subarians is applied specifically to Hurrians."

* E. A. Speiser, "Introduction to Hurrians," http://en.wikipedia....ki/E.A._Speiser

"All indications point toward the general region of Armenia as a main area of Hurrian concentration."

* Dr. Johannes Lehman, "The Hittites,"

"The Hurrians had a history of their own. Assyrian and Sumerian sources dating from the end of the third millenium B.C. supply our first information about this nation, people, and the land of Hurri, South of Caucasus. We also know that they come from the region of Lake Van in Eastern Anatolia, and are referred to as Horrittes by the Bible. Still, later in the ninth-seventh centuries N.C. the highland of Armenia were inhabited by a people who were related to the Hurrians and whose country bore the name Urartu, the Biblical Ararat"

"Queen Nefertiti of Egypt was a native of Mitanni. The Mittani Kingdom of Armenia was an off-shoot of the Hurrian kingdom. The Hurri and the Mittani in turn were the contemporaries the Hittites and the Hykos, within whom they shared many cultural and political aspects. Today, all these aforementioned nations are considered to be, in varying degrees, proto-Armenians, that is, we modern day Armenians are direct descendants of the remnants of those ancient tribes."

* Artak Movsisyan, "Aratta: The ancient Kindgom of Armenia," Yerevan, 1992.

* Artak Movsisyan, "Mithraic (Mehian) Writing in the Kingdom of Van (Biaynili, Urartu, Ararat)," Yerevan, 1998.

* Artak Movsisyan, "Aratta: Land of the Sacred Law," Yerevan, 2001.

Here are some good links:

http://www.angelfire...Azgaser/AR.html from Martiros Kavoukjian's Armenia, Sumer, Subartu, 1982

http://www.tacentral.com/history.asp 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.tacentral...uni/2ndwave.asp Aryan roots

http://arevordi.blogspot.com 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.armenianhighland.com 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.saintsark...rg/Language.htm roots of Armenian language

Edited by Ararat_arev, 08 March 2007 - 10:07 PM.


#2 Ararat_arev

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Posted 08 March 2007 - 11:24 PM

http://myspace.com/30451865 Made a History of Armenia page
IPB Image

This summer (August 11) marks the 4,500 year of Navasard (Haik's calendar). Haik (Orion) in ancient times in Armenia was the Sun of righteousness rising with healing in his wings. The 4 sides and 3 middle stars of Haik/Orion represent the 4 seasons and 3 months in each season, making the total of the 12 months. The 12 signs of the zodiac go around the same pattern 3 months, 4 seasons. Haik/Orion represents the Sun (Ar or Arev) rising with healing in his wings. Precession is shown in the lunar cycle of the 4 weeks (7's) 3 in each. The moon goes through the 12 signs, 2 half days in each sign completing the month. The 4 weeks (7's) make the ancient cross (khatch) symbol which shows the precession cycle. 3 signs of the 12 are in each of the 4 (7's)weeks. Going through the moon phases like how the swaying of precession would be from new moon, half moon, quarter moon, half again, and new again. Each 1000 years is a day so 2 half days is 2000 half years which it goes through of the 12 signs 2 half days in a month. So also the 2 meaning male and female 1000 in each. The cycle of life is like the seasons in a year. We go through darkness in winter and rise to life again at spring. The same with the Sun rising at Spring representing rebirth of life and path to eternal life.

The Aratta, Metsamor, and Kura-Araxes cultures were the same, and during the time of this culture was the time of the Armens and Haik in the 3rd millennium BC. There was high knowledge of astronomy at this time in Armenia.
IPB Image

Edited by Ararat_arev, 08 March 2007 - 11:48 PM.


#3 Ararat_arev

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Posted 09 March 2007 - 08:22 AM

IPB Image
Haya (Orion) and the land of 'rivers' and twin mountains of Masis, the Armenian Highland

These are some of the powerful points and ancient records that will reveal our more ancient history:

*Artatama's (Armenian name with 'Arta' prefix) title is "king of the Hurri", yet again reveals the Hurrian-Aryan links (note: not to mention linguists who say Hurrian language is far from complete)

* T. V. Gamkrelidze and V. V. Ivanov, The Early History of Indo-European Languages, Scientific American, March 1990 (they reveal that Armenian Highland and Armenian language is the root of Aryan-IE)

*Tutmoses III of Egypt (1500 BC) mentions the people of 'Ermenen' paying tribute when he held his court at Ninevah, and says that in their land "heaven rests upon its four pillars." (note: Tutmose III was the first Pharaoh to cross the Euphrates to reach the Armenian Highlands)

*Old Persian name 'Armin' meant "dweller of the garden of Eden" (Persians also used this form 'Armin(a)' for Armenia)

*Menua, king of Urartu (our Khaldi tribe cousins) mentions the 'Armeni' native in the "land of Ari" (Ariyan)

*Sumerian inscription 'Haya' as early as 3000 BC way before 'Hayasa' of Hittite inscription 1400 BC

*Akkadian inscriptions from as early as 2400 BC mention the 'Armani' (aka Armani-Subartu or Arme-Shubria or Hurrians) near Lake Van

IPB Image
the 'tree of life'

Here are some good and "must read" links:

http://www.angelfire...Azgaser/AR.html from Martiros Kavoukjian's Armenia, Sumer, Subartu, 1982

http://www.tacentral.com/history.asp 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.tacentral...uni/2ndwave.asp Aryan roots

http://arevordi.blogspot.com 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.armenianhighland.com 12,000 year history of Armenia

http://www.saintsark...rg/Language.htm roots of Armenian language

Edited by Ararat_arev, 09 March 2007 - 08:44 AM.


#4 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 09 March 2007 - 08:28 PM

Great job Ararat-arev. The revisionists try to re-write the history for over 150 years. Re-writing the history and stealing our identity is one of the major reason behind the Armenian-genocide.

Keep up the good work and don't fall for any cheap, provocative, comments. I will be gone for a while. After i come back, we gonna set the record straight. Nothing scares them more than the truth from coming out...and if it's done by a personal initiative of someone with conviction, then they'll be sorry for ever speaking to you.

BTW, Hovik Nersesian is a living legend. Artak Movsesyan does a great job too...but he is young. I'm sure in no time he'll be where Hovik Nersesian is today.

Edited by Aratta-Kingdom, 09 March 2007 - 09:06 PM.


#5 Zartonk

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Posted 09 March 2007 - 10:54 PM

Nice citation Ararat-arev.

Edited by Zartonk, 09 March 2007 - 11:04 PM.


#6 HyeFedayis

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 09:06 PM

This information is inaccurate, first the image of that thing on Tigranes head can mean anything, So basing history on a image like that is very wrong. Secondly Hurrians are not identical to Armenians. We can barely trace back Urartu, we need to put a lock on that before we go further in the pit. Last but not least these historians and scholars are the worst revisionists ever, and tac central and geocities site's mean nothing. Theres alot of good information from Diankoff though.

#7 HyeFedayis

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 09:12 PM

If you follow Ararat's ideology thats claiming we were Egyptians also, in a period of time in history. This is all based on simple wording.

#8 MadArmo

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Posted 10 March 2007 - 11:54 PM

QUOTE(HyeFedayis @ Mar 11 2007, 03:12 AM) View Post

If you follow Ararat's ideology thats claiming we were Egyptians also, in a period of time in history. This is all based on simple wording.



I disagree... To disconnect from parts of history is dangerous, We should own it ... Proof is valid we evolved from other cultures around us as well, We were stronger at the times hence we remain today they don't ! Hitties are a perfect example I suppose. Turks use propaganda to claim Armenians were roaming around the area so we have no valid claims on historical Armenia... What's really wrong with that assult on historical facts is that Armenian kingdoms were landlords of easten Anatolia during those periods. History channel or any other network shows Asia Minor as Anatolia during the time Armenia had Kingdoms ! Should we not focus on it instead ? We must correct any denial of old Armenia on all documenteries to show it as Armenia... Not erasing the name. Let's challenge them on facts alone and prove Armenia was the name at times . Expose misrepresantations of history and demand corrections to be made without further delay.










#9 Dave

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 12:36 PM

Regarding our claims to our historic homeland, whether Armenia existed starting 700 BC or starting 3500 BC, it doesn't really make a difference. It is a fact that Armenians have a much longer history in the area than Turks/Azeris do.

Besides, historic justifications for territorial claims do not matter in the eyes of the international community. A proof of this is Karabagh. It's been a while that Armenians of Karabagh separated themselves from Azerbaijan, yet not a single nation recognizes its sovereignty, regardless of the fact that Armenians have constituted a majority in Karabagh for centuries.

All it takes is the strength to impose these facts (Karabagh, Western Armenia, etc.) to the world.

#10 HyeFedayis

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 04:15 PM

QUOTE(MadArmo @ Mar 11 2007, 01:54 AM) View Post

I disagree... To disconnect from parts of history is dangerous, We should own it ... Proof is valid we evolved from other cultures around us as well, We were stronger at the times hence we remain today they don't ! Hitties are a perfect example I suppose. Turks use propaganda to claim Armenians were roaming around the area so we have no valid claims on historical Armenia... What's really wrong with that assult on historical facts is that Armenian kingdoms were landlords of easten Anatolia during those periods. History channel or any other network shows Asia Minor as Anatolia during the time Armenia had Kingdoms ! Should we not focus on it instead ? We must correct any denial of old Armenia on all documenteries to show it as Armenia... Not erasing the name. Let's challenge them on facts alone and prove Armenia was the name at times . Expose misrepresantations of history and demand corrections to be made without further delay.


Yes, but your going to need sources, not these Armenian historians artak or what ever, there nothing if your going to connect Armenian history you need solid sources, showing where you get the information from, 1) Artak movisyan is not a third party source, so many historians may reject this. Which he probably does not cite other non-Armenian historians because they go ahead and do it there selves, which may cause mistakes and other problems etc. By the way, we have connections to the hitties also, they definitely were not related to Turkey, they probably all came from the Turkic migration or what ever like I care about there crappy, selfish, ugly, violent, rampaging, pillaging, genocidal, murdering history by the Turks. But we need to connect further to Urartu, Urartu included, Lake sevan, Lake van, mount Ararat etc, that would do very good to us thats the most important not to mention the history of Noah. This would be included in many books. But Turks currently try to erase our history, we need more historians that support us.

#11 MadArmo

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Posted 12 March 2007 - 03:20 AM

QUOTE(HyeFedayis @ Mar 11 2007, 10:15 PM) View Post

Yes, but your going to need sources, not these Armenian historians artak or what ever, there nothing if your going to connect Armenian history you need solid sources, showing where you get the information from, 1) Artak movisyan is not a third party source, so many historians may reject this. Which he probably does not cite other non-Armenian historians because they go ahead and do it there selves, which may cause mistakes and other problems etc. By the way, we have connections to the hitties also, they definitely were not related to Turkey, they probably all came from the Turkic migration or what ever like I care about there crappy, selfish, ugly, violent, rampaging, pillaging, genocidal, murdering history by the Turks. But we need to connect further to Urartu, Urartu included, Lake sevan, Lake van, mount Ararat etc, that would do very good to us thats the most important not to mention the history of Noah. This would be included in many books. But Turks currently try to erase our history, we need more historians that support us.



I'm in concert offcourse... We have other sources to validate all . What we need is exposure in the media outlets not to discredit any link to us... Calling on others to validate our history is redundent if I may say it with sarcasm. We are Armenian, We are not imaginary nor require historians to reject any reference to Urartu - Nairi ... We changed, evolved, adapted, assimilated others in to our cultures and exchange treaties with other kingdoms or empires. We don't lack proof only because evidence still remains Armenians were unique to Sevan and Ararat. Old Hollywood movies for example are a good start to look for this revisionsim thats going on, They show Armenia as Asia Minor . Today it's Turkey or present day Turkey. Do you realise the ramifications to a simple atlas in a time period purged of vital crucial information?

If Alexander passed by Armenia... How come they show it as Anatolia ? that's bad information and if it continues people will buy it as such, It's an uphill battle to correct the damage that's being done . We can't stand idle to it, Stand firm and demand recognition of Armenian no matter how it's being utilized, I guarantee people in parts of the US still don't have a clue about us. They watch television to see some schmuck with the name of goldstein producing a documentry show claiming ancient ruins of Ani as Turkish !!



















#12 Eurocentric

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:11 PM

lol
MadArmo, Alexander never set foot in historical Armenia!
He bypassed it because it was of no importance whatsoever.

#13 MadArmo

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 03:13 PM

QUOTE(Eurocentric @ Mar 13 2007, 07:11 PM) View Post

lol
MadArmo, Alexander never set foot in historical Armenia!
He bypassed it because it was of no importance whatsoever.



LoL, Indeed... Where did I mention Alexander set foot in Armenia ? I said he passed by or went around it... I mentioned him because there was a episode some time ago about him and showed A map of the area which this discussion is evolving about. I don't disagree with historical facts or proof, However I get erked when I see clear misrepresentations of it. Hope this clears things up for you ... tongue.gif



#14 Eurocentric

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 04:32 PM

QUOTE(MadArmo @ Mar 13 2007, 03:13 PM) View Post

LoL, Indeed... Where did I mention Alexander set foot in Armenia ? I said he passed by or went around it... I mentioned him because there was a episode some time ago about him and showed A map of the area which this discussion is evolving about. I don't disagree with historical facts or proof, However I get erked when I see clear misrepresentations of it. Hope this clears things up for you ... tongue.gif


There is no misrepresentation in that or any other map that shows Anatolia. There were numerous countries in Anatolia. Armenia was merely one of many and at the time of Alexander of very little to no importance at all. Most maps don't show any countries of Anatolia at all. Many show Cappadocia and Armenia.

#15 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 09:09 PM

http://hyeforum.com/...ic=15259&st=120
'Eurocentric Jan 20 2007, 03:50 PM Post #129
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Comparing that piece of shit Mutafian to Dink is blasphemous. Dink was not what I would consider a typical Armenian but he had balls and stood up for what he believed in. Mutafian is a rat!'


http://hyeforum.com/...ic=15259&st=140
'Eurocentric Jan 20 2007, 06:01 PM Post #143
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Where did I say Mutafian is a typical Armenian? And yes, a good number of Armenians I know are rats and pieces of shit, replying to one now as a matter of fact...'



For someone who has this much hate for the armenians, one must not be surprised to see crat coming out of him.

#16 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 09:15 PM

QUOTE(HyeFedayis @ Mar 11 2007, 02:15 PM) View Post

Yes, but your going to need sources, not these Armenian historians artak or what ever,



No Fedayi, you are wrong. It's not 'Artak or what ever'. You might 'claim' Artak Movsesyan is young, knows nothing about history...Hovik Nersesian, on the other hand, is one of the few historians who goes to the source and knows how to read the ancient scriptures. Please, at least do a research before you denounce their work.

If you don't wanna read the books, here is your chance to larn about Hovik Nersesian and Artak Movsesyan

Nersesian:

http://video.google....8...esian&hl=en

http://video.google....1...ravot&hl=en





The Movsesyan Video:


Edited by Aratta-Kingdom, 13 March 2007 - 10:11 PM.


#17 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 11:13 PM

QUOTE(Dave @ Mar 11 2007, 10:36 AM) View Post

Regarding our claims to our historic homeland, whether Armenia existed starting 700 BC or starting 3500 BC, it doesn't really make a difference. It is a fact that Armenians have a much longer history in the area than Turks/Azeris do.

Besides, historic justifications for territorial claims do not matter in the eyes of the international community. A proof of this is Karabagh. It's been a while that Armenians of Karabagh separated themselves from Azerbaijan, yet not a single nation recognizes its sovereignty, regardless of the fact that Armenians have constituted a majority in Karabagh for centuries.

All it takes is the strength to impose these facts (Karabagh, Western Armenia, etc.) to the world.


If the armenians were to record the facts of the past, none of this would have happened. If we were to fight what belongs to us, none of these would have happened. We don't need to impose anything on anyone as long as we know nothing about our own identity. Beside, let's not go against the cycle of life. We have lived in those lands for over 10 years, there are still some armenians who live in Western-Armenia. We don't need the west to tell us how to live our life. Just like Iraq, Turkey has no future. Turkey will part apart from the second the Zionists stop supporting that country.


#18 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 12:34 AM

QUOTE(MadArmo @ Mar 13 2007, 01:13 PM) View Post

LoL, Indeed... Where did I mention Alexander set foot in Armenia ? I said he passed by or went around it...


Alexander did not set a foot in Armenia, but he did fight the armenians. The armenian units in the persian army have crashed Alexander's soldiers to a point when he himself had to leave his position and come for help. He would have enter armenia and collect taxes just like in any other places, but after he saw the strength of the armenian soldiers, he didn't wanted to take the chance. That's what made him so great and different from all the others.




#19 MadArmo

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 05:15 PM

QUOTE(Aratta-Kingdom @ Mar 14 2007, 06:34 AM) View Post

Alexander did not set a foot in Armenia, but he did fight the armenians. The armenian units in the persian army have crashed Alexander's soldiers to a point when he himself had to leave his position and come for help. He would have enter armenia and collect taxes just like in any other places, but after he saw the strength of the armenian soldiers, he didn't wanted to take the chance. That's what made him so great and different from all the others.




Ok ... I assumed Armenians were supportive of Alexanders conquests ? He left Armenia alone because we caused him no alarm unlike the Persian empire which he felt as a threat. Where the Armenians in the Persian army came to play ? And is there proof of it ? I honestly don't recall that chapter...










#20 Aratta-Kingdom

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 09:25 PM

Yes MA. the armenian cavalry took part in the 'battle of Granicus'. In fact, the armenians where the most heavily armed among all the others. After Alexander the Great defeated Darius III, just like the others who were loyal to Darius III, armenians returned back to their country and formed armed units capable of defending Armenia.







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